Quote: (02-15-2015 05:51 PM)Akula Wrote:  

Quote: (11-23-2014 04:17 AM)Chaos Wrote:  

^ I second Bulgaria too.
A little dacha at the Black Sea coast. Ha.

Third on Bulgaria. The little seaside places will be crawling with Russian women come summer (assuming the Ruble gets a little better, otherwise they'll be on the other side of the Black Sea!). The mountain resorts have some really low-priced apartments as well.

Akula, got any numbers handy? Just curious what low price is.

Thanks!

I inherited some money about two years ago with instructions to buy land. My brother and I got together and bought about 3,000 square meters for 12,000 euros in the Azores, one of the most remote places in Europe. It's on a cliff and while not particulary fertile, the scenery is impressive and the beach is about 5km away. Although I do not live in Portugal anymore, my long term life goal is to settle back (possibly with a wife and children) in the motherland and have a house built on that land.

The Azores is on my list of places to go. You wouldn't have any insights on Madeira real estate, would you?

Detroit, Michigan


You have to take one of these houses though. They will actually pay you to live here for a few years.

http://www.businessinsider.com/abandoned...011-2?op=1

What are the rules around buying properties in other countries. As an American, am I allowed to buy property in a foreign country?

Also in a similar situation as the OP.

Quote: (02-15-2015 07:29 PM)LouEvilSlugger Wrote:  

I inherited some money about two years ago with instructions to buy land. My brother and I got together and bought about 3,000 square meters for 12,000 euros in the Azores, one of the most remote places in Europe. It's on a cliff and while not particulary fertile, the scenery is impressive and the beach is about 5km away. Although I do not live in Portugal anymore, my long term life goal is to settle back (possibly with a wife and children) in the motherland and have a house built on that land.

Wow, that looks like such a nice place for what you're talking about! Can you PM me with info, there's been a recession in Europe and maybe I can buy something like that.

Quote: (02-16-2015 12:53 AM)JDizzle Wrote:  

What are the rules around buying properties in other countries. As an American, am I allowed to buy property in a foreign country?

Also in a similar situation as the OP.

Not a lawyer but:

I don't think there's an American law against you buying land abroad, in some countries you can't buy land as a non citizen, it varies with the country.

In the Philippines, you can't buy a beachfront property or raw land directly as a foreigner, only a condo.

You could buy a house and put it in your wife's name, which would be monumentally stupid as she can kick you out any time.

I've heard of some guys in Thailand putting land in the name of the kids they had there so the mother can't steal it.

There is another risk with less stable governments or places with poor records.

There are hard-to-foreseer "gotchas" in different places.

1) The title to the land may not be clear. In the USA there are "title insurance" companies who research before you buy.

You might find there's someone who claims the land is really theirs, not the person's you bought it from.

In some countries the land may be encumbered with debts, like utility bills etc.

--The government might decide to expropriate ( steal) all land owned by foreigners. I think Cuba did this is the 1950s.

--Locals can just sweat you so you don't want to stay around and it's hard to fight back as a non-local. I have a friend who bought an apartment in Ukraine and his neighbor continually makes complaints because he is jealous my friend can make afford to make nice renovations to his apartment. My friend also has a cuter-than-average local girl living there. Imagine the hate.
However, as far as I know in Ukraine there is no property tax. People are too broke I guess. That saves you THOUSANDS--until they change it-- compared to the USA.

--Weird regulations. in Italy I've heard there's a whole profession that doesn't even exist in the USA, sort of like a building inspector but much more intrusive, you have to get all modifications approved by that person, and you can't expand an old building at all.

The local cops of course sympathize with the local guy, not the "rich" foreigner, and my friend has to endlessly cater to the asshole next door.

I am sure you can get something in eastern Mindanao. You can buy a house in Dapa, a paradise close to Surigao city.

One thing to watch out for is if you sell a property abroad and you're American you're now subjected to tax on those gains in the states.

The US now requires foreign countries and banks etc... to declare your assets there to it.

Quote: (02-17-2015 03:40 AM)mindanao Wrote:  

I am sure you can get something in eastern Mindanao. You can buy a house in Dapa, a paradise close to Surigao city.

Yeah Philippines has some deals. There was a little old house for sale 1 hour from downtown Davao for $9,000. 2 bedroom, 1 bath, maybe 500 to 600 sqft. I've also seen lots for sale for around $3,000. New 350sqft subdivision houses are around $18,000 total purchase price or $186/month if you have them finance it.

The problem is that properties in the Philippines cannot be owned by foreigners.

How about an RV?

As others have said at $15,000 your are dealing with having to live in a location you most likely don't want to be. No matter where you are. You still have a location problem

However put your house on wheels. Park it when you need to travel. Travel when you are at home too. Especially with wifi getting better and mobile hotspots and 4g.

There is a whole culture of guys on youtube living in class b and up. There is tyman too who lives in San Francisco.

I've considered living in mine, but it's pretty tiny so I figure that'd get old of I didn't have another place to hang.

Quote:Quote:

Measurements

Exterior Length 20'
Exterior Height 101"
Interior Height 73"

As mentioned in another thread, cost was $8000. A used larger class C RV can be had for less than $15k, you'll end up with a late 90s or early 2000s model at that price range so make damn sure you know how the systems of an RV work so you can fix it.

Quote: (02-17-2015 01:25 PM)stpete Wrote:  

How about an RV?

As others have said at $15,000 your are dealing with having to live in a location you most likely don't want to be. No matter where you are. You still have a location problem

However put your house on wheels. Park it when you need to travel. Travel when you are at home too. Especially with wifi getting better and mobile hotspots and 4g.

There is a whole culture of guys on youtube living in class b and up. There is tyman too who lives in San Francisco.

Yes as I mentioned buying an RV is an option I'm pondering. If I can find one at a reasonable price where I am based it may be my preferred option.

Actually I've more or less decided not to buy real estate abroad now. After giving it some thought, I think it's better to just rent when travelling. Be it from Airbnb, other such sites or from local contacts. Less hassle and more flexibility and security. Sometimes you can find pretty decent deals on Airbnb, especially if you sign up for longer stays.

Just ran into an old co-worker who has come back from Sri Lanka. He is married to Chinese but runs with a Sri Lankan crew. They went down there for two months and he bought 2 acres of land with a waterfall for less than 30k USD.

They had a drone fly around and video the whole place, its like a tropical paradise with a big waterfall and stream. He put a large ship container on it. Its something like 3 hours from Colombo, the capital, and also not close to a major city. He said it was for retirement.

Not for me, but an option to think about. Their civil war has been over for a while.

Samana (province), Dominican Republic, is growing in international and US popularity. It boasts a couple hundred white sand beaches that always make '10 Best' lists in the world. And unlike almost all of the Caribbean basin, land is cheap.

Building a home close to the beach is my ideal. But there are amazing, often much cheaper alternatives. And by going small, over time, you can think 'bigger' - or beachier, if you prefer that.

One way is via the hill country with great ocean views. For example, here is a $100K listed (slashed from $150k) home on nearly 4 acres, and it is - apparently - suitable for subdivision.
http://www.juanperdomo.com/samana/las-te...-10285.htm

This way you could own a home and significantly pay down the mortgage by selling lots next to it over a few years.

Meanwhile, assuming a holding period of 10 to 20 years, the property appreciates in value with growing tourist visits and spending.

More importantly, it is heaven. A place to enjoy the beaches with only a few miles of dirt bike riding to get to it.

There are many such opportunities in DR, and the common consensus is that Samana is the loveliest - and still 'undiscovered.'

That property above you mentioned is linked to Century 21 and in English. My first rule of real estate investing overseas if I were to do it is to not look for properties in English.

I would look into a yurt over an RV, unless you plan to be moving around. A 700 square foot yurt costs a little bit over $10,000. Smaller ones cost less.

Keep in mind that is a basic structure. The $10,000 does not include the foundation, electrical, plumbing, etc.

http://www.yurts.com/how/personal-use.aspx

An American girl I worked with in Indonesia met an Indonesian guy and fell in love and started living together and all that (but not married, though doesn't really change anything). They decided to buy a place in Lombok and make it into a B & B. Now him being an outsider from different part of Indonesia, and her as a full blooded foreigner didn't go over too well with locals. They had a modicum of success, locals got jealous, and the B & B got burned to the ground. Local police told them it was an accident and refused to do anything. Shortly there after the relationship went south, and she left, but he kept all the land that she put up the money for.

On one hand as a man, with an attempt to avoid Schadenfreude, I can say its refreshing to see what's good for the goose is good for the gander, because men have dealt with this shit in the west orders of magnitude worse with typical divorces.

On the other as a foreigner, I find it deeply troubling that this sort of thing happens. What these third world countries need to develop is outside investment, and people in there running stuff who know what they are doing. However as long as this sort of expropriation axe is hanging over one's head, and locals are xenophobic of even Indonesian outsiders, it's best to use these places as vacation getaways, and little more.

Even as a Canadian I'd be fearful of buying property in the US now. It likely wont be taken by the gov't, but all it takes is an over zealous border agent arbitrarily deciding you're spending a little too much time down there, and you can effectively be banned from your property.

Quote: (03-08-2015 11:37 AM)Seadog Wrote:  

Even as a Canadian I'd be fearful of buying property in the US now. It likely wont be taken by the gov't, but all it takes is an over zealous border agent arbitrarily deciding you're spending a little too much time down there, and you can effectively be banned from your property.

I went to college with a Canadian, and once they came into the USA and it triggered a search by border patrol and they found something like one marijuana seed, a ridiculous trace amount and they are banned for life from USA.

I know this person had a government job and was a licensed professional, not at all a criminal.

They just get overzealous sometimes and can bar a foreigner for any reason or no reason, you have none of the protection of a citizen.

I know someone else that's put six figures into improving an Ukrainian property and a couple years ago it looked unthinkable that they would do any expropriation there-- they still don't seem to be trying to do it, but who knows what will happen.

I think in countries with a more established rule of law-- say France or Portugal-- if you really do your checking you probably won't get that kind of third world stuff like Indonesia, but anywhere in the third world you risk hate.

If you're in an urban condo in Cebu in Philippines, it's probably a good bet, but when you are in the boonies in the third world you really have no idea what you're dealing with, if you grew up in the USA you might as well be from Disneyland.

In any culture, in any time, the foreigner is always wrong.

Getting effectively banned from your property in the US is incredibly unlikely unless you are doing something against the law. Even if that were to occur...you could still sell your property.

I'd be extremely hesitant to buy in any 3rd world type market despite exceptionally low prices / growth opportunities.

A lot of Canadians buy 55+ flats in Florida. The only problem's I see:

1. they can stay 6 months but have to travel for emergency care. Going to a medical problem in USA will bankrupt most Canadians and the hospital will sue and take your property which will be impossible to defend against due to being a vacation property. An American would be protected from losing their home.

2. Some jurisdictions will actually seize your home and sell it ,without giving you the difference if you don't pay your property taxes. Again since it isn't your primary residence there won't be many organizations that will/can help!

3. Many cities/towns are having financial issues and will look to increase taxes. Taxing foreigners by having a higher property tax rate would be possible and is already being done by excluding them from homestead exemptions.

I own property oversees but worst case , I can transfer to my wife's name. It is always risky owning property in a country where you can't vote!

That being said with all the liberal democrats in USA right now who want to steal from everyone else..anything is possible!

The reason Canadians only stay up to 6 months a year is to keep their Health Insurance...If you are outside of the country more than 6 months a year you can lose your Health Insurance. (I'm not sure how diligent the government tracks this but I do have a friend who was doing 11+ months a year for a couple years who lost his Ontario Health Insurance Coverage) This is especially important for older Canadians who are more likely to suffer serious medical issues like a Heart Attack, Stroke etc, where there isn't time to hop back on a plane home. A Canadian could effectively spend the entire year in the US but he or she would lose their health insurance coverage.

US property is exceptionally cheap compared to Canada generally speaking. (Excluding outliers such as NYC, Los Angeles etc.)

The ROI in many areas of the US has been exceptional post housing crash.

There are downsides to US property though for Canadians. We are allowed to own one personal residence (in Canada) which we don't have to pay capital gains on it when we sell it. If we have multiple homes we can only pick one. This is why you may know of seemingly very young Canadians with real estate holdings. Well off families will often buy residences in the names of their adult children in order to avoid taxation on Capital gains.

I really think if you are going to buy real estate and you aren't a pure speculator or gambler the best market in the world is the US. They have the world's strongest economy and biggest corporations and a relatively cheap real estate market. Why would anyone forego that to buy property in Davao, Saigon, Managua, Santa Cruz, Santo Domingo. To me it defies logic to buy elsewhere unless you intend to live there on a regular basis.

Why put it all on red for the chance at a slightly above market return when you can easily get a market return without the risk?

Sure people got rich who bought into Rio de Janeiro, Hong Kong etc. 10 years ago. But, those are now housing crashes waiting to happen. Maybe prices there will continue to rapidly escalate or maybe they will split in half. Atleast when you buy US property at the moment you know the price is in all likelihood going to trend upwards.

Take this for what it's worth, I'm not an expert but it's my opinion that if you are thinking you can go into any country and buy a tract of land, then put up your dream home you are fooling yourself and will probably lose everything.

Guys have tried this in the Phils for example. There are ways to "buy" land there through various business entities (where Filipinos must be on the board, good luck not getting fucked on that deal. Your only hope is to put people who don't know each other on it. People like your maid and friends gardner). They buy some piece of land and 10 different families show up saying they have the rights to it. You're a foreigner, you're not getting anything. In Southeast Asia especially they cannot STAND to see white men making money "off their people". It's ok for them to swindle their own but not you. If you have a business that's virtual they don't really care about that, but if you have a product or service good luck. My experience is that your only hope is to have something worked out with a larger existing business entity where you basically have the arrangement of "I'll do all the work and you'll make a lot of money, I just want some of it".

Then let's say by some miracle you do get to keep the property when these people show up with their handwritten titles, those families are going to turn the whole town on you. Just like one posters story about a friend above, these people don't like the rich white guy who came in and is flaunting all of his wealth in everyone's face.

You're talking about people that leave trash in their yards. They could pick it up and make the place look better, but they don't.

Your best bet is to buy something that's close to where other foreigners have had success. Condos in Asia are usually allowed (even though you'll be paying the "foreign price").

South America I don't know about at all but again, even if it's totally legal to buy land, you'll be dealing with the locals that resent you and want to see you gone.

I'm not at all saying it's impossible, and the idea really intrigues me, but it's going to take a lot of work and a lot of due diligence.

Good advice. UA is similar. Panama, etc have are better options.

I have two friends that have bought properties out of the states. The one in DR is on the north coast and he seems to be doing well. The legal system of title recording is fairly solid in the DR but do your own research. He and his wife have bars on the windows and personal security, not my idea of paradise... The other friend is a developer, he had interest in an island in the Bahamas, sold it and got out with a profit. He then bought 100 acres in Panama, kept it a couple of years and sold it at a profit. He told me he preferred Panama but now rents a condo when he goes and keeps a boat down there. It can be done, but you have to put in research time and network with guys that have pulled it off in that country. Skip any step and you will get burned...