[CRR]

(01-10-2015 10:51 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(01-10-2015 09:13 AM)CRR Wrote:  

They of course went into full hamster mode, saying that men (me in particular) just aren't interested in 'successful' and 'experienced' women. I pointed out that to them a successful woman is any woman with a job whereas a man's success is directly correlated to his income. And 'experienced'? GTFO, just a euphemism for 'has been fucked by lots of dudes'.

I wonder was there more of a reaction? Did any of it click? I think it is great stuff but, if I may, ust gotta be a little careful around work hags and betas.

Very true, and very important that you point this out regarding coworkers.

I'm generally very careful. Thing is I have some seniority, and my coworkers, even the women, know my nature and accept it.

A lot of that has to do with an important Red Pill characteristic, there was a great article about it on ROK I think, which is to keep your frame and always remain calm. That way, if you do have to raise your voice, people will know there must be a very good reason. The other huge benefit of ROK/RVF that I've picked up in the year that I've been here is the ability to clearly explain my positions.

Since it was out of the office, and not at a work event, I figured it was worth responding. Also, if they had been shrieking at me about it, I would've walked away. But since they brought it up, I calmly but firmly explained my position. Even when the hamster kicked in, they were more or less calm about it, a lot of it was because of the way I engaged them. And to be fair, they are somewhat reasonable for women.

I think it did sink in because they know me well enough that they can't just dismiss me as some 'weirdo' or 'creep'. But the big reason it sinked in? It was true.

[SlickyBoy]

Sebastian, have you been paying attention to anything discussed here or on ROK? I'm not making this stuff up, and neither is anyone else. Nor are any of us bitter/angry about the current map of reality - all we can do is acknowledge and adapt. But denial coupled with anecdotal exception is just foolhardy.

I'm not sure what oasis you found in the US, but congratulations to you and best of luck.

[Bazzwaldo]

Slickboy
Do you actually want to have kids?
46 is fairly old to start being tied down by rug rats

[SlickyBoy]

Indeed, barring serious financial resources, it is late in the game. Though yes, kids would be great, have to look at the big picture regardless of the breeding stock chosen. It's a long road paved with mines.

The more things get civilized and developed, the more expensive, risky and complex it gets to have kids. It's a worldwide phenomenon that follows the urbanization of the population. Another thread talked about a documentary called The Demographic Cliff. Kids went from being assets to a liabilities; the rest was predictable. Scary stuff.

[Sebastian]

well you don't have to listen to some guys opinion like mine on internet

Why don't you share those with average guys generally having a decent life in person and see how he reacts?

(01-10-2015 04:26 PM)SlickyBoy Wrote:  

Sebastian, have you been paying attention to anything discussed here or on ROK? I'm not making this stuff up, and neither is anyone else. Nor are any of us bitter/angry about the current map of reality - all we can do is acknowledge and adapt. But denial coupled with anecdotal exception is just foolhardy.

I'm not sure what oasis you found in the US, but congratulations to you and best of luck.

[iknowexactly]

(01-10-2015 10:51 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(01-10-2015 09:13 AM)CRR Wrote:  

They of course went into full hamster mode,

I wonder was there more of a reaction? Did any of it click? I think it is great stuff but, if I may, ust gotta be a little careful around work hags and betas.

Noooooooo.... you don't have to be "a little " careful, you must NEVER say anything that can be interpreted as Red Pill---women are perfect as they are, etc...

EDIT: The writer has seniority and juice at work-- but for everyone else...

In the Anglosphere workplace, one of the problems with women being very different than men is, you've got to pretend there's no difference between men and women.

[JustlookingForAGoodTime]

(01-10-2015 10:06 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

(01-10-2015 10:51 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(01-10-2015 09:13 AM)CRR Wrote:  

They of course went into full hamster mode,

I wonder was there more of a reaction? Did any of it click? I think it is great stuff but, if I may, ust gotta be a little careful around work hags and betas.

Noooooooo.... you don't have to be "a little " careful, you must NEVER say anything that can be interpreted as Red Pill---women are perfect as they are, etc...

EDIT: The writer has seniority and juice at work-- but for everyone else...

In the Anglosphere workplace, one of the problems with women being very different than men is, you've got to pretend there's no difference between men and women.

I disagree.

One of the things i love doing is redpilling female coworkers and such. Sooner or later they end up in a spot where they know that "strong independent" bullshit is a straight up lie and guys like me are going to leave them to rot.

[Bazzwaldo]

(01-10-2015 08:06 PM)SlickyBoy Wrote:  

Indeed, barring serious financial resources, it is late in the game. Though yes, kids would be great, have to look at the big picture regardless of the breeding stock chosen. It's a long road paved with mines.

The more things get civilized and developed, the more expensive, risky and complex it gets to have kids. It's a worldwide phenomenon that follows the urbanization of the population. Another thread talked about a documentary called The Demographic Cliff. Kids went from being assets to a liabilities; the rest was predictable. Scary stuff.

I respect your choice to become a parent but please go into a committed kid baring relationship with open eyes
I first became a parent at age 35, for me, a lifelong committment. To her the relationship was optional, I got financially raped and visitation rights to rear my son... pathetic. She and my son live together and between child support and government support she got what she really wanted, a kid.
I have also raised another man's kids for 8 years in my current relationship and wish it on no man, they are now adults and no longer live with us.
I may not be the man to take advice from because if I were your age (little younger than me) and child free I'd avoid the notion of having kids altogether.
The more I think of it, child production really is instinctual in women, they look for all the physical characteristics in a male to give HER child the best chance in life.
Society tries to cover this up by introducing notions of equality, and the disgusting emasculation and feminisation of males

[Easy_C]

You touched on something important. NEVER wife up a girl who expresses even the slightest sentiment that Divorce might be OK. The typical line is "I'm totally against Divorce, but it's still better than......."

[rpg]

A 33 year old female doctor isnt going to be happy until she marries some old rich dude who has been married 2 or 3 times already. Hypergamy at its finest.She can adopt kids from Haiti if her uterus takes a shit and doesnt work at 40+. Move on to younger women. That is what they are there for.

[samsamsam]

(01-10-2015 01:07 PM)CRR Wrote:  

(01-10-2015 10:51 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(01-10-2015 09:13 AM)CRR Wrote:  

They of course went into full hamster mode, saying that men (me in particular) just aren't interested in 'successful' and 'experienced' women. I pointed out that to them a successful woman is any woman with a job whereas a man's success is directly correlated to his income. And 'experienced'? GTFO, just a euphemism for 'has been fucked by lots of dudes'.

I wonder was there more of a reaction? Did any of it click? I think it is great stuff but, if I may, ust gotta be a little careful around work hags and betas.

Very true, and very important that you point this out regarding coworkers.

I'm generally very careful. Thing is I have some seniority, and my coworkers, even the women, know my nature and accept it.

A lot of that has to do with an important Red Pill characteristic, there was a great article about it on ROK I think, which is to keep your frame and always remain calm. That way, if you do have to raise your voice, people will know there must be a very good reason. The other huge benefit of ROK/RVF that I've picked up in the year that I've been here is the ability to clearly explain my positions.

Since it was out of the office, and not at a work event, I figured it was worth responding. Also, if they had been shrieking at me about it, I would've walked away. But since they brought it up, I calmly but firmly explained my position. Even when the hamster kicked in, they were more or less calm about it, a lot of it was because of the way I engaged them. And to be fair, they are somewhat reasonable for women.

I think it did sink in because they know me well enough that they can't just dismiss me as some 'weirdo' or 'creep'. But the big reason it sinked in? It was true.

Apologies on my crappy photoshop skills. But your post made me think of this. I have a random imagination and I don't do drugs. Only imagine the random shit I would think of if I was high



Disclaimer: To the PETA members of this forum, no animal as harmed in the making of the picture.

[The Reactionary Tree]

Here is that article by Roosh about how the wall is not as bad as we make it out to be: http://www.rooshv.com/the-wall-is-softer-than-we-think

With thirst that exists in today's society and the sausage fest of the USA mentioned on another thread, there really isn't a wall for women. Sure their looks fade and they can't get pregnant, but there will always be men for them.

To answer Sebastian question, no, I am glad I don't live in a third world country. That's a stupid question to ask. Entitlement is a problem among both sexes and all levels of socio-economic status. It's a cultural problem I wish we didn't have. You see it every day. Look at how people act or treat one another. It doesn't matter if it's the grocery store clerk, their local pharmacist, or the collective of the entire opposite sex. People feel like they should be treated as if they are royalty without offering any value into that relationship. That's entitlement to believe you deserve the world without reciprocating that value to the other person. You'll get more out of life and out of your fellow man if you provide some value for that person, even if it means just being respectful or kind to that person. You get more bees with honey than you do with vinegar.

The same goes for relationships with the opposite sex. Women should offer value to men by making themselves appealing to men and men should do the same for women. To be honest, neither side is really doing this in the west.

I guess it's too much to ask that we not have the problem of entitlement. That's a society I want to live in, where people don't feel entitled. A society where people instead seek to have mutual relations with the people they interact with, be it their waiter at a restaurant or their lover.

[Days of Broken Arrows]

(01-10-2015 11:30 PM)rpg Wrote:  

A 33 year old female doctor isnt going to be happy until she marries some old rich dude who has been married 2 or 3 times already. Hypergamy at its finest.She can adopt kids from Haiti if her uterus takes a shit and doesnt work at 40+. Move on to younger women. That is what they are there for.

Yes, this. ^^^

Or...the polar opposite. She'll marry a still-in-college eternal-grad-student or a gardener or "artist" who is ten years younger and makes no money.

A lot of women who "mother" people on the job (doctors, editors, teachers, nurses) tend to get into relationship where they're the mom, not the girlfriend.

If you want in, you have to hide most of your positive attributes. Instead, pretend you're anything from a recovering addict to a starving artist. This the result of Baby Boomer parents raising a generation of little school-obsessed, take-charge control freaks who look at successful men as threatening competitors, not potential lovers.

If I weren't so lazy, I'd do a ROK piece on this, because I think it's the real reason women prefer so-called bad boys.

[Sebastian]

So people just ignore you or don't acknowledge your presence in public (making eye contacts, smiling, small chat with a Stanger) and you think something is wrong with them?

People generally agree to 'City people are cold' statement. (there is a good reason behind it)
But what you said down there will be looked as crazy if you say such things in public places like coffee shops.

Btw, are you an immigrant?

(01-11-2015 02:38 AM)The Reactionary Tree Wrote:  

To answer Sebastian question, no, I am glad I don't live in a third world country. That's a stupid question to ask. Entitlement is a problem among both sexes and all levels of socio-economic status. It's a cultural problem I wish we didn't have. You see it every day. Look at how people act or treat one another. It doesn't matter if it's the grocery store clerk, their local pharmacist, or the collective of the entire opposite sex. People feel like they should be treated as if they are royalty without offering any value into that relationship. That's entitlement to believe you deserve the world without reciprocating that value to the other person. You'll get more out of life and out of your fellow man if you provide some value for that person, even if it means just being respectful or kind to that person. You get more bees with honey than you do with vinegar.

The same goes for relationships with the opposite sex. Women should offer value to men by making themselves appealing to men and men should do the same for women. To be honest, neither side is really doing this in the west.

I guess it's too much to ask that we not have the problem of entitlement. That's a society I want to live in, where people don't feel entitled. A society where people instead seek to have mutual relations with the people they interact with, be it their waiter at a restaurant or their lover.

[The Reactionary Tree]

Strangers making eye contact when you walk by has nothing to do with relationships.

It sounds like you don't get what I'm trying to say. I don't expect anything from people. I was not born with a silver spoon in my mouth and I have had to work for all the things in my life. My parents are dead. I paid my way through school and now I'm doctored and make a six figure salary. I am far from entitled. I understand that it takes work to achieve my personal goals in life. It also takes work to form real relationships with people.I don't expect people to give me the time of day unless I am willing to provide value in their lives. That's what I'm talking about. In order to attract women, you must be the best man you can be. If you want good friends, you need to be a good friend. If you want good customer service, you got to be a good customer. If you want good business partners, you have to be a good business man. You earn respect, it's not given away freely. When you are entitled, none of the above applies to you, or at least you don't think it should. This is the feeling of a lot Americans. They feel entitled. They feel everything should come easy and when it doesn't, they become hostile. Also it explains the low quality of most people's character that they don't feel the need to add value to others lives if they want something in return.

Do you understand any of that?

And no, I am American born and raised. I don't see why my nationality matters. This is basic human interactions 101.

Here's an example and an experiment you can perform: next time you go out to a restaurant, provide a sincere compliment to your waiter (say you like their hairstyle or whatever but make it sincere). I guarantee you will make that person's day and they will go above and beyond what they normally do to provide you excellent service. You added value to their life, you maybe even made their day. You will get the best service they can provide. This will work better than acting like an entitled prick and barking orders at them, degrading them, complaining and criticizing. Add value to the world man. It's already a shitty place. You'll find that your interaction with people are better if you add value. The whole world would be a better place if people added value instead of only taking value because they feel entitled to it.

[Saweeep]

^^^

People used to call that behaviour "being a gentleman" and I agree wholeheartedly.

There is no weakness or shame in that behaviour.

[kazz]

Sebastion, have you ever lived in other countries? Experiencing deeper interactions and relationships with women than if you were just passing through. I dont see what your getting at. Are you saying that, in general, western women are comparable to foreign women?

[The Reactionary Tree]

Here's a better example and it has to do with 'game.'

Why do women sleep with you Sebastian?

When you are out at the club/bar, why does that sexy woman go home with you that night to get laid? I'm sure there are guys at the bar who are taller than you, better looking than you, wealthier than you, smarter than you, etc. Why does that chick go home with you out of all those other guys there? I bet she could proposition any guy in that bar for sex and they would say yes 9 out of 10 times. Yet she chose you.

It's because Sebastian comes to RVF and he has game!

What is game? Game is value-added to male-female interactions.

When you spit game, you are providing value to an interaction with a woman. You are giving her the value she is craving. You are cocky, funny, confident, masculine, cocksure and alpha. Her panties moisten at the the thought of interacting with a man who provides that value to her everyday mundane life.

A person who is entitled doesnt have game. example: Eliot Rodger. That guy was good looking, medium-high IQ, wealthy but he never got laid. Why not? He had a gross level of entitlement. He never felt the need to add value into the lives of women. He thought by the virtue of merely being himself that the sexiest women in California would throw themselves at his feet.

Adding value to basic human interactions is a sign to you come from an abundance mindset. You are willing to give value because you dont mind parting with it. However, you expect to receive value in return. People who are entitled dont give away value (or reciprocate it), they just take it because they feel they deserve it. They come from a scarcity mindset. (when you think about it, depending on the interaction, adding value is a really low-effort thing)

If you add value to an interaction and into your relationships and they do not reciprocate that value in anyway and they just take it, then fuck those people. They are not people you want in your life. People who just take value without reciprocating are shitty people with entitlement complexes.

Do you want to have friendships, business partners, lovers who only take value from you and never reciprocate? I didn't think so.

What kind of woman do you want in your life? Do you want a feminine, fit, trustworthy, honest, sexy woman (values you admire- values women are adding to the relationship)? Or do you want a masculine, fat, bitchy cunt (no value added whatsoever)?

I've been reading a lot about stoicism and MikeCF's blog (Danger & Play) and he talks a lot about having an abundance mindset and adding value. You will live a richer, more rewarding life if you add value to all your human interactions and relationships.

[VolandoVengoVolandoVoy]

I would not marry a doctor. She will age very quickly unless she has one of the highly competitive "lifestyle" specialties like radiology or dermatology that have manageable hours and pay well.
Medicine is bad for your health. Working 16 hours and then being on call, putting in up to 100 hours a week, always under enormous stress and pressure...most female doctors I know in their mid to late 30s have bad skin and thick legs.

[Saweeep]

(01-11-2015 10:17 AM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  

I would not marry a doctor. She will age very quickly unless she has one of the highly competitive "lifestyle" specialties like radiology or dermatology that have manageable hours and pay well.
Medicine is bad for your health. Working 16 hours and then being on call, putting in up to 100 hours a week, always under enormous stress and pressure...most female doctors I know in their mid to late 30s have bad skin and thick legs.

Yeah. I don't think women are cut out for this kind of lifestyle. Something always has to give.

That something is normally their physical appearance.

[MrLemon]

(01-11-2015 10:17 AM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  

I would not marry a doctor. She will age very quickly unless she has one of the highly competitive "lifestyle" specialties like radiology or dermatology that have manageable hours and pay well.
Medicine is bad for your health. Working 16 hours and then being on call, putting in up to 100 hours a week, always under enormous stress and pressure...most female doctors I know in their mid to late 30s have bad skin and thick legs.

Also, for any man over 40 or so, women doctors provide poor quality care.

Women have a switch in their brain...any man who hits the age of 40 or so, is not worthy of their concern. You aren't a child or a fellow woman or an elderly patient, and therefore the female brain writes you off automatically.

I've learned this the hard way over the years, and confirmed it with my buddies. Once you're a middle aged man, get a male doctor.

I've found especially that the young male doctors treat older men patients with much more respect.

But, I digress.

[Sebastian]

Look. it's too bad that the world (western society) doesn't revolve around your standard (value sharing, whatever you call that)
You must be miserable everyday since you see those American people with Entitled face all the time.

Everybody has different opinions about themselves. If they ask more than what they are worth, you can simply walk away instead of getting mad at them all the time. (whether it's a bum demanding money or a fat chick who wants a charming husband)

Keep hating on people and preach about how they are supposed to act.
They are not going to change. You will only get stressed out in the end.

In the end, you do not like how American people interact. But you are one of them by birth and I can tell you are one of them by how you write. (trying to be very polite while indirectly degrading them)

I am not American. It would be so Fun and Easy to talk shit about Americans.
I am sorry I am trying to defend you guys. I just don't understand when people making general claims based on their experiences. That's Toxic. I don't like to hang around toxic people. Whether it's True or not, people don't like to hear someone bitching about something. Try it with your guy friends or co workers.

(01-11-2015 08:40 AM)The Reactionary Tree Wrote:  

Here's a better example and it has to do with 'game.'

Why do women sleep with you Sebastian?

When you are out at the club/bar, why does that sexy woman go home with you that night to get laid? I'm sure there are guys at the bar who are taller than you, better looking than you, wealthier than you, smarter than you, etc. Why does that chick go home with you out of all those other guys there? I bet she could proposition any guy in that bar for sex and they would say yes 9 out of 10 times. Yet she chose you.

It's because Sebastian comes to RVF and he has game!

What is game? Game is value-added to male-female interactions.

When you spit game, you are providing value to an interaction with a woman. You are giving her the value she is craving. You are cocky, funny, confident, masculine, cocksure and alpha. Her panties moisten at the the thought of interacting with a man who provides that value to her everyday mundane life.

A person who is entitled doesnt have game. example: Eliot Rodger. That guy was good looking, medium-high IQ, wealthy but he never got laid. Why not? He had a gross level of entitlement. He never felt the need to add value into the lives of women. He thought by the virtue of merely being himself that the sexiest women in California would throw themselves at his feet.

Adding value to basic human interactions is a sign to you come from an abundance mindset. You are willing to give value because you dont mind parting with it. However, you expect to receive value in return. People who are entitled dont give away value (or reciprocate it), they just take it because they feel they deserve it. They come from a scarcity mindset. (when you think about it, depending on the interaction, adding value is a really low-effort thing)

If you add value to an interaction and into your relationships and they do not reciprocate that value in anyway and they just take it, then fuck those people. They are not people you want in your life. People who just take value without reciprocating are shitty people with entitlement complexes.

Do you want to have friendships, business partners, lovers who only take value from you and never reciprocate? I didn't think so.

What kind of woman do you want in your life? Do you want a feminine, fit, trustworthy, honest, sexy woman (values you admire- values women are adding to the relationship)? Or do you want a masculine, fat, bitchy cunt (no value added whatsoever)?

I've been reading a lot about stoicism and MikeCF's blog (Danger & Play) and he talks a lot about having an abundance mindset and adding value. You will live a richer, more rewarding life if you add value to all your human interactions and relationships.

[SlickyBoy]

If you're not American, did you grow up here? If not, then no offense but you really have no idea what you're talking about. I'm referring also to your earlier comments where you refute the general consensus here when it comes to Western (and particularly American) women.

If you're not American (and from your writing you do not sound like a native English speaker either) and under 30, then you definitely don't know since you haven't been on the American scene long enough to witness the changes over even the past ten years. It is nothing short of paradigm shifting.

We don't get together here to bitch so much as we do to help solve problems and get answers, as presumably you do too.

[Thaitanium]

(01-11-2015 05:49 AM)The Reactionary Tree Wrote:  

Strangers making eye contact when you walk by has nothing to do with relationships.

It sounds like you don't get what I'm trying to say. I don't expect anything from people. I was not born with a silver spoon in my mouth and I have had to work for all the things in my life. My parents are dead. I paid my way through school and now I'm doctored and make a six figure salary. I am far from entitled. I understand that it takes work to achieve my personal goals in life. It also takes work to form real relationships with people.I don't expect people to give me the time of day unless I am willing to provide value in their lives. That's what I'm talking about. In order to attract women, you must be the best man you can be. If you want good friends, you need to be a good friend. If you want good customer service, you got to be a good customer. If you want good business partners, you have to be a good business man. You earn respect, it's not given away freely. When you are entitled, none of the above applies to you, or at least you don't think it should. This is the feeling of a lot Americans. They feel entitled. They feel everything should come easy and when it doesn't, they become hostile. Also it explains the low quality of most people's character that they don't feel the need to add value to others lives if they want something in return.

Do you understand any of that?

And no, I am American born and raised. I don't see why my nationality matters. This is basic human interactions 101.

Here's an example and an experiment you can perform: next time you go out to a restaurant, provide a sincere compliment to your waiter (say you like their hairstyle or whatever but make it sincere). I guarantee you will make that person's day and they will go above and beyond what they normally do to provide you excellent service. You added value to their life, you maybe even made their day. You will get the best service they can provide. This will work better than acting like an entitled prick and barking orders at them, degrading them, complaining and criticizing. Add value to the world man. It's already a shitty place. You'll find that your interaction with people are better if you add value. The whole world would be a better place if people added value instead of only taking value because they feel entitled to it.

I truly like your last statement. One can see the difference when adding value or barking orders at people (as certain types of tourists do abroad). Great point and one people should follow

[Easy_C]

That quote summarizes the problem that I have with a lot of the "RedPill" community. Across the various sites involved there are quite a few commentators who try to enshrine their pessimism, entitlement, and laziness as a virtue by calling it "redpill", while denigrating anyone who is more successful or with a higher value than them as "blue pill" or "beta".

Not only do these sad fucks have no clue what the terms even mean but they are toxic for the community as a whole.