Early reports are saying 2 dead including the gunman

Quote: (12-15-2014 11:07 AM)big poppa Wrote:  

Early reports are saying 2 dead including the gunman

2 dead, 3 injured according to CNN.

Couldn't find other mentions of this, but apparently the whole world has gotten Stockholm syndrome with the hashtag #illridewithyou.

I see it as an SJW defense of Islam and it has now gone viral.
The islamic culture is taking over the western world, both due to high birthrates of islamic women in western countries and also due to political correctness where you cannot criticize islam, and therefore the culture is allowed to seep in.. Even in my little town of 35.000 people there is a ghetto full of muslims, maybe 500 meters from where I live here in Denmark.. It is impossible for me to walk through when the sun has come down without getting hunted or attacked, and my father who is a firefighter has to have police escort when the young muslim kids burn off cars and containers. Islam and modern western cultures are like what was said earlier in this thread, like oil and water. In UK there is the whole Rotherham scandal, sharia zones and so on. In Australia they apparently failed to keep this man in prison. A man who probably killed his own wife and have 40 cases of sexual assault on his name. Cultural Marxism..
A lot of kindergartens here in Denmark have banned pork in the kindergarten as to not offend anyone. It's sick.

Police barged in and killed the gunman, but no more details for now.

Quote: (12-15-2014 01:08 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

Quote: (12-15-2014 12:34 AM)Grange Wrote:  

Every time something like this happens I think: try that shit in Texas and see what happens.

Worse shit has been done in Texas and nothing happened. Charles Whitman, Luby's Cafeteria, That dude at Fort Hood and on and on and on.

After the Luby's shooting the laws were changed. I doubt the same thing could happen again. Fort Hood has its own set of rules that are much more restrictive than the state's.

Quote: (12-15-2014 12:43 PM)makaveli Wrote:  

Couldn't find other mentions of this, but apparently the whole world has gotten Stockholm syndrome with the hashtag #illridewithyou.

I see it as an SJW defense of Islam and it has now gone viral.
The islamic culture is taking over the western world, both due to high birthrates of islamic women in western countries and also due to political correctness where you cannot criticize islam, and therefore the culture is allowed to seep in.. Even in my little town of 35.000 people there is a ghetto full of muslims, maybe 500 meters from where I live here in Denmark.. It is impossible for me to walk through when the sun has come down without getting hunted or attacked, and my father who is a firefighter has to have police escort when the young muslim kids burn off cars and containers. Islam and modern western cultures are like what was said earlier in this thread, like oil and water. In UK there is the whole Rotherham scandal, sharia zones and so on. In Australia they apparently failed to keep this man in prison. A man who probably killed his own wife and have 40 cases of sexual assault on his name. Cultural Marxism..
A lot of kindergartens here in Denmark have banned pork in the kindergarten as to not offend anyone. It's sick.

Do the right wing parties ever change tack on immigration policies when they get in power?

Quote: (12-15-2014 12:43 PM)makaveli Wrote:  

Couldn't find other mentions of this, but apparently the whole world has gotten Stockholm syndrome with the hashtag #illridewithyou.

I see it as an SJW defense of Islam and it has now gone viral.
The islamic culture is taking over the western world, both due to high birthrates of islamic women in western countries and also due to political correctness where you cannot criticize islam, and therefore the culture is allowed to seep in.. Even in my little town of 35.000 people there is a ghetto full of muslims, maybe 500 meters from where I live here in Denmark.. It is impossible for me to walk through when the sun has come down without getting hunted or attacked, and my father who is a firefighter has to have police escort when the young muslim kids burn off cars and containers. Islam and modern western cultures are like what was said earlier in this thread, like oil and water. In UK there is the whole Rotherham scandal, sharia zones and so on. In Australia they apparently failed to keep this man in prison. A man who probably killed his own wife and have 40 cases of sexual assault on his name. Cultural Marxism..
A lot of kindergartens here in Denmark have banned pork in the kindergarten as to not offend anyone. It's sick.

Sorry for you, but Islam will not be forbidden.
Now terrorism, on the other hand, might be eradicated.

Quote: (12-15-2014 01:17 PM)Grange Wrote:  

Quote: (12-15-2014 01:08 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

Quote: (12-15-2014 12:34 AM)Grange Wrote:  

Every time something like this happens I think: try that shit in Texas and see what happens.

Worse shit has been done in Texas and nothing happened. Charles Whitman, Luby's Cafeteria, That dude at Fort Hood and on and on and on.

After the Luby's shooting the laws were changed. I doubt the same thing could happen again. Fort Hood has its own set of rules that are much more restrictive than the state's.

An armed response to an armed attacker is the only thing that works. An off-duty reserve deputy in Oklahoma shot and killed that mass murderer wannabe recent convert Alton Nolen a few months ago. Sadly he beheaded a woman before he got shot.

http://www.newson6.com/story/26665056/ch...-beheading

Then there was that doctor a while back who shot the nut who started killing people in his hospital.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/38...rt-b-young

I don't mean to derail into another religion thread, but as it's relevant to this guy's motives: Mikado, do you see any signs of reformation within Islam? Is Islam even capable of changing given its belief structure? I'm under the impression such a reformation can only come from the Middle East (if at all) as Western Muslims are too few in number and lack historical authority.

I ask this because one side must give in the end, and I think Australians are in a far better position to dictate the terms in their own country.

"Integration" boils down to it being the responsibility of assimilating groups to reform preexisting beliefs that are incompatible with the new host culture. This includes language, gender roles (even traditional, historic Western standards are more forgiving than Salafism, for example), and religious practices. Practices and beliefs are two separate things, and our freedoms are limited in that sense (e.g. practicing polygamy) without actually restricting beliefs.

The belief structure of Islam, without a reformation taking place, is by its own nature incompatible, as it dictates military, economic, legal, and financial institutions as well as the religious. The SJW campaign resulting from this (Illridewithyou, I think) stems from a fundamental misunderstanding of theology that places Christianity, Judaism, Islam, and all other religions on the same even moral platform, completely equal in execution. "Cultural relativism" is the underlying evil.

2 Hostages and Captor Are Dead in Siege at Sydney Café:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/16/world/...pe=article

Quote: (12-15-2014 02:07 PM)Blick Mang Wrote:  

I don't mean to derail into another religion thread, but as it's relevant to this guy's motives: Mikado, do you see any signs of reformation within Islam? Is Islam even capable of changing given its belief structure? I'm under the impression such a reformation can only come from the Middle East (if at all) as Western Muslims are too few in number and lack historical authority.

The rise in Islamism that we've seen since the fall of the Shah in 1979 is the Islamic Reformation. Think about it - a movement to return the faith to its more ancient, more pure practice. That's exactly what the Protestant Reformation was about. Osama bin Laden is/was the Martin Luther of the Middle East. And now, just as then, we're seeing this religious struggle tearing the region apart.

HSLD

Idk man I'm coming from a muslim background (I never practiced and I don't consider myself Muslim at all), generally speaking my family majority is muslim.

I have the opposing view, Islam is being liberalized here in the US. Reason being most muslim's I've met drink/smoke/party/fuck etc.

There aren't any hard boundaries like there once were, most 1st generation muslim Americans are secular/liberal (that I've met). They also adapt more American culture than their own.

Now for muslim immigrants it might be a slightly different story but I see most as being open and adapting American traits.

An obvious major reason for it was the blowback from 9/11. Of course yes there are extremists and yes they're the ones who get the media attention like this retarded asshole in Oz.

But I have a positive views of the changes, granted in more concentrated areas that are predominately muslim, you'll see the standard customs.

The US will never ever be like the UK or those European countries which are suffering from Sharia Law, Sharia Patrols, and "Multi-Culturalism" as the OP put it.

Source: Me - A 1st Gen AR-15 Toting, Drinking Fucking Machine 'Merican with Pakistani/Islamic heritage.

Quote: (12-15-2014 02:07 PM)Blick Mang Wrote:  

I don't mean to derail into another religion thread, but as it's relevant to this guy's motives: Mikado, do you see any signs of reformation within Islam? Is Islam even capable of changing given its belief structure? I'm under the impression such a reformation can only come from the Middle East (if at all) as Western Muslims are too few in number and lack historical authority.

I ask this because one side must give in the end, and I think Australians are in a far better position to dictate the terms in their own country.

"Integration" boils down to it being the responsibility of assimilating groups to reform preexisting beliefs that are incompatible with the new host culture. This includes language, gender roles (even traditional, historic Western standards are more forgiving than Salafism, for example), and religious practices. Practices and beliefs are two separate things, and our freedoms are limited in that sense (e.g. practicing polygamy) without actually restricting beliefs.

The belief structure of Islam, without a reformation taking place, is by its own nature incompatible. The SJW campaign resulting from this (Illridewithyou, I think) stems from a fundamental misunderstanding of theology that places Christianity, Judaism, Islam, and all other religions on the same even moral platform, completely equal in execution. "Cultural relativism" is the underlying evil.

Ideally, yes. It should come from the Middle East.
The core belief structure has never changed from the beginning. It's the interpretation that the Arabs made of the Quran that defined the current state of the religion.
Islam is not an homogenuous entity. Best proof of that is the racial and societal tensions between the richer white Arabo-Berbers, and the black african muslims. Don't forget that they rode the african continent for slaves during centuries. And still many of them hold black people with big contempt and condescendance.

So in that current state of things, it is impossible to hope for a "pacific unification and reformation" within the whole Islamic world. Because the latter is too much divided. racial tensions, conflicts between Sunnis and Chiites, Hezbollah, Palestine issues, etc etc

The Quran does not advocate for killing innocent people who did no offense. It is also said that forgiving is the best, and yields way more benefits than vengeance, even if the latter is SOMETIMES justified, when you or your family have been attacked physically. Now when you bear in mind the general spirit of conquest of the Arabs even BEFORE the Prophet came, and draw the parallel with the bloody ages of Christianism and Inquisition, then all the violence since the 7th century makes sense ( I do not condone it though).

That reform you are asking for is already done in West African Muslim countries.
There are no religion wars there( --> Senegal, 95% Muslims, 0 religion issue). It's because those populations do not define entirely themselves by their religion, but also by their African roots. And those roots, at least in the past, made my ancesters respect foreigners, treat them as you would do for a guest, and not start violence against those who did nothing against you.
Even though we are "relatively" poor, we do not find a refuge within Islamic contest or any other bullshit. It's because of our african blood and history.

The problem is that the Middle East do not share the same core beliefs. They tend to follow a more radical Islam, and they are more prone to consider foreigners as ennemies, even if they are Muslim ( see the Black people killed, even if they are Muslims). Changing them is, I am afraid, really impossible.
On that path, East African Muslims are also following more and more the Middle East in that escalation of violence ( Somalia for example). They have even infected Nigeria.


Globally, I understand you wish that moderate Muslims should rise and take the control. However it is difficult because
-When you are a minority in a Middle East country, you can't do shit. They will rather kill you than let you dictate them what to do.
- many moderates do not wish to take part in the debate. They 'd rather just practice their religion, and not care about the rest of the world
-It makes you tired on the end. Because no matter what you do, you still end up often associated with terrorists when you say you are muslim. This is why many moderates follow the previous path: just DGAF.


TLDR: the divisions between Muslims are too numerous. Many of them do not recognize themselves in the Saudi Arabia Wahhabism, which is not far from being connected to some obscur activities, probably related to terrorism. From that point, reaching a consensus might be impossible. Also you have to factor the fact that being Muslim isn't the only thing that defines us. We also have our roots, the country in which we live in, etc, and that makes you sometimes disconnected from the whole Islam problem when your main focus in life is just to provide food to your family, and maybe have some holidays on the beach.

The problem is not just Islam, even though it is the worst and most backward, the problem is all religions.
When people drink the kool aid, and start believing in a sky wizard or cave monster or whatever, and think their imaginary friend is in charge, they become disconnected from reality.
They look for answers from someone or something else, instead of focusing on their own lives and self improvement.
They are also subject to manipulation by corrupt forces, and more likely to be docile sheep for the SJWs.

The current world problem is mainly with Sunni extremists. Iranians are predominantly Shiite, which is what this guy was thought to be. Even now Hezbollah, a Shiite terrorist group from Iran, is helping fight ISIS in Iraq. ISIS is made up of Sunnis. So this dude makes no sense at all. A Shiite that supports ISIS?

Granted, this could turn out to be completely incorrect info since the media is fucking reckless, but that's what I've read so far.

His M.O. is unusual too. Most of the psycho Sunni terrorists who attack in the West don't take hostages. They want to kill as many people as possible.

Quote: (12-15-2014 02:33 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  

The problem is not just Islam, even though it is the worst and most backward, the problem is all religions.
When people drink the kool aid, and start believing in a sky wizard or cave monster or whatever, and think their imaginary friend is in charge, they become disconnected from reality.
They look for answers from someone or something else, instead of focusing on their own lives and self improvement.
They are also subject to manipulation by corrupt forces, and more likely to be docile sheep for the SJWs.

Funny, the conservative religious crowd and countries are the ones who have been fighting them for decades. Meanwhile, Atheists are now Atheist+.

Go take a look at godless Sweden and get back to me, bub. Faggotry and SJW dominated with a new "feminist" foreign policy.

Islam is not the enemy, Salafism / Wahhabism is. NATO troops are fighting the same groups in the Middle East they armed in the 1970-1990's. Those groups were created, supported and handled by the CIA and their collaborators (alledgly) and now they're turned their back on the Western world.

Saudi Arabia and Qatar have signed defense pacts with the US, yet most salafists are Saudis and Qataris and have received significant financial backing by their governments.

I honestly think our world leaders will spin this into a n-th Christianity vs Islam crusade for the profit of Zionists.

Delete

Quote: (12-15-2014 12:43 PM)makaveli Wrote:  

Couldn't find other mentions of this, but apparently the whole world has gotten Stockholm syndrome with the hashtag #illridewithyou.

I see it as an SJW defense of Islam and it has now gone viral.
The islamic culture is taking over the western world, both due to high birthrates of islamic women in western countries and also due to political correctness where you cannot criticize islam, and therefore the culture is allowed to seep in.. Even in my little town of 35.000 people there is a ghetto full of muslims, maybe 500 meters from where I live here in Denmark.. It is impossible for me to walk through when the sun has come down without getting hunted or attacked, and my father who is a firefighter has to have police escort when the young muslim kids burn off cars and containers. Islam and modern western cultures are like what was said earlier in this thread, like oil and water. In UK there is the whole Rotherham scandal, sharia zones and so on. In Australia they apparently failed to keep this man in prison. A man who probably killed his own wife and have 40 cases of sexual assault on his name. Cultural Marxism..
A lot of kindergartens here in Denmark have banned pork in the kindergarten as to not offend anyone. It's sick.

It is pathetic. Instead of using it as one of many opportunities to rail against the costs of 3rd world immigration, these people take to the internet while the Australian murdered are still warm to recite the mantras of cultural marxism. It is like watching peasants during the Black Plague whip themselves in order to ward off god's wrath.

Quote: (12-15-2014 02:45 PM)TheWastelander Wrote:  

Quote: (12-15-2014 02:33 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  

The problem is not just Islam, even though it is the worst and most backward, the problem is all religions.
When people drink the kool aid, and start believing in a sky wizard or cave monster or whatever, and think their imaginary friend is in charge, they become disconnected from reality.
They look for answers from someone or something else, instead of focusing on their own lives and self improvement.
They are also subject to manipulation by corrupt forces, and more likely to be docile sheep for the SJWs.

Funny, the conservative religious crowd and countries are the ones who have been fighting them for decades. Meanwhile, Atheists are now Atheist+.

Go take a look at godless Sweden and get back to me, bub. Faggotry and SJW dominated with a new "feminist" foreign policy.

So, is your theory that increased atheism leads to SJW, "faggotry," and a "feminist" foreign policy?
Interesting, to say the least. Two thirds of Sweden is a member of the Church of Sweden. Their problem is feminism and immigrants, not a lack of medieval superstition.
Get rid of feminism and religion, and then maybe humanity can evolve.
I don't even like the word atheist (against theism), it seems ridiculous, sort of like saying I am anti tooth fairy or anti santa claus.
There is no God, no supreme magical sky wizard. Believing in such nonsense, and living in the religious fantasy world, is just as big a cop out as being a heroin addict.
I mean, if your life is truly awful, and you are imprisoned for life or dying of cancer or being tortured in an ISIS dungeon and literally can't change anything, I can see why a man might do heroin or pray to Jeebus or Mohammed or L Ron Hubbard to make it all better in the next world.

Quote: (12-15-2014 02:31 PM)kaotic Wrote:  

Idk man I'm coming from a muslim background (I never practiced and I don't consider myself Muslim at all), generally speaking my family majority is muslim.....

The US will never ever be like the UK or those European countries which are suffering from Sharia Law, Sharia Patrols, and "Multi-Culturalism" as the OP put it.

Source: Me - A 1st Gen AR-15 Toting, Drinking Fucking Machine 'Merican with Pakistani/Islamic heritage.

Interesting viewpoint from one of the few people qualified to comment-- can I ask-- why do you think it's different here? It's true we've had very few incidents of religious violence here.

Quote: (12-15-2014 04:13 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

Quote: (12-15-2014 02:31 PM)kaotic Wrote:  

Idk man I'm coming from a muslim background (I never practiced and I don't consider myself Muslim at all), generally speaking my family majority is muslim.....

The US will never ever be like the UK or those European countries which are suffering from Sharia Law, Sharia Patrols, and "Multi-Culturalism" as the OP put it.

Source: Me - A 1st Gen AR-15 Toting, Drinking Fucking Machine 'Merican with Pakistani/Islamic heritage.

Interesting viewpoint from one of the few people qualified to comment-- can I ask-- why do you think it's different here? It's true we've had very few incidents of religious violence here.

What're the requirements to be qualified to comment ?

Quote: (12-15-2014 02:42 PM)TheWastelander Wrote:  

The current world problem is mainly with Sunni extremists. Iranians are predominantly Shiite, which is what this guy was thought to be. Even now Hezbollah, a Shiite terrorist group from Iran, is helping fight ISIS in Iraq. ISIS is made up of Sunnis. So this dude makes no sense at all. A Shiite that supports ISIS?

Granted, this could turn out to be completely incorrect info since the media is fucking reckless, but that's what I've read so far.

His M.O. is unusual too. Most of the psycho Sunni terrorists who attack in the West don't take hostages. They want to kill as many people as possible.

This guy was predominantly a criminal type, very common sociopathic and narcissistic asshole type who was organized enough to appear sane in court (after helping with the torture-murder of his ex-wife) and get out on bail and create havoc. I'm guessing he was a bully who, like many cowardly bullies when they are cornered, in the courtroom acted real polite and soft spoken, and lied through his teeth about his offense and was able to get out on bail. I don't see him as really being a pure religious zealot, that was just his self-justification.

What's so hard for those outside the criminal justice system to understand is that these people genuinely, seriously feel and believe they are the victims-- that they were "forced" to "protect" themselves against their victims.

You'll hear the same shit from ISIS. He thought he was the victim and was cold towards others-- he just was grandiose and tried to wrap himself in religious glorification. He was involved with not just the murder, but the torture murder of his ex-wife.

If you are up close to these types of people like I have been you see how little they have to do with the everyday people all over the world of every religion who are not murdering, violent assholes.

There are a number of people who are just criminals who have discovered a PR method that they feel gives them more status than scum who kidnap and fuck shit up.

In this case, the solution would have been to not fucking let out on bail a guy who was involved in a murder!! Duh!!!

Quote: (12-15-2014 01:08 AM)HeyPete Wrote:  

Quote: (12-15-2014 12:34 AM)Grange Wrote:  

Every time something like this happens I think: try that shit in Texas and see what happens.

Worse shit has been done in Texas and nothing happened. Charles Whitman, Luby's Cafeteria, That dude at Fort Hood and on and on and on.

Quote:Quote:

Charles Whitman

Whitman happened in a college campus, colleges campus around the country are gun free zone.

Quote:Quote:

Luby's Cafeteria

At the time, Texas did not allowed people to carry guns outside home, Luby's was a gun free zone.

The women in the video, whose parents were killed at Luby's. had a gun but had to leave it in her car because it was illegal for her to take it inside the restaurant.

Quote:Quote:

Fort Hood

Military bases are gun free zones in case you did not know it, that is why Navy Yard guy was able to do what he did.
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/09/...ons-fault/

Quote: (12-15-2014 03:13 AM)Horus Wrote:  

One of the escaped/freed hostages.

WB.

Quote: (12-15-2014 05:31 AM)Tengen Wrote:  

Quote: (12-15-2014 03:13 AM)Horus Wrote:  

One of the escaped/freed hostages.

WB.

Better image



The cynical part of me is just thinking how much she'll milk this for attention, book deals, etc... TRP has made me cold-hearted

I don't know is it is only me, but I get a turn on when I see women scared like that, the first picture even look like she is posting for s magazine shoot.

--------------------
Never let a tragedy get wasted

Quote:Quote:


#I'llridewithyou: Celebrities and tens of thousands of everyday Twitter users take to social media to show support for Muslim community


Australians have flocked to social media to show solidarity with the Muslim community in the wake of the Martin Place hostage crisis

#illridewithyou has had 112,000 mentions across Twitter and Facebook

The campaign offers members of the Islamic faith lifts to work or protection if they feel frightened to wear their religious clothing while catching public transport

Media personalities such as Harry Kewell, Kyle and Jackie O, and Daniel McPherson have all shown their support for the movement

South Australian Premier Jay Wetherwill and Opposition leader Bill Shorten, as well as ASIO have joined the campaign

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...z3M0JvNk6S


There are people inside being hostage, two or more bombs around the city and the first thing those retard do is tweet to show how they do not hate Muslim, celebrities do not ride public transportation, what do they need? some Australian being blown on live TV? for fuck sake, social media let this people do this crap, thank there was not such shit back when 9/11