[Dantes]

I have found that many girls in this age range are in fact less experienced sexually than Western girls of the same age. It might be a case of her feeling remorseful for giving it up so quickly to a foreigner. Russian girls are emotional even though they don't always express their feelings outwardly, especially to people they don't know well. They are sexual but they want to connect with men emotionally and intellectually.

This makes me think of a 19 year old Russian girl that met during the day. On the second date, we had sex and I continued to see her. I liked this girl and she had all of the qualities of a long-term relationship type of girl. She told me she had only been with one other man before me and I believed her.

One night we had plans to hang out and I texted her saying the I needed to meet a few hours later than we agree on. I told her to come by my apartment later in the evening. She went silent and eventually told me that "I am not a girl just for sex". Although I loved the sex with her, I actually valued her other qualities as well. I was disappointed that I never saw her again.

[betterasianbrother]

(05-09-2017 02:54 PM)Dantes Wrote:  

I have found that many girls in this age range are in fact less experienced sexually than Western girls of the same age. It might be a case of her feeling remorseful for giving it up so quickly to a foreigner. Russian girls are emotional even though they don't always express their feelings outwardly, especially to people they don't know well. They are sexual but they want to connect with men emotionally and intellectually.

This makes me think of a 19 year old Russian girl that met during the day. On the second date, we had sex and I continued to see her. I liked this girl and she had all of the qualities of a long-term relationship type of girl. She told me she had only been with one other man before me and I believed her.

One night we had plans to hang out and I texted her saying the I needed to meet a few hours later than we agree on. I told her to come by my apartment later in the evening. She went silent and eventually told me that "I am not a girl just for sex". Although I loved the sex with her, I actually valued her other qualities as well. I was disappointed that I never saw her again.

Ya bro, agreed, I think the remorse might play a big role here. Damn, Russian girls are quite the enigma. Beneath the Ice Queen appearance they are like a volcano of passion waiting to erupt, as long as you push the right buttons. In bed they are screaming maniacs with black belts in giving BJs, and in the morning they make your bed and fold your clothes. Ultra feminine and oozing with passion, yet they are seemingly able to flip that switch in AN INSTANT, at any moment, and act as if you have never met.

Beautiful yet tragic little creatures... Luckily there are plenty of them. :-D

[Gopnik]

@betterasian your posts reflect my experiences with russian devs here in Saint Pete. Whether I meet a girl at night, during the day or through tinder, a lot of them end up flaking. They either stop responding or start acting "cold" and barely answer or they'll say that they're busy. Russian girls are a tough nut to crack and if this was any other country, I would have probably given up already. And to think that when I came here, my boss warned me that "all russian girls would try to marry me" lol.

I'll write a longer post on the Russia thread later, but overall I think it's really easy to underestimate the culture difference and this is coming from someone who speaks pretty decent russian. It's definitely a lot more than just "tone down your clown game a notch and don't use sarcasm/negging".

[reciproke]

Literally the only "bad" thing I can say about Russian girls is how often they flake. I haven't seen a pattern - they can literally go from 180 to 0 within a day. It's extremely frustrating being ghosted that way, but due to the sheer amount of high quality girls that are around, it's not a dealbreaker. It's just something you have to be prepared for emotionally - she can be super excited and giggly when you ask her out, she can text you everday and send you cute photos of her, she can makes plans of what you both can do - all that can be moot without warning and she will ghost you. This didn't happen with girls I've fucked, so i guess having smashed gets your foot in the door for good.

But man, I had some really painful flakes. My take on this is simple: Some other guy was quicker and she's more or less taken. I don't know for sure, but it's the most probable explanation - it's a highly competetive environment, not only for girls. I haven't found a way around it.

However: In my experience some girls are REALLY busy. My GF for example is working 2 jobs, while studying at the same time. There was a short window of 1-2 hours a day where we could meet. Just ask the girls you are dating, most of them will completely be occupied except for 1-2 days a week. And then you have to compete against their hobbies, friends and family. Being persistent is key here, I have met so many great girls that didn't seem interested or enthusiastic at first but were convinced to meet up by me being persistent and not sulky. Also you have to bring a lot of time with you.

[icrus]

This is some very good advice right there, you all should highlight that and make a note.

The long game is where Vinny's IG game comes in. On holidays, I now regularly send out ping texts to girls that ghosted me. Like for Victory Day two days ago. If she replies, and most of them do, you just restart the convo and game away. Being persistent is the key, but at the same time you must have an abundance of options, in order to not really give a damn when she is blabbering your ear off with irrelevant shit.

Nowadays I use weekdays only for short tea dates to put in some facetime. No point in trying any escalation on those, just make sure she knows your intentions. Russian girls are very prude when they're sober but with alcohol you can bring out their inner sluts. Use your time and your money wisely and only go on alcohol dates when you know that you can keep the night going long enough (aka Fridays, days before holidays and Saturdays if it's virtually a layup).

[churros]

I've already had several girls request to bring their friends along on dates. In my book this is a no: but should I be open minded? Is this a cultural phenomenon?

[Gopnik]

(05-13-2017 12:16 AM)churros Wrote:  

I've already had several girls request to bring their friends along on dates. In my book this is a no: but should I be open minded? Is this a cultural phenomenon?

I had this happen once, where a girl asked me last minute if a friend of hers could join us. I took it as a shit test of some sort and told her she should have mentioned it before making plans. She was fine with this and didn't bring it up again.

I don't think it's a normal thing at all, if they insist, tell them you'll bring another dude for her friend and make it a double date, otherwise I wouldn't bother. From my experience, it's better to frame it as a date cause certain girls just want to chat with a foreigner out of novelty, practice their english or socialise a bit cause they've got few friends (it's surprising how little social lives some of these hot girls have).

Of course, if you're staying long enough, it's always useful to make some friends that can show you around, introduce you to other girls, and so on and it's good social proof at the club for example. Probably not worth it for short trips though.

[edlefou]

(05-13-2017 07:21 AM)Gopnik Wrote:  

(05-13-2017 12:16 AM)churros Wrote:  

I've already had several girls request to bring their friends along on dates. In my book this is a no: but should I be open minded? Is this a cultural phenomenon?

I had this happen once, where a girl asked me last minute if a friend of hers could join us. I took it as a shit test of some sort and told her she should have mentioned it before making plans. She was fine with this and didn't bring it up again.

I don't think it's a normal thing at all, if they insist, tell them you'll bring another dude for her friend and make it a double date, otherwise I wouldn't bother. From my experience, it's better to frame it as a date cause certain girls just want to chat with a foreigner out of novelty, practice their english or socialise a bit cause they've got few friends (it's surprising how little social lives some of these hot girls have).

Of course, if you're staying long enough, it's always useful to make some friends that can show you around, introduce you to other girls, and so on and it's good social proof at the club for example. Probably not worth it for short trips though.

How do you handle the bill in this situation? Do you cover the whole thing?

Last summer in Moscow I made last-minute plans to meet a girl who had been out walking all day with her friend. We met at a wine bar, but I bounced them for a walk around Patriarch Ponds before we ordered anything in order to suss out the situation.

They were cool, so we decided to hang out and went to Aist for a shisha. We all had some drinks and snacks on the patio and it was great hanging out with two attractive, intelligent Moscow lizards (we spoke entirely in Russian).

However, when it was time to pay, I wasn't sure what to do. Clearly it wasn't a date, but as a man I felt like being a man and paying, even though I shouldn't have to.

Now Aist is pretty nice place and it's in a very nice area of Moscow, so it's not cheap. The first bill was for the shisha, and it was almost 4K RUB. I put a 5K note into the bill holder and looked at the second bill, which was for the snacks and drinks (shisha is always billed separately for some reason). It came to around 7K RUB. The girls paid the second bill without me asking and I let them do it.

So the question is: how would you handle the situation if the lizards expect you to pick up the bill?

At the end of the day, picking up a $200 USD tab wouldn't break me, but I'd have felt like a chump because I'd just met these girls and a bang or three-way wasn't assured.

[Philosopher]

(05-07-2013 06:03 AM)Apocalyptica Wrote:  

Hi all

Do Russian women differ (a lot) from western european chicks in terms of gaming them?

Are they ok with cocky/funny lines?
Can you neg them? Or do they expect you to compliment them a lot.
Is buying drinks seen as an act of "class" ?
Can you hold a slightly arrogant/overly confident frame?

thank you.

-Yes, they appreciate cocky and funny
-Negging works, keep the compliments to a minimum (more than 1 will put their ego in overdrive)
-Yes, buying drinks is seen as an "act of class" may joke about "you trying to get them drunk" but just ignore it
-Yes, the slightly arrogant/overly confident frame works

[Dantes]

(05-13-2017 07:58 AM)edlefou Wrote:  

(05-13-2017 07:21 AM)Gopnik Wrote:  

(05-13-2017 12:16 AM)churros Wrote:  

I've already had several girls request to bring their friends along on dates. In my book this is a no: but should I be open minded? Is this a cultural phenomenon?

I had this happen once, where a girl asked me last minute if a friend of hers could join us. I took it as a shit test of some sort and told her she should have mentioned it before making plans. She was fine with this and didn't bring it up again.

I don't think it's a normal thing at all, if they insist, tell them you'll bring another dude for her friend and make it a double date, otherwise I wouldn't bother. From my experience, it's better to frame it as a date cause certain girls just want to chat with a foreigner out of novelty, practice their english or socialise a bit cause they've got few friends (it's surprising how little social lives some of these hot girls have).

Of course, if you're staying long enough, it's always useful to make some friends that can show you around, introduce you to other girls, and so on and it's good social proof at the club for example. Probably not worth it for short trips though.

How do you handle the bill in this situation? Do you cover the whole thing?

Last summer in Moscow I made last-minute plans to meet a girl who had been out walking all day with her friend. We met at a wine bar, but I bounced them for a walk around Patriarch Ponds before we ordered anything in order to suss out the situation.

They were cool, so we decided to hang out and went to Aist for a shisha. We all had some drinks and snacks on the patio and it was great hanging out with two attractive, intelligent Moscow lizards (we spoke entirely in Russian).

However, when it was time to pay, I wasn't sure what to do. Clearly it wasn't a date, but as a man I felt like being a man and paying, even though I shouldn't have to.

Now Aist is pretty nice place and it's in a very nice area of Moscow, so it's not cheap. The first bill was for the shisha, and it was almost 4K RUB. I put a 5K note into the bill holder and looked at the second bill, which was for the snacks and drinks (shisha is always billed separately for some reason). It came to around 7K RUB. The girls paid the second bill without me asking and I let them do it.

So the question is: how would you handle the situation if the lizards expect you to pick up the bill?

At the end of the day, picking up a $200 USD tab wouldn't break me, but I'd have felt like a chump because I'd just met these girls and a bang or three-way wasn't assured.

Tough call call in that situation. In Western culture it is perfectly acceptable to split the bill. However, as you know the cultural dynamics are different in Russia in this situation. Men are usually expected to pick up the bill and it was your idea to go for food, right?

I am curious to hear how this plays out. Have you followed with with her?

By the way, Patriarch Pond is my favorite date spot in Moscow.

[Dantes]

(05-13-2017 12:16 AM)churros Wrote:  

I've already had several girls request to bring their friends along on dates. In my book this is a no: but should I be open minded? Is this a cultural phenomenon?

How are you meeting these girls? If it is through social circle, then it is ok to meet them.

I don't recall a girl asking me if she could bring a friend, unless it was last minute like in Edlefou's situation.

If you are setting up a date with a girl you met through Tinder, at a club or a Daygame approach, she is likely not interested. If she is hot, suggest that you bring a friend and meet for a drink.

[TripleG]

Speaking of Patriarch Pond I think it is a great place for day-game. While I did not succeed there (polite rejections from my targets) I did befriend a local couple there and spent some quality time reading books in the beautiful nature.

Now, at the end of the pond there is a historic building that appears to be a high-end spa/gym. I saw a lot of stunners go in there. Does anyone have experience joining it or have any further info?

[Vinny]

(05-13-2017 06:58 PM)Philosopher Wrote:  

(05-07-2013 06:03 AM)Apocalyptica Wrote:  

Hi all

Do Russian women differ (a lot) from western european chicks in terms of gaming them?

Are they ok with cocky/funny lines?
Can you neg them? Or do they expect you to compliment them a lot.
Is buying drinks seen as an act of "class" ?
Can you hold a slightly arrogant/overly confident frame?

thank you.

-Yes, they appreciate cocky and funny
-Negging works, keep the compliments to a minimum (more than 1 will put their ego in overdrive)
-Yes, buying drinks is seen as an "act of class" may joke about "you trying to get them drunk" but just ignore it
-Yes, the slightly arrogant/overly confident frame works

2nd tier Russian might be different from Moscow where I have never tried to game, but I disagree on few things.

Negging is not necessary, except a very soft type delivered as a joke.
Arrogant/overly confident frame especially when it gives out a player in you can hurt you a lot.

I wrote a post about Russian women a while ago
http://www.igcasanova.com/how-to-date-russian-women/

You can sum it up in three words: be like Putin!

This thread is like a graveyard. Some pages consist of posts entirely by banned members. Even looking through this thread is bad luck.

[churros]

Thanks for the advice guys.

One more thing: this three date rule. Do you cut them off after three? Thank God I did my research before getting over here, because these girls are not putting out. What's the appropriate method to escalate? What are conventions of PDA? It feels like a different world out here.

What about hugging? In the USA, I usually do this as an introduction to break down the physical barrer. But they don't seem to expect it here. It's quite cute, they actually give me a real hug! This made me realise yet again how fake US culture is, with its bullshit perfunctory hugs.

(05-09-2017 02:54 PM)Dantes Wrote:  

Russian girls are emotional even though they don't always express their feelings outwardly, especially to people they don't know well. They are sexual but they want to connect with men emotionally and intellectually.

It's actually kind of amazing. I almost get the same pleasure from dating that I do from sex in the west. The girls here are smarter, dress better, and value their sexuality. US women are slobs in comparison.

And I thought this forum was just being jaded about the West. Now I've seen it with my own eyes, holy shit.

[betterasianbrother]

(05-15-2017 01:08 AM)churros Wrote:  

Thanks for the advice guys.

One more thing: this three date rule. Do you cut them off after three? Thank God I did my research before getting over here, because these girls are not putting out. What's the appropriate method to escalate? What are conventions of PDA? It feels like a different world out here.

What about hugging? In the USA, I usually do this as an introduction to break down the physical barrer. But they don't seem to expect it here. It's quite cute, they actually give me a real hug! This made me realise yet again how fake US culture is, with its bullshit perfunctory hugs.

(05-09-2017 02:54 PM)Dantes Wrote:  

Russian girls are emotional even though they don't always express their feelings outwardly, especially to people they don't know well. They are sexual but they want to connect with men emotionally and intellectually.

It's actually kind of amazing. I almost get the same pleasure from dating that I do from sex in the west. The girls here are smarter, dress better, and value their sexuality. US women are slobs in comparison.

And I thought this forum was just being jaded about the West. Now I've seen it with my own eyes, holy shit.

Let me sum it up for you:

- If a Russian girl is drinking freely on a date (and en route to getting drunk -- although they don't get drunk very easily), she is basically letting you know that she is DTF that night, and it's up to you to escalate properly and not screw up.
- Lots of touching really helps to escalate, especially if they are younger/prudish (no creepy/rapist groping -- hold her hand firmly while making deep conversation, make subtle but "risque" touches on her knees under the table); less effective if she is a seasoned slut/man-eater.
- Russian women are alpha females with decisive judgments, and they usually know if they are willing to fuck you within minutes of meeting you. First impression is everything with them, and if they smelled weakness at the start, they've probably friendzoned/Ice-Queen'd you already.
- Like many of the banned Russia playas have mentioned, direct game is the only game really (unless you are French or superb at dancing salsa). You must be direct and bold with your intent, but operate smoothly and cooly while at it, no clowning.
- They sometimes test your persistence. However, if she is still answering and willing to meet up, and allowing for escalation, then it could be very close.

Every Russian girl I've ever closed was in 3 dates or less, with at least a spectacular BJ on date #1. Granted, these are Russian girls living and working/studying in Asia so might be slight varied in their behaviour. In fact, they are put on massive pedestals in Asia so might possibly be more difficult here than in their native environment, however at the same time they are definitely more corrupted/Westernized than some of the devushkas back home.

[TripleG]

(05-15-2017 11:31 AM)betterasianbrother Wrote:  

(05-15-2017 01:08 AM)churros Wrote:  

Thanks for the advice guys.

One more thing: this three date rule. Do you cut them off after three? Thank God I did my research before getting over here, because these girls are not putting out. What's the appropriate method to escalate? What are conventions of PDA? It feels like a different world out here.

What about hugging? In the USA, I usually do this as an introduction to break down the physical barrer. But they don't seem to expect it here. It's quite cute, they actually give me a real hug! This made me realise yet again how fake US culture is, with its bullshit perfunctory hugs.

(05-09-2017 02:54 PM)Dantes Wrote:  

Russian girls are emotional even though they don't always express their feelings outwardly, especially to people they don't know well. They are sexual but they want to connect with men emotionally and intellectually.

It's actually kind of amazing. I almost get the same pleasure from dating that I do from sex in the west. The girls here are smarter, dress better, and value their sexuality. US women are slobs in comparison.

And I thought this forum was just being jaded about the West. Now I've seen it with my own eyes, holy shit.

Let me sum it up for you:

- If a Russian girl is drinking freely on a date (and en route to getting drunk -- although they don't get drunk very easily), she is basically letting you know that she is DTF that night, and it's up to you to escalate properly and not screw up.
- Lots of touching really helps to escalate, especially if they are younger/prudish (no creepy/rapist groping -- hold her hand firmly while making deep conversation, make subtle but "risque" touches on her knees under the table); less effective if she is a seasoned slut/man-eater.
- Russian women are alpha females with decisive judgments, and they usually know if they are willing to fuck you within minutes of meeting you. First impression is everything with them, and if they smelled weakness at the start, they've probably friendzoned/Ice-Queen'd you already.
- Like many of the banned Russia playas have mentioned, direct game is the only game really (unless you are French or superb at dancing salsa). You must be direct and bold with your intent, but operate smoothly and cooly while at it, no clowning.
- They sometimes test your persistence. However, if she is still answering and willing to meet up, and allowing for escalation, then it could be very close.

Every Russian girl I've ever closed was in 3 dates or less, with at least a spectacular BJ on date #1. Granted, these are Russian girls living and working/studying in Asia so might be slight varied in their behaviour. In fact, they are put on massive pedestals in Asia so might possibly be more difficult here than in their native environment, however at the same time they are definitely more corrupted/Westernized than some of the devushkas back home.

Sorry bro, gotta call you out on this.

Have you actually been to a 1st tier Russian city like Moscow or St. Petersburg and gamed on the streets? I've personally met some of the best pick-up artists on these forums and have been on many dates and seen no such easy action, but on the contrary lot's of shit tests...maybe my target demographic is different from yours as I usually go for older, college educated women who I meet via regular game and am no casanova but to expect a bang on a normal (non night-club) first date in Moscow is foolishness.

[icrus]

Couldn't agree more on this. I cannot comment on diaspora Russians, but at home, you are facing very long odds to get action on the first date without alcohol.

Also, y'all are invited to come with me and approach 100 18-25yo girls off the street and ask them about their attitudes about BJs. I am willing to bet you 200 quid that the majority is gonna tell you they find it more intimate than P in V and it's something they reserve for their boyfriends. That is exactly the observation I have made and I've had a solid amount of girls here. Majority of Russian girls just plain suck at sucking, I've no idea where you meet these pornstar type of girls.

The rest of your advice is spot on though.

[betterasianbrother]

(05-16-2017 12:56 AM)icrus Wrote:  

Couldn't agree more on this. I cannot comment on diaspora Russians, but at home, you are facing very long odds to get action on the first date without alcohol.

Also, y'all are invited to come with me and approach 100 18-25yo girls off the street and ask them about their attitudes about BJs. I am willing to bet you 200 quid that the majority is gonna tell you they find it more intimate than P in V and it's something they reserve for their boyfriends. That is exactly the observation I have made and I've had a solid amount of girls here. Majority of Russian girls just plain suck at sucking, I've no idea where you meet these pornstar type of girls.

The rest of your advice is spot on though.

Guess luck has been on my side then. Either that or the Russian diaspora abroad is being well-represented.

Although, my own experience aside, I believe it has been well-documented by the experiences of many others that the average BJ skill and enthusiasm of FSU women is well above their sisters of other origins.

[churros]

Everyone keeps coming back to alchohol, but I've don't have time to stay up all night drinking with these chicks. No work around?

[Beirut]

Champagne gets into the blood stream quicker

[betterasianbrother]

(05-09-2017 02:06 PM)betterasianbrother Wrote:  

Reviving this old thread. Some nuggets from Prosal, too bad he's banned now.

Anybody have experience with young Russian girls? I'm talking like 18 year olds. The below happened to me recently and I'm a bit lost in my analysis:


I met a young Russian girl on the street after a night out and went direct but charismatic/charming, great confident frame and always leading, followed by the right escalation (kiss, lots of touching), and she came over to my apartment as the sun rose, asking me to promise that we would not do anything sexual. Of course, as is typical with young girls, once they are in your crib and the touching gets heavy, clothes come off real quick. She tells me that "she has never had sex before" (I'm not 100% convinced), but has absolutely brilliant BJ skills (as is common with most Russians). Anyway, after an entire morning and early afternoon well spent (goddam what a tight body!!!), I take her out to get something small to eat before dropping her off at the metro. During this time, while we sat outside eating our sandwiches, she asked me questions like, "What do you think of me? What happens now?" etc. etc., to which I answered along the lines of "I think you are sweet" and "ya I'd like to see you again", thinking that I should build some comfort after moving so fast with this precious young thing. Anyway, kiss and wave goodbye and return to the crib to catch on some sleep.

The next day I hit her up with a "test" message just to check in, some mundane shit like "did you find ur way home" and she answered somewhat cheerfully with "of course how are you?". I replied with some stupid answer about some task I was doing (a simple "good" probably would have sufficed), and she didn't reply after that. A few days later I hit her up with a text asking what she's doing and she takes several hours to respond saying she is in class, and then I proceed to be direct and tell her I want to see her, and she simply replies "I can't today". Our convo ended there. The vibe felt off and entirely like she has gone to her kind's favourite habitat -- the Russian Ice Queen zone. This is surprising to me because I figured a young girl who supposedly just lost her virginity on first meeting would be a little bit more needy afterwards, or at least show interested in meeting again, especially one who did not grow up in the West. Am I right in my assumption or have the times really changed that much?

Anyway, I am rather surprised with this development. I hate being a bitch so my current game plan is simply "nexting" and not messaging her again, especially considering I may have sounded a little bit needy with my previous messages, when I thought I was being "direct" and trying to take what I want. But I am always trying to analyze the psychological state of our female prizes, and I am unsure with this one, seeing that I have zero experience dealing with such a young species of the legendary Ice Queen family. The pickup was so effortless and natural, and the experience itself so beautiful, that I cannot help but slightly rue such a feeble ending.

RVF thinkers and players, your thoughts?

This mystery kinda unraveled a little bit, for anybody that cares.

Through some committed PI work (aka searching said girl on Google) it appears that said young specimen has a boyfriend at her university.

It could be that she briefly wandered out of her budding young relationship to "experience/test it" with an older guy before returning to taking it to that next level with the puppy love. Or, it could be that she jumped into this relationship right after the ONS, as a result of a combination of buyer's remorse, guilt, a need to connect with someone emotionally after what happened, or some other strange XX chromosome feelings. I'm leaning more towards the second scenario, as it happened exactly like that with a previous young Russian specimen that I took home on first date.

Shame really, beautiful little creature she was. I proceeded to delete her contact info after weak responses and a flake over the weekend. So, off into the sunset I ride, in search of the next pretty young thing.

[churros]

Holy shit betterasianbrother, I am REPPING you because I got my first Russian +1 tonight.

Day 2. Tinder 7. Shy, but cultured girl. I suggested we get shots of vodka, being in Russia... Got into the corner of some Irish bar, and escalated very slowly. She was icy and nervous at first. The whole time I was thinking "firmly hold her hand, deep conversation".

My hand is on her back, she asks: should I sit on your chair? Hell yes you should! Mid-way through the make out, we drink the third shot of vodka, and it's back to my place.

Couldn't have done it without you guys...

[betterasianbrother]

(05-16-2017 03:13 PM)churros Wrote:  

Holy shit betterasianbrother, I am REPPING you because I got my first Russian +1 tonight.

Day 2. Tinder 7. Shy, but cultured girl. I suggested we get shots of vodka, being in Russia... Got into the corner of some Irish bar, and escalated very slowly. She was icy and nervous at first. The whole time I was thinking "firmly hold her hand, deep conversation".

My hand is on her back, she asks: should I sit on your chair? Hell yes you should! Mid-way through the make out, we drink the third shot of vodka, and it's back to my place.

Couldn't have done it without you guys...

[edlefou]

(05-14-2017 06:15 AM)Dantes Wrote:  

(05-13-2017 07:58 AM)edlefou Wrote:  

(05-13-2017 07:21 AM)Gopnik Wrote:  

(05-13-2017 12:16 AM)churros Wrote:  

I've already had several girls request to bring their friends along on dates. In my book this is a no: but should I be open minded? Is this a cultural phenomenon?

I had this happen once, where a girl asked me last minute if a friend of hers could join us. I took it as a shit test of some sort and told her she should have mentioned it before making plans. She was fine with this and didn't bring it up again.

I don't think it's a normal thing at all, if they insist, tell them you'll bring another dude for her friend and make it a double date, otherwise I wouldn't bother. From my experience, it's better to frame it as a date cause certain girls just want to chat with a foreigner out of novelty, practice their english or socialise a bit cause they've got few friends (it's surprising how little social lives some of these hot girls have).

Of course, if you're staying long enough, it's always useful to make some friends that can show you around, introduce you to other girls, and so on and it's good social proof at the club for example. Probably not worth it for short trips though.

How do you handle the bill in this situation? Do you cover the whole thing?

Last summer in Moscow I made last-minute plans to meet a girl who had been out walking all day with her friend. We met at a wine bar, but I bounced them for a walk around Patriarch Ponds before we ordered anything in order to suss out the situation.

They were cool, so we decided to hang out and went to Aist for a shisha. We all had some drinks and snacks on the patio and it was great hanging out with two attractive, intelligent Moscow lizards (we spoke entirely in Russian).

However, when it was time to pay, I wasn't sure what to do. Clearly it wasn't a date, but as a man I felt like being a man and paying, even though I shouldn't have to.

Now Aist is pretty nice place and it's in a very nice area of Moscow, so it's not cheap. The first bill was for the shisha, and it was almost 4K RUB. I put a 5K note into the bill holder and looked at the second bill, which was for the snacks and drinks (shisha is always billed separately for some reason). It came to around 7K RUB. The girls paid the second bill without me asking and I let them do it.

So the question is: how would you handle the situation if the lizards expect you to pick up the bill?

At the end of the day, picking up a $200 USD tab wouldn't break me, but I'd have felt like a chump because I'd just met these girls and a bang or three-way wasn't assured.

Tough call call in that situation. In Western culture it is perfectly acceptable to split the bill. However, as you know the cultural dynamics are different in Russia in this situation. Men are usually expected to pick up the bill and it was your idea to go for food, right?

I am curious to hear how this plays out. Have you followed with with her?

By the way, Patriarch Pond is my favorite date spot in Moscow.

It was my idea to go for shisha and when we sat down I ordered tea and the girls got some dessert and drinks. When they started ordering I did think about whether I was getting played, but the vibe was good and I have good gold-digger radar so I went with it.

As for the followup, I checked my WhatsApp history from last year and it turns out I invited the hottie out a couple times and she responded, but she wasn't interested enough to schedule something, perhaps because I didn't pick up the entire bill? Who knows? Then one day she wrote to me that she's getting kicked out of her apartment, but that's dodgy so I didn't pursue further. Next.

(05-14-2017 10:42 AM)TripleG Wrote:  

Speaking of Patriarch Pond I think it is a great place for day-game. While I did not succeed there (polite rejections from my targets) I did befriend a local couple there and spent some quality time reading books in the beautiful nature.

Now, at the end of the pond there is a historic building that appears to be a high-end spa/gym. I saw a lot of stunners go in there. Does anyone have experience joining it or have any further info?

Patriarch Ponds is also my favorite spot, not just for dates, but for chilling out as well. I'm a big fan of Bulgakov, so I like the energy there and am always on the lookout for giant cats.

The historic building at the end is a cafe/restaurant with a patio looking out over the pond. Occasionally it's booked for weddings and private events, but generally it's open to the public. You might be thinking of Clean Ponds (Chistiy Prudi), which has a high-end spa/gym looking out over the ponds.

[edlefou]

(05-16-2017 12:56 AM)icrus Wrote:  

Couldn't agree more on this. I cannot comment on diaspora Russians, but at home, you are facing very long odds to get action on the first date without alcohol.

Also, y'all are invited to come with me and approach 100 18-25yo girls off the street and ask them about their attitudes about BJs. I am willing to bet you 200 quid that the majority is gonna tell you they find it more intimate than P in V and it's something they reserve for their boyfriends. That is exactly the observation I have made and I've had a solid amount of girls here. Majority of Russian girls just plain suck at sucking, I've no idea where you meet these pornstar type of girls.

The rest of your advice is spot on though.

This is spot on regarding EE girls and BJs.