I agree with many of the other respondents who essentially said that indulging in such a melodramatic and long-winded argument was very harmful to you and to the relationship. The specifics of the give-and-take are essentially irrelevant, save for your understandable desire to stand up for yourself when she went posting shit on Facebook when she claimed she was sleeping.

Most significantly, she's now proven that she can be a loud drama queen, and you'll go right along and indulge - not merely tolerate, but actually reciprocate and amplify - girly histrionics. I believe that women want men to be men and above their lust for drama. They have girlfriends and celebrity gossip mags for drama, deep down they want their man to be the opposite: strong, aloof, and magnanimous about trivialities.

This is a case where you could have clearly said more with less, much less...

A paradox that one is, you're trying to explain why you're going radio silence on her, while doing the exact opposite by giving her your full attention.

Think of a good magician, he never proceeds to explain his trick after performing it, as the power comes from displaying the illusion of magic, not from the technical details that enable it.

Every word you said after "Don't ever get too comfortable with me, Gnit" took you down a step closer to her level and made her hamster spin a mile slower.

Radio Silence is your friend.

Rockhard - my point exactly! I don't know what she means. I interpret it as that she expects me to be a beta bitchboy who she can walk all over. Go to clubs without me, get drunk with her friends, hang up on me etc. Then she would show me "respect". At least that's how all her previous relationships were. Needless to say, at some point the guys got fed up and left/cheated.

Maybe someone else can clarify this for me.

OP, I wouldn't know where to begin here...my first reaction was a facepalm.

I only made it a few lines down and once I saw how much texting was going on, that was enough.

I'm not saying this to trash you. You need a harsh wakeup call and you've got a lot of catching up to do. I really mean it; I don't know where to begin.

You sound young, and you sound like you need a few hardcore failures in relationships to get up to speed. In lieu of that, here's my take.

I guess I'll just stick to the beginning since it all went downhill from there:

1) Facebook. Just get off that shit. Unless you're using it to post pictures of yourself with tons of hotties and using it to get more puss, get rid of it. Take an account of your life: Do things contribute to your life? Or detract? Take an honest inventory of your life. The things that detract; cut them out. Here you're getting into some argument over facebook, I can't even tell what but it just looks like high school drama, with one or both of you trying to make some point, "Yeah? Well YOU do THIS!". That's a loser's game and not worth playing.

2) "FYI don't get too comfortable..." Don't tell girls this message; show them. That is the distinction between alpha and betas trying to act alpha. Telling a girl you don't give a fuck is what betas that try to act alpha do. Showing a girl you don't give a fuck is what alphas do.

Your girl rightfully called you out on your bullshit because she can smell it from a mile away. You can't just read up on this shit and try to imitate it, you have to be the real deal. And of course as soon as she called you out on it, you buckled and dropped down like a cheap ho on nickel night. You got emotional, defensive, and started writing a bunch of longwinded crap all over text. Nothing about your response indicates you're detached. With every successive text you're essentially screaming to her, "Needy. NEEDY. NEEDY."

The good news is it's over, you hit the bottom, so now it's time to take account for what's happened. You'll either lose her, or you'll get a free pass this time. Either way, learn from your mistakes. I don't have it in me to tell you how to recover at this point, because I don't feel like writing a novel, but my best advice would be to cool it on the wannabe-alpha behavior until you do a lot more reading on the forum, do a lot more working out, get some more mileage under your belt, approach and bang some other girls, and push the red pill a little farther down.

You've got a ways to go.

Quote: (06-18-2014 07:22 PM)thegiant Wrote:  

Rockhard - my point exactly! I don't know what she means. I interpret it as that she expects me to be a beta bitchboy who she can walk all over. Go to clubs without me, get drunk with her friends, hang up on me etc. Then she would show me "respect". At least that's how all her previous relationships were. Needless to say, at some point the guys got fed up and left/cheated.

Maybe someone else can clarify this for me.

You can never ever ever ever, demand respect. Not in the workplace, not in your social circle, not in your dating life.

Respect is the result of action, not words. There is a preoccupation with respect in our culture, this faux-tough guy bullshit, "You disrespectin' me?!". We hear it all the time in pop culture. That's not how respect works.

Respect is earned with resolve. Your girl certainly won't respect you by calling her out, "You disrespected me!". Just stamp the word "Bitch" on your forehead while you're at it.

It will take time to get your girl back on a short leash based on what I've read. She might be past that point. But we're talking very simple and effective communication and action here. Here's the formula:

1) Girl does something you dislike.
2) You tell her she did something you dislike.
3) Based on her reaction, you take action.

Instead of telling her, "You disrespected me.", put her on radio silence. When she contacts you, let her know exactly what she did wrong without bringing up the "disrespecting me" BS.

"You came over too drunk. It's very unattractive to me. You get extremely annoying when you're drunk and the sex is awful."

Watch her expression with that one.

"You hung up on me. That's childish bullshit and my time is too valuable. When you're ready to communicate like an adult then maybe we can talk."

Treat her like a child to put her in a position of qualifying herself to you.

If she comes back with, "Yeah well what about YOU, you're not the only one that gets to make demands". Women will often bring up the double-standard issue. So call it out like it is: "You might feel like this is a double-standard. That may be so but these are my standards and if you can't live up to them then I'll find someone else who can."

Thanks for the harsh critique thedude.

I'm def not losing her, as she said towards the end "if you weren't [all I need] I wouldn't be trying to keep you forever". So it seems that no matter how needy I came across, it barely did any harm.

But I agree with you wholeheartedly that a man should never come across butt hurt, and I need more real-life alpha affirmation. Most of my "alphaness" definitely stems from reading the forum, ROK, McQueen and CH.

Apparently I still have a problem calibrating.

thedude3737 said all there is that needs to be said along with many others.

your first line sounds like something a chick would send. and the long txt convo..... Jesus

"I'm def not losing her, as she said towards the end "if you weren't [all I need] I wouldn't be trying to keep you forever". So it seems that no matter how needy I came across, it barely did any harm."

remember, just because she said that and meant it in that moment. doesn't mean she will always feel that way.

love slips and slips until it finally falls. you slipped juuust a bit more with that txt. it's just a series of small infractions.

Quote: (06-18-2014 06:58 PM)Ethan Amarante Wrote:  

Quote: (06-18-2014 06:52 PM)Christian McQueen Wrote:  

"Typing in full sentences seems a lot more mature and "alpha" to me"

It's not.

Try this out.

Go get 20 girls numbers.

Then text them with perfect grammar, punctuation and capitalization.

See how many dates you get.

Then go get 20 more numbers and use short text speak texts.

See how many dates you get.

I'm not saying you're necessarily incorrect, but that's far from my experience. Having said that, it might have something to do with my general appeal being linked to my career and a general perfectionism.

Also, imagine comparing the SMS messages of a prince and a pauper - who's more likely to use text speak? Does that tell you something?

It depends. It would seem odd to a girl if I used text speak as I am 44 and come across as a classy, well off guy that likes younger women.

Interestingly, the girls generally do not use text speak with me either. It's pretty rare actually. And the ones that do I generally lose interest in quickly.

Now if I was late 20's and more of a party guy I'd probably use text speak a lot. It just doesn't fit me or the women I am generally after.

One needs to adjust their game to their own style AND the targets they are after.

Quote: (06-18-2014 07:22 PM)thegiant Wrote:  

Rockhard - my point exactly! I don't know what she means. I interpret it as that she expects me to be a beta bitchboy who she can walk all over.

That's my point. You *don't* know. You don't read minds, and it's even worse asking some random dude on the internet to read hers. Ask her, when the dust settles. Set your boundaries. Don't be passive aggressive about it.

Did she actually hang up on you? As in, no "I'm beat, gotta go to bed, bye", just *click*? Do chicks do this these days and think it's OK?

Quote: (06-18-2014 08:02 PM)Hotwheels Wrote:  

Quote: (06-18-2014 06:58 PM)Ethan Amarante Wrote:  

I'm not saying you're necessarily incorrect, but that's far from my experience. Having said that, it might have something to do with my general appeal being linked to my career and a general perfectionism.

Also, imagine comparing the SMS messages of a prince and a pauper - who's more likely to use text speak? Does that tell you something?

It depends. It would seem odd to a girl if I used text speak as I am 44 and come across as a classy, well off guy that likes younger women.

Interestingly, the girls generally do not use text speak with me either. It's pretty rare actually. And the ones that do I generally lose interest in quickly.

Now if I was late 20's and more of a party guy I'd probably use text speak a lot. It just doesn't fit me or the women I am generally after.

One needs to adjust their game to their own style AND the targets they are after.

Calibration is key, definitely. However, Hotwheels, part of the emphasis is not just on using "text speak" but keeping things short and NOT verbose, as well as not sending as many texts as them overall. In MOST cases those are rules to stand by.

Ethan Amarante - You're absolutely wrong. If you've ever interacted with most people in powerful positions, such as a VP or CEO of a significant size company, you would know that they will generally NOT mince words and have no problem using text speak/shorthand in a non-formal setting.

People whose time is in high demand don't generally waste it, including in their communications.

Quote: (06-18-2014 07:45 PM)thegiant Wrote:  

Thanks for the harsh critique thedude.

I'm def not losing her, as she said towards the end "if you weren't [all I need] I wouldn't be trying to keep you forever". So it seems that no matter how needy I came across, it barely did any harm.

But I agree with you wholeheartedly that a man should never come across butt hurt, and I need more real-life alpha affirmation. Most of my "alphaness" definitely stems from reading the forum, ROK, McQueen and CH.

Apparently I still have a problem calibrating.

You are listening to her WORDS instead of her ACTIONS. Her actions show that you are losing her with your actions. Maybe not today, but it's not going in the right direction.

You definitely have a problem calibrating, but I'd say your problem is even more fundamental. You admit that most of your "alphaness" comes from reading the forum/websites and yet your self-analysis is that you need to work on your calibration. No, not just your calibration, but your ACTUAL alphaness. If your actions were alpha, you wouldn't have ever had that ridiculous conversation over text with her.

Quote: (06-18-2014 06:15 PM)thegiant Wrote:  

We were talking on the phone and she said in a pretty rude cute off manner "k I'm tired, gonna go to bed" and hung up on me. Then an hour later she posted some dumb video on Facebook. Yea it kinda annoyed me. It obviously didn't have to escalate like it did. It escalated after I told her "don't get so comfortable". What I meant was you can't hang up on me and tell me you're going to sleep when I wasn't done talking to you and then you don't even sleep. I find that disrespectful. Maybe it's just me.

You blew something up that was either nothing, or something to bring up in person as something you don't tolerate (people hanging up on you). People often decide they're going to end a conversation as others have described or then change their minds on the reason to end the conversation. You overreacted hugely.

Quote: (06-18-2014 07:22 PM)thegiant Wrote:  

Rockhard - my point exactly! I don't know what she means. I interpret it as that she expects me to be a beta bitchboy who she can walk all over. Go to clubs without me, get drunk with her friends, hang up on me etc. Then she would show me "respect". At least that's how all her previous relationships were. Needless to say, at some point the guys got fed up and left/cheated.

Maybe someone else can clarify this for me.

Your words back up your actions. You assume she expects you to be a beta bitch boy? Man, what a NEGATIVE things to assume, this reflects how you feel about yourself, not what she expects of you.

Quote: (06-18-2014 07:11 PM)thegiant Wrote:  

Yup kaotic, women fucking love drama. Especially hot ones. I just feel like when a girl feels like she's allowed to talk back to me, I have no frame with her. I can't imagine a girl ever talking back to a Christian McQueen. There's gotta be a subtle difference in the choice of words I use vs what experienced players would've said. I absolutely agree that provoking fights over small shit doesn't make sense, that's my own fault. Like I said, I didn't expect it to escalate like it did. She blew it way out of proportions. When she wanted me to pick up the phone she called 20(!) times.

You allowed her to talk back to you by continuing the conversation, that's what you're missing. YOU gave her the concept that she can treat you like that with your actions. You didn't expect it to escalate? YOU escalated it. You keep looking externally and in a way that reflects negatively on your development and on your own self-worth.

Also, your thread title? You and your bitch? Why do you feel the need to talk about her in a derogatory manner instead of just calling her your main girl or your girlfriend or something like that? I think it's your passive aggressive way of trying to pretend you have some control over her. You need to control your own emotions.

You asked for a harsh break down, there it is.

This belongs in the Newbie Forum.

That was like watching a train wreck happen to the front of the train while someone is hooking wagons up to the back. Early on I used to set up a rule that I don't fight over the phone. Not that it helped here cause you started it. By creeping on girls fb posting. It's not like she was posting pix of her taking some dudes baby battery.. jeez. Overall id say you need to grow up a bit and only treats with dramaif she deserves it. Cause drama is a carrot not a stick. Train wreck.

Quote: (06-18-2014 08:02 PM)Hotwheels Wrote:  

Quote: (06-18-2014 06:58 PM)Ethan Amarante Wrote:  

Quote: (06-18-2014 06:52 PM)Christian McQueen Wrote:  

"Typing in full sentences seems a lot more mature and "alpha" to me"

It's not.

Try this out.

Go get 20 girls numbers.

Then text them with perfect grammar, punctuation and capitalization.

See how many dates you get.

Then go get 20 more numbers and use short text speak texts.

See how many dates you get.

I'm not saying you're necessarily incorrect, but that's far from my experience. Having said that, it might have something to do with my general appeal being linked to my career and a general perfectionism.

Also, imagine comparing the SMS messages of a prince and a pauper - who's more likely to use text speak? Does that tell you something?

It depends. It would seem odd to a girl if I used text speak as I am 44 and come across as a classy, well off guy that likes younger women.

Interestingly, the girls generally do not use text speak with me either. It's pretty rare actually. And the ones that do I generally lose interest in quickly.

Now if I was late 20's and more of a party guy I'd probably use text speak a lot. It just doesn't fit me or the women I am generally after.

One needs to adjust their game to their own style AND the targets they are after.

In your case, yes, that makes sense. Didn't know you are 44.

This just reads to me as you reading some stuff online, typing the words to the girl, but not applying the correct attitude and persona and expecting her to react as if you were that person.

As I said before, look inwardly.

Aneroid - I agree with everything you said, except me giving her the idea that it's ok to talk to me like that, me being the reason it escalated. So is the solution just to IGNORE a girls' verbal abuse? Wouldn't that result in even more of it later down the road?

Quote: (06-18-2014 08:26 PM)Christian McQueen Wrote:  

Quote: (06-18-2014 08:02 PM)Hotwheels Wrote:  

Quote: (06-18-2014 06:58 PM)Ethan Amarante Wrote:  

Quote: (06-18-2014 06:52 PM)Christian McQueen Wrote:  

"Typing in full sentences seems a lot more mature and "alpha" to me"

It's not.

Try this out.

Go get 20 girls numbers.

Then text them with perfect grammar, punctuation and capitalization.

See how many dates you get.

Then go get 20 more numbers and use short text speak texts.

See how many dates you get.

I'm not saying you're necessarily incorrect, but that's far from my experience. Having said that, it might have something to do with my general appeal being linked to my career and a general perfectionism.

Also, imagine comparing the SMS messages of a prince and a pauper - who's more likely to use text speak? Does that tell you something?

It depends. It would seem odd to a girl if I used text speak as I am 44 and come across as a classy, well off guy that likes younger women.

Interestingly, the girls generally do not use text speak with me either. It's pretty rare actually. And the ones that do I generally lose interest in quickly.

Now if I was late 20's and more of a party guy I'd probably use text speak a lot. It just doesn't fit me or the women I am generally after.

One needs to adjust their game to their own style AND the targets they are after.

In your case, yes, that makes sense. Didn't know you are 44.

I completely agree on the not being wordy part. That spans generations.

I just don't do textspeak.

Your mistake was obvious: You answered her shit, instead of keeping silent.

Silence makes her hamster run. Replies reassure her, and give her the upper hand.

You fucked up when you answered. Next time, STFU.

Just my 2¢.

OneIdea

Quote: (06-18-2014 08:41 PM)thegiant Wrote:  

Aneroid - I agree with everything you said, except me giving her the idea that it's ok to talk to me like that, me being the reason it escalated. So is the solution just to IGNORE a girls' verbal abuse? Wouldn't that result in even more of it later down the road?

Great, that's progress.

What I meant by you giving her the idea that it's okay to talk to you like that, is as follows:

1. She hung up on you. <--- Her action, a slight disrespect to a medium disrespect depending on how it occurred, either way not a huge deal and could be brought up at a later date.

2. You acted butt hurt NOT when she disrespected you (by calling her back or texting her or putting off words about the topic into the FUTURE), but you did it by texting her SPECIFICALLY calling out her posting a video to Facebook. Your actions were incongruent. If you were actually annoyed by her hanging up on you, you should've withdrawn your attention and/or dealt with it later or IMMEDIATELY. Instead you waited until she was on Facebook and you called her out on that...and EVENTUALLY calling her out on hanging up on you.

3. Further, you miss that she's still being playful in your second screenshot worth of texts. Instead of saying something like, "k, night" and ending it (or not responding at all), you chose to just talk down to her and shit on her playfulness. You could've sexualized the conversation, you could've gone any number of routes, but you chose the route (and continued to go down that path). As others have said, your actions must command respect. I don't see how your actions would lead her to respect you. Hence, you gave her the idea that it's okay to disrespect you. People think that respect is fundamental. No, it's earned through ACTION.

Quote: (06-18-2014 07:11 PM)thegiant Wrote:  

Yup kaotic, women fucking love drama. Especially hot ones. I just feel like when a girl feels like she's allowed to talk back to me, I have no frame with her. I can't imagine a girl ever talking back to a Christian McQueen. There's gotta be a subtle difference in the choice of words I use vs what experienced players would've said. I absolutely agree that provoking fights over small shit doesn't make sense, that's my own fault. Like I said, I didn't expect it to escalate like it did. She blew it way out of proportions. When she wanted me to pick up the phone she called 20(!) times.

I can imagine a girl pulling this on McQueen, I can't imagine him taking it seriously.

Wtf, I couldn't even tell which one was the "bitch", if you had a problem with her - GO GET SOMEONE ELSE. If you don't like the way she treated you then go silent, you basically just acted like a little boy. This reminds me of when I was a teenager with my first girlfriend and was waaaaaaay too into her, guess what happened? She gtfo cause I was behaving like a chick and so are you.

TLDR. It seemed like you randomly started some fight because of your pride and in an attempt to be alpha and big dog her you seemed weak and pathetic. Rule of thumb for you ( and pretty much everyone) If you couldn't imagine a Don Draper/James Bond/ slick cool cat doing something with a girl, you probably don't want to be doing it.

Could you see any sort of badass dude getting suckered into a argument like this? Likely not. Keep your pride in check and you will deal with less bullshit like this.

It's my bitch and I.

This thread doesn't do justice to its title.






That is all.

Quote: (06-18-2014 08:16 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

Calibration is key, definitely. However, Hotwheels, part of the emphasis is not just on using "text speak" but keeping things short and NOT verbose, as well as not sending as many texts as them overall. In MOST cases those are rules to stand by.

Ethan Amarante - You're absolutely wrong. If you've ever interacted with most people in powerful positions, such as a VP or CEO of a significant size company, you would know that they will generally NOT mince words and have no problem using text speak/shorthand in a non-formal setting.

People whose time is in high demand don't generally waste it, including in their communications.

I hope this doesn't come across as needlessly pedantic but I did say 'text speak', rather than other non-standard English. I'll often use contractions and initialisms like FYI, ASAP and xmas. These, however, are world apart from their 'text speak' equivalents like 'u' instead of 'you' and the omission of punctuation marks, which I picked the OP up on.

I don't think it's something to get too worried about, and I admit to having limited evidence, however.

Also I wholly agree with previous posters about adapting your language to
context and character. I would even go a little further and say that if you're too verbose, it can come across as artificial and conceited, which is possibly even worse than immature.

Now, I'm no expert, but if you really were annoyed at something small like this, I think just asking her not to do it nicely would have been better. The man who can exhibit authority with a smile is a million times better than the guy who has to scream and scowl all the time.

You get dramatic over petty stuff OVER PHONE? At late night?

This means
1) you let some insignificant actions from a girl totally distort and own your frame

2) you are insecure enough to get pissed off when an oversized kid (read: girl) does something childish bc she is a kid EDIT: you are 44 and girl's in her 20s? .....

3) you choose to fight over your most disadvantage battlefield. There is nothing masculine or powerful about a text gun fight, where the girl has unlimited ammunition and wins by sheer attrition

Most men would just ignore that shit. Your girl cutting you off to watch shit from fb doesn't mean shit if you are texting your rotation girls at midnight. And what kind of man with game stalk his girl on fb at midnight? Then get into a phone text fight?

You want some drama of your own? Go hit on other girls