@ Icarus: Isn't a lot of Eastern Europe a chance creation caused by history i.e. the Ukraine really never was a country until very recently. It was a creation post the USSR collapsing and it never made sense along ethnic lines. Even a homogeneous place like Poland, look at the history:

"Historians have postulated that throughout Late Antiquity, many distinct ethnic groups populated the regions of what is now known as Poland. The ethnicity and linguistic affiliation of these groups have been hotly debated; the time and route of the original settlement of Slavic peoples in these regions have been the particular subjects of much controversy"

Sure, the Slaves have been there now for about 1,000 years. You think, wow that is a long time! But 1,000 years in the scope of human history of freaking NOTHING. Humans have been around for 200,000. Think about that.

While I don't think any nation should just bend over for migrants simply because it is a fact of human history, it is always absurd when people defend xenophobia based on this concept that they have some pre-ordained right to the land. They don't because the fact is EVERY single nation currently existing on Earth while likely have a different "ethnic" group majority within the next 1,000 to 5,000 years.

Very relevant, just saw this link on Bodybuilding.com, here it is straight from the horses's mouth:






It seems like the Polish do not want their countries to go the way other western european countries have gone with regards to muslim and arab immigration.

Quote: (03-11-2014 06:33 AM)berserk Wrote:  

It seems like the Polish do not want their countries to go the way other western european countries have gone with regards to muslim and arab immigration.

I'm usually very open about my resentment for Islam and get a lot of shit from people in western europe but Poles were straight up agreeing like yup hate it as well

Quote: (03-11-2014 07:34 AM)BishesMyron Wrote:  

Quote: (03-11-2014 06:33 AM)berserk Wrote:  

It seems like the Polish do not want their countries to go the way other western european countries have gone with regards to muslim and arab immigration.

I'm usually very open about my resentment for Islam and get a lot of shit from people in western europe but Poles were straight up agreeing like yup hate it as well

Uwootm8?

Quote: (03-11-2014 12:44 AM)nomadicdude Wrote:  

While I don't think any nation should just bend over for migrants simply because it is a fact of human history, it is always absurd when people defend xenophobia based on this concept that they have some pre-ordained right to the land.

Spoken like a true American, not like a European. Define "right".

You are looking for cold rationalism where there is none. This is purely an emotional issue. If you were born in Europe, and your ancestors have lived in the same land for some 1,000 years, you don't want foreigners, be they invaders or immigrants, walking on the sacred soil where your ancestors are buried. You don't want invaders marrying your women, thereby eroding your people's ability to preserve itself. This whole "blood & soil" religion is based on worshiping one's ancestors, something Americans have not been very good at since the decadent baby-boomers took over.

Where does this "blood & soil" religion come from? From the profound dissatisfaction with one's mortality, as in virtually all other religions. Your life acquires meaning by worshiping your ancestors, because your descendents will worship you once you're dead, too. This feeling of continuity alleviates the pain that comes with the realization that one's life is finite.

An excerpt from Ernst Jünger's Storm of Steel (1920), his WWI diary:

Quote:Quote:

Today we cannot understand the martyrs who threw themselves into the arena in a transport that lifted them even before their deaths beyond humanity, beyond every phase of pain and fear. Their faith no longer exercises a compelling force. When once it is no longer possible to understand how a man gives his life for his country – and the time will come – then all is over with that faith also, and the idea of the Fatherland is dead; and then, perhaps, we shall be envied, as we envy the saints their inward and irresistible strength. For all these great and solemn ideas bloom from a feeling that dwells in the blood and cannot be forced. In the cold light of reason everything alike is a matter of expedience and sinks to the paltry and mean. It was our luck to live in the invisible rays of a feeling that filled the heart, and of this inestimable treasure we can never be deprived.

(...)

We – by this I mean the youth of this land who are capable of enthusiasm for an ideal – will not shrink from them. We stand in the memory of the dead who are holy to us, and we believe ourselves entrusted with the true and spiritual welfare of our people. We stand for what will be and what has been. Though force without and barbarity within conglomerate in sombre clouds, yet so long as the blade of a sword will strike a spark in the night may it be said: Germany lives and Germany shall never go under!

Quote: (03-11-2014 06:33 AM)berserk Wrote:  

It seems like the Polish do not want their countries to go the way other western european countries have gone with regards to muslim and arab immigration.

Let us not forget that it was the Polish king Jan III Sobieski and his Polish-Austrian-German forces who saved Europe from the Ottomans at the Battle of Vienna in 1683. Most people have forgotten about it, but the Poles still remember it:






The Polish heavy cavalry, the Winged Hussars, fucked them Ottomans up real good:

I agree, but I don't this section is for this kind of discussion - except to educate people who seem to have some difficulty understanding that Poland is not liberal america and you can't come waltzing in there with liberal slogans of the evil European or how no one has the right to any country. I do think there are quite a lot of either americans or young europeans (who grew up with the EU) who simply don't get the idea of nationstates based on ethnicity and religion very well. They don't get that europeans themselves distinguish themselves from each other and take that quite seriously. Many european countries are very old, some are 1000 year old, like Denmark. Nationality means something in Europe, it isn't Texas vs California or made up countries in Africa and the Middle East.

To think that those people which ancestors died through hundreds of years for their countries should just bend over backwards and give their country and women over to a bunch of foreigners is quite honestly insulting and arrogant. If you go to a country like Poland with that attitude, I can better understand why you might encounter violence.

Think of Poland like you would Japan, except they aren't as docile, and then you have a better idea.

Quote: (03-10-2014 10:44 AM)Booyah Wrote:  

Also I've noticed one think, Asians and Black guys have no problem at all, why? because they're being friendly to everyone.

When guys from southern Europe come to Poland they act like they were pro, they like to be really loudy, they tend to make some rude comments in loudness etc.

Majority of the polish lads are hitting the gym or do some mma/box/bjj trainings, it's quite popular here while southern has mostly only big mouth and when it comes to something, they end up with bleeding nose.

I know how it's because I know southern nature

I barely see Asians here, although there are quite a few black dudes and some are loud and act like they"run the place" although I don't believe that justifies any kind of violence.

You would be surprised to know how popular contact sports are in Spain. There is not a single small town/village in my area (Valencia) without a kickboxing gym, and I am not exaggerating. Also, from what I know, guys who train seriously, very rarely would start a fight for no reason.

I think that the more "international" a club is, the safer you will be. If however you look foreigner (dark skin etc) and you go out on a Saturday night to a club where people there are predominantly Poles, I would label that as risky. A couple of clubs in Wroclaw I would avoid in such nights are:

bezsennosc/ insomnia -Here is where my friend got assaulted,I'ts good on weekday nights where they do student parties.

Eter- I never go here anyways due to the massive sausage fest problem, fights are common any night of the week, even between trashy girls. Some Erasmus still go there though.

GAP- I was there only once and it looked like a convention for cancer patients or something, it was full of skinheads. I went there with an Italian friend and we got bad looks everywhere. There were a few hot girls though.

When the term 'Asian' is mentioned I always thinks it applies to me, but then I remember in america an 'asian' is a person with oriental features.

The problem is that foreigners mostly don't know which clubs are worth to go or should be avoid, there are some clubs where even locals are not coming.

Quote: (03-11-2014 09:55 AM)bojangles Wrote:  

When the term 'Asian' is mentioned I always thinks it applies to me, but then I remember in america an 'asian' is a person with oriental features.

In America, Asian is usually applied to Koreans, Chinese, Thais, Japanese, Vietnamese, Cambodians and areas around there. I know I left off a few, apologies.

In my travel experiences, it seems Indians and Pakistanis are included in the Asian term. But they are excluded from the Asian term in the states. A good buddy of mine is Indian and always is referred to as Indian not Asian in America.

Quote: (03-11-2014 11:04 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

Quote: (03-11-2014 09:55 AM)bojangles Wrote:  

When the term 'Asian' is mentioned I always thinks it applies to me, but then I remember in america an 'asian' is a person with oriental features.

In America, Asian is usually applied to Koreans, Chinese, Thais, Japanese, Vietnamese, Cambodians and areas around there. I know I left off a few, apologies.

In my travel experiences, it seems Indians and Pakistanis are included in the Asian term. But they are excluded from the Asian term in the states. A good buddy of mine is Indian and always is referred to as Indian not Asian in America.

Totally off topic, but while we're on the subject of what constitutes Asians in America, there is a hilarious tendancy of creepy Indian dudes to join "Asian" organizations here for the sole purpose of banging Asian girls. Technically, from a US government point of view, Indians are indeed grouped under the Asian category as a result of lobbying carried out by Indians back in the 80s to qualify for minority small business loans. However, Indians view themselves (and are viewed in turn) as a distinct group and have their own Indian American organizations. You only ever see Indian dudes, not girls join the Asian American groups where they are the only non-oriental members. I wonder how the other members view this kind of sneakery, lol.

Quote: (03-11-2014 11:04 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

Quote: (03-11-2014 09:55 AM)bojangles Wrote:  

When the term 'Asian' is mentioned I always thinks it applies to me, but then I remember in america an 'asian' is a person with oriental features.

In America, Asian is usually applied to Koreans, Chinese, Thais, Japanese, Vietnamese, Cambodians and areas around there. I know I left off a few, apologies.

In my travel experiences, it seems Indians and Pakistanis are included in the Asian term. But they are excluded from the Asian term in the states. A good buddy of mine is Indian and always is referred to as Indian not Asian in America.

Yeah in the UK Asian refers to geographical South Asians (Indians/Pakistanis/Bangladeshis etc). Asian in terms of Oriental is almost universally just referred to as 'Chinese' lol.

A good mate of mine is of Burmese extraction and he gets pissed off when people just refer to him as "that Chinese guy" when it reality he looks a lot closer to Thai than Chinese.

Quote: (03-11-2014 12:50 PM)Teedub Wrote:  

Quote: (03-11-2014 11:04 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

Quote: (03-11-2014 09:55 AM)bojangles Wrote:  

When the term 'Asian' is mentioned I always thinks it applies to me, but then I remember in america an 'asian' is a person with oriental features.

In America, Asian is usually applied to Koreans, Chinese, Thais, Japanese, Vietnamese, Cambodians and areas around there. I know I left off a few, apologies.

In my travel experiences, it seems Indians and Pakistanis are included in the Asian term. But they are excluded from the Asian term in the states. A good buddy of mine is Indian and always is referred to as Indian not Asian in America.

Yeah in the UK Asian refers to geographical South Asians (Indians/Pakistanis/Bangladeshis etc). Asian in terms of Oriental is almost universally just referred to as 'Chinese' lol.

A good mate of mine is of Burmese extraction and he gets pissed off when people just refer to him as "that Chinese guy" when it reality he looks a lot closer to Thai than Chinese.

Some people even get bent being called Oriental. I knew a guy who corrected his boss once. He said Oriental describes carpet. I can't think of the last time I heard Oriental in the US.

^^ In the English language..I don't take offense to Oriental. It sounds kind of like a funny historical term that would be comparable to referring to Italians as Romans modern day 2014..least in my perspective, haha.

Then again, many people of Iranian descent will still proudly call themselves "Persians" today.

In Portuguese, easterner is called "oriental" while easterners (plural) is "orientais."

Westerner = ocidental & westeners = ocidentais.

End of day I guess it all makes sense.

Xenophobia and xenophilia are the two sides of the same coin. I don't think Luisaceo or his friends complain when in the queu at the entrance of a club they get a group of girls talking to them because they speak Spanish/Portuguese/Italian or making their panties wet just triggering in their hamster mind the stereotype of the latin lover; or the asian guys complaining about some girls being open to them just because of the j-pop/k-pop subculture, or the turks or arabs who are adored by a great deal of women who are into their culture or like the stereotypes of men from those countries; or you black guys getting some chics not for how good looking or who you are but just for being black and thus accountable for their black cock ride experience or because they want to breed a mulatto.

For the booties of baby Jesus, being RVF a redpill community I can't believe some members here are using the same argumentums and with the very same goal as women playing the sexism, male chauvinism, patriarchy, androcentrism, etc: Provoking self-guilt in the listener, getting some kind of advantage or profit from it, not being accountable for their own mistakes and having someone else to put the blame on for their very own failure as an individual or as a colective.

I just love how none of the cards they play in the West work in Poland:

Slavery? The very word slavery come from pagan slavs who were taken into captivity by Byzantine Empire.

Islamophoby/Turkophoby? Tatars were riding polish territory looking boys and girls to be sold in the Otoman Empire and the Middle East. Their girls were already highly appreciated for their beauty and formed the core of the harems all over the region. E.g.: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roxelana

Colonialism? When European powers were taking their share of African countries Poland was a colony itself split between Austrian and Russian Empires and the Kingdom of Prussia.

Poles are lazy so Poland need immigrants to do the jobs they don't want? Oh boy.

These guys have been struggling for survival for centuries, surrounded by the strongest empires of the time and the region trying to seize their land and people, dying by millions just to give the country away to any of us just because we like the girls there and have the money or to fill it with black, yellow, brown whatever skin for the sake of diversity? yeah, wait for it.

Poland and the whole Eastern block were as liberal as it gets regarding race; their countries educated their people against racism, they supported freedom fight against colonialism in Africa and elsewhere, one of the arguments they used to put to shame Americans what the way they treated their black population:



In the USSR they even had a university to grant an opportunity for people from Africa, Latin America, Asia and the West to achieve higher education for free:



Named after this guy:



So in the early 90ies the page in the book of relations between Eastern Europeans and Blacks/Asians/Indians/Middle Easterns/Western Europeans was blank or written in positive terms so each of them had their own story written, or said in other words you reap what you sow. Why Nigerians have a bad reputation anywhere here in Europe or even in Africa while nobody no kind of hostility towards Japanese or Koreans? Two clues, it has nothing to do with money or skin colour. It's just based on previous experiences both, individual and collective.

Quote: (03-09-2014 03:52 PM)rekruler Wrote:  

Now, from the perspective of this forum, is that kind of "racism" necessarily a bad thing? I would argue that no, it's not, if it turns out to be effective in helping Poland escape the fate of "diversity" and "multiculturalism." The funny thing is all the dudes crying about "racism" and this and that are choosing to escape from their own "multicultural" paradises in order to seek greener pastures in racist, homogenous eastern Europe. Maybe the eastern Europeans just want to keep their pastures green?

Most racist guys I've met in my life were precisely those of groups who tend to use the R-word. When in another country they're very friendly with people like them, salute and act friendly in streets and clubs, call each other brother, sadiq, kanka, whatever. The truth behind curtains might be they are self-hating [...] (fill the gap) who abhor their own kind, to find refugee in a place where people like him are rara avis leaving oceans and continents between them and their homeland. And I can't blame them, if I lived in Lagos or El Cairo I'd flee at the least opportunity. Then, when looking for partners they just want to date outside their own community, maybe in the pursuit of having siblings that look so different from themselves as possible. I've heard so many times my muslim friends praising the virtues of the muslim woman, just to end up with a Russian atheist And I've never seen any of my black friends hitting on black girls either, all are dating spaniards, romanian, colombian, argentinian... the unblacker the better, the only black guys with a black wife are those who had one back in Africa.

All that delusional "we are just looking for a more traditional kind of women" is just a big pile of bullshit. You won't find more traditional women than in countries like Haiti, India or Nigeria but for some reason that would be the last place where any man from any race would look for one. You just don't leave Detroit or New Orleans to go to Africa to look for family oriented sistas. It's not just the bad attitude and unfeminity of your silky-voiced afro-american women, it's just there are beautiful (and ugly) women among all races but not all races of women are equally beautiful.

Would any of you go to Ukraine looking for this:



or this:

Quote: (03-09-2014 06:34 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

Now, from the perspective of this forum, is that kind of "racism" necessarily a bad thing? I would argue that no, it's not, if it turns out to be effective in helping Poland escape the fate of "diversity" and "multiculturalism." The funny thing is all the dudes crying about "racism" and this and that are choosing to escape from their own "multicultural" paradises in order to seek greener pastures in racist, homogenous eastern Europe. Maybe the eastern Europeans just want to keep their pastures green?

Amen. It's like when one find abroad a heavenly beach, clean, uncrowded, and authentical and then complains there is no electricity, nowhere to see the superbowl, he cannot find his favourite kind of beer from home, natives not speaking your language, you don't like local food, etc. Man if you want to be home stay home and leave this little piece of paradise as it is. Don't want it to become so shitty as the place you come from.

Quote: (03-11-2014 10:49 AM)Booyah Wrote:  

The problem is that foreigners mostly don't know which clubs are worth to go or should be avoid, there are some clubs where even locals are not coming.

There is also an attitude problem. Luisaceo, tío, how many times have you witnessed your Southern European friends performing unnecesary displays of wealth, being disrespectful to the country or it's symbols (remember those retardeds in Latvia: http://www.elperiodicodearagon.com/m/not...889.html), complaining about local food, weather, people, mindset, etc. It's the fucking "no me hace falta hablar polaco" attitude. Not understanding we are not in Kansas anymore and that we have to fit in the place we are and not the other way. The overwhelming majority of people treat other fairly when we earn their respect. I've witnessed similar contempt against people from Iran in Kuala Lumpur, they behave like they own the place, treat malaysians as lower, come in the country ilegally, are usually involved in scams and ilegal activities, they're "bad muslims", etc. Then persians don't understand the bad attitude towards them there and don't even wonder what their compatriots are doing to run up such a negative reputation.

It's not passports or skin colours what causes all the troubles. When we are abroad we are ambassors of our countries, and whatever we do will have consequences in our fellow country men who come next.

And keep in mind that even if they HATE your kind for whatever the reason but you are polite, respectful, show interest in their country, are honest in the end they'll be friendly, accept you, or at least they will tolerate you presence. And in their racist/xenophobic minds you'll be the exception to their rule or even make him question their previous point of view. In the end we are judged for what we do, full stop.

One other thing: are third world migrants moving to Poland really to bang Polish women and take over the culture, or are they just willing to work harder for less pay in crap jobs? I imagine its the jobs issue which brings me to the point that every society is responsible for itself. If people do not want to work hard enough or have a sense of entitlement then you should expect that they will be over run by other humans that do. That is basically natural selection that will always rein supreme over what we call borders and laws.

Apply that to America. It use to be that white Americans studied science, medicine, CS, engineering, and math back in the pre 1960's. Now they basically don't so Indians and Asians have filled the gap. Hell, arguably the tech revolution in America would not have occurred without the influx of Asian and Indian tech immigration.

This also applies to Mexicans. Say what you want but they work ten times as hard for half the wages of a white or black American. White and black Americans simply do not want to work hard for crap jobs compared to Mexican. They have a sense of entitlement.

So sure I get that no society should spread its legs to get creamed by an outside group, but at the same time each society is really responsible for its own downfall. If you cannot compete with the scrummy dirty immigrant even though you think you have a superior culture than LOL that is completely on you.

Quote: (03-11-2014 04:13 PM)Don Juan Tenorio Wrote:  

Xenophobia and xenophilia are the two sides of the same coin. (...) For the booties of baby Jesus, being RVF a redpill community I can't believe some members here are using the same argumentums and with the very same goal as women playing the sexism, male chauvinism, patriarchy, androcentrism, etc: Provoking self-guilt in the listener, getting some kind of advantage or profit from it, not being accountable for their own mistakes and having someone else to put the blame on for their very own failure as an individual or as a colective. I just love how none of the cards they play in the West work in Poland:

What a tour de force! One of the best posts ever posted on RVF, imho.

Quote: (03-11-2014 09:52 AM)Luisaceo Wrote:  

Quote: (03-10-2014 10:44 AM)Booyah Wrote:  

Also I've noticed one think, Asians and Black guys have no problem at all, why? because they're being friendly to everyone.

I wouldn't be so sure. I've known both, personal friends, that have had major problems with violence. An Asian friend (korean-american) was harassed so much on the streets at night that he ended up moving home after a couple months, with a sour taste in his mouth. The black guy I knew, a basketball player from USA was in fights about once a week. It got so bad that he even stopped walking in public with Polish girls, which helped a lot but not entirely. Sometimes he was fighting off groups of four by himself. Again, he left after a few months, tired of being attacked. Who could blame him.

You won't see anything like this in the news, either - incidents like this go unreported. If I was a black foreigner, I'd personally skip eastern europe entirely - but if you don't mind fighting I guess the risk might be worth it to some.

Quote: (03-11-2014 04:26 PM)nomadicdude Wrote:  

One other thing: are third world migrants moving to Poland really to bang Polish women and take over the culture, or are they just willing to work harder for less pay in crap jobs? I imagine its the jobs issue which brings me to the point that every society is responsible for itself. If people do not want to work hard enough or have a sense of entitlement then you should expect that they will be over run by other humans that do. That is basically natural selection that will always rein supreme over what we call borders and laws.

That is mostly a bunch of libertarian bullshit.

What is society? Society is composed of millions of individuals with conflicting interests. The truth is that the capitalists have extreme power and labor has virtually no power these days, especially since white-collar workers are too effeminate to organize themselves. To make matters worse, too many white-collar workers believe they are part of the capitalist class, too, when in fact they are glorified labor, fungible cogs in the machine.

Am I a communist? No. But I am not a useful idiot, and I won't defend a system that will try to work me to death, keep me in the rat race by feeding me false promises, and then discard me when I am 45 and can be replaced by a 25 year old fresh out of college. If the social contract is broken, there is no reason for me to be loyal to those who see me as a mere meat robot to be used and discarded.

Flooding a country with poor immigrants is just a way for those who have the capital to erode the power of labor even further. Does anyone believe that there is a shortage of Americans in STEM? There isn't!! What there is is a shortage of qualified Americans willing to work for peanuts with no career prospects. Better hire some Indians, who will work as slaves for a decade, then save enough, and retire in India at 35.

You know, there's also a shortage of Playboy bunnies willing to have sex with broke Reddit omegas for free.

The Polish soldiers and civilians who died in WWII fighting the Nazi and Soviet invaders did so so that their children could inherit the land and live a better life than theirs. They did not sacrifice themselves to have their land invaded by foreigners. They did not die for their country, so that 70 years later a bunch of 3rd world immigrants could lower the leverage of their great-grandchildren and force them to work for peanuts and have no financial means to procreate and ensure the survival of the Polish people.

Globalization is great if you're an investor. It's hell if you're labor. Not being able to tell whether one is an investor or labor is a sign of extreme stupidity. It is amazing that so many high-IQ aspies make this mistake.

Quote: (03-11-2014 04:26 PM)nomadicdude Wrote:  

One other thing: are third world migrants moving to Poland really to bang Polish women and take over the culture, or are they just willing to work harder for less pay in crap jobs? I imagine its the jobs issue which brings me to the point that every society is responsible for itself. If people do not want to work hard enough or have a sense of entitlement then you should expect that they will be over run by other humans that do. That is basically natural selection that will always rein supreme over what we call borders and laws.

Apply that to America. It use to be that white Americans studied science, medicine, CS, engineering, and math back in the pre 1960's. Now they basically don't so Indians and Asians have filled the gap. Hell, arguably the tech revolution in America would not have occurred without the influx of Asian and Indian tech immigration.

This also applies to Mexicans. Say what you want but they work ten times as hard for half the wages of a white or black American. White and black Americans simply do not want to work hard for crap jobs compared to Mexican. They have a sense of entitlement.

So sure I get that no society should spread its legs to get creamed by an outside group, but at the same time each society is really responsible for its own downfall. If you cannot compete with the scrummy dirty immigrant even though you think you have a superior culture than LOL that is completely on you.

The forementioned sense of entitlement is a true poison of western societies, but it infects equally native and naturalized immigrants as they gain the right to access social benefits in the same conditions as locals. That's why, I guess, in the Persian Gulf they systematically reject immigrants the right to citizenship no matter how many decades they've been living there. They know once they were Saudi, Emirati or Qatari citizen they'd become so lazy and entitled as locals, and will have to mantain them and their families and bring new immigrants who will become entitled with citizenship and so the story goes till the whole society collapses (and that's what will happen in the West).

I'm against against mass immigration and social dumping because scarcety of labour force is the only weapon of workers to get an increase of their salaries or an improvement in their working conditions. That's why USA and the EU are so interesting in flooding our homeland with desperate immigrants: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reserve_army_of_labour In the end low wages and cheap labour force in countries with wellfare state lead to the overthrow of the system as if they can't make enough for a living it's the rest of the tax payers who have to pay for their healthcare, education of their kids, housing, etc.

Immigration in the West is also to be held responsible for the current situation with women, not only because when labourforce were scarce one salary was enough for a family, also were not for cheap mexican housekeepers American women would have to take care of their own kids and homes instead of wasting their time in amateur theatre, art or bellydance lessons.

Last time I was there I noticed Ukrainians were to Poland the same as Poles to British (carpenters, plumbers, construction workers), and FSU students were to Polish Politechnic Universities what you say Indians and Asians are for Americans. Don't know what was the deal about students, but with workers it was the classical, working cheaper than the locals.

Quote: (03-11-2014 04:55 PM)Don Juan Tenorio Wrote:  

Last time I was there I noticed Ukrainians were to Poland the same as Poles to British (carpenters, plumbers, construction workers), and FSU students were to Polish Politechnic Universities what you say Indians and Asians are for Americans.

If you use VKontakte, you can very easily find Ukrainian girls studying at Polish universities ;-)

^^ Has anyone got bangs out of VK in the past year? I get the impression that girls are being spammed a lot by foreign guys.

Quote: (03-11-2014 04:13 PM)Don Juan Tenorio Wrote:  

There is also an attitude problem. Luisaceo, tío, how many times have you witnessed your Southern European friends performing unnecesary displays of wealth, being disrespectful to the country or it's symbols (remember those retardeds in Latvia: http://www.elperiodicodearagon.com/m/not...889.html), complaining about local food, weather, people, mindset, etc. It's the fucking "no me hace falta hablar polaco" attitude. Not understanding we are not in Kansas anymore and that we have to fit in the place we are and not the other way. The overwhelming majority of people treat other fairly when we earn their respect. I've witnessed similar contempt against people from Iran in Kuala Lumpur, they behave like they own the place, treat malaysians as lower, come in the country ilegally, are usually involved in scams and ilegal activities, they're "bad muslims", etc. Then persians don't understand the bad attitude towards them there and don't even wonder what their compatriots are doing to run up such a negative reputation.

It's not passports or skin colours what causes all the troubles. When we are abroad we are ambassors of our countries, and whatever we do will have consequences in our fellow country men who come next.

And keep in mind that even if they HATE your kind for whatever the reason but you are polite, respectful, show interest in their country, are honest in the end they'll be friendly, accept you, or at least they will tolerate you presence. And in their racist/xenophobic minds you'll be the exception to their rule or even make him question their previous point of view. In the end we are judged for what we do, full stop.

I have never witnessed any unnecesary display of wealth or disrespect to a polish national symbol. I already knew the story about the guys in Latvia. Spending 19 days in prison for taking some flag from a lampost is more than excessive, they just wanted it as a souvenir, it was never proven that they were trying to insult the country.

That being said, I understand what you mean with the "no hace falta hablar polaco" attitude. Some Erasmus students don't put in any effort in learning the culture let alone the language. They also usually separate Erasmus from Polish students in order to give us "private" lessons in English, so some students rarely interact with Poles if at all. Overall I'd say that many foreigners don't socialize much with Poles. They tend to say that Polish people are close minded ,when in effect it is them who are close minded by not putting in the effort to understand the culture and beliefs of the country they are at.

I do recall an incident in my second week in Poland, where some Spaniards were idiots to a Polish dude. It was 5.00 a.m and we were waiting in line for mcdonalds when a Spanish dude who is a huge douchebag allowed a bunch of his friends to push in the line. The Polish dude was alone but he still had the balls to complain politely and the Spaniard went all "macho" and bravado against him. I felt disgusted at the attitude of the short, retarded Spaniard so I defended the Polish guy.

Recently, I was lost and considerably drunk and I asked for directions (in Polish) to a guy who looked totally like a Slask "Ultra" (Slask woolen hat, black eye and tracksuit, if he hadn't been a small guy I would had never asked him) and he was very polite to me. He could tell I was a foreigner and we had a brief chat in English, he was also very helpful. We talked about how Wroclaw is a very international city and I think he made some negative remarks about muslims (so perhaps they are the ones who have the worst reputation) and he also told me how certain areas can be dangerous for non Poles.

I agree with what you say that we are guests in their country and I wish that other fellow exchange students were more interested in Polish culture/language even if they only stay for a year/semester.

However, I originally created the thread because over the past months there have been several, completely unjustified attacks on a few friends of mine (2 Portuguese and 1 Spanish) by drunk Poles. The latter, is a Spaniard that has spent almost the last 3 years in Poland and he told me it is somewhat normal. I believe maybe it is the attitude of a few foreigners that ruin it for all of us here so I guess now I know what it feels to be a minority

That being said, I enjoy my time here and I wouldn't say Poland is a dangerous country.

I'm non-white (from the USA) and lived in Wroclaw for 5 months last year.

I definitely experienced more racism there than in the USA (NYC). The harshest incident was one time, coming out of Galeria Dominikanska. A skinhead approached me, got up into my face, saying something in Polish that I didn't understand. He then, made a "Heil Hitler" kind of gesture with his hand, and proceeded to headbutt me. I walked away, and he didn't follow.

Other times, when walking alone in Rynek at night, I would often hear snide remarks directed at me. I would get confronted about once/week by guys trying to cause trouble (coming up to me with a mean look on their face), but I learned to just walk away quickly, and they never followed.

Overall, I never felt really safe walking alone at night in Wroclaw, even in Rynek. So I would walk fast everywhere. On the other hand, when I was with other guys, I never had problems. Contrast that to NYC, where I feel 100% safe in Manhattan walking alone at night.

It was common knowledge among Poles that Polish girls prefer non-Polish guys. So there is some resentment among the guys. When doing direct daygame in Rynek using a Yad-stop (Krauser style), I would sometimes hear hisses from Polish-guy observers. When doing daygame in the mall, one time the Polish mall cops kicked me out (probably got jealous).

On the other hand, this kind of "bad-racism" among the Polish guys (granted, only about 5% of the guys) translated into a "good-racism" among Polish girls. They were always curious about me, and it was easy to get conversations started, dates, etc.