[Naughty_Boy]

I really need your advice!

I am currently trapped in a white collar job in the aviation industry. Due to career reasons I have to work at least 2 more years in the company
before I can change the job (for instance for going abroad). Despite that I am really getting sick of spending my whole life in the same city

The problem

I am currently living in my hometown (1st tier city northern Germany) and the gaming situation became a total desaster in the last 3 years (probably due to the the rise of Tinder, Instagram):

- Women seem to gain weight and loose their attractivness after the age of ~20
- Online Game such as Tinder is a total waste of time for dating a woman above a 6
- Nightgame has terrible ratios (often 70%:30%) and requires more and more social circle game
- Many pretty women are either mental or lack terribly in personality (very low class, uneducated drama queens)
- High status like very good looks, a lot of money or being a kind of celebrity (such as a Youtube Prankster) became predominant attraction triggers
- German women in general dont please their men as much as eastern european

I even tried two niches here in order to adapt and avoid the mainstream hunt:

1# I worked on the weekends as a Bartender - It worked quite well for me on the tourist girls for ONS. But working at night on the weekends additionally to a 40 hours office job destroys your health an spare time completely

2# I joined dancing classes (Salsa and Hip Hop) but the overall talent did not impress me. Furthermore it is not really a niche since many desperate guys attempt these classes also in order to get laid


Possible solutions

I have only 30 days of holiday per year, what really doesnt allow me to travel too much around the world but there are some little advantages:

1# Flights to eastern europe (Poland, Kiew, Moscow) are quite cheap from my hometown (in both directions between 100 - 200€)
2# I am of polish descent and speak the language fluently + I have loads of relatives spread all over Poland who can offer me accomodation for free

My target is to date top talent for a serious relationship and get her to moving to Germany, not just going for the ONS

I am quite unsure if I should go for ukrainian or polish women. Lookwise the Ukrainian are way better than Polish + they have a better traditonial attitude towards gender roles.
But as I heard from a friend who went for 2 weeks gaming in Kiew you have to come around the language barrier and their awarness of being a sex tourist

What is your best advice? Should I go more for Poland or Ukraine? If Poland - what City would you prefer for high quality, more 1st or 2nd tier?

[brat]

Ukraine all the way but make sure you learn some russian before or you can go to west ukraine instead because:

1-You can speak polish there and for some reason people there consider that polish are wealthy.

2-You will avoid the all sex tourist thing(if you dont look turkish).

[samsamsam]

Maybe try some online dating to gauge looks and the women's reaction to you. Then fly there and take a look. Even a 3 or 4 day trip including a weekend.

[Naughty_Boy]

brat
I didnt know they speak polish in west Ukraine
The only I see there are logistics, getting a girl visiting me later in Germany is a total different story from Lviv than from Kiew as the flights are way more expensive and bus/train take approx. a 20 hour journey changing 3 times

samsamsam
I already did. Spoofed my tinder to Poland and Ukraine. I get less matches in Ukraine but more responses from prettier girls. In Poland I get tons matches but of mediocre quality and less responses (no matter if I text in polish or english).

From my last short trips in Poland (only a long weekend) in Gdansk and Krakow it was easy for me to date a 7 and pulled once a 6 from a club. But nothing above a 7 until now

[ksbms]

(02-22-2017 05:43 AM)Naughty_Boy Wrote:  

I really need your advice!

I am currently trapped in a white collar job in the aviation industry. Due to career reasons I have to work at least 2 more years in the company
before I can change the job (for instance for going abroad). Despite that I am really getting sick of spending my whole life in the same city

The problem

I am currently living in my hometown (1st tier city northern Germany) and the gaming situation became a total desaster in the last 3 years (probably due to the the rise of Tinder, Instagram):

- Women seem to gain weight and loose their attractivness after the age of ~20
- Online Game such as Tinder is a total waste of time for dating a woman above a 6
- Nightgame has terrible ratios (often 70%:30%) and requires more and more social circle game
- Many pretty women are either mental or lack terribly in personality (very low class, uneducated drama queens)
- High status like very good looks, a lot of money or being a kind of celebrity (such as a Youtube Prankster) became predominant attraction triggers
- German women in general dont please their men as much as eastern european

I even tried two niches here in order to adapt and avoid the mainstream hunt:

1# I worked on the weekends as a Bartender - It worked quite well for me on the tourist girls for ONS. But working at night on the weekends additionally to a 40 hours office job destroys your health an spare time completely

2# I joined dancing classes (Salsa and Hip Hop) but the overall talent did not impress me. Furthermore it is not really a niche since many desperate guys attempt these classes also in order to get laid


Possible solutions

I have only 30 days of holiday per year, what really doesnt allow me to travel too much around the world but there are some little advantages:

1# Flights to eastern europe (Poland, Kiew, Moscow) are quite cheap from my hometown (in both directions between 100 - 200€)
2# I am of polish descent and speak the language fluently + I have loads of relatives spread all over Poland who can offer me accomodation for free

My target is to date top talent for a serious relationship and get her to moving to Germany, not just going for the ONS

Not sure if it's the best thing to approach girls with this idea in mind. It seems as if you are already setting yourself up for a provider mode. I think it was PapayaTapper who recently mentioned one should not expect too much and let things develop organically. It actually is the phrase I always use with girls who ask me 'where is it going'.


I am quite unsure if I should go for ukrainian or polish women. Lookwise the Ukrainian are way better than Polish + they have a better traditonial attitude towards gender roles.
But as I heard from a friend who went for 2 weeks gaming in Kiew you have to come around the language barrier and their awarness of being a sex tourist

What is your best advice? Should I go more for Poland or Ukraine? If Poland - what City would you prefer for high quality, more 1st or 2nd tier?

Try Poznan?

There's a direct train Poznan Glowny <> Berlin Hbf, and it takes 3h10min. Then you can easily umsteigen in Berlin to ICE nach Hamburg or wherever you live...

Poznan has many universities, thus many students (foreign too, especially studying medicine) and is cheap. You can get inexpensive, good quality hotel room just next to the Old Town. I think speaking Polish shouldn't be underestimated. With your money, job, and living in a big German city, if you roll wearing smart causal, you should have very good time.

[dongiovanni]

Spend your weekends in Poland and online game there hard would be my advice. There are a few 8s and 9s and you're of Polish blood so Ukraine wouldn't make much sense to me even if the overall quality is higher.

[This Is Trouble]

(02-22-2017 07:09 AM)Naughty_Boy Wrote:  

brat
I didnt know they speak polish in west Ukraine
The only I see there are logistics, getting a girl visiting me later in Germany is a total different story from Lviv than from Kiew as the flights are way more expensive and bus/train take approx. a 20 hour journey changing 3 times

And she'll need a visa.

[Naughty_Boy]

@ksbms
Why exactly Poznan? Getting there is takes by plane or train a lot of time from Hamburg (no direct flight connection). Furthermore only the richer part of my polish relatives lives there so I thought that money plays a bigger role in this city.

@dongiovanni
Getting 8s and 9s in Poland Online is in my opinion as hard as in the west. More of them have instagram than western girls as it is their way of getting worldwide attention and the most out of their looks while living in a overall poorer country with limited opportunites. Furthermore since Poland joined the EU it receives millions each year from Brussels that only ends at the corrupt elite sugardaddies. Therefore the gap between the rich and poor is way bigger than in Germany. To put it short, imagine a similar situation as in London, NYE, LA where you compete with the rich elite for those chicks

@This Is Trouble
I didnt consider that but you are absolutly right. Would you recommend Krakow?

As for polish cities the following 3 came to my mind:

Gdansk
+ An empty 3 bedroom apartment from a passed away relative
+ Cheap flights for weekends
+ You can go to the beach
- Poor logistics as it has consists of spread 3 cities (Trojmiasto) and has no centralized nightlife

Krakow
+ Huge student population
+ Loads of bars and clubs in the city center
+ Perfect logistics when you live in the city center
+ Cheap flights
- Many foreigners
- No relatives were I could sleep

Wroclaw
+ Cousin living there
+ Huge student population
+ Central nightlife
- Flight connections for the weekends are inept for weekend visits

[Cambodian Creamsicle]

Go to Poland dude. You have the rare combination of being from an Eastern (central?) European country but living and making a good living in a western country. You need to leverage that. Speaking Polish is huge and will give you access to a pool of women that the rest of us aren't prive to.

And what's wrong with a 7? 7s are ideal for ltrs. 8s get too much attention and thus more likeky to branch swing if you aren't on her level.

[kirdiesel]

Never found North Germany so bad. Funny enough its probably the only place I would want to live in Germany besides here in Cologne.

However if you were born and raised there and are still there I can understand you being tired of it.

My friend up there lives off of Tinder and just closed a 8+ Brazilian just passing through... Germany seems to work for some and other for others.

I will be up around your way in around 3 weeks or so. Need to get the hell out of this "village" for a while.

[Travesty]

^ If I remember aren't you black?

That scores some serious points there from what I've read.

[kirdiesel]

(02-23-2017 04:20 PM)Travesty Wrote:  

^ If I remember aren't you black?

I am.

That scores some serious points there from what I've read.

I wouldn't say serious points because there isn't a shortage of black guys in Hamburg.. (if he is where I think he is).

It can help depending on what clubs you to go to etc etc etc.

[Naughty_Boy]

(02-23-2017 08:06 AM)Cambodian Creamsicle Wrote:  

Go to Poland dude. You have the rare combination of being from an Eastern (central?) European country but living and making a good living in a western country. You need to leverage that. Speaking Polish is huge and will give you access to a pool of women that the rest of us aren't prive to.

And what's wrong with a 7? 7s are ideal for ltrs. 8s get too much attention and thus more likeky to branch swing if you aren't on her level.

You are right. Sure I prefer a solid 7 with a better character than a spoiled 8

@kirdiesel
Somehow I do not well in northern germany. Finding here a 7 with with a great character or slim body is not that easy
2 years ago it was way easier than now

[Odin.fils.de.bor]

Naughty boy, in which city do you live? i couldn't describe the situation here in germany better than you. only the part when you are saying that girls are getting fat after 20 years old. i don't find them fat just sometimes meaty. I usually ask myself whether the problem is coming from me? I don't understand why is it like that and when i hear some girls complaining why the men are not handsome, i am just surprised because the girls in questions are not attractiv. It is really bothering sometimes, especially that i am a foreigner living here in Germany for about 5 years and seriously the average German man looks better than the average German woman. Sometimes i don't wanna be very choosing in terms of dating someone but if i hear so many average woman having high expectations and getting very arrogant, it is a waste of time flirting with them. Sometimes i feel like i am becoming a misogynist. Here when i go out i see much less couples than other countries where i've been to. and there are usually couples where the guy is higher than 7 and the girls is between 5 and 8. most other people are single. men under 7 are mostly single and women under 5 are mostly single.
but a women which is 5 can be 6 or 7 with make up.

I like Germany as a place to work , the countriy has so much beautiful places to visit, i met very nice people also, but to date it is probably not the best place. I am waiting to finish my diplom so that i can travel more.

[scrambled]

^ Deutsche Frauen seem to be 100% fat, of the ones I have seen (outside of German), except for an occasion 'hiker' athlete type girl. Must be similar genes and culture to 'Americants'.

[kirdiesel]

I agree on the following points:

-Online Game is mostly a waste of time (even worse for black guys)

-Good looking girls are very snotty and you need to have a certain "look" to get them. If you don't fall into a certain category then forget about it. Seems like feast or famine here. I swear it seems like you see clones of the same guys with all the hottest girls.

-German girls are for the most point pretty damn "cold" I have never dated colder girls in my life. Not ALL but it seems to be the trend. My plate is a fucking ice block.

I disagree with:

Ratios at least where I am at. You can get some parties here where you can open girls all night and not run out of targets.

You GOTTA know where to go on what night. If you don't follow nightlife trends religiously you will get left behind and end up going to the wrong spot to game and then you got ugly girls and the sausage fest. All the hottest girls are trend whores and want to be seen at the hottest parties of the night where everyone else is going on that day/weekend.

[SpursFan741]

I'm now in Poland and i will share my toughts so far ( i spent a lot of time in Germany as well, so i can compare a bit):

- German girls are possibly indeed the coldest girls i already met, in comparison: polish girls are not that cold and they are funnier to hang out with
- Concerning looks: i think polish girls look a bit better but some german girls can be a hot either
- competition: this is the thing that will make the difference, what i encountered in Germany was tons of good looking dudes for a few good looking girls, in poland the competition is not that high ( in al the cities expect for krakow)
- Polish girls are way less drama then german girls and are complaining less

[sync]

Germany is a disaster for girls. I live in Frankfurt. I like the city. Its small and modern. But for example in my fitness club. The biggest one , not in the centre. There are only few good looking chicks its an fucking disaster. Here is germany i ve seen a lot of good looking guys with ugly girls. German guys are beta to woman. the arab turkish guys are different. They look good, have good cars and game alot. I v seen on zeil in the zentre, 2 normal girls (6) were aproached 7 times in one hour. All were turkish or arabs.

Like somebody said before. Germany is a good country, but not for girls. Do your money here and get out.

I know many guys who bring girls from poland to germany. The girl gets so many attention here that she will freak out and cheat you. I know more than 10 stories.

Poland is better, but for easy lays i find germany better. And here you have a lot of choice. Russian, turkish, yugos, you will find what you like.

[kirdiesel]

(02-24-2017 03:34 PM)SpursFan741 Wrote:  

- Concerning looks: i think polish girls look a bit better but some german girls can be a hot either
- competition: this is the thing that will make the difference, what i encountered in Germany was tons of good looking dudes for a few good looking girls, in poland the competition is not that high ( in al the cities expect for krakow)

I agree with you. I have been browsing alot of the Polish Instagram and these girls' boyfriends are unreal. Some of the these guys would absolutely get destroyed out here in Germany and in Poland they are with some serious high end looking girls. Shit has me scratching my head sometimes. I don't think this will be easily replicable due to not having an innate understand of the Polish language and culture but from the outside looking in.. it really says "man if these guys can do it why cant i?"

The amount of work you gotta put in here is enormous for what you actually end up with. Just from looking on Insta you def seem to get more bang for your buck in Poland.

I hope to get over there one of these days and give it a run.

[Giacomo Casanova]

(02-27-2017 01:41 AM)kirdiesel Wrote:  

(02-24-2017 03:34 PM)SpursFan741 Wrote:  

- Concerning looks: i think polish girls look a bit better but some german girls can be a hot either
- competition: this is the thing that will make the difference, what i encountered in Germany was tons of good looking dudes for a few good looking girls, in poland the competition is not that high ( in al the cities expect for krakow)

I agree with you. I have been browsing alot of the Polish Instagram and these girls' boyfriends are unreal. Some of the these guys would absolutely get destroyed out here in Germany and in Poland they are with some serious high end looking girls. Shit has me scratching my head sometimes. I don't think this will be easily replicable due to not having an innate understand of the Polish language and culture but from the outside looking in.. it really says "man if these guys can do it why cant i?"

The amount of work you gotta put in here is enormous for what you actually end up with. Just from looking on Insta you def seem to get more bang for your buck in Poland.

I hope to get over there one of these days and give it a run.

This is a common thought when you are in Poland.
After a while you understand that unfortunately these guys play in a different league for the simple fact to be Polish. Girls here generally - obviously there are some exceptions - would prefer a local guy even despite a massive deficit in terms of game, look, money, social value. I agree that if you put them in West they won't get anything, but they use the advantage to play at home.
Hence finally the amount of game that you should put is very high as well in Poland, and even in case of success, the risk of disappointment for the quality is big.
For this reason I still prefer Ukraine, where they like foreigners, look and style are definitely more important than in Poland and you can have a beautiful girl that in Poland is nowadays impossible even if you are insider and speak the language.

[balybary]

Can you work in an other country with a in job the aviation industry (white collar job)?

Like going to Kiev and working in aircraft maintenance at the airport?

[kirdiesel]

(02-27-2017 02:28 AM)Giacomo Casanova Wrote:  

(02-27-2017 01:41 AM)kirdiesel Wrote:  

(02-24-2017 03:34 PM)SpursFan741 Wrote:  

- Concerning looks: i think polish girls look a bit better but some german girls can be a hot either
- competition: this is the thing that will make the difference, what i encountered in Germany was tons of good looking dudes for a few good looking girls, in poland the competition is not that high ( in al the cities expect for krakow)

I agree with you. I have been browsing alot of the Polish Instagram and these girls' boyfriends are unreal. Some of the these guys would absolutely get destroyed out here in Germany and in Poland they are with some serious high end looking girls. Shit has me scratching my head sometimes. I don't think this will be easily replicable due to not having an innate understand of the Polish language and culture but from the outside looking in.. it really says "man if these guys can do it why cant i?"

The amount of work you gotta put in here is enormous for what you actually end up with. Just from looking on Insta you def seem to get more bang for your buck in Poland.

I hope to get over there one of these days and give it a run.

This is a common thought when you are in Poland.
After a while you understand that unfortunately these guys play in a different league for the simple fact to be Polish. Girls here generally - obviously there are some exceptions - would prefer a local guy even despite a massive deficit in terms of game, look, money, social value. I agree that if you put them in West they won't get anything, but they use the advantage to play at home.
Hence finally the amount of game that you should put is very high as well in Poland, and even in case of success, the risk of disappointment for the quality is big.
For this reason I still prefer Ukraine, where they like foreigners, look and style are definitely more important than in Poland and you can have a beautiful girl that in Poland is nowadays impossible even if you are insider and speak the language.

I touched on this briefly in my datasheet but didn't expand on it much.

You now thats so funny after living in Germany I have noticed a similar pattern. I don't want to sound cocky but there have been times here that I KNOW I have a guy beat in all areas and he still wins because hes German and I am not. Even though I am fluent in the language it can't beat the familiarity that a local guy can bring to her. I wonder sometimes here if girls aren't tired of dating what I see are the "same guy" over and over again. That home court advantage is NO JOKE.

It works in my favor anyways anytime I bump into a UK or American girl in my city.

[SpursFan741]

(02-27-2017 08:32 AM)kirdiesel Wrote:  

(02-27-2017 02:28 AM)Giacomo Casanova Wrote:  

(02-27-2017 01:41 AM)kirdiesel Wrote:  

(02-24-2017 03:34 PM)SpursFan741 Wrote:  

- Concerning looks: i think polish girls look a bit better but some german girls can be a hot either
- competition: this is the thing that will make the difference, what i encountered in Germany was tons of good looking dudes for a few good looking girls, in poland the competition is not that high ( in al the cities expect for krakow)

I agree with you. I have been browsing alot of the Polish Instagram and these girls' boyfriends are unreal. Some of the these guys would absolutely get destroyed out here in Germany and in Poland they are with some serious high end looking girls. Shit has me scratching my head sometimes. I don't think this will be easily replicable due to not having an innate understand of the Polish language and culture but from the outside looking in.. it really says "man if these guys can do it why cant i?"

The amount of work you gotta put in here is enormous for what you actually end up with. Just from looking on Insta you def seem to get more bang for your buck in Poland.

I hope to get over there one of these days and give it a run.

This is a common thought when you are in Poland.
After a while you understand that unfortunately these guys play in a different league for the simple fact to be Polish. Girls here generally - obviously there are some exceptions - would prefer a local guy even despite a massive deficit in terms of game, look, money, social value. I agree that if you put them in West they won't get anything, but they use the advantage to play at home.
Hence finally the amount of game that you should put is very high as well in Poland, and even in case of success, the risk of disappointment for the quality is big.
For this reason I still prefer Ukraine, where they like foreigners, look and style are definitely more important than in Poland and you can have a beautiful girl that in Poland is nowadays impossible even if you are insider and speak the language.

I touched on this briefly in my datasheet but didn't expand on it much.

You now thats so funny after living in Germany I have noticed a similar pattern. I don't want to sound cocky but there have been times here that I KNOW I have a guy beat in all areas and he still wins because hes German and I am not. Even though I am fluent in the language it can't beat the familiarity that a local guy can bring to her. I wonder sometimes here if girls aren't tired of dating what I see are the "same guy" over and over again. That home court advantage is NO JOKE.

It works in my favor anyways anytime I bump into a UK or American girl in my city.

I would not say that the local polish guys have an advantage on me, most polish girls here in Warsaw are more into foreigners than their local guys. And don't get me wrong, here in Poland, tight skills are required to get laid. The girls here are just funnier to hang out with and not that cold and boring as the german girls.
In Germany ,when i was there, they prefer indeed local guys with who they can build a family with.

Concerning the competition: Yes , that's what i mentioned before, the competition is way less in Poland, so it's easier to date up. Polish guys also seem to focus less on scoring chicks but seem to be more focussed on drinking and just getting wasted.

[Vinny]

1. Take my free daygame coaching.
2. Take a short vacation or go to Poland or a few weekends in a row (Poland for you as you speak the Language and girls will not need a visa).
3. Daygame like a Mofo.
4. Get your leads, fly or train them out to Germany, get a girlfriend or a few.
5. Enjoy.

Honestly this is a desperate plan for a desperate man. But is is exactly what I would do if I were you.

[Odin.fils.de.bor]

(02-26-2017 05:56 PM)sync Wrote:  

Germany is a disaster for girls. I live in Frankfurt. I like the city. Its small and modern. But for example in my fitness club. The biggest one , not in the centre. There are only few good looking chicks its an fucking disaster. Here is germany i ve seen a lot of good looking guys with ugly girls. German guys are beta to woman. the arab turkish guys are different. They look good, have good cars and game alot. I v seen on zeil in the zentre, 2 normal girls (6) were aproached 7 times in one hour. All were turkish or arabs.

Like somebody said before. Germany is a good country, but not for girls. Do your money here and get out.

I know many guys who bring girls from poland to germany. The girl gets so many attention here that she will freak out and cheat you. I know more than 10 stories.

Poland is better, but for easy lays i find germany better. And here you have a lot of choice. Russian, turkish, yugos, you will find what you like.

sorry to disagree with you about german guys being betas, you're so wrong. I got to know many german men here and the problem is not coming from them but from their women who are sellfish, arrogant, boring and sometimes whore attention.(the big part, not all). German men look much better and have better education than turkish or arabic guys at least the ones you see here, because 8 out of 10 turkish men here are working in a donershop.
The german men are friendlier than their women and when you get to know them you understand why they don't flirt with their women. and please hitting on many women like some arab dudes do doesn't make them alphas. Using some strategies to get them is another story.trying to improve yourself to get them without getting a serious relationship is just the way to go. and many german dudes do that, just check the number of German women who finish rising a kid alone or staying alone after finishing their careers, didn't you ask yourself why german are not making kids anymore. It is just men here who are readapting to the situation that the women created.
It is just like that, at least for me