[reaper23]

re that GH Liar Guide:

good shit. but the thing to keep in mind is what "contest condition" means. thats like 6% BF isn't it?

if i was 214 i would be about 6%. i would be absolutely completely shredded to the max.

won't ever happen

220 would be 9-10%
230 would be 14-15%

still not contest condition but damn good.

slowly but surely.


------------

this all just brings up interesting ideas about who likes what and what do we think about it.

chicks say they love brad pitt in fc but do they really? what if they realized he was like 140-150 lbs for that? or that he had to diet hard core for 2 months before hand just to shoot that one scene? thats not the effortlessly in shape that they also say they want.

the guy that just played superman said he dieted down for 6 weeks for ONE SCENE where he was shirtless.

guys often get big for the respect of other guys. chicks hate roid monkeys, or do they? chicks want dudes who are way bigger than they are? or do they?

funny, the one thing we can agree is that they like tall men.

[thegmanifesto]

(08-31-2013 06:47 AM)RussianSoul Wrote:  

RioNomad: No hard feelings. You write some quality stuff here. Next time your in the vicinity of Vienna, beer is on me.

Reaper: Impressive! You are strong, no doubt it. I have to disagree with you about women preferences though. There are a lot of big hefty guys walking around, very very few guys with sub-10 bodyfat. Women like rare things like diamonds, the reactions I get are priceless. About coming across as to try-hard I would have to to put more effort in achieving a bulkier look. It kind of comes down to embracing your natural phenotype.

Gmanifesto: Thanks, man. I don't do any independent core work. Just to be able hold a handstand, your abs/lower back have to be tremendously strong.

Sometimes I will do uphill sprints if I am trying to get extra shredded for a pool party or something. Highly recommended but brutal...

I think the athletic transfer is great. I have never been as fast, strong and flexible as I am now. I am trying to get more seriously into mountain climbing and this type of training is ideal for that. You just don't want to be carrying too many spare pounds when you are hanging off a cliff with one hand. From what I gather, many fighters train this way but that is not my expertise.

My booze intake is high, too high. 2-3 nights a week(7-8 drinks). Its slows down recovery a little bit, but honestly alcohol is not so bad....

Basilransom: Take it very very slow. Your body has to get used to being upside down and blood pooling in the head. Just start with trying to hold a headstand for a minute.

Thebassist: I have one of those doorway pull-up bars. Thats it.

How long did it take you to get to be able to do this:

"5 sets of handstand pushups to nose (14,12,10,8,6) "

That is pretty damn impressive in and of itself.

Do you vary your grips on chinups/pullups?

How do you keep from going bored with this workout?

You do this workout inside? Damn this is the kind of workout I would do outside everyday.

[rhodey]

(08-30-2013 02:00 AM)RussianSoul Wrote:  

Ok, so I have taken a little heat in this thread not for how I look but for referring to myself as built when I don't weigh much for my height. I think this perhaps really a matter of semantics. In my opinion, there is the following scale when it comes to male physiques:

Skinny(Self-Explanatory)>Skinny Ripped(Basically, a guy with nothing but a 6 pack(Brad Pitt in fight club))> Built(6 pack and noticeable muscle(Ryan Reynolds in Blade 3)> Big(A lot of muscle but not particularly lean, think Vin Diesel)>Freak of Nature(Big and Lean).

The latter really only applies to pro-bodybuilders and top athletes in 1-2 sports. None of these guys maintain that look year round and most of them are getting help.

There are a couple good reasons why I am weary about becoming bigger. Firstly, clothes. Nice clothes, Armani suits, etc are made for slim guys. Big guys just don't look as good in them, its an undeniable fact. Under a suit, an Arnold chest looks like man-boobs.

Secondly, the whole muscle head look is an enigma outside the U.S. I grew up in the U.S and have lived abroad for a while now. America may be the only country in the world where a sizable percentage of women like the look. I trace this to American football and WWE. Euro women are turned off by the look. Why invest so much time and effort into a look that most of the world doesn't like?

I didn't start this thread to fish for compliments or to get criticized by people who admire AAS users for the matter. I put this up to help young guys trying to achieve a certain look and avoid stupid advice. Most young guys don't want to look like Arnold, if anything more like Brad Pitt in fight club(which ironically is what most women go crazy over). My physique is comparable, if not more muscular and so yea I think I have some credibility in achieving that goal.

Let me play out a scenario for you..You have a tall 18 year old, just started college. Hes a got decent natural build but his arms are small and he wants a 6-pack. He wants to get buff! So he joins a bodybuilding program and everyone, literally everyone, tells him that he need to do Starting Strength. In fact, since hes a skinny bastard, they tell him to do GOMAD too. With such unanimous advice, how can the kid go wrong? He does the program faithfully and initially is thrilled. The scale goes up, he looks bigger in his clothes, and all his lifts are going up. 6 months later hes gained 30 pounds(60% muscle, 40% fat.). His abs are less visible then when he started. Most of muscle mass he gain is in his thighs/ass and his arms are still small. The kid is left thinking: WTF!. His sole consolation is hes a big guy now and hes a got a solid 3 lift total...

I wish this scenario was hypothetical. That was me and I have seen the same shit play out over and over again. I gained 30 lbs of useless mass. No girls could tell that I had put on mass, because it was all hiding in my jeans. Unless you are playing football, what the hell do you need the mass for? My point is this: most young guys would better off getting really lean and adding mass slowly to the rights areas. 5 pounds in the shoulders/chest/arms is a lot more noticeable than 20 pounds in the legs. Calisthenics is perfect for this type of goal...

Aside from the looks, there is the whole issue of relative strength, which is totally underrated btw. And this is what I don't like about free weights. The amount of weight you can lift will go up the more you weigh. It gives people a false confidence in how strong they are. I am not impressed when when I see a 260LB guy lay down and bench 3 plates, yet same guy will strut around the gym like hes the shit. He probably cant do one pull-up. Do you think women care how much weight you can put up? Despite not lifting for a year, I am confident I could dead lift 400 pounds off the floor with good form. So what. Girls are more impressed when I go over to the nearest pole and hold a human flag for 10 seconds. Fuck, long post. I am tired so I am going to stop writing now...

Dude you are lean but until we see your entire physique I can judge. An upper body does not make an entire physique.. At 6'2" 165 I'm guessing you have toothpicks for legs...

[XXL]

This is blowing my mind RussianSoul. Ok so let me get it straight, you...
- do a combination of handstand push ups, pullups, decline/close grip pushups [or variations] and occasional squats, all in your house, no equipment etc.
- eat when you're hungry, mostly as many protein as you can find, good amount of fruits/veggies, plenty of healthy fats and drink 1.5-2 gallons of water a day.
- drink a couple of drinks a few days a week

Are we missing something?

PS. I fully agree that your look is basically a pinnacle, girls get wet for good definition, not big mass.

[Enigma]

I can't quote from my phone but that chart proves my point exactly. You're comparing bodybuilders to athletes. Find some NFL players that aren't heavier than that list. Even the QBs and WRs are bigger than that. People on the internet get so caught up with this bodybuilding.com stuff that they think that's the only measure of fitness.

[Hades]

(08-31-2013 12:13 PM)XXL Wrote:  

This is blowing my mind RussianSoul. Ok so let me get it straight, you...
- do a combination of handstand push ups, pullups, decline/close grip pushups [or variations] and occasional squats, all in your house, no equipment etc.
- eat when you're hungry, mostly as many protein as you can find, good amount of fruits/veggies, plenty of healthy fats and drink 1.5-2 gallons of water a day.
- drink a couple of drinks a few days a week

Are we missing something?

PS. I fully agree that your look is basically a pinnacle, girls get wet for good definition, not big mass.

An important thing to mention is that he does supersets or uses relatively short rest intervals.

What short rest intervals with a strength movement accomplishes is that, over time, it will increase the ability (and speed) of the muscles to uptake and convert glycogen (carbs).
Given the condition of sufficient lean body mass, that will lower your insulin resistance and have the net effect of making you more carb tolerant.

That's why a lot of the barstarzz athletes are ripped to shreds and still eat like shit, they'll do the same routine for months but just reduce the rest intervals -- basically they go from like 5 sets of 20 dips to a hundred straight dips. High volume, high rep training, increase the intensity over months, and all that.

Starting out you won't have any choice but to use longer rest periods (this is partially why guys on SS get fat, they're training for maximal strength efforts and take huge rest intervals), as longer rest periods are ideal for maximal strength.
Strength always has to come first, over time you can adapt your program to fit more volume in the same amount of time through shorter rest intervals, or the same volume in a shorter time, and it will provide a serious conditioning benefit. It's like learning how to crawl before you can sprint.

[cool]

OP is cut not built. /thread

[Therapsid]

(08-31-2013 01:27 PM)cool Wrote:  

OP is cut not built. /thread

Nice try.

On the one hand you're technically correct.

But it doesn't matter. The point is he looks better than most people would guess just based off body-weight exercises.

This thread kind of annoys me because when I was younger I also relied exclusively on body-weight exercises for several years.

I did this because I was traveling extensively and doing biological field research and didn't have reliable access to gym equipment. I made up a body-weight routine so that I could workout no matter where I was. But people thought I was pretty jacked.

Years later I workout studiously in the gym using barbells, dumbbells, and machines. I'm bigger than I was, but in retrospect I admire what I was able to accomplish simply using my own body. If I were to start over again I would do what RussianSoul did. Any guy who doesn't workout much should forget about free weights and machines and do calisthenics first.

[Screwston]

I think americans are obsessed with being huge. I would say the NFL and other major sports caused this to happen.

[dog24]

I think the title is misleading and i wouldnt recommend other guys doing what the OP did. Yes you definitely look like you lift, but youre still small, you look like you lift because of your muscle insertions not because you focused on certain body parts. I think youre selling yourself short, like other guys said. And claiming that dieting is bullshit? Maybe if you dont ever want to go over 165

Genetics plays a HUGE role in getting an "aesthetic" built. Check out nick wright on youtube, dude has been a competitive bodybuilder for years and still looks like shit.

Also i looked like you for many years, i got tired of it eventually, now i cant wait to get to 220+ i barely care about bodyfat anymore. I think its a natural progression to want to be bigger and stronger every year.

[Every10GivesMeA10]

The guy obviously looks good and looks better than 99% of guys walking outside on any given day.

But...

Sure, a good body helps but by no means do you need to be sub 8% bodyfat and 200+ lbs. Putting the gym in front of learning social skills and making money is wrong unless you actually make money with your body or are a competitive bodybuilder. Obviously you do not want to be a fat fuck, but even if you are, you can get laid. I know fat fucks that get pussy because they simply do not give a fuck what people think and are confident whereas some guy obsessed with lifting will not even approach a girl because he is 'bulking' and does not realize that 12-14% bodyfat with some muscle looks good to girls and is considered to be 'in shape' by 99% of the world.

As a natural, there is no reason to go below 12-10% bodyfat unless you are prepping for a show. Your hormones will suffer massively.

The guys you see online that are huge but claim natural are either genetic freaks or on anabolic steroids.

[RussianSoul]

Gmanifesto: It took about 6-7 months to hit 14-15 on the first set. Yea, I use a lot of different grips for pull-ups. Sternum pull-ups are my favorite.

As for getting bored, something has to drive you. I like getting stronger and looking better. After knocking out 50+ HSPUs in a workout, I feel invincible. That confidence really carries over into my professional/personal life. I hope to be able to do 20 HSPUs one day and that gives me something to look forward to.

Sometimes I do this in the park across the street. The moms stare hard...

Rhodey: My webcam is haywire right now but I will put up leg pics, far from tooth picks. Honestly though, I am trying to remember the last time a woman asked me to flex my thigh....

XXL: Yea, that's it. I like to keep things simple.

Dog24: No offense, mate but to attribute my build to good muscle insertions is just idiotic. First of all, its not true. I have narrow clavicles, shoulders, and high biceps insertions. For years, my upper chest was nonexistent. I had to build that area up and took a lot of hard work.

And what exactly did you get tired of? Swimming in pussy and getting eye fucked everywhere you go? If you want to get massive, I respect that. That said, I hope you are satisfied with American/Anglo women because that look wont get you very far elsewhere.

Every10: My feelings exactly. Guys who take this fitness stuff too seriously become very one dimensional human beings. I walked down that road a few years ago and its not pretty.

[reaper23]

the bottom line is at this height and weight you are not built. you have created the illusion of being so by being of very low body fat.

i find it stretching the boundaries of believability that in clothing you get any particular looks specifically due to your build. personally, i would find you to be very very skinny. we are just two inches apart and i have 80 lbs on you, and i am not fat by any stretch of the imagination. and i am not BUILT.

you should be commended on your low body fat, good definition and ability to do some nice movements. but to be built you need to add progressive amounts of weight and eat more.

[RussianSoul]

Reaper: I don't really care how you would find me, I didn't get into this game to impress men. With clothes on, I have a strong V-taper. I wear a 42 jacket and have a 29 inch waist. I haven't measured my arms but they are snug in a large polo. Most men consider me built and every woman does. The fact that I might look small standing next to a fat muscular guy like you is really the least of my worries. You said your bf percentage is in the high teens. That is fat, bottom line. There's no reason for a man to be above 12%...

[reaper23]

I'm 37 years old.

On one device i'm 17% and on another 19%. Fat? come on now. I wear a 48 jacket and 36-38" pants depending on brand. Fat? haha.

I'm glad you're happy with your physique. You took the time to show it off to us men here, so you must really value men's opinions on it. We have given them.

The bottom line is that a 42 inch jacket on a man 6'2" is kinda like a boys size.

[Teedub]

I've got to say I'm going to pitch in with RussianSoul on this, he put pics up which most people don't and I've got to say he looks great. I don't know what planet people are living on if they're saying girls wouldn't find his body appealing? Or that he wouldn't look good in a tshirt or whatever?! Who do you think would be considered a more attractive proposition, him... or someone who looks like this:

[ImmoralPsychology]

Feel sorry for you RS. You put up an awesome post and have to spend way too much time defending it. Fuck it, dude. Don't bother trying to explain it. Just know that you shared some very valuable insights with a few that do get it.

Some posts in this thread remind me of the comments section on this blog post: http://foxhoundstudio.com/blog/fitness-l...ant-to-be/

And guys say that women's hamsters are strong! LOL

[Enigma]

Haha Reaper, you may as well give up. You're either skinny, fat, or freakishly huge and on steroids. There is no middle ground.

[dog24]

(09-01-2013 04:35 AM)RussianSoul Wrote:  

Dog24: No offense, mate but to attribute my build to good muscle insertions is just idiotic. First of all, its not true. I have narrow clavicles, shoulders, and high biceps insertions. For years, my upper chest was nonexistent. I had to build that area up and took a lot of hard work.

And what exactly did you get tired of? Swimming in pussy and getting eye fucked everywhere you go? If you want to get massive, I respect that. That said, I hope you are satisfied with American/Anglo women because that look wont get you very far elsewhere.

Actually i cant help but take it as an offense, yes you built up your muscles, meaning you made them bigger, but theyre still the same shape theyre genetically predisposed to be. Training and even drugs can do very little if you dont have good muscle insertions.
Of course you dont have to take my word for it, but this is not the first "check out my body" thread ive seen, ive been lurking bb.com for years. I dont really want to go looking for pics of shirtless guys to prove my point. Like i said before i wouldnt recommend the training you did, your diet, or staying at your weight for anyone that wants to look built. And im not putting down on you, i think you have good genetics and look good, what you did worked for YOU.

At 155 13% girls would yell at me from cars (if i was walking around shirtless), also some girls even blatantly said OMG that body at then looked at me with a blush (i was also shirtless in those occassions). Then i cut down to 155 10%, pretty much the same thing happened, except with more female attention and more guys trying to fight me. Whenever i went to a club, the only girls that would hit on me were the fat and ugly, and i would get rejected by hot girls.
And 190 bloated i had hot girls offering to buy me beer just to dance with them, nobody said shit to me, besides the usual damn when did you get so big.

(09-01-2013 10:17 AM)RussianSoul Wrote:  

Reaper: I don't really care how you would find me, I didn't get into this game to impress men. With clothes on, I have a strong V-taper. I wear a 42 jacket and have a 29 inch waist. I haven't measured my arms but they are snug in a large polo. Most men consider me built and every woman does. The fact that I might look small standing next to a fat muscular guy like you is really the least of my worries. You said your bf percentage is in the high teens. That is fat, bottom line. There's no reason for a man to be above 12%...

Its incredible hard to even get to 12% if your not an ecto (which im guessing you must be). Have you ever trained one of your friends (i have), and gave them a diet to see if they got below 12% like and looked remotely like you, or youre just talking based on personal experience?

[Basil Ransom]

(09-01-2013 11:08 AM)Teedub Wrote:  

I've got to say I'm going to pitch in with RussianSoul on this, he put pics up which most people don't and I've got to say he looks great. I don't know what planet people are living on if they're saying girls wouldn't find his body appealing? Or that he wouldn't look good in a tshirt or whatever?! Who do you think would be considered a more attractive proposition, him... or someone who looks like this:

Making an extremely contrived comparison by exaggerating the arguments of your opponents is not convincing, it's laughable.

[cool]

(09-01-2013 01:17 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 11:08 AM)Teedub Wrote:  

I've got to say I'm going to pitch in with RussianSoul on this, he put pics up which most people don't and I've got to say he looks great. I don't know what planet people are living on if they're saying girls wouldn't find his body appealing? Or that he wouldn't look good in a tshirt or whatever?! Who do you think would be considered a more attractive proposition, him... or someone who looks like this:

Making an extremely contrived comparison by exaggerating the arguments of your opponents is not convincing, it's laughable.

A better comparison is Chris Hemsworth's bulk for his role in Thor. He bulked to 225 at 6'4". This is what I call built.

[lovejoy]

(08-30-2013 10:29 PM)reaper23 Wrote:  

It's entirely possible and probable that the definition you're seeing is a direct result of the mad cardio you do and not the push ups and what not.

15% body fat at 6'2" and 185 lbs that means you have 157 lbs LBM. That honestly sounds so scrawny to me. Is it even possible to be defined at 15% bf and only 157 lbm on. 6'2" frame?

I think just like with the chick hotness scale we all have different ideas of what muscular or jacked or ripped or defined means.

Again I have 200 lbs lbm at just about your height with high teens bf and I don't look jacked and I've got 40 lbs of lean body mass on you. 40 lbs! Maybe once I cross down to sub 15% bf it will all make more sense to me. Who knows.

I've done the " Mad Cardio" for years, as interval training, it boost's metabolism. I've found the body weight training works better for me than the isolation exercises, it builds everything in proportion. When you look around the gym it's usually full of guys with one area that's over developed compared to the others, it's very hard for that to happen with bodyweight routines, because none of them focus on small muscle groups.

A lot of how you look is proportion, in my case with a 44" chest and 32 waist I look good in a 44 long suit, the pants generally have to be taken in, but that's it. Steve Reeves, probably one of best natural looking body builders of the golden era at 6'1" flucuated between 193-215lbs, so ideally if I put on another 10lbs I'd be in very good company, but my body loves 185 and i don't have to stuff protein and suppliments to keep it there.

[lovejoy]

(09-01-2013 11:00 AM)reaper23 Wrote:  



I'm 37 years old.

On one device i'm 17% and on another 19%. Fat? come on now. I wear a 48 jacket and 36-38" pants depending on brand. Fat? haha.

I'm glad you're happy with your physique. You took the time to show it off to us men here, so you must really value men's opinions on it. We have given them.

The bottom line is that a 42 inch jacket on a man 6'2" is kinda like a boys size.

Don't know where you get that from, a 42-44 suits comes under "Large" in Men's clothing size charts, a 46 is XL, 48 is a XXL.

[lovejoy]

(09-01-2013 01:41 PM)cool Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 01:17 PM)basilransom Wrote:  

(09-01-2013 11:08 AM)Teedub Wrote:  

I've got to say I'm going to pitch in with RussianSoul on this, he put pics up which most people don't and I've got to say he looks great. I don't know what planet people are living on if they're saying girls wouldn't find his body appealing? Or that he wouldn't look good in a tshirt or whatever?! Who do you think would be considered a more attractive proposition, him... or someone who looks like this:

Making an extremely contrived comparison by exaggerating the arguments of your opponents is not convincing, it's laughable.

A better comparison is Chris Hemsworth's bulk for his role in Thor. He bulked to 225 at 6'4". This is what I call built.

Would you consider Hugh Jackman (Wolverine) built? Off training he's normally 181lbs @ 6'2" . To play the role he got up to 210lbs, but the routine to keep it there is brutal.

[RussianSoul]

Reaper: When almost a fifth of your body is lard, you are fat. Nothing complicated about that.

I didn't put up this thread to fish for compliments and I certainly didn't put it up to take criticism from anonymous self-admitted fat boys. And "we" is like 3 guys in this thread. Whether you want to admit or not, the lean cut-up look is what most men and the vast majority of women find desirable. This thread is a guide for the guys trying to attain that look. There are plenty of forums out there for fat guys to brag about how much they squat and how much mass they have. Perhaps you would be more comfortable there....

Dog24: I take it back, I am glad you are offended. It pisses me off that you presume to know my body better than me. Aside from being predisposed to being lean, my genetics suck. I looked like a stick figure before I started lifting. I have built a sizable amount of mass to attain that V-shape.

Why should I or anyone care what you recommend? Somehow I am not credible because I am the light side of scale yet you put nothing out there for anyone to critique. Post up or shut up...Really, I am fucking tired of this playground bullshit!