[The Golden God]

Holy shit I just got back from taking a break over the holidays to see the continuation of this...

Jefferson there’s really no need to keep posting if you’re gonna just pick apart the advice that everyone here is giving you.

You really spent 90k on this bitch, played captain Save-a-hoe sending her money and paying for her apartments worldwide (she fucked other dudes on your tab.... 100%).

For close to 100k, I would expect that girls mouth to be on my dick with the snap of my fingers without a fucking complaint, your morning head ain’t that big of a deal buddy.

If this is the life for you go for it.

I’d really hate myself if I were you though to be honest.

For all that money you’re paying, you could at least get a pleasant slut and not some ungrateful hoe.

[Jefferson]

(11-25-2018 04:09 AM)KYT88 Wrote:  

How much time have you spent in SEA in total?

You're kind of girl was my favourite kind living broke in Bangkok. Sponsor lives overseas, girl is bored but doesn't want to spoil a good thing. They call up the sponsor screaming and crying about the cow/relative sick/emergency, sponsor sends over a quick Western Union and it's bottles on the town. Briefly wait on balcony/outside whilst video call of gratitude takes place.

Let us know when you have to take a trip and leave her alone in BKK. I'm sure plenty of volunteers to help her spend that law money

That's not my kind of girl. She lives in a remote part of the world, not in Bangkok, and lives with her mother and siblings. I've had a private investigator follow her, they interviewed the neighbours who confirmed she had no suitors, boyfriends and had a good reputation generally. Besides there are almost no expats where she lives.

She's only had six guys apart from me, in her late twenties a perfectly reasonable number. She's generally a semi-pro. She left home briefly at 20 to work in a resort island, went on a dating site at 21, met an American, lost her virginity. Then another guy, an Australian, on a dating site, who flew her in and showed her a good time. Then a Scandinavian guy who spent serious money on her, that's when she 'excercised her options', as she calls it, basically cheated on that guy with another Australian who also had serious money, and basically dated both at the same time. The Australian ended it with her when he thought she was cheating on him because she uploaded a pic with her previous Scandinavian guy on her facebook. She wasn't, but because she did previously the trust was gone, the guy was gone for good, so she went back to the Danish guy. She was too difficult to handle for him due to her anger issues, so he ended it. She briefly met a Japanese guy for a few days, but did not really like him. Then she met me for 3 weeks. Because she thought I would not come back, so she says, she met up with another Filipino-American guy for 18 days. But she did not like him, she chose me.

She's not a highly promiscuous Bangkok bar girl. Rather she targeted wealthier guys with a view to long term relationship and ultimately marriage. That's what she really wanted. So the real danger is her writing to guys on social media. Her modus operandi is writing to a guy, then going on a two or three week vacation with him to see if a more serious LTR could lead to marriage, enjoy restaurants and five star resorts. If she goes with another guy I would know, because she would be AWOL for a full 5 day period or longer. However, we are in touch every day, she texts every 30 minutes and I call her at random times. So I have a good certainty she's not with other guys.

This girl is way too smart to hook up with some fuckboys when she has a real chance to finally achieve her ambition and be with someone long term who has the financial means to fulfill her personal ambitions. So you don't really have a chance, KYT88. Sorry.

[KYT88]

Mate, you should get off your high horse. You only make around $12k max with your new deal and $90k nearly broke you. Clearly her personal ambitions are pretty low. Good luck.

[Jefferson]

(11-25-2018 09:44 AM)The Golden God Wrote:  

Jefferson there’s really no need to keep posting if you’re gonna just pick apart the advice that everyone here is giving you.

No, it's actually been extremely helpful, some of the advice has been very useful. I understand now that it is better not to invest any more emotionally, and just have some fun. Of course the current feels I have I have to get those under control. I have to write less, and generally walk away when she acts crazy. All in all this thread has some excellent advice.

(11-25-2018 09:44 AM)The Golden God Wrote:  

You really spent 90k on this bitch, played captain Save-a-hoe sending her money and paying for her apartments worldwide (she fucked other dudes on your tab.... 100%).

You got the wrong end of the stick, TGG, I do not pay for her apartments worldwide, only for my own, and when she comes she stays with me. In her hometown she lives with her mother. She has never fucked another guy on my tab, ever. And she's not a hoe, she's a semi-pro at best. She's just got real financial needs. When I talked about apartments in Bangkok, that was about me going there and us staying together in an apartment.

(11-25-2018 09:44 AM)The Golden God Wrote:  

For close to 100k, I would expect that girls mouth to be on my dick with the snap of my fingers without a fucking complaint, your morning head ain’t that big of a deal buddy.

As indeed would I, TGG, and as I said, it was morning, lunch and mid-night. She does complain a bit, but never about having to have sex, she's totally into that. She complains about money and me and other women mostly, and some stupid little things.

(11-25-2018 09:44 AM)The Golden God Wrote:  

I’d really hate myself if I were you though to be honest.

Why?

(11-25-2018 09:44 AM)The Golden God Wrote:  

For all that money you’re paying, you could at least get a pleasant slut and not some ungrateful hoe.

She is extremely pleasant when she's with me, about 70% of the time, she's great then. And it gets better with ever longer period of time we're together. She's learning how to behave around me.

And again, she's not a hoe, at most a semi-pro. About the money, I don't pay her huge amounts, I briefly would give her 1000 dollars a month, but I cut that out, it's a few hundred now, maybe 500, often less. The 90,000 Dollars racked up due to flying her around the world, where I lived, going on holiday to 5 star resorts, expensive restaurants, visa fees, lawyers' fees, a few presents, her sister's operation (and yes it was real, I saw receipts from the hospital, pictures of the sister seriously injured), and such. It just added up. But it's not like I'm lining her pockets, just paying enough so she can pay the bills and get a haircut.

[Fortis]

You're never gonna totally control a chick. They're like tigers and shit. They'll stick around if the zoo is good and cozy but there isn't a whole lot the zoo could do if the tiger decided it wanted to escape.

First off, you can't really walk around worried about the attention that a good-looking girl gets. That shit will kill your mood.

Secondly, you gotta make sure your bedroom game is strong. This is often neglected when dudes talk game, but if you're not laying it down her head won't be on right. Don't believe this? Try just limp-dicking it with your girl for a few weeks. Then suddenly go back to being Superman. You'll see her personality change overnight when you're going full-throttle again.

Thirdly, you gotta make sure that you make yourself into the sort of dude who can move on and find a new girl if this girl doesn't work out. The fear of not being able to do better is like pussy-repellent.

[Jefferson]

Thanks Fortis, I think you're right you can never totally control a girl. And I wouldn't not want to, it's too exhausting. However, in this kind of situation where she does not have a job, lives at home, bored, and social media is her life, I have to say I'm glad that all the orbiters have been cut out by her, at my request. It just cuts down on opportunities. If I did not lay down the law on that front, she'd maybe see nothing wrong engaging in chatting with other guys, she did that in the past. Whereas now, those guys are blocked, I saw her blocked list. Less tempation. It's a good thing.

I accept she will get a lot of attention from guys, because she's very attractive, when she's with me, it's not a problem. However, while we're apart, it's her social media game that's a real concern.

And you're absolutely right about the bedroom game. Thankfully that is one area where we both do well. And you're definitely right, when I put down an especially good performance she's extra sweet and purry, no doubt about it.

Will work on myself generally, as well, just in case this does not work out.

Good advice.

[BassPlayaYo]

Just hire a professional if you're going to pay to play. You get what you want how you want it without all of the bullshit.

[Jefferson]

A man can be all alpha but if he doesn’t cash it in for the ultimate prize he’s revealed the beta at his core.

You don't know the pleasure of relinquishing everything for love.

With love, the poor person can feel rich as if the struggles of his survival were minor inconveniences. With love, the old person forgets his age. With love, the young person sheds his angst. A man can amass a kingdom’s fortune and an emperor’s power but without love his worldly successes stand like hollow totems to unhappiness. What good is anything if it doesn’t ultimately reach a conclusion in love? The wealthy businessman who spends all his hours in his office and wastes his years whistling past the grave being too busy for love is a loser no less than the unloved degenerate street bum.

The Heartiste.

I am not paying to play. I'm in love and I'm helping the woman I love because she has real financial needs.

[The Golden God]

(11-27-2018 10:18 AM)Jefferson Wrote:  

A man can be all alpha but if he doesn’t cash it in for the ultimate prize he’s revealed the beta at his core.

You don't know the pleasure of relinquishing everything for love.

With love, the poor person can feel rich as if the struggles of his survival were minor inconveniences. With love, the old person forgets his age. With love, the young person sheds his angst. A man can amass a kingdom’s fortune and an emperor’s power but without love his worldly successes stand like hollow totems to unhappiness. What good is anything if it doesn’t ultimately reach a conclusion in love? The wealthy businessman who spends all his hours in his office and wastes his years whistling past the grave being too busy for love is a loser no less than the unloved degenerate street bum.

The Heartiste.

I am not paying to play. I'm in love and I'm helping the woman I love because she has real financial needs.

Dude.

You've been fishing here for someone to tell you to wife that hoe up and I'm glad you went ahead and admitted that you were idealizing the "romance" of this.

Go post under r/relationshipadvice if you want bubbly, feel good advice on this.

No one here gives a fuck about your butterflies for miss "double the money of my allowance or we're through" because it is NOT GOOD FOR YOU.

These feelings are your downfall, not your saving grace.

[Jefferson]

Not at all, TGG, I was after advice on how to improve the relationship in terms of relationship management. Some very good advice on this here. I'm certainly not going to wife this girl up at this point.

And I'm not idealising 'romance'. The quote you refer to is from Chateau Heartiste.

https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2007/07/06/love/

It's just a fact of life that love is the ultimate prize, it's not idealising, it's just relating how the world is. You can have all the money in the world, without someone who loves you your life is empty. You can have more notches than Sinatra, without a woman who loves you your life is empty.

This is just a reality, it's not idealising.

It won't be my downfall. That's a bit overdramatic. The worst that can happen is that it will not work and I will find someone else.

And for the record, I told her there is no allowance in the future. I send what I think is appropriate, and I certainly did not double the allowance. Guess what happened, she was suddenly very appreciative of what she got.

[The Golden God]

Jefferson you sound like a good guy and I legitimately want you to get your situation straight.

I can emphasize with the want to be able to enjoy the relationships you are in and feel love for what you are doing in life.

I try to be as loving and caring as possible to my family and friends.

I look to be the best person that I can in life and I try to bring positive value to people.

But, relationships are something that you need to be wary of, especially in today's environment.

You, like many guys here, understand that a relationship SHOULD be traditional with a strong man supporting a loving spouse and family.

But, we simply do not live in times where people can be up front about what they want and live happily.

If we were born 50 years earlier, we would not be having this conversation.

You, being a guy who seems to make decent money, would be set with a high value wife from a traditional family. You would be able to provide and take the masculine role and things would work the way you want.

Today's society does not allow that though. Girls are already inundated with providers and they have power like never before.

Like you mentioned, your girl had guys before who bent to her demands and spoiled her with expensive trips, allowances and shopping. Like an experienced whore, she knows how to withhold, tease and create drama until she gets what she wants.

This is not your problem or hers, but society's and unfortunately you are no match for the societal conditioning that she has already undergone.

Understand what you're facing, and find a way to not get screwed in this fucked up environment we are in right now.

The answer is to stay perceptive, stay on top of your game and never stop learning.

Don't fall asleep at the wheel, because the consequences are slow-building but very real once they hit.

[Jefferson]

You too TGG, I know you're a cool, young, guy with a good social circle, who is smart enough to be careful with what he is doing, and I appreciate all your advice.

Unfortunately it is true that you can not, or at any rate, should not be up front about what you want, when you are in the early stages of a relationship, and I have to admit, sadly, that I made the mistake of putting my cards on the table too early. I know now, I never should have done that.

You have to be wary of relationships, it's true.

I have been in a traditional LTR, that lasted almost 18 years, with a woman that is high value. Intelligent, slim, hard working, loyal, eleven years younger than me, she wanted children, she got them. And soon children were the focus of her life, the relationship changed. She still loves me, but when love is divided between children and husband, there is only a little left for the husband.

You can live with that, accept it, and live for your children, maybe cheat on the side, like many on here do. That is not for me.

I want all. Or nothing.

But I am wary of relationships now, I understand that modern times favour women. I know my girl has been conditioned entirely the wrong way, and is maybe biologically conditioned for drama. It know it will be hard.

I know I need to stay perceptive and up my game, never stop learning. I am doing the best I can.

It can't be helped though, this is the one I want, for now. It may change, but she's just more fun, better looking, better in bed, and more interesting.

I know I have to be careful, that is why I started this thread to enquire about relationship management.

It may be that a woman’s loyalty is as much a function of your ability to seduce it out of her as it is of her character, as some say. However, relationship management, I think, has to be more than seduction and being attractive. A relationship creates real practical problems, I want to minimize issues, minimize drama and make sure the woman is loyal and focused on me.

It's not easy, and I appreciate your advice and that of many other people here.

[BassPlayaYo]

A woman is not going to focus on you in the way you think. Women are primarily after resources, you have them and are willing to part with them and so the focus is on you (your resources not you the person). IMO, you're being played and are busy coming up with all kinds of excuses to escape the reality. You're paying for pussy, plain in simple, just accept it and be okay with it.

[Jefferson]

Well, I have had a woman focus on me like that, twice. If a woman is truly in love with you, she will make you the centre of her life. She will do all that you want, and come up with things you want you did not even know you want.

But it is true that women are ultra-materialistic. This is a fact which cuts across all cultures. We all pay for pussy. If you think pussy is free you are deluding yourself. If it's for free it's no good, that's for sure. But quality pussy, you pay for. I don't mean in a full on prostitute mode, but all guys know what I mean. It is taken as given that a quality woman will want the good things in life, travel, restaurants, gifts, and it will be up to you to provide that. If you don't, the relationship will end.

Now, what concerns me is that this sensation of true love, ie when a woman really makes you the full centre of her life, may always be temporary. It may not be possible that this lasts. Perhaps you have to, at some point, give in to her matrix and accept that child care is your ultimate destination in life. Usually for men who have nothing left to give or experience, other than child care.

I am not getting played. Yes, this girl has financial needs. Yes, I help out, I provide experiences. However, in the end I have a very watchful eye on whether the girl has real feelings for me or whether the money is more important. You can tell if someone is in love with you or not. And if I get what I want, great sex, a woman that loves me, makes me laugh, entertains me, who shows she really loves me, then nobody is getting played. Both are there to give.

I'll give you an example. There's a Filipino restaurant where I live. My girl used to go there with me. She saw a very flirty waitress and hates her. I told her that waitress put her hand on my shoulder and asked me 'Are you alone now'. Which was true. As you can imagine, my girl does not want me to go there. Today I told her I'm going to eat there. As a joke I said 'I'm going to see that waitress'. In response my girl called me all kinds of names and told me to unfriend her on Facebook. Stopped talking to me. I laughed inside though, because I know that this response only shows she has deep feelings for me. You see, you keep an eye on how they behave, and you know what they really feel. Usually.

[The Golden God]

As long as you are truly internalizing the advice given you're going to be better off, yes.

My concern is the fact that you are going to break down when it gets to putting your foot down, because of you seeing her as some high value prospect.

I read through some of your other posts on other threads since the start of this and you seem like you're a smart guy... which sometimes makes seeing stuff for what it is harder sadly. Intelligent guys think that there is a method out there to solve every single problem.

You see potential in her and you believe that you can control and mold her. To a point you can... but there's only so much one person can control.

I've been guilty of the same thinking in the past where I believed that no matter what I would be able to find a way.

And the question becomes, when is the effort put in too much for the results?

It is not inconceivable that you could find another girl who is just as attractive, with a better predisposition and a clean slate to work with, that will save you countless headaches.

Managing a high maintenance girl is not fun. It takes energy that you could be spending with your family, that you could be using to better yourself, that you could be utilizing to find new girls to connect with. It constantly throws you off balance into bad moods that can ruin your whole day, or even week.

As for this girl,

Like other posters and myself have said it is going to be an uphill battle with all of the slip-ups in the past. You have to consciously work on framing yourself as higher value in the relationship and make sure that she knows if she leaves then you're gonna end up with another girl better than her.

Don't like things your way? Tell her to hit the road.

I would strongly advise letting her know in a firm manner next time she starts some shit that you have standards and you are done entertaining a relationship with a girl that will not respect your wishes.

No big fight, no back and forth over text, just a simple explanation of your wishes and in a serious manner. Like you've been saying, the time for games is done so make it known that you will not tolerate that kind of behavior from your woman.

[BassPlayaYo]

Jefferson's, chick is on a pedestal. She can't be touched.

[Jefferson]

Yes, it was also a concern of mine that I see her as too high value and therefore would not stick to my guns. That has happened in the past.

However, I have made great progress in that regard. I recently was very firm in laying down the law, she complied, apologised and I got what I wanted.

Just today I told her I'm going to see someone she doesn't like, she flipped out and I simply did not care. If she were to end it I know it is her loss now.

In this sense the posts on here have been extremely helpful, and have helped me to see her more objectively.

You are exactly right, you can only control a woman to a certain degree. In the end if she loves you she will self-police herself, just like you do. She won't write to other guys if she really wants to be with you. Once we end this spell of long distance those problems will be gone, or she will do it and I have to let her go.

You are even more right about the bad moods this girl has caused me in the past. Far too many. And yet, when she then turns on the sweetness all that is forgotten. But I'm not going to lie, there have been times when things went so far that I was almost done with her.

The rest of your advice is excellent, the time for games is done, she can see them a mile away anyway. There is nothing else but to firmly demand what I want and then let her walk if she will not comply.

It is an uphill battle, but sometimes even those can be won. We'll see.

[DVY]

awaiting this trainwreck of a thread to come to completion

1) either this guy is gonna have a kid w/her, she calms down

2) or he has a kid w/her, and his life turns into a bigger shitshow.

3) OP ends up exactly where he started. awful codepedent relationship w/a borderline semi-pro/gold-digger

How do ppl have time for this time of insanity

I would say its a 30% chance of success.
30% #1
30% #2
40% #3

[Jefferson]

Great quote by WIA there in the signature.

Ultimately the choice is being master of your own fate or the ease of servitude to a wife with children.

Better a 30% chance of mastering your own fate. That's actually odds I can live with.

[PapayaTapper]

(11-27-2018 03:10 PM)Jefferson Wrote:  

Yes, it was also a concern of mine that I see her as too high value and therefore would not stick to my guns. That has happened in the past.

However, I have made great progress in that regard. I recently was very firm in laying down the law, she complied, apologised and I got what I wanted.

Just today I told her I'm going to see someone she doesn't like, she flipped out and I simply did not care. If she were to end it I know it is her loss now.

In this sense the posts on here have been extremely helpful, and have helped me to see her more objectively.

You are exactly right, you can only control a woman to a certain degree. In the end if she loves you she will self-police herself, just like you do. She won't write to other guys if she really wants to be with you. Once we end this spell of long distance those problems will be gone, or she will do it and I have to let her go.

You are even more right about the bad moods this girl has caused me in the past. Far too many. And yet, when she then turns on the sweetness all that is forgotten. But I'm not going to lie, there have been times when things went so far that I was almost done with her.

The rest of your advice is excellent, the time for games is done, she can see them a mile away anyway. There is nothing else but to firmly demand what I want and then let her walk if she will not comply.

It is an uphill battle, but sometimes even those can be won. We'll see.

It seems like some of the advice is getting through so Id like to think that this thread will at least reduce the pain to come

Its apparent youre determined to see this through so if there's one take away Id suggest is this:

Dont cave as soon as you see your hard lines are working

Your "nice guy" instincts want to kick in as soon as you see you've "won" a particular battle with this girl and so you let up immediately.

Dont

Youre going to have to use a constant tit-ration of fear / desire with this woman in order for her to stay in the lanes you want her too. The dread to nice guy ratio Im guessing will need to be about 80 / 20 or even 90 /10. If you can fight your nice guy drive enough to maintain this you might be able to keep her bitch mode suppressed to a tolerable level

[The Golden God]

^ Great post PT

Absolutely do not bail out of a situation where you see your dread game is working.

After putting your foot down and stepping away her emotions will change, from:

Anger -> Reconsideration -> Dread -> Reconciliation

No man has ever been hurt by letting a girl stew in the uneasy dread stage where she is wondering if she has REALLY fucked up this time.

At that point she has turned the corner and is actively seeking your approval of her coming back to you.

Take your time.

Put that bitch and your interactions on ice.

Cool... calm.... collected...

Not sitting by your phone thinking "man I wonder when she is gonna realize her mistakes and come running back to me so we can live happily ever after".

[Jefferson]

That is exactly what I want, to neutralize her bitch mode.

That is not easy, to maintain strong dread 80 or 90 percent of the time.

I will kill the bigger part of nice guy, if that's what it takes though.

Because I fear you are most likely right. Her best behaviour in the past has usually come after brutal dread game. She responds best to it.

So you're basically saying to not be 'nice' 80 to 90 percent of the time, but to maintain the hard lines the majority of the times.

Thanks, PT.

[Jefferson]

Got it TGG.

It's just she's so inconsistent. After she comes back and seeks approval she then again blows up in a rage. Time and time again.

It's a reflection of my own inconsistency, no doubt, PT is right.

Definitely need to NOT engage in drama, arguments, and retain a cool and collected frame.

[CharlsMile]

Man, your post is out of place here. You can't control someone else life and you might lose her the more you try these "control shit tips". To me it seems like a proof of your low self-steem, beta attitude excusing by power and money. Better you could SPEND TIME with her instead of WASTE both time.

[Karlo]

Trying to control her by locking down her social media only shows that you’re insecure and scared of competition real or imagined. Also, quit trolling her about what biscuits she’s eating or telling her you’re going to see a waitress she doesn’t like (that’s a shit test a bitch would give, don’t act like a bitch, dude) It’s very immature. Quit trying to use game on this girl, it’s not always required. You should not be trying to make power plays and use manipulation to control her if you really “love” this girl. That’s kinda sick. Let her have instragam betas. If she runs off with someone go get another. As others have said, the best thing to do is act like whatever tantrum she’s throwing doesn’t matter. Say stuff like, “I understand” and “I don’t like it when you’re angry” neither of which means you have to give into her demands, but let’s her know you’re listening. Most importantly, don’t act like a bitch.