Quote: (08-21-2014 06:39 AM)kosko Wrote:  

The video does not match the rugged ISIS mantra. It is too polished and crafted.

Their mix of barbarism and social media savvy is one of their noted characteristics (They once tweeted a Crucifiction).

Their kill tapes even have really catchy Jihaddi tunes and theme songs.

Quote: (08-21-2014 09:17 PM)xpatplayer Wrote:  

I wonder how many of the guys criticizing him here from their air-conditioned rooms for not 'dying like a man' would have gone into an active warzone as a photojournalist, endured torture for 2 years and gotten beheaded without crying like a baby.

Its easy to call someone an idiot and a coward. Its not easy to take big risks, like covering the Syrian Civil War and certainly not easy to know that you are about to be executed.

I wonder how many of the members criticizing his 'lack of resistance' would even dare to go into Syria.

Asking us to do something we have absolutely no interest in, is extremely irrelevant. I do not want his job and most of us obviously had zero interest in it as well. Ignorance of the consequenses is no excuse, in fact he had been caught before and still did not change what he did for a living. He obviously had a death wish.

Did you watch the video? Watch it first and see if your opinion is the same.

NSFW!!
Skip to 1:55

Why aid and support the enemy with that ridiculous statement before you die, when you know god damned well they will kill you regardless? Wasn't the ransom 100+ million dollars? The US does not negotiate with terrorists and he is no VIP.

If someone was standing over you with a gun and asked you, "What do you want on your tombstone?" Why would you fellate his criminal organization on camera for the entire world to see? Especially when you are surrounded by hundreds of them? If escape is impossible, you tell that cocksucker to fuck off and at least try. What is there to lose when you have nothing left at all? Where is the dignity? Where is the self respect? The fact that he wasn't even punched, bruised, or beaten tells me he did not try anything knowing he was a dead man.

Don't tell me some elementary shit about what if they lied and told him if he read the paper statement they would let him go. That's a fucking load of shit. He was dead the minute they captured him. He knew what those guys were about. We saw an ISIS video of them joy riding and killing innocent muslims/Iraqis for fun a few months ago on RVF. I guarantee you he saw that same video too. There is a fine line between being brave and stupid and so far he is on the stupid side. Becoming a mouthpiece for evil is flat wrong, even if your country is controlled by bad leaders.

RIP to him and bless his soul, but I will not commend him for bravery like everyone else is doing in some sheepish way, just because he died. Giving him a medal when he does not deserve it is part of the struggle we currently fight in the manosphere. Orange slices, Capri Sun drinks, and trophies for participation right? Isn't that the way little boys and kids are raised these days? Everyone gets a blue ribbon just for trying right? Sorry son, but this is the real world. There are winners and losers. There are consequences for poor decisions in the real world. Mommy and Daddy cannot help you out there and give you a paper diploma for "Participation" in the work place if you get fired or laid off.

We gotta stop coddling "men" who make poor decisions like this. It undermines the newbies here, it undermines the mission of the manosphere, and the fight against political correctness/wussification running amok.

Not criticizing you Sam. Just saying that those who call him a coward from their rooms fail to empathize with him. You didn't call him a coward.

Great couple of videos by the way. Only question is what if you know you will be mutilated to death in the worst possible fashion if you attempt bravery before your execution? These guys are psychos and they surely wouldn't shudder from gruesome torture of a man who calls them out for the crazies they are.

Quote: (08-21-2014 10:04 PM)xpatplayer Wrote:  

Not criticizing you Sam. Just saying that those who call him a coward from their rooms fail to empathize with him. You didn't call him a coward.

Why would anyone empathize with a guy who knowingly took a major risk by going to a war-torn shithole? If you dont want to get your head cut off, the solution is pretty simple: stay in bumfuck, USA.

Quote: (08-21-2014 10:04 PM)xpatplayer Wrote:  

Quote: (08-21-2014 09:34 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  

Not criticizing you Sam. Just saying that those who call him a coward from their rooms fail to empathize with him. You didn't call him a coward.

Great couple of videos by the way. Only question is what if you know you will be mutilated to death in the worst possible fashion if you attempt bravery before your execution? These guys are psychos and they surely wouldn't shudder from gruesome torture of a man who calls them out for the crazies they are.

Well at some point I am sure I would scream in pain, but I just hope I wouldn't beg for my life. But as you said they are crazy so to be there also that person (reporter, whoever) must be crazy as well, right?

you guys calling him a coward are the epitome of keyboard warrior tough guys and your ignorance is blatant. they had two years to work on Foley. TWO YEARS to turn him so far inside out he didn't know which way was up. it's an eternity to apply sensory deprivation, sleep deprivation, drugs, torture, psychological warfare, very possibly repeated mock executions with beatings for noncompliance - and there's an entire psychological phenomenon dedicated to people who begin to empathize with their captors over time.

everyone on here who fancies himself a man would love to say he'd accept his execution with a rakish smirk, a cigarette, and a refused blindfold. but nobody here has any ability to say that since they have no idea what happened to that poor bastard before his death.

These beheadings have been going on for over a thousand years. Doubt the executioner (who may be a London doctor) cared that Foley was apparently in support of the Syrian rebels. When a $130 million ransom was not forthcoming, he was made out to be an example. And we ain't seen nothing yet.

Hell, why are Marines called leathernecks? Because of the leather collars they wore to help protect themselves against beheadings when fighting against the Muslims i.e. Barbary Wars.

Those of you who are asking why he is cooperating with the terrorists and why he doesn't tell them to fuck off since they will kill him anyway and he's got nothing to lose, there are many worse things than death. All it takes to break a man's spirit is showing him a knife and telling him they're gonna cut off his balls or something. Or cut off his eyes, or anything twisted you can think of. You would sing like a bird whatever they told you to sing if you were in his shoes. You are being captive by the most monsterous people on earth, and we are talking about 2 years of captivity, that is enough time to break your whole spirit even without physical torture, so think twice before asking ''what's he got to lose?''

http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comme..._american/

In 1849, a twenty seven year old young up and coming Russian writer became part of an anti-imperial plot. He and his fellow conspirators thought they would be given a light sentence, but were sentenced to be shot. On the day of their execution, they were taken to some gallows. They were given the opportunity to make their confessions to a priest, then dressed in peasant shirts and covered with hoods. The first three were led to stakes and tied up, and the soldiers took aim. There was a drum roll, and then a messenger from the Tsar rode into the square with a pardon of sorts (the whole thing was staged).

The writer, who had been sixth in line, was extremely moved by the experience, and became more religious for it. Later, during his time in Siberia, he witnessed the best and worst of men, and all such experiences informed his writing. Included in such experiences was that two of the men who had been sentenced to be shot along with him in 1949 lost their minds during the experience and never regained them.

That writer went on to produce some of the most insightful and poignant works on the human condition. After his brush with death, he did not see fit to mock those who had not handled it as well. I don't think we should either.

I met a guy who was one of Saddam's western hostages during the 1991 Gulf War. He was subjected to a mock execution, taken out and put up against a wall in front of a firing squad, and heard the "Fire" order and the click of the AKs dry-firing.

Fifteen years later his voice was still shaking with rage describing it.

It's not really critical of Foley to say you'd hope to do better and not denounce your own brother if you were in his shoes. You'd have to have huge inner reserves and a strategy of course.

There's a lot of otherwise solid guys that are really undermining their credibility by claiming this is a false flag operation.

I mentioned it earlier but no one tried countering it. How can this be a false flag operation when IS has assumed responsibility for the attack?

The video was posted on their official Diaspora social media account (Al-Furqan media). While the account had been deleted by Diaspora since then (just like their official Twitter and YouTube was deleted) there's been no denials or pushback since then.

Quote: (08-22-2014 03:58 AM)Feisbook Control Wrote:  

In 1849, a twenty seven year old young up and coming Russian writer became part of an anti-imperial plot. He and his fellow conspirators thought they would be given a light sentence, but were sentenced to be shot. On the day of their execution, they were taken to some gallows. They were given the opportunity to make their confessions to a priest, then dressed in peasant shirts and covered with hoods. The first three were led to stakes and tied up, and the soldiers took aim. There was a drum roll, and then a messenger from the Tsar rode into the square with a pardon of sorts (the whole thing was staged).

The writer, who had been sixth in line, was extremely moved by the experience, and became more religious for it. Later, during his time in Siberia, he witnessed the best and worst of men, and all such experiences informed his writing. Included in such experiences was that two of the men who had been sentenced to be shot along with him in 1949 lost their minds during the experience and never regained them.

That writer went on to produce some of the most insightful and poignant works on the human condition. After his brush with death, he did not see fit to mock those who had not handled it as well. I don't think we should either.

Seriously...reading this thread is disappointing. The guy is beheaded, and according to some posters, the most disturbing thing about this whole affair is the "narcissism" of his parents in their press conference? When they are likely being heavily medicated and are in the midst of shock and grief over his death? We're critiquing how composed and stoic they are? The fuck?

Like I said before, he probably had been subjected to many mock executions before they finally carried it out. How many people here have been kidnapped by Islamic extremists and then didn't break under extreme torture and prolonged psychological stress? They have ways in that situation of making you cooperate...."Hey, we can make this quick if you read our script, or you can die a slow, agonizing death that lasts for days?"

He obviously knew the risks in going to a war-torn region where journalists are kidnapped and held for ransom or worse, he willingly put himself in danger, but a little compassion for him and his family? Just a little?

Quote: (08-21-2014 10:01 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

Did you watch the video? Watch it first and see if your opinion is the same.

NSFW!!
Skip to 1:55

Why aid and support the enemy with that ridiculous statement before you die, when you know god damned well they will kill you regardless? Wasn't the ransom 100+ million dollars? The US does not negotiate with terrorists and he is no VIP.

If someone was standing over you with a gun and asked you, "What do you want on your tombstone?" Why would you fellate his criminal organization on camera for the entire world to see? Especially when you are surrounded by hundreds of them? If escape is impossible, you tell that cocksucker to fuck off and at least try. What is there to lose when you have nothing left at all? Where is the dignity? Where is the self respect? The fact that he wasn't even punched, bruised, or beaten tells me he did not try anything knowing he was a dead man.

Don't tell me some elementary shit about what if they lied and told him if he read the paper statement they would let him go. That's a fucking load of shit. He was dead the minute they captured him. He knew what those guys were about. We saw an ISIS video of them joy riding and killing innocent muslims/Iraqis for fun a few months ago on RVF. I guarantee you he saw that same video too. There is a fine line between being brave and stupid and so far he is on the stupid side. Becoming a mouthpiece for evil is flat wrong, even if your country is controlled by bad leaders.

RIP to him and bless his soul, but I will not commend him for bravery like everyone else is doing in some sheepish way, just because he died. Giving him a medal when he does not deserve it is part of the struggle we currently fight in the manosphere. Orange slices, Capri Sun drinks, and trophies for participation right? Isn't that the way little boys and kids are raised these days? Everyone gets a blue ribbon just for trying right? Sorry son, but this is the real world. There are winners and losers. There are consequences for poor decisions in the real world. Mommy and Daddy cannot help you out there and give you a paper diploma for "Participation" in the work place if you get fired or laid off.

We gotta stop coddling "men" who make poor decisions like this. It undermines the newbies here, it undermines the mission of the manosphere, and the fight against political correctness/wussification running amok.

There are a lot of possibilities on why he made this statement. Maybe they promised him drugs that will ease the pain of the beheading, maybe they threatened to kill other journalists that are captured because of him and maybe in front of him if he refuses. Maybe they threatened him to torture him in the most horrifying way possible over the next couple of days before they kill him.

So what exactly would've been the point of him refusing a statement that everyone knows is fake and not his honest opinion anyway under those circumstances? False pride?

And don't kid yourself thinking he could've put up a fight. Every form of resistance is simply asking for more torture. You are totally powerless in a situation like this, red pill or blue pill, doesn't make a difference.

You also have to remember that he already was captured for 600 days before this video was filmed. Two years of the worst form of human existence you can live through. He had every right to just get done with it and die in the least painful way.

It's not like refusing to make a pointless statement would have made any difference in any form. It wouldn't have been smart, it wouln't have made any sense, "to man up" doesn't work in a hopeless situation like this.

I just found out today that Foley was captured by guerrillas in Libya, too and held for 44 days there.

2003: Hey, Saddam is killing his people

2014: Hey, the ISIS are killing their people

2003: Saddam is a threat to global security, especially our security

2014: the ISIS is a threat to global security, especially our security

2003: action must be taken against Saddam

2014: action must be taken against the ISIS

2003: let's strike Iraq

2014: let's strike Iraq

"Should've died like a man..."

Pfft.

How many people can't even endure an extra rep when they squat?

Let alone endure the months of torture they would have put him through if he didn't say what they wanted.

What the fuck is this bullshit about people writing about honor and "sticking to their principles" while they die?

This is the definition of keyboard warrior bullshit. People don't know how they will react to torture and death until they are in the situation.

Here we have people talking about how to get over "approach anxiety" to a a fucking woman judging a guy who had his head cut off as a coward.

Show some fucking respect. This guy was fucking beheaded. No one knows what we went through or how it feels unless they've been through it themselves.

Quote: (08-22-2014 06:09 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

There's a lot of otherwise solid guys that are really undermining their credibility by claiming this is a false flag operation.

I mentioned it earlier but no one tried countering it. How can this be a false flag operation when IS has assumed responsibility for the attack?

The video was posted on their official Diaspora social media account (Al-Furqan media). While the account had been deleted by Diaspora since then (just like their official Twitter and YouTube was deleted) there's been no denials or pushback since then.

I don't know. All I know is there are major red flags that the video is fake. It's possible that ISIS faked the video for some reason. It's possible that the U.S. faked the video for war propaganda. It's also possible the video is real.

However, anyone who watches that video carefully and who has also watched other ISIS beheading videos can clearly see huge discrepancies between this one and all the others.

Quote: (08-22-2014 01:27 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

Quote: (08-22-2014 06:09 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

There's a lot of otherwise solid guys that are really undermining their credibility by claiming this is a false flag operation.

I mentioned it earlier but no one tried countering it. How can this be a false flag operation when IS has assumed responsibility for the attack?

The video was posted on their official Diaspora social media account (Al-Furqan media). While the account had been deleted by Diaspora since then (just like their official Twitter and YouTube was deleted) there's been no denials or pushback since then.

I don't know. All I know is there are major red flags that the video is fake. It's possible that ISIS faked the video for some reason. It's possible that the U.S. faked the video for war propaganda. It's also possible the video is real.

However, anyone who watches that video carefully and who has also watched other ISIS beheading videos can clearly see huge discrepancies between this one and all the others.

Bust a datasheet.

Edit: Nevermind, saw your post in the previous page

Though I agree with the idea of "invictus" or whatever in spirit, the truth is that two years is a long time. Enough to break anyone psychologically. I don't care if you're Alexander the Great, if your torturer knows how to keep you from dying and makes a sustained effort to break you, you're either going to break or you're going to go insane.

I'm not saying that's what happened to Foley. The fact is that we just don't know, so no use speculating.

And while the idea to never give up is noble, and I certainly subscribe, I have a suspicion that you can visualize yourself dying all you want, the truth is that just like combat, until the rubber meets the road no man knows how he's going to fare. Regardless of how much training you have.

For those who are interested in the subject of how much heroic men can endure if they are determined to resist their tormentors, and how men reach a breaking point -- and can then bounce back from the breaking point -- I recommend the following books. Each one of these is a great book -- I would perhaps single out Nick Rowe's as the greatest one of all -- and there is something to learn from all of them.

1. "Five Years to Freedom" by James N. Rowe

2. "When Hell was in Session" by Jeremiah Denton

These are both books by American officers who spent a long time as POW's in Vietnam -- imprisoned by the Vietcong in Nick Rowe's case, and by the North Vietnamese in Jerry Denton's case.

Both of these are masterpieces, and Nick Rowe's book is one of the most memorable that I've ever read.

3. "Against All Hope" by Armando Valladares

The story of a Cuban political prisoner who spent more than 20 years in Castro's terrible prisons.

Weren't POWs surrounded by other POWs? That has to make it much easier to defy your captors. Having that sense of brotherhood and being able to gain strength from each other.

I can also imagine the torture subjected to them by the Viet Cong was horrible, but probably nothing compared to what ISIS would do to a captured American.

Two years of extreme torture, starvation, etc. while being held captive alone by completely fanatical and batshit insane Jihadists is enough to break anybody. His mind was probably completely gone. Not because he's weak, but because of the extreme torture, malnutrition and duress.

Yes, he had no.bruises. That's because someone skilled at torture knows that there are things exponentially worse that you can do to someone besides beat them.

Rio,

In Jerry Denton's case he was surrounded by others. In Nick Rowe's case, he was alone for the better part of five years. That is indeed one of the things that makes his story so especially dreadful.

I want to make clear that I posted these books not to make any comment on this case, but simply because they are great books and guys who are interested in these subjects will find a lot to learn from them.

Quote: (08-20-2014 10:21 PM)Menace Wrote:  

Funded by USA?

We have no control over foreign policy, lets stay focused on the chimpfest in Missouri. This is the greatest opportunity we have had in a long time. Keep fanning the flames.