[lifeizfunhuh]

Interesting alternative to t-replacement therapy. I am 35, healthy, regular lifter. Recently I was curious about raising my testosterone to assist my general well being and lifting. I have an endocrinologist who put me on Clomid 25mg every other day. Within 30 days my t went from Total T 687 to 1352, and my free t went from 114 to 258. These numbers are off the charts, and I feel amazing, my libido is crazy!

Do your own research of course, but the science behind this is pretty compelling. I'm losing body fat and putting on muscle much easier. It has been about 90 days so far.

[kbell]

I was thinking of taking this myself rather than T if need it. SO you go to an endocrinologist? I wouldn't might getting my T to your starting point. Is it injected or oral? Do you know about the side effects?

[CleanSlate]

It's nice that you're feeling great now, but clomid tends to raise your estrogen, subsequently offsetting the benefits you get from higher T. Then within a couple months from now, you're back to where you started.

[rhodey]

(04-07-2016 07:12 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

It's nice that you're feeling great now, but clomid tends to raise your estrogen, subsequently offsetting the benefits you get from higher T. Then within a couple months from now, you're back to where you started.

This is true however some TRT doctors are combining Clomid with estrogen blockers (ie DIM)to counteract the estrogenic side affects. How do I know this? Well I'm about to go on clomid myself. Apparently it's picking up steam as a treatment for Secondary hypogonadism. Might be an option for guys who are low to moderate range and want to optimize, but without the hassles of injecting exogenous testosterone. My baseline test ranges from 460 - 555 but I have some noticeable symptoms. Would be nice to get to 1000+ ....well see what happens.

[Dominicus]

I'm lucky to be married to an endocrinologist who diagnosed me with hypogonadism.
After searching a bit I persuaded her to prescribe me Clomid (25mg/day). My T went from 250 to 724 in about 1,5 month.
Can't say anything for Estrogen but my Prolactine level remained steady. After reading you gents I'll ask for a Prolactine test next time.
Positive effects (40yrs old): higher sex drive, morning erection is systematic, more assertiveness.

[lifeizfunhuh]

A follow up from my original post. The Clomid did raise my progesterone to above the normal range. Doc prescribed .5mg Aramadex every 3.5 days (1mg/wk). That has worked perfectly to keep my test way way up and estrogen normal.

Not necessarily for this, but if anyone is in San Diego and wants one of the doctors that literally wrote the book on life extension medicine, see Dr. Steven Brody http://www.lifespan-med.com/. He is highly respected in the field.

[ScrapperTL]

(04-07-2016 07:12 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

It's nice that you're feeling great now, but clomid tends to raise your estrogen, subsequently offsetting the benefits you get from higher T. Then within a couple months from now, you're back to where you started.

Clomid IS an Estrogen (completely benign) and it competes with other Estrogens at the receptor site, blocking their estrogenic actions.

This is what eventually can lead to increased Testosterone levels (although some research has shown Clomid to have some merit for powering up the LH/FSH system as well)

As a result this could "possibly" show up as increase Estrogen on a blood test, but it is not the real thing.

The only true negative side effects of Clomid are that it unfavorably effects some peoples Vision (floaters) and Emotions (anecdotal).

No need to worry about Estrogenic side-effects while on Clomid.

Also, Progesterone has been shown to naturally rise with Testosterone, your Doc putting you on Arimidex for increase Progesterone seems amateurish, especially when you already have Clomid in your system binding to estrogenic receptor sites.

A lot of anti-aging clinics are now prescribing Progesterone and Pregnenolone Transdermal Creams to men to increase Neurotransmitter function, which then restores your Adrenal Gland output, leading to increase DHEA, Testosterone, Thyroid Hormones and lowered Cortisol.

Try to get switched to Exemestane from Arimidex.
Exemestane (commonly known as Aromasin) is the fucking bomb.
Exemestane is a Suicide Inhibitor that lowers SHBG, causes ZERO Estrogen Rebound upon cessation of use and doesn't crush your Estrogen levels like Arimidex/Letrozole (Aromatase Inhibitors) will.

[lifeizfunhuh]

(04-08-2016 12:58 PM)ScrapperTL Wrote:  

(04-07-2016 07:12 PM)CleanSlate Wrote:  

It's nice that you're feeling great now, but clomid tends to raise your estrogen, subsequently offsetting the benefits you get from higher T. Then within a couple months from now, you're back to where you started.

Clomid IS an Estrogen (completely benign) and it competes with other Estrogens at the receptor site, blocking their estrogenic actions.

This is what eventually can lead to increased Testosterone levels (although some research has shown Clomid to have some merit for powering up the LH/FSH system as well)

As a result this could "possibly" show up as increase Estrogen on a blood test, but it is not the real thing.

The only true negative side effects of Clomid are that it unfavorably effects some peoples Vision (floaters) and Emotions (anecdotal).

No need to worry about Estrogenic side-effects while on Clomid.

Also, Progesterone has been shown to naturally rise with Testosterone, your Doc putting you on Arimidex for increase Progesterone seems amateurish, especially when you already have Clomid in your system binding to estrogenic receptor sites.

A lot of anti-aging clinics are now prescribing Progesterone and Pregnenolone Transdermal Creams to men to increase Neurotransmitter function, which then restores your Adrenal Gland output, leading to increase DHEA, Testosterone, Thyroid Hormones and lowered Cortisol.

Try to get switched to Exemestane from Arimidex.
Exemestane (commonly known as Aromasin) is the fucking bomb.
Exemestane is a Suicide Inhibitor that lowers SHBG, causes ZERO Estrogen Rebound upon cessation of use and doesn't crush your Estrogen levels like Arimidex/Letrozole (Aromatase Inhibitors) will.

I appreciate the feedback, although the purpose of posting was not to debate its merits. Just an FYI. I don't recommend anyone make medical decisions based on the advice of randoms on an internet forum. That's why we go to experts.

[6figureger]

What if you are only 18 years old and already have low t. My Levels are basically on the downside of "normal" (which is basically the normal Level for a 60 year old maybe) but my Doc doesn't know shit about it.

I am already doing everything in terms of diet and Lifestyle changes and the changes are minimal (it's been over a year already).

Does this suppress natural production aswell?

[ScrapperTL]

Clomid encourages natural production.

[Neo]

A little bit off topic, but what about Hcg monotherapy? Any members try this approach?

[Spectrumwalker]

To the posters taking clomid. Prior to, did you all suffer from "mental fog", and low energy? Has clomid helped you mentally, and given you more energy?

Are there any warnings of hair loss with this?

[rhodey]

(04-09-2016 09:09 PM)Spectrumwalker Wrote:  

To the posters taking clomid. Prior to, did you all suffer from "mental fog", and low energy? Has clomid helped you mentally, and given you more energy?

Are there any warnings of hair loss with this?

Yep as far as the symptoms. Only my 2nd day on so nothing obvious yet re results. No warnings re hair loss, only anxiety and blurry vision. Both seem to be dose dependent,- so rare for anyone on 25mg a day or less - and overwhelmingly temporary - after you stop using.

[dred349]

(04-09-2016 06:00 AM)6figureger Wrote:  

What if you are only 18 years old and already have low t. My Levels are basically on the downside of "normal" (which is basically the normal Level for a 60 year old maybe) but my Doc doesn't know shit about it.

I am already doing everything in terms of diet and Lifestyle changes and the changes are minimal (it's been over a year already).

Does this suppress natural production aswell?

First what I would do - morning Lab test (tsh,ft3,ft4,testosterone, lh,fsh,prolactine,dhea-s, acth, cortisol), then I would repeat those lab tests few days later, then Pituitary MRI (minimum 3 T device), then Clomid test (1 x 50mg every day for a month). Don't know where you live, but in Poland we have some docs who prescribe clomid for clomid test.

[dred349]

I forgot, add to morning labs estradiol

[ChokingHazard]

Dominicus & Lifeizfun

Are you still taking it / is the idea to take it forever? I never understood this about Clomid. If you stopped taking it, how are your T levels then?
I like the idea of boosting T via boosting LH, especially if you have low normal LH levels this seems to make sense to me. Much more then suppressing normal T production with Testogel etc.

(04-08-2016 06:22 AM)Dominicus Wrote:  

I'm lucky to be married to an endocrinologist who diagnosed me with hypogonadism.
After searching a bit I persuaded her to prescribe me Clomid (25mg/day). My T went from 250 to 724 in about 1,5 month.
Can't say anything for Estrogen but my Prolactine level remained steady. After reading you gents I'll ask for a Prolactine test next time.
Positive effects (40yrs old): higher sex drive, morning erection is systematic, more assertiveness.

[ScrapperTL]

(04-14-2016 04:15 PM)ChokingHazard Wrote:  

Dominicus,

Are you still taking it / is the idea to take it forever? I never understood this about Clomid. If you stopped taking it, how are your T levels then?
I like the idea of boosting T via boosting LH, especially if you have low normal LH levels this seems to make sense to me. Much more then suppressing normal T production with Testogel etc.

(04-08-2016 06:22 AM)Dominicus Wrote:  

I'm lucky to be married to an endocrinologist who diagnosed me with hypogonadism.
After searching a bit I persuaded her to prescribe me Clomid (25mg/day). My T went from 250 to 724 in about 1,5 month.
Can't say anything for Estrogen but my Prolactine level remained steady. After reading you gents I'll ask for a Prolactine test next time.
Positive effects (40yrs old): higher sex drive, morning erection is systematic, more assertiveness.

Upon cessation of Clomid use, your Sex Hormones should return to baseline levels (homeostasis)

Though, I believe that the highest level of masculinity can only be achieved by daily routine and ritual.

Swallow a pill every single day for the rest of your life, takes 30 seconds to complete the ritual. (Glass, Water, Pill, Swallow)

Imagine all the men who routinely sit in front of a Television, 365 days a year for 3+ hours a day.
Unnaturally driving their physiques away from masculinity

[John Michael Kane]

I looked into Clomid to resolve my long-standing low testosterone levels. The last few years they have consistently been in the 210-220 range. I discussed it with my doctor, but he and I both shared the long-term usage concerns of the potential eye troubles, and ruled against it, instead, opting for implanted testosterone pellets into the buttocks. The pellets will be supplemented with a testosterone cream from my local compounding pharmacy until my levels are brought to optimal peaks. As I'm only 33 and single, I want to have children in the future once married, and will reconsider Clomid at that time, after cycling off the T therapy if my sperm counts are too low to conceive.

[redbeard]

Pellets?

Are you afraid of injections?

[John Michael Kane]

(04-15-2016 01:21 PM)redbeard Wrote:  

Pellets?

Are you afraid of injections?

No, I'm not afraid of injections. I've had a number of injections over the years (TDAP, Hep A, Vitamin B shots, Novacaine for surgery etc.) and have never really flinched at the idea of getting a shot. Thankfully, my pain threshold for needles is high. I wouldn't say I enjoy them, but I certainly don't fear them.

The reason as to why I'm considering the pellets as a first-try therapy is because:

1. All the research I've done on them seems to suggest that they provide a very even dosage of T.
2. It is simple, you get one inserted once every 3-6 months. You don't have to really add a lot more trouble to your daily routine. As someone who leads a very busy life, I like that.
3. I'm going to monitor blood work (as well as my subjective feeling of well-being) while on the pellets. If they don't raise my lab results to optimal levels, or I feel that they didn't get rid of the brain fog or sluggishness, then I will cycle off them and give injections a go.
4. I live in the United States where the most commonly prescribed T is Cypionate. Unfortunately, this has a longer half-life, which leads to more fluctuations from what I've heard than Propionate, which has a more frequent injection schedule. As MikeCF has mentioned up-thread and in his podcasts, Propionate is not commonly available in U.S. pharmacies, meaning that the only way that many American men can obtain it is through online stores, of which gives me second thought as to the quality controls for purity or pharmaceutical therapeutic benefit.
5. I'm working with an anti-aging clinic with a doctor that is flexible about options, so if one method doesn't work, I will certainly switch to another and report back the results.

[JohnKreese]

I’ve been absent from posting for a bit, but I want to provide my experience with Clomid. I know the jury is still out for a lot of people, but it is working wonders for me.

Headline stat: My total T was in the high 500s this time last year before plummeting to 280 in February (I’m in my late 20s so this is problematic). Shot up to almost 1500 in under 3 weeks.

I had originally been on DHEA and anastrozole to jumpstart my T production and to manage my estrogen (anastrozole DID/DOES have a significant effect on my estrogen production) since I first clocked in in the high 500s. However, seeing my T go down since the beginning of the year was disheartening. Before going on injections, my endocrologist suggested that I give Clomid a try. I started my first dose during the first week of March (~2 weeks after the 280 result) and had my blood drawn again 3 weeks later (end of March). Of course, its possible that my T was lower than it should have been during the 280 draw, but, in just THREE WEEKS, my total T shot up to 1482! Granted, my estrogen levels increased as well (may need to add an extra serving of anastrozole every week), but not NEARLY in proportion to the rise in T (about 1.5 times as opposed to the almost 5X improvement in total T).

I have always been extremely active (surprising that my T levels were so low) and so my body wasn’t suffering as badly from typical low T effects. However, it has taken the strictest of discipline to develop a 6-pack. Since I’ve been on Clomid, I’ve found that I can “cheat” a little more with the diet/drinking yet still maintain an excellent physique. I feel even more productive and my mood seems to have elevated.

Also, taking half a pill (25mg) a day is probably easier than injecting 2-3 times a week (which I would gladly do if the Clomid stops working so well). Additionally, its CHEAP. A 2-month supply is running me $90 USD (anastrozole is roughly another $60 for 2 months). I also want to give a special thanks to Cleanslate, Menace, and Mike Cernovich for turning me on to TRT-related endeavors. I’m happy to expand on this post as I know that this is a bit brief, but for me Clomid has been a game-changer.

[zatara]

That's a great result JohnKreese, congratulations. Have you experienced any negative sides at all? Have your estrogen levels increased?

[RexImperator]

http://newyork.legalexaminer.com/fda-pre...rone-drug/

Quote:

The FDA is being more cautious with testosterone replacement drugs.
The administration recently put the brakes on the process to approve a new drug called “Androxal” (enclomiphene citrate), which is designed to treat men with low testosterone. Manufactured by a company called Repros Therapeutics, it was in the final stages of development when the FDA cancelled an advisory committee meeting intended to discuss the new drug application.

[Fortis]

Here's my question:

Why take clomid instead of testosterone if you want to raise your low-testosterone?

Just seems sort of round about. Like guys who focus on lifestyle 100% and and never cold approach because it'll help "raise their value!"

I'm not being sarcastic, I just want to know why. Anyone?

[RexImperator]

I think the reasoning behind it is that it doesn't shut down your natural testosterone production like TRT. It's a SERM (Selective Estrogen Receptor Modulator).

Quote:

At its simplest, SERMS work by selectively inhibiting the actions of estrogen hormones in the body so they won’t set off the adverse side effects that they are capable of sooner or later. Besides blocking estrogen activity in the tissues, SERMS also stimulate the pituitary and hypothalamus glands to sync up its production of luteinizing and follicle-stimulating hormones that plays a key role in normalizing testosterone levels.

http://www.postcycletherapy.net/serms/