I come from a tipping culture, and I despise it. If I go to a restaurant in the US and order a $20 dish, the bill comes and I'm paying taxes and tip on TOP of the $20. May well be $30 at least.

But if I go to a restaurant anywhere else in the world and order a $20 dish, I know I'm paying $20 when the bill comes. Life is a lot simpler that way. And if I want to lock down a place with better service, all I have to do is smile and introduce myself, and slip an extra few dollars in the bill folder. Yes, in those instances, I am tipping.

The point is, tipping works best when it is coming from a place of GRATITUDE, not OBLIGATION.

EDIT: of course the blame lies with the restaurant industry with their refusal to pay even minimum wage to their servers. They're essentially breaking the law.

Quote: (09-21-2017 03:54 PM)Robert High Hawk Wrote:  

^ exactly. That's why I absolutely love it how nowadays they have a mandatory 15% tip included in the bill. It let's you pay extra regardless of your thoughts on the matter, and you feel awesome for having been forced to tip. It was the right thing to do anyway. This mandatory tip did not come about due to the absurd entitlement and free reward culture we have, rather it came about because waiter service has just gotten so darn good these past few years that it simply goes without saying they should get 15%. We should bump it up to 25% actually. They deserve it. All of them. Every time.

Nice strawman.

I don't tip in bars and restaurants. If owners are not paying their stuff enough, that's totally NOT my problem.

Quote: (09-22-2017 06:02 AM)Gambler Wrote:  

I don't tip in bars and restaurants. If owners are not paying their stuff enough, that's totally NOT my problem.

Do not eat the same place twice, they will remember you and make it your problem-they just won't tell you about the "special sauce"......

I like how when you tip 20% in other countries you're BALLIN'. I tip 10 zloty here in Poland (2.80) the first drink and then a few zloty here and there after and I'm treated like gold.

I like tipping outside the US. Tipping in the US is out of control. I used to bartend in a high end club and would laugh when someone asked me to "pour heavy" and only slipped me a 5. I would short pour after that and think the guy was a cheap fuck. In reality I was just spoiled and entitled. The servers and bartenders act this way because they are used to it.

Quote: (09-21-2017 02:00 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  

Quote: (09-21-2017 12:21 PM)Thrill Jackson Wrote:  

I always hates this tipping bullshit. Servers should get paid by the hour like any other position.

Your a good server?:you get a raise
Your a bad sever?: you get minimum wage.

If I could I would only tips the cooks/dishwasher. They are the ones making sure my meal is clean/good.

I can get the food/ drink my damn self

Why do you hate tipping? And if you do, you better not be a libertarian.

Tipping is one of the few situations where the customer gets complete freedom to set the price however he sees fit.

I think a lot of people hate tipping because true freedom is too much work.

I don't agree with you about the worthlessness of waiters. I would rather have a good waiter in a pretty good restaurant than a bad waiter in a great restaurant.

A good waiter can turn your whole night around, can steer you clear of shady specials, can make you look like a genius to your date, can leave you alone when you are obviously deep in conversation, and then suddenly appear the minute you need a drink refill or dessert, or almost anything really.

I used to work in a really classy restaurant in college, one I could never afford eating in, and I won a free meal there. I ended up in the section of the best waiter they had, and it was amazing how my workplace was transformed from table cloths to change and plates to drop into an excellent experience.

Because the guy serving was so on top of things from the start, I could just sit back and relax and enjoy the experience, the awesome view, and the company of my girlfriend. It was like a changed reality.

I didn't have to worry about ordering the wrong thing, looking like a fool with the wine list (I was 19 so maybe I should say the soft drink list.) or like rube choosing wrong appetizers with right meals. The dude came in, and made it all smooth, correcting some of my choices seamlessly, making it seem like it was my idea, complimenting me, and then my date, without hitting on her.

How often do you just get to sit back and have a great experience without having to think ahead about what can go wrong?

You can even show up at a restaurant stressed out and frazzed, and a good waiter can put you at ease and give you a good experience, and make you look like the man to your girl.

And here is the kicker. If he doesn't you don't even have to pay him.

I love tipping. It offers instant feedback to the worker and keeps him on his toes, an awesome incentive, really for any worker. And it give you as a customer total freedom to set the price any way you want to.

I am aware that there is too much tipping in the culture, end even baristas want something just for pouring a cup of coffee. It has gone overboard for sure.

For some jobs though, it works exactly as it should, and waiting tables is one of them. And even if you do have a waiter who isn't the best, think how you would feel if you had to collect your paycheck one dollar at a time off a table. It isn't an easy job, and there is an art to it.

Having a good waiter is like having a personal butler (that has been with you for years) for about an hour. It is a personal service, not a rote trade. It allows the common man to feel like a rich guy for a while.

I understand where you are coming from in a high end restaurants where your food needs to be cooked a certain way/where the server recommends some wine/etc etc but in these bullshit chain restaurants where the only thing a server does is make small talk/ fill up you drink/ take your food order and if your lucky has a nice set of tits then they deserve as much as the cook if not less. There is no art for writing down on a piece of paper i want a hamburger with a side of fries with a glass of water.

Hah. I served and bartended for years. I truly think every guy in here against tipping or who is a cheap tipper has never worked hospitality in their lives. I think it should be required for everyone to serve or bartend or something for a year or so, it's invaluable life experience. When I see someone undertip, I am embarrassed for them. And hearing their various justifications for doing so is simply hilarious, but honestly, I'm like, dude, do you never want us to be allowed to come back here again? It's embarassing. I do not associate with cheap people. It's tacky and unattractive.

unless the bartender gives you extra drinks or fast service it's like tipping a McDonalds employee. Same shit. Yet the latter you didn't tip.

Quote: (09-21-2017 06:50 PM)Fortis Wrote:  

I'm not sure how guys don't like tipping. I love showing up at a spot, being welcomed by name and being treated like a valued friend of the establishment.

That is the fundamental point. You are not a valued friend. You are just giving them money, and they like that.

Quote: (09-21-2017 06:50 PM)Fortis Wrote:  

How do guys not like that shit?

I'm equally amazed that people don't see through the falsity of this financial transaction.

Money corrupts every relationship. It's staggering to me just how normalized this has become in US culture.

Tipping should be surplus, not taken for granted. If someone is having a bad day, their wage shouldn't depend on it.

Quote: (09-21-2017 10:19 PM)cascadecombo Wrote:  

I've worked service industry before, I've also lived in countries where you don't tip servers.

care to guess which places had better service?

I'll clue you in, it was the countries with no tip culture who received average wages that had better service.

Yes, in Japan it can even be considered an insult if you tip, but the customer service there is generally the best in the world. Korea has good service but you can tip if you want to. It's not expected but they love it if you do. If I remember right, in Germany you're only expected to tip about 5%.

After returning to the US I'm kind of jaded on the tipping thing. I understand the reasons for it and don't try to fight it. So, if I don't feel like tipping, which is often, I go to a restaurant with counter service.

Quote: (09-22-2017 06:02 AM)Gambler Wrote:  

I don't tip in bars and restaurants. If owners are not paying their stuff enough, that's totally NOT my problem.

why you care who tip who mr high school drama man

Usury isn't a real job. It was seen as the worst of all sins in classical and Christian antiquity.

This story is like the horsefly telling the work horse to get a real job as it carries cargo.

Quote: (09-22-2017 09:53 AM)Chicopicante Wrote:  

Hah. I served and bartended for years. I truly think every guy in here against tipping or who is a cheap tipper has never worked hospitality in their lives. I think it should be required for everyone to serve or bartend or something for a year or so, it's invaluable life experience. When I see someone undertip, I am embarrassed for them. And hearing their various justifications for doing so is simply hilarious, but honestly, I'm like, dude, do you never want us to be allowed to come back here again? It's embarassing. I do not associate with cheap people. It's tacky and unattractive.

Ah yes the," fuck you, tip me" attitude. Part of the reason I generally avoid tipping American bartenders.

Spent a lot of my time in high school and college waiting tables and working at hotels. Then I got a real job. I proudly leave small tips when I get attitudes like this.

Trust me, if someone leaves a bad tip they're probably never going to set foot in your bar/restaurant again.

Quote: (09-21-2017 06:49 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

Quote: (09-21-2017 05:55 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

Quote: (09-21-2017 02:08 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

I hate tipping. Pisses me off.

What I loved most about living in Anglo countries is not having to tip, but leaving a small tip anyways. In the UK, I always threw a pound or two extra in when I bought my drink to the bartender. After doing this 3 times, I had the bar locked down and was getting free drinks passed to me.

In America, you have to tip upwards of $50+ to get that level of service at a bar. Fuck that.

Where are you ordering "in America?" Maybe in New York or another really high end spot in Los Angeles, but the vast majority of the country a 10 dollar bill or maybe max a $20 spot at the beginning of your first (multiple) drink order (and then a few bucks here and there otherwise) is plenty to get top-tier service. Alternate is just to get to know the bartenders a bit and tip reasonably well.

An even better example, tipping $10s or even $20s in my opinion for a $5 drink is excessive especially for having to deal with bartender attitudes and horrific wait times. Tipping $2-3 should be more than enough to get pleasant service.

You go to Europe and you don't have to deal with this BS. Throw a single or even a double euro coin and you're the man. I have no problem paying wait staff better so I don't have to tip.

On a side note, I used to wait tables back in the day as a part time job and I never had a problem getting tips even from demanding customers. The worst part about working in a restaurant was having to work with the other front of house staff and is part of the reason I have a low opinion of waiters, waitresses, and bar tenders. Even on my worst days with massive rushes, I was always able to stuff my pissed off attitude behind a smiley veneer.

To be bluntly honest, a lot of wait staff and bar tenders are utter crap at their jobs.

If you're getting sourpuss waiters/waitresses I fully support you not tipping. HOWEVER, it would help for you to explain your argument in this way (and I think there are valid reasons that tipping culture can have negatives) as opposed to completely glossing over the fact that I never talked about tipping $10 on a single drink. What I said was:

Quote:Quote:

Where are you ordering "in America?" Maybe in New York or another really high end spot in Los Angeles, but the vast majority of the country a 10 dollar bill or maybe max a $20 spot at the beginning of your first (multiple) drink order (and then a few bucks here and there otherwise) is plenty to get top-tier service. Alternate is just to get to know the bartenders a bit and tip reasonably well.

Also:

Quote: (09-21-2017 02:08 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

I hate tipping. Pisses me off.

What I loved most about living in Anglo countries is not having to tip, but leaving a small tip anyways. In the UK, I always threw a pound or two extra in when I bought my drink to the bartender. After doing this 3 times, I had the bar locked down and was getting free drinks passed to me.

I find it hilarious that you hate tipping, yet you love to do it in countries where you get a little better value out of it. Basically, you're a somewhat cheap dude who claims to be against tipping, not just someone against tipping. That's fine and I don't think you're a bad guy for it, but argue your case well and don't frame it in a way that makes you look like a hypocrite, hating on tipping in one breath and the next breath saying how much you love it when it's cheaper for you.

Quote: (09-22-2017 10:44 AM)churros Wrote:  

Quote: (09-21-2017 06:50 PM)Fortis Wrote:  

I'm not sure how guys don't like tipping. I love showing up at a spot, being welcomed by name and being treated like a valued friend of the establishment.

That is the fundamental point. You are not a valued friend. You are just giving them money, and they like that.

Almost all human interactions are transactional in nature. What makes a difference is if the person is genuine. You could be a pretty solid tipper but if you're an asshole people are going to think, "yeah that guy is a decent tipper, but fuck that asshole" and not give a shit about you at all.

If you're a solid dude and a shitty tipper, staff may eventually figure it out, but you'll have an uphill battle being overly cheap. If you're a cool dude and you don't tip excessively so, but are known to tip healthily especially in the beginning of the night, you're going to not only get better service but staff will get to know what you're about and expect less in tips and genuinely look forward to serving you because they know you're not some entitled douche (like most of those establishments deal with on a daily basis).

The servers are fine with all the people in between (majority of people that don't stick out), but they don't have much interest in providing them exceptional service because they don't know them. When you separate yourself from the pack in terms of value, both higher tipping as well as attitude/personality, you will get significant value in return.

At minimum the few extra dollars here and there net me priority entrance when there's a line, faster service at the bar, and usually an occasional free drink (or a double instead of a single).

At maximum, I rarely pay for < 75% of my drinks, they're all strong as shit, I stroll in the front door whenever I want, with as big a group as I want (nobody pays cover if there is one), if some dude is being a fuckup to me security will probably kick him out, most of the staff greet me (I don't have to explain the benefits of social proof on RvF do I?), and my whole party gets to stay and drink past closing until it's truly time to go.

I've also made a few solid friends from the service business. I figure if you can't even become good acquaintances with some service staff through social interaction (and yes a little good tipping when it's appropriate/appreciated), you have very little chance of banging that real hot girl at the bar that every guy is checking out.

Tipping is not an all or nothing proposition, certain situations will be far different depending on the general area, the specific type of establishment/service, and the general tipping culture, but to say tipping should be abolished because it's all negative is very short-sighted.

You can hate it or love it, you can be emotional over it, but I'll keep extracting tremendous amounts of value for the dollar/effort, recognizing it as having aspects of networking (give value to receive value).

Quote: (09-22-2017 10:44 AM)churros Wrote:  

Quote: (09-21-2017 06:50 PM)Fortis Wrote:  

How do guys not like that shit?

I'm equally amazed that people don't see through the falsity of this financial transaction.

Money corrupts every relationship. It's staggering to me just how normalized this has become in US culture.

Tipping should be surplus, not taken for granted. If someone is having a bad day, their wage shouldn't depend on it.

What kind of entitled, socialist clap-trap is this (highlighted in bold above)? If someone is having a bad day and their job is to provide upbeat, quality service to a business' customers, why shouldn't their wage/job be dependent on their attitude and performance? What job do you expect to be in that you treat your customers subpar because you're having a bad day and not get a stern talking to or get written up, at minimum?

Oh you're having a bad day and that's affecting your ability to do your job? Ask if someone can replace you for the day, otherwise step up and do your job at the very basic level because...that's what the money is for!

Whether they're getting paid a base with no tips or dependent on their tips to make a decent wage, damn straight their bad day should affect their wage if they let it affect their performance.

As a guy living in Europe this tipping stuff is like an alien language. It seems nowhere else in the world tipping works this way other than America and there's a lot of rationalisation for the exorbitant tips you guys are socially obligated to pay.

It's fair enough the points about getting better service, but you're paying way over the market rate. As The Beast1 mentioned earlier only a few extra Euros will get you that level of service here. I'm wondering how is it the legal system there has allowed restaurants to get away with paying less than minimum wage and foisted the salary requirements onto you the customer.

All people here in Germany tip - because they are too weak to resist the social pressure.

There is no other reason for it.

All the other arguments for tipping are nonsense. You don't tip at the supermarket, where tipping the right amount could even speed things up. And you don't tip the teacher of your children or your doctor whose work enthusiasm could have a real impact.

Quote: (09-22-2017 02:03 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

Quote: (09-21-2017 06:49 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

Quote: (09-21-2017 05:55 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

Quote: (09-21-2017 02:08 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

I hate tipping. Pisses me off.

What I loved most about living in Anglo countries is not having to tip, but leaving a small tip anyways. In the UK, I always threw a pound or two extra in when I bought my drink to the bartender. After doing this 3 times, I had the bar locked down and was getting free drinks passed to me.

In America, you have to tip upwards of $50+ to get that level of service at a bar. Fuck that.

Where are you ordering "in America?" Maybe in New York or another really high end spot in Los Angeles, but the vast majority of the country a 10 dollar bill or maybe max a $20 spot at the beginning of your first (multiple) drink order (and then a few bucks here and there otherwise) is plenty to get top-tier service. Alternate is just to get to know the bartenders a bit and tip reasonably well.

An even better example, tipping $10s or even $20s in my opinion for a $5 drink is excessive especially for having to deal with bartender attitudes and horrific wait times. Tipping $2-3 should be more than enough to get pleasant service.

You go to Europe and you don't have to deal with this BS. Throw a single or even a double euro coin and you're the man. I have no problem paying wait staff better so I don't have to tip.

On a side note, I used to wait tables back in the day as a part time job and I never had a problem getting tips even from demanding customers. The worst part about working in a restaurant was having to work with the other front of house staff and is part of the reason I have a low opinion of waiters, waitresses, and bar tenders. Even on my worst days with massive rushes, I was always able to stuff my pissed off attitude behind a smiley veneer.

To be bluntly honest, a lot of wait staff and bar tenders are utter crap at their jobs.

If you're getting sourpuss waiters/waitresses I fully support you not tipping. HOWEVER, it would help for you to explain your argument in this way (and I think there are valid reasons that tipping culture can have negatives) as opposed to completely glossing over the fact that I never talked about tipping $10 on a single drink. What I said was:

Quote:Quote:

Where are you ordering "in America?" Maybe in New York or another really high end spot in Los Angeles, but the vast majority of the country a 10 dollar bill or maybe max a $20 spot at the beginning of your first (multiple) drink order (and then a few bucks here and there otherwise) is plenty to get top-tier service. Alternate is just to get to know the bartenders a bit and tip reasonably well.

So let's assume you go out for a night on the town. You buy your first drink, plop down a $20 and then every subsequent drink you put down a $1.

When I go out, I drink about 5-6 drinks in a sitting. You're a good guy, so i'm going to assume you drink similarly. All in, you've tipped upwards of $25. That's pretty excessive for someone to stand behind a counter and whip up beverages that I could whip up myself faster if I went behind the damn counter myself and did it for them.

Even if you drop down a $10 you're still in $15 all in on tips for slow service and a bartender who gives you attitude.

Believe me, back when I lived in Boston I tried tipping well at a few bars near my house so I could bring girls to for that stellar service. I probably tipped around $300 trying to ingratiate myself with the bar staff between two different venues and nothing came of it. No free drinks, no Cheers level greetings when I walked in, nothing.

Maybe i'm an asshole or just ugly? I have no idea. Either way, both bars never had the same bar staff working consistently each time I went in the middle of the week and these were just divy neighborhood bars. I'm expected to drop wads of cash each day for ungrateful staff? F*ck that.

Quote: (09-22-2017 02:03 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

Also:

Quote: (09-21-2017 02:08 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

I hate tipping. Pisses me off.

What I loved most about living in Anglo countries is not having to tip, but leaving a small tip anyways. In the UK, I always threw a pound or two extra in when I bought my drink to the bartender. After doing this 3 times, I had the bar locked down and was getting free drinks passed to me.

I find it hilarious that you hate tipping, yet you love to do it in countries where you get a little better value out of it. Basically, you're a somewhat cheap dude who claims to be against tipping, not just someone against tipping. That's fine and I don't think you're a bad guy for it, but argue your case well and don't frame it in a way that makes you look like a hypocrite, hating on tipping in one breath and the next breath saying how much you love it when it's cheaper for you.

The same argument can be levied against guys who go to third world countries because they can't stand the attitudes of women in 1st world countries. Are those men hypocrites for wanting to be with the prettiest and most pleasant woman possible instead of being stuck with ones from their home countries (yuk yuk yuk)?

You're right, it's not a bad thing. I want to extract the maximum amount of value out of my activities.

If it makes me a hypocrite so be it. I have no problem admitting to such things.

The flipside of this however is that I tipped small amounts of cash at bars for a good four to five months before someone told me that I didn't need to. I subsequently stopped after. I still hate tipping and I avoid establishments where I have to.

My disdain for service staff comes from a handful of bad experiences working at restaurants when I was in school. We used to pool our tips at the end of the day. I was a pretty dorky kid, but genuinely friendly and cared about people. I was one of the highest tipped servers at this restaurant and eventually quit because the other wait staff made working there a miserable experience. Knowing what I know now, I could have dealt with them better, but 'tis part of growing up. Lots of back stabbing, rumors, and outright lies which then carried out into nightlife in a small town because all of the restaurant staff in town hang out with each other. Game over before I even began!

This happened at two different restaurants, both times I got fed up and quit. Once I got to a hotel, things improved with my coworkers immensely.

Thankfully, I can take solace in the knowledge that I graduated from school and went on to better things. Those same losers will continue working at those restaurants and other crap jobs for the foreseeable future.

My hatred of tipping comes from the cash I wasted in Boston trying to get bars on lock with fickle staff.

I've come to realize that the type of people who work these establishments fall into three camps:
1. Those who are working part time to get through to better things for school.
2. Professionals who not only wait on you hand and feet, they explain the nuances between the food and beverages. You only get this at 5* restaurants, hipsters places where they obsess over food , and ethnic restaurants where the owners see themselves as cultural ambassadors.
3. Failures who have nothing better to do, feel the work is beneath them, and have an entitlement towards customers expecting tips for half assed service.

The majority of the men and women working in restaurants and bars fall under number three especially those here in Los Angeles and townies that work in college towns. Everyone should work in a restaurant at least once in their lives to see the parade of low life failures that stream through. For whatever reason bars tend to attract the worst of these types of people.

Edit: I'll say this, wait staff do deserve to be paid minimum wage.

Ok let me break it down for some of you bozos: not tipping is beta. Tipping fat is alpha. Got it? Lmao.

As a former bartender, you would be AMAZED at the difference in how I treated fat tippers as opposed to low or even average tippers. Free drinks, skipping the line, building the guy up in front of his tinder date, free snacks/food, the list goes on and on. Are you saying it's not worth ten, twenty, thirty bucks to LOCK DOWN a joint and get treated like royalty? I had one guy, an older gent, that would regularly leave me a c note on top of his bill. I worked fine dining, and the second we saw this guy pull up, didn't matter how crowded the bar was, we would clear out a few seats at the bar, pour him his glass of wine, and order his favorite app on the fly. Royal treatment. Every date he brought in there probably thought he owned the joint. We would try and comp his check or take items off and he would get upset and tip extra. I fucking loved that guy. Guys on this forum are always talking about locking down a venue, how the fuck do you think that happens? TIPPING FAT. DUH.

I can't be the only one who's noticed in the last 5 years or so that now 20% is expected as opposed to the traditional 15? I spent most of that time in China where there is no tipping and even if there was, service is so shit like I would even tip (the China crew can back me up on this).

Not that I have a problem, I usually tip well (makes a huge difference in service).

My dad is a shitty tipper (because he's a cheap fuck), almost embarrassing going out with him, more than once I've dropped a few extra bucks down when he was unawares. Its one thing if the service was bad and it's a place you're just passing through, but if you're a local you can't be doing that.

Only twice have a refused to leave a tip and both times were talking waiting over an hour for food and drinks (and me and my girl pulled a dash one of those times anyways, got her good and ready - not that I advise it but it never ceases to amaze me how much girls love mischief).

Back when I was working in the city (almost a decade ago), there was a nice bar/lounge across the street and the head bartender was a guy I went to high school with - we weren't buddies or anything, but we knew of eachother - and from the start I was dropping heavy tips, $10 on a bottle of beer (this back around 2009, a bottle of beer wasn't $14 then), $50 on a few apps et cetera.

What did I get? Always a spot at the bar or a table when I needed one within reason, treated like a rock star when I brought dates, comped delivery when I ordered food, free drinks and the occasional free app and so on.

It pays to pay, although that said I do think if some greasy teenager can make minimum wage flipping burgers, waiters and bartenders deserve it too.

Quote: (09-22-2017 04:16 PM)Chicopicante Wrote:  

Ok let me break it down for some of you bozos: not tipping is beta. Tipping fat is alpha. Got it? Lmao.

As a former bartender, you would be AMAZED at the difference in how I treated fat tippers as opposed to low or even average tippers. Free drinks, skipping the line, building the guy up in front of his tinder date, free snacks/food, the list goes on and on. Are you saying it's not worth ten, twenty, thirty bucks to LOCK DOWN a joint and get treated like royalty? I had one guy, an older gent, that would regularly leave me a c note on top of his bill. I worked fine dining, and the second we saw this guy pull up, didn't matter how crowded the bar was, we would clear out a few seats at the bar, pour him his glass of wine, and order his favorite app on the fly. Royal treatment. Every date he brought in there probably thought he owned the joint. We would try and comp his check or take items off and he would get upset and tip extra. I fucking loved that guy. Guys on this forum are always talking about locking down a venue, how the fuck do you think that happens? TIPPING FAT. DUH.

Oh please tell us all how to live and by gosh also help us not all become betas. because you know exactly how we all are supposed to live.

Tipping culture is a waste of resources.

Pro tip (ha ha, see what I did there?):

Ask the bartender how big of a tip they need (cash) for "free" drinks. If they hate the place they work for, they will likely throw you a number and you drink for a fraction of the cost.

Most places do not keep track of liquor. It's so fucking bad I have a friend who is doing a startup to track liquor usage in bars with technology.

Get it while you can!!

Quote: (09-21-2017 10:46 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

I come from a tipping culture, and I despise it. If I go to a restaurant in the US and order a $20 dish, the bill comes and I'm paying taxes and tip on TOP of the $20. May well be $30 at least.

But if I go to a restaurant anywhere else in the world and order a $20 dish, I know I'm paying $20 when the bill comes. Life is a lot simpler that way. And if I want to lock down a place with better service, all I have to do is smile and introduce myself, and slip an extra few dollars in the bill folder. Yes, in those instances, I am tipping.

The point is, tipping works best when it is coming from a place of GRATITUDE, not OBLIGATION.

EDIT: of course the blame lies with the restaurant industry with their refusal to pay even minimum wage to their servers. They're essentially breaking the law.

I was in shenzhen once and went to a sushi restaurant that has a chain in Japan. My wife and I were reading reviews from Chinese locals and most of the reviews were one star or two stars. They all wrote that the food was good but they felt cheated on because of something called gratuity on the bill and a few said they got into a fight with the staff for these hidden charges. They did not care to discuss the food at all.

I told my wife this food must be awesome. Sure enough it was just like in Japan. That was the best Japanese restaurant my wife ever had so far. I will go back again next time I go to shenzhen.

Just goes to show the gap in the tipping culture between China and Japan. Tipping in China is met with funny looks and in some cases its an insult.

Never a clearer demonstration of who "gets it" and who doesn't when tipping is discussed on online forums.

Quote: (09-22-2017 09:53 AM)Chicopicante Wrote:  

Hah. I served and bartended for years. I truly think every guy in here against tipping or who is a cheap tipper has never worked hospitality in their lives. I think it should be required for everyone to serve or bartend or something for a year or so, it's invaluable life experience. When I see someone undertip, I am embarrassed for them. And hearing their various justifications for doing so is simply hilarious, but honestly, I'm like, dude, do you never want us to be allowed to come back here again? It's embarassing. I do not associate with cheap people. It's tacky and unattractive.

Can you elaborate on that bolded sentence? That is a hot take right there

I don't mind either way. In Australia I still tip but obviously not as much. Just got back from the USA and I didn't mind at all, the only thing a bit confusing was say the non restaurant / bar type situations. As for Japan I was there a few weeks ago and tipped these pricks on purpose knowing it was an insult. Just couldn't be frigged asking for my money back on some dodgy tuna (some OK mixed in with old, sneaky pricks) and they chased up the stairs after me.

Personally I think its very poor form not tipping in places like the USA, I found the service pretty good.