[Mr.GoodThread]

I have ketoconazale 2% that I got prescribed to me for dry scalp by a dermatologist. I am unfortunately extremely poor, so the shampoo was completely free with my health insurance.

Not until reading this thread yesterday however, did I find out that it might be useful for prevention of hair loss. I checked on Wikipedia, and it says it needs to be taken in conjunction with a 5α-Reductase inhibitor to have the best chance of working. Then I looked at the side effects for 5α-Reductase inhibitors and according to the article are mostly based on how high dose you take, but still the side effects of impotence, breast enlargement, and all sorts of crazy stuff like that are frightening.

I will still use the ketoconazole from time to time for the dry scalp, but I'm not going to get the 5α-Reductase inhibitor things to take in conjunction with it, and I won't really look at this as a potential hair loss prevention method. I would much rather do the "no shampoo challenge", and hope it helps the situation out.

I have in the past used the shea moisture apple cider vinegar shampoo. I'm not sure if it is beneficial in any way, but it doesn't seem to be the worst shampoo out there.

[rainy]

What is considered "cheap" varies from person to person, as well as the seriousness and effect of balding.

Frankly, if hair loss was a real concern to me I'd pony up the 1.5-2K it costs for a FUE transplant in either Greece or Turkey. If you're not living in Europe that might not be be feasible but plane tickets from most anywhere in Europe and the price of the procedure would cost thousands less if done in Greece/Turkey than getting it done in Western Europe or the US where it'll likely you cost at least 8K and more likely 10K+. Given I'm often in Bulgaria I'll likely go down to Greece at some point and get one.

If your options are in the USA, consider Mexico. If you're in Asia, consider the Philippines or Thailand. All are top 10 globally when it comes to affordability of procedures.

[FretDancer]

(07-27-2016 01:07 PM)LeightonBlackstock Wrote:  

rottenapple,

Thank you so much for posting your comment about Saw Palmetto. I nearly bought some today. I reckon anything which could affect libido is totally not worth taking.

Phoenix, thanks for the link about that stuff. Have read about it before briefly.

Guys, what are your thoughts on Biotin? I took it for a week or two one time and I noticed my new chest hair growing was DOUBLE usual thickness (if not a little thicker!).

Was scared to keep on with it as there are horror stories of shedding happening after a few months. Have also heard it makes hair grow faster but fall out easier. Can anyone add?

The thing with Saw Palmetto is that you shouldn't really take it orally, the side effect risk is too high. Instead, apply it topically on your scalp.

[Leads]

Great to hear the efforts on this topic. I have some all-natural tips that have worked for me.

1. Apple Cider Vinegar - Rinsing/leaving it on in shower for a bit works great to remove any parasites,junk etc.

2. Garlic Oil - Another brutal method for cleaning out junk and revives growth

3. Cold Showers - proven to help circulation and even hair. The benefits are many and hair is a bonus

4. Cucumber/Celery - Eating tons of this helps build hair growth

5. Zinc - Get it from shrimp/oysters/sardines to help with hair growth


Aside from that, keep in mind a good scrub can also be used on the head to get all the dead skin off. This one is great: http://www.themanual.com/grooming/best-e...crubs-men/

[Hypno]

(05-18-2014 05:05 PM)Basil Ransom Wrote:  

2. Minoxidil

6 month supply at Costco = $26.49. Cost per day = 26.49/182.5 = $0.145 per day.

Costco is now $45.00 for a 6 month supply. Label says to use twice a day.

[Ballr]

https://www.drsebiscellfood.com/products...-fortifier

^^^

This shit actually works. If you can keep it on for almost 5 days you'll be pleased, to say the least. All Dr Debi products are legit.

Off note: I no longer use any kind of tooth paste and my teeth are whiter, smell fresher, and gums don't bleed when I floss anymore. He's got a tooth powder I've been using for several months now.

[Dalaran1991]

Gotta confirm here that coconut oil does wonder for hair loss prevention.

Im 25 and balding. Since my dad is bald I thought might as well accept it. 3 weeks ago I jumped on the coconut oil train wagon, first for cooking, then started to put it in my hair after shower. 3 times per week before bed.

Lo and behold, after the 3rd week now I barely lose any hair while showering! It used to be so much hair loss that it clogged the drain.

You guys should really try it out.

[FretDancer]

I figured I could add a bit more to this datasheet that help improve your hair and possibly prevent loss and stimulate growth.

Topical Solutions

Magnesium Oil: According to some studies, magnesium is great for strengthening the hair and preventing hair loss, however many people are magnesium deficient. Add to that the fact that magnesium is absorbed very poorly by our bodies when taking orally, magnesium oil therefore is a good option to aid our hair.

Nettle Leaf extract is also another good substance that helps block DHT. It is extracted from the plant called Stinging Nettle (Urtica dioica), which can be found in Asia. I have encountered it in my hiking trips and many times have accidentally grabbed it with bare hands, it truly stings like a bitch.

Saw Palmetto, as mentioned before is another potent DHT blocker. However there are many reports of side-effects similar to those of Propecia when taking orally. This is why it's better to squeeze the oil out of the softgels to create a separate mixture.

Pumpkin seed oil is another great oil to add to the mix.

Mix all these oils and essences together into a single mixture and apply it to your scalp before bedtime a few times a week and see the results you get after a few months.

Diet and Supplements

There is a lot we can do in the diet department to help us strengthen and keep our hair. The basic and main idea is that we should try to eat and incorporate more fruits and vegetables into our diets (really simple huh).

If you are a big and constant meat eater (like me) and you are avoiding the necessary fruits and vegetables, you are doing yourself a lot of harm and your hairline is paying the price. Since getting a big amount of fruits and vegetables into our diets can be a bit difficult and inconvenient, JUICING is a great option. I recommend you check out MikeCF's Juicing thread right here on the forum. Keep in mind that blending is also another great option as well.

Aside from veggies, you will benefit greatly if you consume foods such as almonds, nuts, pumpkin seeds, cashews, and peanuts. Be sure to consume at least a handful of these daily.

Some teas are also said to be helpful since they improve circulation and contain many good antioxidants. I personally like drinking hot ginger tea and black tea in the morning, and I have replaced coffee completely now for quite a while.

Allergic Foods

Some people are allergic to certain foods such as dairy, seafood, etc. The tricky thing though is that sometimes the symptoms and reactions to these foods only develop after certain weeks, this makes it more difficult to diagnose the cause. If you think you have an allergy to a certain food, stop eating that food completely for 2 weeks and see how you feel. Then try re-incorporating that food for another 2 weeks and re-assess.

Supplements

It is a good idea to take supplements that can help keep your hair strong and your scalp healthy. From my research online I have come across a few:

Pumpkin seed oil: Mentioned before as a topical solution to the scalp, pumpkin seed oil is also a great supplement to take orally daily.

ZMA: Contains necessary Zinc and Magnesium that your body needs. ZMA truly does wonders, and it is a favorite among RVF. Check the Zinc and Magnesium threads out.

[Maxzilla]

I think we can simplify this down to the following:


1. Finasteride


That's it.

Minoxidil is very weak, doesn't even work in like half of men, and is majorly impractical due to its topical nature. RU58841 is a speculative off-market research chemical and is topical too. By all means, try these if you want and you can tolerate it, but Fin is the de facto "cure". As for all other supplements, they're just snake oil.

So when you start noticing hair loss and you wanna do something about it, get Finasteride and pop an easy pill a day. Either it works or it doesn't. Either it gives you sides or it doesn't. And if ideally it works and doesn't give you sides and successfully saves your hair, after many years it will stop working like it did and you will lose hair, because it doesn't stop hair loss completely - rather it slows it down. And that point you can accept this slow loss, or shave it, or get transplants, or get a wig. But you can rest assured in the fact that you prolonged the life of your hair and gave it your all.

[Pinocchio]

My stack is as follows

Soy Isoflavones x 1 per day
theaflavin x 1
saw palmetto x 1
curcumin x 1
cayenne x 1

All off amazon

Kirkland minoxidil apply before bed. Off eBay.

Had no side effects from anything.

This costs me about £20 per month. Since I started it my hair loss has completely stopped and I gained some at the beginning. Probably lost about 15% and managed to get it back to 10% with the above.- mainly the hairline.

I then got a FUE transplant done two months ago to finish the job off. Cost £4K, £1k deposit then paying the remaining 3k on an interest free loan over two years. Works out at about £150 per month.

If you got the money I would highly recommend getting the procedure done. I had it done unshaven so no one noticed. Takes about 8 hours, only bad part is it is quite itchy for the first few days after and you can't itch and can't use hair products or blow dryer for a month after. Hopefully in another 4 months my hair will be completely back to pre loss.

[markygras]

Holy moley there's some strong bro-science in this thread, which is shocking considering OP's post from 2014 was 100% on the money.

Here's the thing - no method of hair loss prevention/regrowth has been proven except fin, minox, and keto. Those three. That's it. They had the actual scientific method applied to them, and they had actual evidence provided in medical journals and the nhs website. All other methods are snake oil and a tremendous waste of $$.

Fin is the main driver. I personally don't use minox because I don't think the money/effort is worth the results it gives, but that's dependant on my own physiology. Ketocozonal shampoo does like 1% while fin does the other 99%. So its nice to have, but nothing major.

Dutasteride "probably" works as well (since it targets DHT just like fin), but it's never been tested specifically for hair loss. Same with that RU or spiro stuff.

But anything you can buy over the counter? Stuff at the ol GNC or health food store? Does nothing. And there's not a shred of scientific evidence that it does anything. I would hate for an impressionable 19 year old who's starting to experience aggressive male pattern baldness to happen upon this thread, and run out to the store to buy "magnesium oil" or (lol) cayenne, while forgoing simply taking 0.5-1mg of finasteride.

Logic, reason, evidence: Finasteride, minoxidil, and ketocozonal, and that is it.

Superstition, hunches, woman-logic: Nettle root, pumpkin seeds, soy isoflavones, etc.


* Oh, and funny thing about those supplements that get brought up. You know there's no law requiring supplement pills to actually contain the ingredient or dosage that they advertise, right? They're exempt from those laws (see the documentary "Bigger, Faster, Stronger"). When you march into a vitamin store and buy a 60 pill bottle of "Nettle Root 5mg"....it's just as likely that those gelatin pills merely contain cellulose (wood chips) and nothing else. Consumer reports did a study of some garlic pills bought at a grocery store. None of the pills actually had garlic or its components in them. Just gelatin and cellulose.

[fortysix]

Can someone discuss the process for getting a fin prescription? I think I finally hit the point where I really need it, but I've always kind of avoided going to doctors since I've been relatively healthy (bad, I know).

Do you just visit your physician and tell them you want fin? Or do you have to go to a dermatologist or some other doctor?

Do they make you take any blood tests etc?

Is it covered by insurance?

Is it weird to ask for proscar, the cheaper alternative?

How much $ do you guys spend on it per month?

[PUA_Rachacha]

(01-24-2017 12:52 PM)fortysix Wrote:  

Can someone discuss the process for getting a fin prescription? I think I finally hit the point where I really need it, but I've always kind of avoided going to doctors since I've been relatively healthy (bad, I know).

Do you just visit your physician and tell them you want fin? Or do you have to go to a dermatologist or some other doctor?

Do they make you take any blood tests etc?

Is it covered by insurance?

Is it weird to ask for proscar, the cheaper alternative?

How much $ do you guys spend on it per month?

Go to a dermatologist and tell them that you need fin for reclining hair line and 2% ketoconazole for occasional dandruff. He should prescribe 5mg generic proscar and generic 2% ketoconazole shampoo.

No, they don't take blood tests.

Yes, it's covered by insurance.

No, they almost always prescribe generic proscar.

I spend about $17/month for the Big Three ($2 Proscar, $10 Rogaine, $5 Ketoconazole). My hair has come back about 90% to where it was when I was a teenager. The difference is remarkable. No side effects.

Don't listen to the bro-science on here saying you should take zinc and pumpkin seed oil. If you're concerned about permanently losing your hair, give this a shot. If the sides are intolerable, go off. Only 1% of users get sides, and the most common side effect is ED.

Again, these are the only FDA-approved medicines that are shown to reduce hair loss. I tried the nutraceutical route for years and was basically spinning my wheels. Being on the Big 3 for a year has completely reversed the hair loss.

[kellyon]

I think it's better to consult with a doctor first. I also use only natural products for hair care, keep on a healthy diet and take biotin (vitamins for skin&hair)

[musashi]

I'm near 40 and i use Nizoral shampoo with rosemary, peppermint and tea tree oil mixed in. Rosemary essential oil was found to be as effective as Rogaine for hair regrowth. I have also used RU from anagen with great success (utilized when running masteron on cycle). My hair is thick, long and strong.

[Perfectionist]

(02-07-2017 08:44 AM)musashi Wrote:  

I'm near 40 and i use Nizoral shampoo with rosemary, peppermint and tea tree oil mixed in. Rosemary essential oil was found to be as effective as Rogaine for hair regrowth. I have also used RU from anagen with great success (utilized when running masteron on cycle). My hair is thick, long and strong.

Do you have a link talking about the Rosemary oil and how much of these oils do you add to the Nizoral?
Thanks

[musashi]

(02-08-2017 09:23 PM)Perfectionist Wrote:  

(02-07-2017 08:44 AM)musashi Wrote:  

I'm near 40 and i use Nizoral shampoo with rosemary, peppermint and tea tree oil mixed in. Rosemary essential oil was found to be as effective as Rogaine for hair regrowth. I have also used RU from anagen with great success (utilized when running masteron on cycle). My hair is thick, long and strong.

Do you have a link talking about the Rosemary oil and how much of these oils do you add to the Nizoral?
Thanks

Rosemary oil vs minoxidil 2% for the treatment of androgenetic alopecia: a randomized comparative trial.https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25842469

here's another link:
https://tophairlosstreatments.com/rosema...hair-loss/

I add about 20 drops of rosemary oil and 20 drops of peppermint oil to my nizoral.
Peppermint oil also has benefits against hair loss and helping stimulate hair regrowth
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4289931/

[LeoneVolpe]

Hair loss drugs (and even some supplements) are notorious for their potentially negative (sometimes devastating) sexual side effects. I urge anyone considering taking Propecia to give it a second thought. Would you rather be bald with a fully functioning dick or possibly retain some hair and only have a limp noodle to offer a girl? Your mileage may vary, but to me, it's just not worth the risk.

A better solution is to find a great hairstylist who can give you a flattering haircut until you no longer have enough hair to pull it off. Then, once that happens, start using clippers to crop it short or just say "fuck it" and shave it all off. The sooner you can come to grips with your baldness, the better off you'll be.

[Vincent Chase]

Agreed better to go for a hair style or a transplant at 35-40 than destroying your genitals.

I use minoxidil, nizoral shampoo, another shampoo with DHT blockers and biotin supplements myself. Minoxidil has definitely worked for me, those shampoos I'm yet to be convinced despite clinical studies showing otherwise.

[zphyer7]

(02-13-2017 09:57 PM)LeoneVolpe Wrote:  

Hair loss drugs (and even some supplements) are notorious for their potentially negative (sometimes devastating) sexual side effects. I urge anyone considering taking Propecia to give it a second thought. Would you rather be bald with a fully functioning dick or possibly retain some hair and only have a limp noodle to offer a girl? Your mileage may vary, but to me, it's just not worth the risk.

A better solution is to find a great hairstylist who can give you a flattering haircut until you no longer have enough hair to pull it off. Then, once that happens, start using clippers to crop it short or just say "fuck it" and shave it all off. The sooner you can come to grips with your baldness, the better off you'll be.

A million times this^^^

It actually makes me sick to my stomach that guys are still recommending Propecia to other people. That stuff along with Advodart is poison for a man. It's a crime in my opinion that Doctors are still allowed to prescribe this to people now that the devastating side effects are known.

I took Propecia for 6 years. At first I thought it was a miracle drug. It stopped my hairloss almost immediately and with some concealers I was able to walk around with basically a full head of hair. Unfortunately the side effects will always get you eventually. In my case it took 2-3 years before I first started feeling them. They're insidious like that. As the DHT gets drained from your body you slowly start losing energy, sexual desire, and the motivation to get out and live.

Even with these side effects I still wouldn't stop because I became overly invested in keeping my hair. Eventually the sexual side effects built up to the point where I'd have a beautiful girl naked in front of me and I wouldn't be able to get my dick up. To say those moments were incredibly embarrassing would be an understatement. Propecia will wreck your erection quality. During that 6 year period my dick actually shrank an inch due to incredibly poor erection quality. I repeat IT SHRANK MY DICK!

After these incidents I was willing to go bald instead of suffering these side effects. Thankfully I decided to give RU 58841 a shot because I had nothing to lose. In my case RU58841 has worked. I've been taking it for almost three years and it has held my hair line steady. It works as good as Propecia in my experience without the terrible side effects, mainly due to it not lowering DHT throughout your entire body. So far I've noticed no side effects from RU58841, but if some do start to occur I'll just take a Bic to my head, throw in the towel, and enjoy a healthy sex life.

TLDR: I wouldn't give Propecia to my worst enemy. Horrible side effects particularly the sexual ones. RU58841 works for me. Peace.

[ElMexicano]

I'm on 1mg of Finasteride since March 2016 after my transplant, no side effect. Only thing is since I had 2000 grafs done, it is still not enough, I bought Dermmatch and works wonders, but.... there is always a but. After I shampoo it out, it seems I'm losing a bunch of hairs. Does anyone else have similar experience with Dermmatch? if so, are hairs falling out and how have your remedied it or just accepted it?

Thanks lads

[samsamsam]

Anyone have negative side effects with rogaine?

[Ballr]

The best option for hair loss is surgery. Everything else is hear-say. That's why this thread is 4 pages long.

If there was a real solution here it would be 1 post and /end thread.

Dabbling more into hair loss will probably make it worse considering stress plays a major factor here. I know guys who've experienced thinning in 1 area (particularly the top back of the head) and after months of eliminating stress-inducing activities / thoughts it started to grow back again.

[_Cicero]

Whatup bros. Balding bro here. I'm 36, but I've been told I look older than I am. Thinning/balding hair, and also some wrinkles on my face, with a thick beard. This has cost me girls in the 18-22 y.o. category. I recently saw a dermatologist about it. It blew my mind. Here's what I learned:

Hair-loss is totally treatable in most men, and with treatments that have little or no side effects. Most people in this thread probably already knew this.

I'm now following this treatment regimen, based on my dermatologists advice:
(1) Minoxidil/Rogaine. A generally effective drug with few side effects. Tends to thicken your hair where you have it rather than bring your hair-line forward. You do need to apply twice a day, and with all of these treatments you're going to have to wait months to see results. (My doc was down on the foam version. he said was less effective than the spray).
(2) Micro-needling/dermaroller. The idea is actually to damage your scalp and thus force your body to send growth agents to your scalp to repair. These growth agents happen to also be good for hair regrowth. Incidentally, this is also generally a good skin treatment, including for wrinkles. I'm started also using on my face (but you want .5mm or 1 on your face, and 1.5mm on your scalp, according to him). He emphasized that it is important to keep your dermaroller soaked in alcohol for 15 minutes after treatment, to make sure you aren't spawning bacteria which you then inject into your scalp.
(3) Plasma Injections, PRP. I've started this. They take your blood, separate out the plasma and then inject this into your scalp.

*Note: All three of these treatments have been proven to work in randomized controlled trials (RCTs), and are not known to have bad side effects. They all also operate differently, and thus are good complements to each other.

**Downsides: Minoxidil can cause scalp discomfort. Micro needling doesn't feel great. The plasma injections hurt like a mofo, but nothing a man can't handle. Two of these treatments need to be done every day (Rogaine and micro-needling), and I have to go once a month to the doctor for plasma injections. It cost me about $100 for 5 months of treatment. I paid about $15 for a dermaroller, which I can use three months. I think I dropped about $30 on minoxidil, but I'm not sure how long it will last.

Personally, I'm very down on "natural" remedies. Why do that stuff which is scientifically unproven when there is stuff that is proven? Also, the giant supplement industry is a f*cking scam. Take St. Johns wart for this or that, zinc for testosterone, garlic to prevent colds. It's all or mostly bullshit. Even vitamins do not have good results in RCTs, even with poor people in Africa who aren't eating healthy diets.

Other treatments I'm not doing (yet):
(1) My dermatologist was down on the shampoo treatment. Said was unnecessary. I'm not sure why.
(2) He was very high on hair transplants, which is a permanent solution. I may go this route if my hair or hairline doesn't respond. He said I have a large donor area, which is good. Said there are good clinics in St. Petersburg (Russia) and in Tbilisi, surprisingly. Also in the Netherlands and Switzerland. Also said some of the best are in north america, but also the most expensive. (I'm based in Moscow). Indeed, surgery may be the best option.
(3) Finasteride/Propecia. I know people who use and swear by it, and had no noticeable side effects. My doctor recommended this but with hesitation. He said 5% get erectile disfunction, and some of these cases are permanent even when people stop taking the drug. I do wonder if some of this is reverse placebo effect. Still, it is going to mess with your hormones, and I'm risk averse when it comes to this stuff. It also stops hair loss more than promotes regrowth. I decided against. There are other alternatives. Personally, I would do a transplant over this.

In any case, I've just started this treatment regimen. I'll give it 6 months to see what happens and then think about a hair transplant if I get frustrated with slow progress. My doctor does the same regimen, and the back of his hair responded well but not the very front.

[Dantes]

Cicero,

Thanks for the information. I can confirm from my own experience that the Rogaine spray is more effective than the gel.

My question about Hair Transplants is won't you continue to lose hair after the surgery, perhaps needing another one in 5-10 years?