[lunchmoney]

(12-01-2018 03:32 PM)quaker13 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 03:29 PM)Jefferson Wrote:  

I found that women lose the sweetness as the age creeps closer to 40 plus.

How old is she?

If she is over 40, then getting that sweetness back is a lost cause, imho.

She turns 41 next year lol

yeah sad to say Jefferson is right. I know guys in the same situation as you, and in fact one earlier this week was complaining about how his wife (she's 43, he's 39) always throws it in his face she makes more than him when they argue. He feels trapped because of their daughter. Unlike you, they don't have sex, so he is starting to step out.

[Jefferson]

My wife was a sweet 19 year old Russian. Voice of an angel, face of a Victorian fairy, slim, laughing and sweet. Fast forward 19 years and the sweetness has reduced markedly, life ground her down. Still a good woman, but that sweetness of a 19 year old, it's just gone. Even if I make more money than she does. Makes no difference.

[lunchmoney]

This is an argument for guys I know who don't want their women to work, kids or not. Some guys at my job who have wives 10-12 years younger killed their careers when they walked down the aisle. Their wives do yoga, get massages, and keep the house all day. We will see how they hold up as time goes on.

[tugofpeace]

(12-01-2018 04:14 PM)lunchmoney Wrote:  

This is an argument for guys I know who don't want their women to work, kids or not. Some guys at my job who have wives 10-12 years younger killed their careers when they walked down the aisle. Their wives do yoga, get massages, and keep the house all day. We will see how they hold up as time goes on.

My main reason against that is that idle hands become the devils' play things.. if she's sitting around all day with nothing to do, there is a VERY high chance that she could open up tinder and get laid without you ever knowing

[quaker13]

(12-01-2018 04:22 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 04:14 PM)lunchmoney Wrote:  

This is an argument for guys I know who don't want their women to work, kids or not. Some guys at my job who have wives 10-12 years younger killed their careers when they walked down the aisle. Their wives do yoga, get massages, and keep the house all day. We will see how they hold up as time goes on.

My main reason against that is that idle hands become the devils' play things.. if she's sitting around all day with nothing to do, there is a VERY high chance that she could open up tinder and get laid without you ever knowing

that why every and all women i deal with now and in the future have to work. Fuck that. One of my good bros makes a shit ton of money and he has a nanny and his wife doesn't fuckin work

[lunchmoney]

(12-01-2018 04:22 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 04:14 PM)lunchmoney Wrote:  

This is an argument for guys I know who don't want their women to work, kids or not. Some guys at my job who have wives 10-12 years younger killed their careers when they walked down the aisle. Their wives do yoga, get massages, and keep the house all day. We will see how they hold up as time goes on.

My main reason against that is that idle hands become the devils' play things.. if she's sitting around all day with nothing to do, there is a VERY high chance that she could open up tinder and get laid without you ever knowing

the argument back would be you put a beautiful woman in a male dominated industry, and she will have a "work husband" you will never know about, or her boss will have her working late nights/going on trips with him.

[quaker13]

(12-01-2018 04:31 PM)lunchmoney Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 04:22 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 04:14 PM)lunchmoney Wrote:  

This is an argument for guys I know who don't want their women to work, kids or not. Some guys at my job who have wives 10-12 years younger killed their careers when they walked down the aisle. Their wives do yoga, get massages, and keep the house all day. We will see how they hold up as time goes on.

My main reason against that is that idle hands become the devils' play things.. if she's sitting around all day with nothing to do, there is a VERY high chance that she could open up tinder and get laid without you ever knowing

the argument back would be you put a beautiful woman in a male dominated industry, and she will have a "work husband" you will never know about, or her boss will have her working late nights/going on trips with him.

We make a put a very strong emphasis on self improvement in this forum. Presumably a woman marrying a man from this forum would be getting the best of the best, doubtful that a fat middle aged senior manager can seduce the panties off one of our wives. Exception might be if she's in sales.

Further, if she does cheat fuck her at least she brought home some bacon in the process instead of lounging around the house like a fucking primadonna all day getting into trouble

[Jefferson]

Actually 40% of affairs are with a person from work.

Where there's opportunity

[doc holliday]

These days, women should work and most will want to anyway. I think the ideal for women that have small kids is to work part time. This way she has time to be with the kids and also feels like she has some agency over herself by getting out into the world and also feels like she's contributing financially. I think either extreme is a recipe for disaster. A complete stay at home mom will slowly and painfully deplete your assets while you grow to resent her sitting on her ass (much more the case when the kids go to school full time). Plus if you divorce a stay at home mom and you have been married for a long time, you will get fucked hard with alimony for a very long time and getting equal time with your kids will be harder since she's the parent who has more time.

Now on the flip side, being married to some hard driving career bitch is a recipe for failure. Those girls are not at all feminine and if you make less than her, she will eventually go cold on you like has happened to Quaker. This doesn't surprise me in the least that she's gone this way. She likely feels that she's Wonder Woman, doing all the work, making all the money, being mom etc so she's gotten resentful. Being married to a chick that makes more money is a losing proposition. I could never be with a chick that made more money than me, it would always be a competition and she'd use it to challenge my manhood. No thanks, career bitches are so unattractive and unfeminine to me.

[tugofpeace]

(12-01-2018 04:31 PM)lunchmoney Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 04:22 PM)tugofpeace Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 04:14 PM)lunchmoney Wrote:  

This is an argument for guys I know who don't want their women to work, kids or not. Some guys at my job who have wives 10-12 years younger killed their careers when they walked down the aisle. Their wives do yoga, get massages, and keep the house all day. We will see how they hold up as time goes on.

My main reason against that is that idle hands become the devils' play things.. if she's sitting around all day with nothing to do, there is a VERY high chance that she could open up tinder and get laid without you ever knowing

the argument back would be you put a beautiful woman in a male dominated industry, and she will have a "work husband" you will never know about, or her boss will have her working late nights/going on trips with him.

Well, this is why I would ideally want to date a woman who works in an industry where she's only around other women. Like a doctor or dentist who has her own practice.

My current doctor is a pretty attractive lady, and all her employees are women. No chance for her to really cheat there.

[EndsExpect]

(12-01-2018 03:10 PM)quaker13 Wrote:  

I have not, but it sounds like this weekend might be the perfect weekend for it. I have demanded she change or im leaving

I've asked her to change and then she says she needs a bunch of cryptic nonsensical things from me in order to be submissive, so basically bullshit

What Exactly did she say?

Here is the thing... female speak typically needs to be plugged into google translate, but with some effort it can be deciphered.

On the other hand... if you just have the itch to be free and this is just an excuse. Just take that step and be free. Just do one thing for all the men out there getting boned in divorces... go for some fucking alimony or child support or something.

[RougeNoir]

(12-01-2018 03:32 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

I am not excusing her behaviour, but she must work hard to earn that kinda of money.

Sounds like it would be best for you to take a break from her, make her know your serious.

Fall back from her for a while. Pack up a good amount of your shit and sleep by a relative's house or a hotel until further notice. Tell her you'll be by Joe Blow (your relative ) in case of emergencies. Let your child know you love him or her and you'll be back in a few days. Do not initiate contact with her until she decides to call you. When she decides to chase your validation again is when you return to normal routine. When she reaches out to you, make her cook your favorite meal/perform your sexual fantasy/anything that suits you as a penance. It may take 3 days, a week, a month, or 6 months for her to chase your validation; however.

[Dodgy]

@OP
If you are considering leaving her, you should meet with a Family law attorney ASAP, specifically one that specializes in "Father Rights," so you know what your options are if you decide to legally separate or divorce. This is especially crucial in regards to your child, and the inevitable fight for custody over her/him if it goes to divorce.

And you know a divorce proceeding will be an all out war, so don't wait to get a lawyer after you decide to separate, start getting legal advice now.

[JackinMelbourne]

(12-01-2018 03:30 PM)quaker13 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 03:28 PM)eradicator Wrote:  

If you didn't have kids I'd totally say to bail. You say the sex is good but she has become cold and mechanical otherwise, maybe try marital counseling first, give it 6 months if you see no change, then bail.

Thanks for your response. Her sex is good but not atom splitting or ground breaking. I've been with a ton of women, I would never marry a woman for sex or remain married for sex. We have been marital counseling from the inception, even before the kid.

Forget counseling, that's toxic rubbish for cucks and a waste of cash. No more counseling or shrinks, unless you enjoy giving away power over your own mind and authority in the relationship.

Do more things you want to do, hang with mates, smoke weed if that's your thing (more productive substitute would be better) and train her up to be a filthy sex freak since you don't think she's all that great. The onus is on you to put the work in. Dominate the fuck out of her, it's what she needs and be sweet to her too. Get some dick pills (whether you think you need them or not) and show her who the fucking boss is, on a completely random night, or day.

They all melt and get sweet again after being *propper* fucked, even the oldies. I love it when oldies become young again mentally and emotionally and if the light is dim enough, they even look younger too!

p.s. won't separating cost you and mess up your kid?

[Windom Earle]

She probably knows you’re cheating (or senses it at least, women have pretty good intuition for that type of thing) and has withdrawn her emotions toward you as a pride protection mechanism (and to inflict some hurt on you).

Don’t discount the possibility that you’re creating the problem that you’re experiencing. If you are, i’d say that’s pretty arrogant thinking.

[questor70]

(12-01-2018 03:30 PM)quaker13 Wrote:  

We have been marital counseling from the inception, even before the kid.

Could you explain when the counseling started? It's not a shotgun wedding, right? So the marriage went soured and...then you had a kid (which doesn't sound logical unless it was an oops)? I'm just trying to get the chronology straight here.

[Jefferson]

I agree with Windome Earle. She could be aware of the infidelities.

It would explain the coldness.

[doc holliday]

I remember one time when I was married to my ex, we went for marriage counseling, female counselor. Before the counselor could get started on figuring out what I needed to do to make things better, I took control of the session and read out a long list of things that I did to contribute to our marriage. Neither of them were expecting that. By the time the session was done, I had the counselor telling my ex what she needed to do more of to reconnect emotionally with me. My ex was obviously not pleased with that outcome as she had dragged me to counseling so that the counselor could lecture me about what I was doing wrong and how I needed to be better. Needless to say, my ex never went back for session number 2. Counseling is such a waste and I'd bet the rate of success from counseling is dismal.

[questor70]

One thing about timing. When I moved out I did not immediately file. My ex-wife then beat me to the punch and filed before me. This immediately put me into a defensive posture with the court. No-fault divorce may be what it's supposed to be but she sure tried to twist me into a demon during the custody battle. She also cleared out our joint bank account and I never saw a penny of that, but I was stupid on that one.

If you're gonna leave the best way to protect yourself is to make it sudden and unpredictable. The more you telegraph to her that you're on the verge the more likely she'll be playing the same sort of chess game in her head. It's a very cold-war brinksmanship sort of situation. Have all your ducks in a row. Leave no stone unturned in determining how you can be hurt during the split and figuring out how to firewall yourself. Do not expect your wife to just split everything up amicably. Women are incredibly vindictive during a divorce. My ex did a lot of damage to me during the divorce and she had almost no money. Your wife has a lot more money to throw at a lawyer so expect that she'll attempt to use this leverage. Hope for the best but expect the worst. The time for civility is after the dust settles and you know you and your assets are in the clear.

[doc holliday]

(12-01-2018 08:06 PM)Windom Earle Wrote:  

She probably knows you’re cheating (or senses it at least, women have pretty good intuition for that type of thing) and has withdrawan her emotions toward you as a pride protection mechanism (and to inflict some hurt on you).

Don’t discount the possibility that you’re creating the problem that you’re experiencing. If you are, i’d say that’s pretty arrogant thinking.

Would agree with this wholeheartedly. I don't for the life of me understand motherfuckers who go crazy banging pussy on the side while they're married and arrogantly think that they won't ever get caught or that somehow its ok that they're doing it. A guy might think that his wife doesn't know anything but man, women can sense that infidelity from a mile away. Any guy who does this is seriously playing with fire, risking losing everything just for the sake of some skank pussy.

[PapayaTapper]

I suspect several things are going on here.


Once a woman has children her priorities shift. A man / husband is no longer the top of her "love" list. I suspect its an evolutionary / biological imperative designed to give the child / children the best chance of survival / success


Doc is correct. The fact that she makes more money is a problem. A big part of a woman's attraction "mechanism" is couched in her perception of a man as "higher value" We know for a fact that attraction is not a choice. Its an involuntary response to numerous factors: social, sexual status, physical appearance etc. But a woman's response to those factors change as they age.(A 19-25 yo can find "chemistry" with a broke wannabe DJ , surfer , skater, tatted up stoner, but not a 40 yo woman. The exception of course being the divorcee / cheater that is looking for a fuck toy to give a good hard piping)

In Western society a man's perceived "value" is closely tied to his earning power

(OP Im not saying youre not higher value...but rather that her subconcious perception of you doesn't create the needed involuntary responses)

Additionally I suspect OP has probably unknowingly let the power dynamic shift slowly over time. This is very very common in LTRs (Its happened to me). How? We as guys tend to hate drama (well most of us ...yeah you know who you are. Dont worry I wont mention any names Jefferson ). And because of our repulsion to drama we tend to let little shit slide and pick our battles. The problem is that by letting little shit slide we are transferring our masculine power to her. It happens in teeny almost imperceptible increments over a long time. Before you know you look up and she's the one wearing the pants and a fucking bitch.

Sound familiar?

It gets worse. While this power shift is going on two other things are happening within her:

-She starts resenting you albeit unconsciously because deep down she doesn't want the power. It goes against her nature. She wants a man thats strong enough to hold it. Even though she's unknowingly trying to take it. (Shit tests never end...they just shape shift)

-She's losing her attraction for you. A woman's sexual attraction is closely tied to her emotional attraction

"Men fall in love with women they are attracted to"

"Women are attracted to the man they fall in love with"

It works in reverse too

Solutions?

Well if you had said you didnt find her attractive any more Id have said "bail". But you do so...

You have to take the power back. Its not easy but it can be done. It'll take time and effort.

She may be a bitch from hell but she's still a woman. They aint that complicated

A combination of some dread (though Im not sure of the specific leverage) and behavioral changes on your part. Id need more about her (fears and desires) to make specific suggestions

[Leonard D Neubache]

(12-01-2018 03:20 PM)quaker13 Wrote:  

(12-01-2018 03:17 PM)Longshanks Wrote:  

Have you checked whether she's having an affair? No hello after a week trip is raw. All the best.

No i haven't. TBF, i've been one cheating fool and part of the reason i don't feel bad i because of her behavior. I'm not sure i'd even care that much if she had an affair.

Just so I haven't got this wrong. You've been fucking other women and she's cold to you now, but it's not because you've been fucking other women, it's because of money and age and every other excuse you can come up with other than the stuff that's your fault.

Am I summing this up correctly?

You put your dick before your wife and your kid and now you're looking to bail on the consequences AND your kid.

So in response to the question posed in your OP is would say "when she's drunk and has a gun in her hands."

"TBF". Good lord. I couldn't make this shit up.

As for anyone here who thinks it's ok to "step out" (or any other BS soft-padded euphemism for being a deadbeat dad) because your wife had the audacity to age 20 years over the space of 20 years then kindly pack your shit and move to Africa where you belong. You don't belong among civilized people, no matter how much your suit costs or how much you have in your bank account.

[Kona]

(12-01-2018 02:34 PM)quaker13 Wrote:  

those that know me know my wife makes a fair bit more than me. 500k to my 150k.

Those that don't know you know that you are gonna get your ass handed to you in court. She'll blow all 500 of it to take half your shit. She'll win too. She can live on that little 150k too.

You better start hiding shit before you drop any bombs. "Honey, I can get an amazing deal on gold bars!"

Also, you want to meet perfunctory with all of the top divorce attorneys in and around your area. That way, she's unable to obtain quality representation. I learned that on the Sopranos.

Aloha!

[questor70]

I don't condone the cheating but I do not subscribe to the idea of staying in loveless marriages for the sake of kids. It's really not good for the kids. Divorce is the lesser of two evils.

Also, the thread topic is not whether to drop the bomb, but when. He's already gone to counseling and it didn't work and he's written off his wife. So it's too late to game her back into being a princess. Sure sounds like a lost cause to me.

[Cattle Rustler]

Sounds like the spark went off in your marriage. Find a way to lit it up. All relationships turn dull, it's up to y'all to keep the spark lit.

Also, she might be tired of your shit and is no longer attracted to you. If you wife cheated on you, would you be attracted to her? Things were different with my ex when she found out I constantly cheated on her, I might talk my way out of it....but the damage was done; our relationship wasn't the same. It's really hard to take your side on this....