[WashedUPVet]

(09-02-2015 03:09 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  

If time ever allows, I'd be curious what you learned during those three weeks with that one Russian lady.

I guess your flight is today, so safe travels.

Yes, landed in Moscow yesterday and went out to a bar my first night. I'll update the Russia thread on that experience soon. It was incredible.

As far as the woman who visited me, I learned how quickly she lost her fashion sense. I even told her on day 10 that she became "An American Woman." On the first day, she wore a dress and heels to the beach for sunset. I didn't know her too well from the Moscow trip where I met her, but she expected a lot of me. She couldn't drive, look up directions or even search for a place to eat (she is from Russia's 3rd city). Every moment of every day had to be planned out by me and I was responsible for absolutely every moment. Her coming out to see me really hit the bank account too. I eventually had to have a talk with her about splitting some costs and she paid for her own food from there, but not lodging. After the trip she told me, "A man must give his woman everything." It wasn't all bad. I got to lay a 21 yo 7 any time I wanted with no resistance. She saw it as her job to please me. I had a lot of fun and she was a fantastic companion. A little too strong a personality and not hot enough for me to LTR. She was also critical in assisting me to get into the top tier University that I'm enrolled into in Moscow. She attends, but in a different program.

P.S. I'm also a big lurker on the delete thread. Thanks for the contributions @samsamsamsamsam

[Travesty]

So I got off a 2 hour phone conversation with my friend last night.

After talking to him almost 2 years ago about taking an Asia trip with him I said we should go to China or Vietnam because it is less expensive and we both like the girls' looks from those countries. He's is probably 80% red pill overall, with women he only looks at actions ever nothing else.

He went to Vietnam with another friend, because I decided to hit S.A. first over the next year or two.

Before the trip I had talked to him how foreign girls are so much better than American girls and he was very lukewarm to it stating bullshit like there are Asian girls in the U.S. as well. He got on VietnamCupid found a chick to Skype with video chatted, sex cammed each other and so on for about 3 months before his trip. She starting flirting and hitting on him first. Not saying this girl is looking to shape up to be great LTR material, but stating girls put in effort here it seems. Not the three word replies from many Western girls reported.

He just got back and is pretty much falling in love with this girl and agrees she totally outclasses the foreign born and raised American girls.

He has high standards for girls' looks and likes nice things. So it says two good things about Vietnam. The girls are up to snuff in looks and he likes the energy and girl so much he can seemingly easily overlook the developing nation aspects and humidity which I found to be a huge shock. He likes BMW's, nice clubs and restaurants

Coincidentally his latest LTR of 4 years with a girl he recently broke up with, who(m?) had moved from Vietnam to the U.S. when she was 12. She had a slight accent and you could tell she was different than American girls in a good way as far as taking care of herself, still had the bitchy entitled attitude in medium consistent doses.

He said the girl now he is falling for in Vietnam put him first, tried to pay for him, and was just generally nice.

So another data point +1 for Vietnam.

[TravelerKai]

(08-22-2015 07:19 PM)Travesty Wrote:  

Looked through the "Wife" threads some piecemeal stuff about abroad, nothing serious I came across that comes close TravelerKai's China dating thread which is specific to that country and I will most likely use heavily in the future.

I've recently had strong gut feelings that are telling me I need to have a teammate, a real wife, to build a happy home and have at least 2 children with. I haven't felt this way in the past few years. I think my game currently is the best it has ever been. I am very tired of balancing hoes. I have exceeded almost every game fantasy I ever wanted and then some. I have done it without getting a permanent STD and want to keep it that way. I am not nomadic at heart. I love a comfortable home and I want a woman to build it with that wants to host friends and raise a close family.

I'm 30 and I want to find a wife 8-12 years younger. The age gap I'd want would be wider if I was ok with finding an older girl when I am older - I'd like to find her younger though and with less experience. I think I'd stay in the low-mid 7 range as far as looks. Open to religious girls, they just have to have my best interests at heart. I don't want to sustain the level of Game over the long term that comes with marrying a truly hot a girl.

I'd want a girl that is into her family. I would be find spending lots of time with her family as long as they are warm and happy people. I would have no problem treating them as I treat my own family. I'd be okay with lending them some financial support over the years etc... if they were good people I cared about.

Fact is I'd like to find a girl before she hits 24, and I want to do it before I hit 36 so I have a good amount of time to form a solid relationship before children.

I'd like to say I would commit to living abroad, I am not sure that is possible though financially to support a family. I do have a career in tech where I could work for an international.

I'm working on getting my current gig to let me remote from South America for a year. I am going to Colombia for a month in November. This decision was made before really desiring to spend my time looking for the best teammate possible over the span of the next 6 years.

My plan is to spend my vacation time over the next year on going to South America to scout incase I am granted the ability to remote in the future.

Whether or not that works out I would go to Europe then Asia after on scouting trips over the next 2 years using all my vacation. This assumes I do not find a suitable remote gig or international job before then.

The countries I would visit in this order over the next 2 years before picking one or two to heavily concentrate on trying to work at remotely or find an international gig:

Mexico
Brazil

Poland
Romania
Serbia (maybe Albania and Bosnia - are they worth it?)

China
Taiwan
Vietnam
(I prefer Vietnamese looks over any other in SEA by far - I left PI off the list because I have heard the quality is lower than people like to admit from forum members in PM's and in person and that they place is mostly a shit hole with too much pollution - strong words I know. I left off Japan because of all the crazy social and sexual norms I have heard about (also heard about no sex after marriage) and Korea due to the chicks crazy emotional nature, and what I have read is a tough dating scene for an outsider.)

I am going to visit these all with an open mind, honestly I think the only country on the list I could really live in for the long term maybe would be Taiwan or Poland, which I see as a large challenge.

I am putting work into learning Spanish presently. I will probably spend my mornings in Colombia going to intensive language school. I would study Portugese before my Brazil trip, and Mandarin before China and Taiwan.

Once I decide on a country I think I could find the best teammate I would dedicate myself as I said to working there remotely or getting an international gig. Maybe I will build an online business before then.

If I felt taking a girl back to the U.S. for whatever reasons may come up I would roll the dice probably live in Colorado or Texas where I think there is the best chance of raising a grounded family with a prenup or anything I could to defend myself against the worst.

Just looking for thoughts about my plan.

You may have some of your facts wrong about certain places or strategies, but in a big picture view, I do not see anything wrong with your plan. Strategy wise your reasoning is more than good enough to accomplish your goals.

The only few things I take issue with is the following:

Wife material is not 8+
Japan not having wife material that will take care of your needs.
The PI not worth looking at.

Since you are willing to chase 23 and under, 8+ is highly possible in many places. I won't lie to you, they are not easy to find anywhere. Realistically you might catch only ~ 5-10 that are wife material at best, per year. In my opinion at least. The trick is to break down what are deal breakers for yourself, find them very early on, be direct about finding out, and be quick to pull a trigger on the best scored ever. Write down all the deal breakers so that you can look at them and honestly see for yourself if your demands are unrealistic. Share them with a trusted friend if you want. Make sure you do not do what damn near every dude on RVF would do when grading women with that 2/10 mindset. Actually, you are one of those dudes. lol

If that ugly Chinese dude snapped up that smoking hot 9-10 wife in the Ukraine that makes his dinner naked, I am quite positive The Great Travesty can do better than that too. That said, you still need to have the presence of mind to not toss away an 8-10 like you would have in your younger years before you can find out enough to make the decision in the first place. Sounds crazy, but I can see you doing that fairly easily.

Japanese women are no different than other women. Rock their world and gain a stalker/fanatic. I thought my sex drive was high until I met women younger than me. I can barely keep up with my wife's drive to be honest and we have a kid. You really have to strive for bond and romance early on. Momentum is key. You will know what you have before you marry a woman unless you marry a virgin. If you know to look out for certain things like that, you will see the clues early on. A general overall lack of submission is the main cause of Japanese women doing that. Yeah there is a subculture aspect of them doing this, but there are many that do not adhere to it there as well. Asians do not all get married for love reasons. Any Asia pro here on RVF can atest to this. Many get married for social, business, and face reasons. Westerners tend not to notice this as much when we marry Asians because we never start off like that and our interactions are 100% lust or love from jumpstreet. If homegirl was not in a loving mood, their cold or robotic reactions tend to cause us to next them or not offer marriage or other things, thus causing them to disappear to our surprise.

Bottom line is that there is always a reason why and a method to the madness you see abroad. Just actively seek the answer and most of the time it will be made clear to you. Self awareness to look is the hurdle, nothing else usually.

The PI is not as bad as others made it seem, but they are not 100% wrong either. Most would make better wives than others, because their hearts are perhaps hands down the biggest in Asia. I know you are picky on looks and there is nothing wrong with that. I personally found them to be not ideal for me for several reasons, but physically very few of them have the hairstyle looks I like and the biggest sin of all (to me at least) was that lots of them shave their pussies. This goes back to what I mentioned before about "deal breakers". I am not going to go into a diatribe over feminism and shaving, but I have strong feelings about it and it is a complete and utter deal breaker for me. Not only that, the hairy ones don't look good to me any fucking way, compared to other Asians.

I greatly digress.... Anyway, high society Filipinos are the coolest of all Asians and the easiest to get along with, in my experience. The women are also extremely hot and compare to the hottest Japanese as well. Problem is that there are not a ton of them, compared to the legions of poorer and less beautiful ones. HiSo parents will probably make for the coolest in laws ever as well. Keep that in mind too.


As an end note, I have to disagree with my buddy VP about not wifing up someone you meet online or via pipelining. I met mine online. HOW you FIND them online is what matters more. Lots of younger girls have no idea what some of these websites or Tinder-like sites are. If you are the first guy to catch them before they figure out what kind of trash might be on there, you should not throw that opportunity away.

Pipelining is BOSS in Asia. Asian girls grew up with all kinds of women. Their Facebooks /Qzones/Weibos, etc. are full of intriguing women. NEVER be afraid to ask a 5-6 to meet her friends. NEVER be afraid to do that. I had an 8 (that VP thinks is a 9 or 10) introduce me to her 17 soon to be 18 cousin that was even hotter than her using that strategy. Never went anywhere but that was more because I stopped chasing her. ABP! Say it with me. Always Be Pipelining!!!

[Travesty]

Good point I read before in your China dating guide.

I couldn't dream of hitting a 5 or 6 up online here and saying hey let me meet your friends. For starters the chances of them having hotter available friends is about zero. They would take it as first an insult, then they would see it as being a creep. I'll have to remember this.

Does anyone have thoughts about this working in Europe or SA? Other than you I have never read a guy following that strategy.

Meeting a 5 or 6 in a bar or at an event and having her introduce you to her group with hotter friends, sure.

My biggest goal is to get a remote job in the next few years so I am not making decision between countries and can simply hit each one up for two weeks - to one month to get the feeling, then pick one home town for wife hunting.

I really am not a quality troll. It's just this...

If given the option I think most of RVF would take banging a total 30 different girls with a handful of 5's, half or more 6's, a handful of 7's and a couple 8's between 25-35 years old.

I'd rather bang 10 different 7.0 - 7.5's in the 18-24 year old range and miss out on all the extra bangs and 8's.

[reco2100]

(08-23-2015 01:04 AM)Tytalus Wrote:  

I'm quoting myself from another thread, because I think it's important. When you really need ?When you really need frame? Is when you're living with the same woman day in day out. Yes, an incredibly attractive woman can be extra work, but just because you have a "cute" wife instead of a hot one does not mean you need less game.

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-47878-...pid1047854

Quote:

There is NO SUCH THING as unconditional romantic love. It is hopeless, hopelessly naive and immature to believe such a thing exists. Your parents will probably love you forever, but in love? No way. Romantic love lasts 2 years tops. Then your blinders come off and your judgement comes back and you wonder who the fuck you married and what the fuck you were thinking. This happens to BOTH genders. She will not be enchanted with you forever. You will make mistakes and displays of low value (hopefully not too many) and will become much more realistic about who you really are over time. The same will happen with you about who she is.

If you want someone to unconditionally love you no matter what, then yeah, don't get married and have a good relationship with your mom.

You want your wife to love and appreciate you forever? Well be a man, not a chump. Fix the shit in your house without her asking you to, let alone having to remind you. Keep your cool. Keep your career and income steady and rising over time. Be good with your kids and not lose your shit. Help out a bit when she's having a bad day. Flirt with her plenty and play grab ass when the kids aren't looking. Pass her shit tests.

You cannot just be, and expect her to love you.

Also I think one should also keep in mind that you really can't be looking for a unicorn. Everyone has rough parts of their personalities. Everyone. We here accuse women of having long laundry lists of desirable traits, well, guys can do the same thing.

With things that are NOT major red flags, remember that the only time you have leverage to change her behavior is BEFORE the wedding, the engagement in particular.

She has a lousy diet but still thin? Get her to clean it up. Doesn't exercise as much as you like? Get her to the gym more. She gains 5 lbs? Tell her she needs to lose it ASAP.

My wife's friend married a man, who I shit you not, will not drink anything (or so I hear) other than cherry coke. Goes through at least 6 cans a day of the stuff. So severely unhealthy in his lifestyle that the friend can't get pregnant. Had she spoken up and said this HAD to change for them to get married, well, his health may be lousy instead of being a wreck.

Conversely, another friend of my wife's was complaining that her husband spoke up as she hit 145 lbs, and was 140 when she married him. I couldn't believe it, this quiet, mild mannered dutch guy belligerently on his wife's case every time she hit 145 on the scale. And, to boot, she lost the weight every time he told her to.

Absolutely...Game is twice as important when married, especially long term.

[WalterBlack]

As western citizens we have to be careful…some of these women play the long game just to extract what they want. For example, Indian village women make great wives but even they have been corrupted over the last couple of years.

Case 1

I know of an Indian woman who married a guy from UK. She was married to this guy until she got her UK citizenship, then she divorced him and went to India and married a guy from India.

Apparently husband number 2 was her boyfriend from before she got married. They hatched a plan where she would get married abroad to obtain citizenship and then get divorced and marry the boyfriend.

She even went an had an abortion so she didn’t have to have husband 1’s kid.

Time for plan to come to fruition: 5 years +

Case 2

UK Indian guy marries girl from India. He sponsors her to come to UK, and she moves in with him. 2 weeks later she’s gone.

Apparently she had some UK based cousins who arranged for her to marry the UK guy, and then when she was in UK she would leave the husband and go and live with her relatives.

Time for plan to come to fruition: 1.5 years +

I know of many more cases...
--------------------------------------------------
I’m very suspicious of women from some Eastern European and certain SE Asian countries. Most Japanese/Chinese/Koreans are not poor, so they probably have less baggage...

There’s been a couple of occasions where I’ve spoken to US based Filipino women on the phone (from OKCupid), where they admit to having a kid back in the Philippines.

Be careful guys!

[rudebwoy]

(09-24-2015 12:28 PM)WalterBlack Wrote:  

As western citizens we have to be careful…some of these women play the long game just to extract what they want. For example, Indian village women make great wives but even they have been corrupted over the last couple of years.

Case 1

I know of an Indian woman who married a guy from UK. She was married to this guy until she got her UK citizenship, then she divorced him and went to India and married a guy from India.

Apparently husband number 2 was her boyfriend from before she got married. They hatched a plan where she would get married abroad to obtain citizenship and then get divorced and marry the boyfriend.

She even went an had an abortion so she didn’t have to have husband 1’s kid.

Time for plan to come to fruition: 5 years +

Case 2

UK Indian guy marries girl from India. He sponsors her to come to UK, and she moves in with him. 2 weeks later she’s gone.

Apparently she had some UK based cousins who arranged for her to marry the UK guy, and then when she was in UK she would leave the husband and go and live with her relatives.

Time for plan to come to fruition: 1.5 years +

I know of many more cases...
--------------------------------------------------
I’m very suspicious of women from some Eastern European and certain SE Asian countries. Most Japanese/Chinese/Koreans are not poor, so they probably have less baggage...

There’s been a couple of occasions where I’ve spoken to US based Filipino women on the phone (from OKCupid), where they admit to having a kid back in the Philippines.

Be careful guys!

I don't even give those marriages a 50/50 chance, not in todays climate.

I know a few similar stories from friends in the Indian/Asian community.

I know another dude who married a Cuban, she has already started the process for her whole family to come here. God only knows what will happen once they get here.

I know of one old dude, who has been married a few times. He actually left his wife in Cuba and said he would never bring her here.

There have been a few cases in the newspapers regarding these sort of things, usually it is some woman that has gotten burnt. Never the men.

These girls are playing the long game!!!!

[Biologist]

(09-24-2015 12:28 PM)WalterBlack Wrote:  

As western citizens we have to be careful…some of these women play the long game just to extract what they want. For example, Indian village women make great wives but even they have been corrupted over the last couple of years.

Case 1

I know of an Indian woman who married a guy from UK. She was married to this guy until she got her UK citizenship, then she divorced him and went to India and married a guy from India.

Apparently husband number 2 was her boyfriend from before she got married. They hatched a plan where she would get married abroad to obtain citizenship and then get divorced and marry the boyfriend.

She even went an had an abortion so she didn’t have to have husband 1’s kid.

Time for plan to come to fruition: 5 years +

Case 2

UK Indian guy marries girl from India. He sponsors her to come to UK, and she moves in with him. 2 weeks later she’s gone.

Apparently she had some UK based cousins who arranged for her to marry the UK guy, and then when she was in UK she would leave the husband and go and live with her relatives.

Time for plan to come to fruition: 1.5 years +

I know of many more cases...
--------------------------------------------------
I’m very suspicious of women from some Eastern European and certain SE Asian countries. Most Japanese/Chinese/Koreans are not poor, so they probably have less baggage...

There’s been a couple of occasions where I’ve spoken to US based Filipino women on the phone (from OKCupid), where they admit to having a kid back in the Philippines.

Be careful guys!

I agree that men in Western countries need to be very careful.

I know a guy who married a Vietnamese girl so that he could sponsor her to live in Australia. She disappeared the very day she received the email from the immigration department saying that she was successfully granted permanent residency.

I was stunned because they were around the same age (she was in her late 20s and he was 30) and he treated her like a princess. No only that, he was well educated, had a decent job and was fairly good looking.

Regarding your Case 1, it amazes me that the guy would actually marry that woman after what she did. Not only does he know how evil and conniving she really is, but also why would you want to marry a woman who was previously married and impregnated by another man?

[KingTut]

Lesson of the story: if you are used to close on on 2 or 3's in your home country, Bringing back a 8 or 9 from a foreign country would be equal to hanging your underwear where your arms can't reach. Complete suicide. It is all about self-awareness.

[Bushido]

In the UK my impression is that bringing back a white girl from the FSU is much riskier than say, an Asian girl. The reason being that most British men still prefer to marry white girls.

A white girl of fair complexion is much, much more pedestalized than an Asian chick. The former transforms within a few weeks of landing on British soil. Going with the latter will even get you some stigma where I'm from and my hometown is not exactly in the sticks.

The situation might be different in the US where you seem to have a bigger mix. Despite the influence of multiculturalism, most Brits still don't date interracially.

Not many people are going to be trying to steal your Chinese or Filipina bride from you. Blonde Russian? Good luck mate.

[Phoenix]

(09-25-2015 07:51 AM)dreambig Wrote:  

In the UK my impression is that bringing back a white girl from the FSU is much riskier than say, an Asian girl. The reason being that most British men still prefer to marry white girls.

A white girl of fair complexion is much, much more pedestalized than an Asian chick. The former transforms within a few weeks of landing on British soil. Going with the latter will even get you some stigma where I'm from and my hometown is not exactly in the sticks.
...

Not many people are going to be trying to steal your Chinese or Filipina bride from you. Blonde Russian? Good luck mate.

This is definitely an important consideration. Girls who are 'with you' are only entrenched so deep, and bringing them back to the West is going to make that trench a whole lot more shallow.

The way I see it there are three options:

1. Only bring them back if they're carrying or have a child with you. That's pretty strong entrenchment. The 'deal is done' then, and they can't really 'return the goods and go back to shopping again' at that point. This entrenchment would of course be weakened by single-mother welfare laws and divorce laws, depending on your country.

2. Live there. That requires you to: be able to make a decent income there somehow; and actually like the place enough to want to stay there. Russia would be well down my list of places I'd like to live.

3. Take her to a 3rd country. Probably the hardest, and I'd love to hear any examples of men who've pulled this off. That way you get the best of both worlds. The money and energy you'd have to expend to sustain this would probably be ridiculous. She'll no doubt have family she's attached to and wants to visit often. Any children you have with her, you'll have to factor in whether the country suits their development. Places you like might not be places she likes, especially when you're settling down there versus just traveling.

Sometimes I wonder if my plans are just superhuman feats and I'm deluding myself. Not sure there's really any other alternative though.

[WalterBlack]

(09-25-2015 01:01 AM)Biologist Wrote:  

Regarding your Case 1, it amazes me that the guy would actually marry that woman after what she did. Not only does he know how evil and conniving she really is, but also why would you want to marry a woman who was previously married and impregnated by another man?

Some guys don't give a fuck, they just want to leave India by almost any means necessary.

(09-25-2015 07:51 AM)dreambig Wrote:  

In the UK my impression is that bringing back a white girl from the FSU is much riskier than say, an Asian girl. The reason being that most British men still prefer to marry white girls.

A white girl of fair complexion is much, much more pedestalized than an Asian chick. The former transforms within a few weeks of landing on British soil. Going with the latter will even get you some stigma where I'm from and my hometown is not exactly in the sticks.

The situation might be different in the US where you seem to have a bigger mix. Despite the influence of multiculturalism, most Brits still don't date interracially.

Not many people are going to be trying to steal your Chinese or Filipina bride from you. Blonde Russian? Good luck mate.

The average white British guy doesn’t go for east Asian women over other women at all, in fact being seen with one is a negative in many circles. Firstly, there's hardly any east-Asian women in UK, and of the ones who grew up there, most of them are HK Chinese, who are not exactly lookers. Secondly, UK is right next to mainland Europe, and a lot of UK guys fly into Europe and meet women there, or there are European women living in UK for them to approach.

Being seen with an east-Asian woman in the UK still has the "mail-order-bride" stigma attached to it. I use to work with an educated Taiwanese woman who was married with a white professor who was a lot older than her. She said people thought she was a mail order bride all the time.
-----------
This is an article from today about guys getting fucked over by their wives in Thailand:

The Phuket property nightmare

Quote:

The sparkling seas and warm beaches of Phuket are a magnet for sun-seeking holiday-makers and, increasingly, for foreigners seeking a comfortable and cost-efficient retirement. More than 100,000 foreigners have settled on the island - though some now bitterly regret it.

British expat Ian Rance and Irishman Colin Vard are now living almost penniless with their children on the outskirts of Bangkok as they struggle against overwhelming odds to recover properties they bought on Phuket. Both men lost all their investments through frauds that neither of them imagined were possible.

"I'd made my money in England and had enough to retire I thought. I was looking for a place that was warm, a place that had some rule of law, where I could live in safety and peace," says Rance, a chartered surveyor and professional arbitrator from Hertfordshire, who arrived in Phuket in 2000.

"When I came to Thailand on a trip to Australia it sort of seemed to fit the bill."

In 2001 Rance met and married a Thai woman called Suda and went on to have three children with her. The prime minister at the time, Thaksin Shinawatra, had started a programme called "Thailand Elite", through which he hoped to attract wealthy foreigners to settle by allowing them to own small amounts of land, something not normally permitted under Thai law.

Encouraged by this, Rance began investing in property, buying two houses, and eventually a restaurant and two pieces of land. But the Thailand Elite scheme never took off, so in the end he did what thousands of other foreigners did - he put the properties either in the name of the company he had already formed to run his consultancy business, or in the name of his wife.

The family home was in his wife's name, but leased to him on a 30-year lease. The company was nominally Thai-owned but Rance, as a director, had majority voting rights - nothing could happen to the company's assets without his approval. He was advised by local lawyers that this was legally quite safe.

But unbeknown to him, in July 2008 Suda began transferring the properties out of the company. In September she also removed Rance as a director. On paper none of this should have been possible. In practice, all she had to do was to forge her husband's signature. The Land Office in Phuket, where property transfers are formalised, was willing to accept a simple forged power of attorney from Rance to change ownership of properties worth hundreds of thousands of pounds, and to cancel his 30-year lease on their home.

To change the control of the company the forged signature had to be notarised by a lawyer - but that presented no problem. A local lawyer did this willingly, without Rance being present. When the BBC confronted the lawyer about this he admitted the signature was his, but claimed it was normal practice in Phuket. The Thai Lawyers Council has since told the BBC this is not true, that it is a serious violation of their code of conduct. But Rance's attempts to sue the lawyer have got nowhere.

He only spotted the fraud in July 2010, when checking his company's tax status. He discovered that all five properties, worth well over £1m ($1.5m), had been stolen. What began then was, he says, a nightmare period for him. His wife ran away. Four men came into his house and threatened his life if he did not get out of Phuket. His wife phoned him and told him they would kidnap the children if he did not leave the house immediately. Gun crime and murder are not uncommon in Phuket, and Rance decided to flee to Bangkok with the three young boys.

"It was a terrible, terrible time. I really had no time, thinking I was going to be shot, or the kids would be kidnapped. My first thought was to protect the family, try and get some evidence, and get a lawyer on board as quickly as possible."

The evidence Rance has amassed is staggering. Document after document shows the same land agent and two moneylenders, transferring the properties back and forth to his ex-wife in a form of pawnbroking, where she was in effect borrowing at astronomical rates of interest, using the properties as collateral. Rance believes she was being pressurised by relatives to raise the cash. He believes she received only a fraction of the properties' value. She was arrested in 2010, and is now serving a four-year prison sentence.

But nothing has happened to any of the other parties linked to the fraud. Rance has filed nine criminal and civil suits against them. He has had to travel to Phuket for every hearing, paying for himself, a lawyer, and a translator - hearings which are usually many months apart, and sometimes cancelled at the last minute. Worse, one of the moneylenders has filed a perjury case against Rance, claiming that he knew about the fraud all along. This has resulted in Rance's passport being confiscated, and he is now obliged to report to the police every month in Phuket.

Over five years Rance estimates he has spent the equivalent of £200,000 ($300,000) on legal fees and other costs relating to the legal battle. The only case he has won resulted in the imprisonment of his ex-wife and the restoration of his company directorship. Yet the same judge ruled that he had no right to sue the moneylenders for the stolen properties, because he had not been a director of the company at the time.

Rance has hired five lawyers, some of whom he says have overcharged him and sometimes deliberately sabotaged his cases. He has had to petition the Ministry of Justice to find a lawyer he can trust.

"There are many foreigners who have filed cases similar to Ian Rance," says Surin Bumrungphol, who heads the Phuket Anti-Corruption Network, a campaign group. "In many cases the lawyers they hire actually work for the other side, for more money. The reason most of them lose is because of corrupt, incompetent lawyers, and the failure of law enforcement officers to do their job properly."

Since I started working on this story a number of foreigners have contacted me to tell me about their experience of different kinds of fraud on Phuket. In some cases the property deal they have signed up to has not been honoured. But only one other case matches Rance's in almost every detail.

Colin Vard also invested about £1m in Phuket, after a successful career in Dublin as an author and part-owner of a clothing factory. He lost a total of eight properties, over a similar time period. In some cases the same moneylenders who exploited Rance's wife were involved.

Vard's Thai partner, the mother of his son, has been sentenced to 17 years in prison for the fraud but evidence showing the involvement of several other people has been ignored by police. Vard has accused some police officers in Phuket of tampering with his criminal complaints by removing evidence from his files, so the cases fail in court - and he has discovered that the cousin of one police chief actually ended up with one of his stolen properties.

In desperation, in March this year Vard went with his two children into the central branch of a Thai bank he believes is connected to the fraud, and mounted a sit-down protest. He has done the same outside the police headquarters in Bangkok, blocking the traffic. Each time he has been promised a proper investigation.

But after five years, there has been no visible progress. The Thai police have assured the BBC that they are working on his case. The deputy governor in Phuket also promised Vard and the BBC in February that his case would be taken up, but to date nothing has happened.

Ian Rance has a new wife now, and they have a young baby girl. His main priority he says is to provide a proper home for the four children, and put them through school. With the boys' mother in prison, and his funds exhausted, this is a huge challenge. He cannot even consider returning to the UK, because of the requirements regarding income and savings, which in his case are now insufficient.

I asked him what he would say to those considering retiring and buying property in Phuket.

"Don't. Don't come here. The system of law is nowhere near as strong as you think it is going to be, there is no protection for you, and there are gangs of people victimising you. The lawyers have very little in the way of ethics or professionalism."

Thousands of foreigners have settled in Phuket without serious difficulties. But if things do go wrong, they may find it hard to get help from the police or the judicial system.

I trust the average Thai woman about as far as I can throw her. The only Thai woman I would consider marrying would have to be from a well off family…

[Travesty]

(09-25-2015 07:51 AM)dreambig Wrote:  

In the UK my impression is that bringing back a white girl from the FSU is much riskier than say, an Asian girl. The reason being that most British men still prefer to marry white girls.

A white girl of fair complexion is much, much more pedestalized than an Asian chick. The former transforms within a few weeks of landing on British soil. .

Not many people are going to be trying to steal your Chinese or Filipina bride from you. Blonde Russian? Good luck mate.

Same in the U.S.

The totem pole would be like this for bringing back a good looking chick:

White - 5x as likely to be thirsted after and leave
Latina - 3x
Asian - base number
Indian - 2x likely to stay
Black - 3x likely to stay

Guys thirst so hard for white pussy.

[KingTut]

@travesty,. I think you are generalizing a bit too much. A hot girl is hot no matter what race she comes from. No need to put this into some race classification. Your classication is flawed because you assume that Latino guys have n the U.S (example) will not go for that hot Latina you brought back. For many people white blonde girls are not top on the list. "Guys thirst so hard for white pussy" is a complete fallacy. Case in point, Latin America and SEA are prime destinations for many in this forum.

[Travesty]

^ No it isn't a fallacy in the U.S.

I have no clue what you are talking about. Sad to say but I believe it is true because I have "white washed" Hispanic close friends for many years. Most Latin men in the U.S. at least the Mexican and Central American ones are usually more of the cholo/rap type, lower class, short, and lower earners than whites are by a large majority. That is just the truth. Not saying they are bad people. Your competition to keep an import of a white chick vs. a latin chick is a bit easier especially if that import Latin chick isn't into cholo rap, lifted car, neck tatt guys. It still won't be easy hence, they receive the silver thirst medal.

I live in a very diverse area. Riddle me this Batman. What do all my Black, Latino, Asian, Middle Eastern friends have in common? Oh yeah they all love white pussy. Now you ask this same group about any other race outside of theirs and now opinions wildly differ.

My racially charged totem pole is fucking science. Get outta here.

[PapayaTapper]

^^^^ Patrice explains it best

[worldtraveler3]

Pretty much agree with travesty on this.

Sure a Latina or Even Asian can be hot and wanted in Anglo countries, but they are no where near as popular as whites. Keep in mind this is even after considering the attitude of entitled white girls. I know some of my close friends who would actually rather specifically date a white girl no matter what her attitude is and how she treats him. And these guys are successful people. The amount of tolerance these guys give to them further feeds their ego. One of the guys got a divorce later on.

The media, etc all play a role in giving value to white girls. Look at how many white models there are compared to Asian or black ones you will be surprised to see the ratio.
Goes to show how much white girls are valued.

[samsamsam]

(09-25-2015 09:13 PM)worldtraveler3 Wrote:  

Pretty much agree with travesty on this.

Sure a Latina or Even Asian can be hot and wanted in Anglo countries, but they are no where near as popular as whites. Keep in mind this is even after considering the attitude of entitled white girls. I know some of my close friends who would actually rather specifically date a white girl no matter what her attitude is and how she treats him. And these guys are successful people. The amount of tolerance these guys give to them further feeds their ego. One of the guys got a divorce later on.

The media, etc all play a role in giving value to white girls. Look at how many white models there are compared to Asian or black ones you will be surprised to see the ratio.
Goes to show how much white girls are valued.

Or how much media flips out over a missing or murdered white woman or kid but blacks don't get nearly the media coverage for same crimes.

[Bushido]

Didn't mean to make this into a race thread. My bad.

As we all know, the issue is more about the lack of healthy BMI, feminine women than any particular race of woman. I wasn't trying to say that white girls are somehow superior. It's more that there are so few truly attractive ones to go around.

To put it conversely, if I married a hot Ukrainian and took her to Japan the effect would be similar to bringing an Asian to the UK. Despite widespread beliefs to the contrary, most local guys wouldn't be hitting on her. Hmm, maybe that's an idea!

[El Chinito loco]

(09-25-2015 12:41 PM)WalterBlack Wrote:  

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-34346620

I trust the average Thai woman about as far as I can throw her. The only Thai woman I would consider marrying would have to be from a well off family…

Based on the article you quoted this guy has more money than brains and is probably a really poor judge of character to boot. I have a hard time believing this wife didn't display any personality red flags throughout their relationship. A guy even moderately experienced with women should easily see the problems before they get to the level of fuckery he walked into. Another thing is that a lot of western guys are clueless when it comes to asian culture and many can't really tell the difference between bad and good women.

The reason why is that the degenerate feminist social atmosphere in the west blurs these lines with women. So when some guys go to asia their expectations and social skills concerning women are all messed up too.

Also, forming a company and putting all your assets into your wife's name in a foreign country is a classic dipshit expat move. Zero sympathy. It's second only to the sad sacks you hear who are planning to start a beer bar or will shortly be investing all their money into a coconut/turkey/snake farm.

[Phoenix]

(09-25-2015 12:41 PM)WalterBlack Wrote:  

I trust the average Thai woman about as far as I can throw her.

I dunno man, they're pretty light. You sure you want to invest that much trust?

[KingTut]

@dreamng I get your point. Opposite always
attract. For instance a hot Brazilian mulatta would be a hit in Sweden as a hot blonde Swedish will be a hit in Brazil, from this to infer that blondes have supremacy on the totem pole, that is a big jump. The blonde ice queen might be a trophy for some people here in the U.S.A but let's not generalize.
@travesty. You meant science of subjectivity at best, based on anectodal evidence, tautological reasoning and self fulfilling prophecy.
@worldtraveler. To follow up on your example and logic, how many miss world in the last few years were blondes?

[Travesty]

(09-26-2015 04:37 AM)KingTut Wrote:  

@travesty. You meant science of subjectivity at best, based on anectodal evidence, tautological reasoning and self fulfilling prophecy.

Yes that is my case. I am shocked you live in the U.S. and you don't know of or experience the white girl pain in the ass entitled syndrome. This comes from them being entitled through thirst they receive from men of all types. They get the biggest pussy pass and halo effect of anyone in American society by far.

[rudebwoy]

(09-26-2015 04:37 AM)KingTut Wrote:  

@dreamng I get your point. Opposite always
attract. For instance a hot Brazilian mulatta would be a hit in Sweden as a hot blonde Swedish will be a hit in Brazil, from this to infer that blondes have supremacy on the totem pole, that is a big jump. The blonde ice queen might be a trophy for some people here in the U.S.A but let's not generalize.
@travesty. You meant science of subjectivity at best, based on anectodal evidence, tautological reasoning and self fulfilling prophecy.
@worldtraveler. To follow up on your example and logic, how many miss world in the last few years were blondes?

Hot Brazilian mulatta would stop traffic in most places, god forbid if she has a nice round booty.

[Brosemite]

(09-25-2015 06:23 PM)KingTut Wrote:  

@travesty,. I think you are generalizing a bit too much. A hot girl is hot no matter what race she comes from. No need to put this into some race classification. Your classication is flawed because you assume that Latino guys have n the U.S (example) will not go for that hot Latina you brought back. For many people white blonde girls are not top on the list. "Guys thirst so hard for white pussy" is a complete fallacy. Case in point, Latin America and SEA are prime destinations for many in this forum.

There is a bit of a point in this. One of my buddies works for a Delta affiliate and spent time piloting in Vietnam. Despite the cooking, cleaning, and submissive feminine behaviors these gals exhibited when dating pilots, a good bit of them peaced after waiting 3 years to get that Green Card in the US.

Also, just because you bring back a non-white girl doesn't mean she will at one point during the marriage not feel the urge to peace.

Peruvian chicks in Dallas are all about finding that rich old white gringo...but I know a tacky alpha chachi Peruvian dude who loves to holler at them anyways...with good bang results too, haha