Taking into account Taxes/Income , transport/rent cost and the red pill independnet non conformist lifestyle some of us are either accustomed to or seeking it would be interesting to discuss what is a baller salary today.

Things that I would consider necessary to be able to afford to live a semi baller to a high end lifestyle is a condo/apartment in a very central locaion walkable to high end clubs, able to book holidays without worrying about costs, drive a car worth 25k or more, able to afford gym and club memberships at the exclusive members only, able to buy purchase new tech gadgets as they become available and hit the club and wine and dine your girl at will without worrying too much about it.

In London or Paris (and I assume New York) you would need a starting salary of 120k (take home about 70k) to be able to able to afford the lifestyle.

Berlin which is significantly cheaper you can do it on a 80k Salary. The number would be even lower if not for the high German tax system.

In Switzerland you would need a 150k chf salary and you would still have to carefully manage finances to be able to live freely.

In Zagreb with 36k net a year I could have the same lifestyle as the other cities mentioned above. In Belgrade on 30k.

What would you say is a good, great income and an exceptional income in the cities you know and lived in?

I don't think 120k is going to get you that in NYC. Also many cities such as NYC will make driving a car pretty silly and be higher in rent than cities where you need a car.

I'm also interested in this topic.

For NYC, I would assume you need $6000/month after taxes minimum to have any sort of "lifestyle". ~$3000 for nice apartment in central location. That leaves you $3000/month for bills.

30k for Belgrade... Hm... Average income per month is like 400,500usd. That may be overkill?

Quote: (04-08-2018 12:59 PM)NapoleonDynamighty Wrote:  

In Zagreb with 36k net a year I could have the same lifestyle as the other cities mentioned above. In Belgrade on 30k

To "book holidays without worrying about costs" as you say, where you live isn't relevant .....the cost of a trip to an exotic destination like let's say Bangkok is the same whether you live in Zagred, Kiev, NY or Paris, ie about 250 €/day with a chick on board (decent -but not 5 stars expensive- hotel, good restaurants, posh bars). I speak from experience. Therefore, for a three weeks trip, about 8 000 € if you travel coach (and of course much more if you travel business and stay in expensive hotels) - count two trip/year for a normal lifestyle. Plus the occasional extended spring weekends.

I also spend about 15k each year for my wardrobe (new collections) and where I live isn't relevant -in fact clothes are most often cheaper in West Europe than in Ukraine or Russia. BTW it would be very easy for a big spender to spend 60k/year or more on his wardrobe, since a Zegna (which is even not an outrageously expensive brand a la Brunello Cuccinelli, Loro Piana or Berluti ready-to-wear) leather jacket costs about 5000 €.

No way for a "semi baller" lifestyle you can live anywhere in the world for 36k. Or we don't have the same idea of what a "semi baller" lifestyle means.

Very easy.

1,000$, or for us Europeans €, per day.

How did I come up with that?

Very easy.

Friday and Saturday you drop that money on heavy boozing and swooping girls.

Sunday is the day when you plan eating all week. 150 bucks a day yields another grand.

Monday is the day you buy things like clothes, insurances and whatever else you need to keep yourself a well-oiled machine.

Tuesday is the day you pay yor travel plans.

Wednesday is the day you pay your housing.

Thursday is the day you lay low and save.

Run the numbers. The numbers don't lie. Very hard to have a grand per day and not have to comfort to do all the things on this list.

These figures don't seem very high, 30k usd a year in Ukraine makes you very comfortable, but hardly a baller.

Quote: (04-08-2018 12:59 PM)NapoleonDynamighty Wrote:  

In London or Paris (and I assume New York) you would need a starting salary of 120k (take home about 70k) to be able to able to afford the lifestyle.

What would you say is a good, great income and an exceptional income in the cities you know and lived in?

I was making at one point $180k (including bonuses) almost 10 years ago in New York City. It wasn't enough, really. My rent was, $4200. I would have roughly $6000-$6500 net to spend in a month.

When you think about it $6000 is good enough to live comfortably in New York in theory but it doesn't really work out that well once you're living in. For example, if you go to "average" dinner with a date in New York, you'll easily pay $100-130 and I'm talking average. If you go to upscale restraurant, such as Lavo, Tao, Cipriani. You'll easily pay $200-250.

If you include taxi (there was no uber back then), utilities, cell phone, dry cleaner etc, it was good enough to live with but I couldn't really save any money or do extraordinary things.

But I lived little bit better than average. And then, nowhere near baller.

Quote: (04-08-2018 07:55 PM)Rossi Wrote:  

Quote: (04-08-2018 12:59 PM)NapoleonDynamighty Wrote:  

In London or Paris (and I assume New York) you would need a starting salary of 120k (take home about 70k) to be able to able to afford the lifestyle.

What would you say is a good, great income and an exceptional income in the cities you know and lived in?

I was making at one point $180k (including bonuses) almost 10 years ago in New York City. It wasn't enough, really. My rent was, $4200. I would have roughly $6000-$6500 net to spend in a month.

When you think about it $6000 is good enough to live comfortably in New York in theory but it doesn't really work out that well once you're living in. For example, if you go to "average" dinner with a date in New York, you'll easily pay $100-130 and I'm talking average. If you go to upscale restraurant, such as Lavo, Tao, Cipriani. You'll easily pay $200-250.

If you include taxi (there was no uber back then), utilities, cell phone, dry cleaner etc, it was good enough to live with but I couldn't really save any money or do extraordinary things.

But I lived little bit better than average. And then, nowhere near baller.

According to the CPI inflation calculator 180 K a year in 2008 would be roughly 212 K a year now. That would be in the 97th percentile + of incomes. Of course NYC is very expensive so you can probably knock a few percentiles off of that total. In any case if that's what it takes to be a "baller" in NYC then very few are making it to that level.

https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl

https://dqydj.com/income-percentile-calculator/

Quote: (04-08-2018 08:05 PM)Scorpio Rising Wrote:  

According to the CPI inflation calculator 180 K a year in 2008 would be roughly 212 K a year now. That would be in the 97th percentile + of incomes. Of course NYC is very expensive so you can probably knock a few percentiles off of that total. In any case if that's what it takes to be a "baller" in NYC then very few are making it to that level.

https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl

https://dqydj.com/income-percentile-calculator/

Of course, very few making that to level. One bottle at nightclubs was $550-600 back then. We used to go to clubs with 2-3 friends and everyone would pay $200-250 each. Before clubbing, you need to go to dinner, that would also cost $100-150. So, great night would be around $350-400. If you include taxi etc, it might be even more.

If you're talking baller game, $6000 won't be enough to have baller game. You can live comfortably but not enough to be baller.

Quote: (04-08-2018 07:55 PM)Rossi Wrote:  

Quote: (04-08-2018 12:59 PM)NapoleonDynamighty Wrote:  

In London or Paris (and I assume New York) you would need a starting salary of 120k (take home about 70k) to be able to able to afford the lifestyle.

What would you say is a good, great income and an exceptional income in the cities you know and lived in?

I was making at one point $180k (including bonuses) almost 10 years ago in New York City. It wasn't enough, really. My rent was, $4200. I would have roughly $6000-$6500 net to spend in a month.

When you think about it $6000 is good enough to live comfortably in New York in theory but it doesn't really work out that well once you're living in. For example, if you go to "average" dinner with a date in New York, you'll easily pay $100-130 and I'm talking average. If you go to upscale restraurant, such as Lavo, Tao, Cipriani. You'll easily pay $200-250.

If you include taxi (there was no uber back then), utilities, cell phone, dry cleaner etc, it was good enough to live with but I couldn't really save any money or do extraordinary things.

But I lived little bit better than average. And then, nowhere near baller.

You were spending WAY too much on rent.

The studios in Hell’s Kitchen (Midtown West), which is one of the best neighborhoods in Manhattan, start at $1,600/month.

I know guys who make $50k/year who live fine in NYC. They either live alongside a roommate in Manhattan or have their own place in Queens and take the subway to Manhattan. The monthly unlimited subway pass is barely over $100/month.

Quote: (04-08-2018 08:22 PM)GoingHAM20 Wrote:  

You were spending WAY too much on rent.

The studios in Hell’s Kitchen (Midtown West), which is one of the best neighborhoods in Manhattan, start at $1,600/month.

I know guys who make $50k/year who live fine in NYC. They either live alongside a roommate in Manhattan or have their own place in Queens and take the subway to Manhattan. The monthly unlimited subway pass is barely over $100/month.

We're talking about "baller" lifestyle, man. Then, you can go to Flushing and rent a studio with a roommate for $900 as well.

My studio was on 32nd floor in Upper East side, then I also lived in West Village and Soho too.

If you're just talking about breathing as living, then yeah. You can go to a bar, get a lousy beer for $6 and sip it every other 45 mins, hang in there all night too. You don't have to spend $250 for a bottle.

I just looked it up right now for my old building. They're renting it for $4400 right now.

Vancouver: Decent vs Baller

Rent- $1800 vs $12000
Car- $400 vs $2200 (1967 Ford Mustang GT- Maybe the best car for girls)
Fuel- $150
Ins- $230
Phone- $120
Elect- $65
Net- $85
Food- $400
Gym- $80

Entertainment gets a category of its own. People live in this city because of the lifestyle. There are a lot of things to do, and while not all of it revolves around nightlife, things can get expensive.

Boat rental (2 days a month) - $1000
Ski Pass- $1300 a year, or $160 a day
Hotel in Whistler- $450/night
Club fees- $250
Dining out (8 days a month)- $800
Drinks (12 days a month) - $1200
Cocaine (4 days a month)- $650
Clothes- $800

You can live a good average lifestyle here for $150k, meaning after taxes you take home $100k. $8k a month means you can do many things on this list but not all. It also does not count for savings, and on this salary you should be putting some money aside for things like real estate or other large long term investments.

A 2bdrm 2 bath condo here is over $1million now. So that means about $220k down and $4.5k a month mortgage. That same condo might rent for about $4k a month, so for the first time in about 7 years renting is cheaper than owning. But this never lasts, and rents are rising again. To make girls spin, you will want an exclusive building with ocean view and 2 stories of glass windows. A huge bathtub with a glass wall looking out over the inlet and north shore mountains will get you laid. These places are going to start at $10k a month, but most likely will run you $12 - $15k.

I have always said that taking home $10k a month here gives a very good lifestyle, with cash for savings, and trips every couple months. For a baller life, the sky is the limit. I would say if you wanted to make a reasonable salary, live in impressive address, drive a cool car, lock down the locations with the hottest women, and host killer parties you would need about $25k a month. Thats almost a $500k salary. The guys that I know who are living these lives are all entrepreneurs, investment bankers, mining stock players. Not saying its impossible to get salaries of that level, just very difficult in Vancouver. Its a new city, so many of the young guys balling hard here have figure out innovative ways to make bank.

Vancouver is a premier city for people with money and has the reputation for attracting some of the wealthiest people in the world. Private islands just a short yacht ride away are owned by pretty much anyone you have heard about with billions. Its becoming somewhat of a divider among the people here for this reason. Lots of people make money by being good at taking money from these super wealthy - of which I am one - and our current super left government is trying hard to stop this. But the city was built with aesthetics in mind, and people are now used to the clean and new side of the city so they are not going give this up easily.

Baller city score 8/10*

*summer only

There is a huge difference between living a baller lifestyle and sharing a studio apartment with 3 other people.

I think the bar for true baller status has become pretty high almost anywhere in the world

Depends on the definition of balling out but in Texas, I'd say a baller for a day would spend around $3,500 (not including shopping)

Ex: Baller for a weekend in TX will probably spend $300-$600 a day in food. If he wants to ride around in style, another $300 a day (renting a S class Benz). $300 -$900 per night for a vip table at a popular club. Suite in the best hotel, $700/night. $800 per day miscellaneous:

So $3,500 a day in TX for baller status Fri thru Sunday and you should be able to do whatever your heart desires plus accompany one more.

Perhaps, u can use a cost of living comparison calculator to see what that would mean for another country. Ex: If Colombia's entertainment cost is 33% less and food 50% less, make the adjustments and determine how much it'll take to ball out.

Just a thought

A friend of mine who lived in Paris for a while a few years back reckoned that you needed @ €10k pm to have decent lifestyle, ie nice flat, eating out at good restaurants, trips to the theatre, etc. I dread to think what you would have needed for high end.

I think a 3-4 room (1 bedroom/living room/kitchen) apartment in central Tokyo with a parking garage with one assigned spot is about $5,000 a month. Cars are a little more expensive there, as well as gas. So, you'll need at least $150k a year.

To live a baller lifestyle, such as being able to, sometimes, rent a pilot and plane, regularly using a car/limo service, renting a big boat for private parties, or joining one of the exclusive private clubs that upper income Tokyo people can join, I think you'll need twice that- $300k a year, at least.

It really depends on how baller your apartment and vacations are, because a pretty high end penthouse vs. high end studio or one bedroom can be over twice as much and that's your biggest expense. Likewise for luxury hotels vs. Airbnb'ing a decent place on vacation.

It's not that hard to estimate if you look at local apartment websites. Numbeo.com gives you an idea of most other costs. The numbeo apartment averages can be over 50% off though if you want to live in the trendiest neighborhood near bars/restaurants and in a place with high end furnishings.

In Warsaw I was spending 2.5-3k/month. 80 sqm penthouse with decent furnishings for 1.5k USD/month plus 1-1.5k for daily meal service and going out expenses. You don't need a car in most Euro cities.

Antarctica: $0.

In Los Angeles, I would say that you need to make at least $9-10k/month net (so ~$200k gross) to have a semblance of a baller lifestyle.

- $3-4k for rent. This should get you a one-bedroom apartment in a new building with pool/jacuzzi/gym, in a central location. On the low and high ends, think $3k for downtown, $4k for Samo. This might sound expensive, but keep in mind that 1) LA rents have gone up a lot over the past few years, and 2) because it is such a spread out city, there aren't a lot of places in walkable areas, so they come at a premium.

- $1k for car expenses. You can lease a mid to high-end German car for surprisingly little (think $450/mth for an Audi A5 or a BMW 4-series, or ~$700 for the high end ones), but then you get fucked by insurance especially if you're younger, and you still need to spend on gas, maintenance, etc. High-end German cars are super common out here so it actually pays to have a more unusual car.

- $1-2k for other expenses - food, gym, clothes, furniture, etc. Perhaps count this as $2k if you like to travel a lot, otherwise can assume travel comes from savings or leftover money.

This leaves ~$3k for lifestyle spend - nightlife, drinks, nice group dinners, etc etc. Obviously this is the most flexible cost, and you can party in LA for pretty little if you have connections and go to the right spots. But, even being a borderline "baller" should mean that you aren't opposed to buying bottles once or twice a month, buying a few rounds of drinks for your crew when you go out, or going to a nice spot for dinner on Fridays/Saturdays. This shit adds up QUICK.

How much does it cost to be a true baller in LA? I would say the sky is the limit. The amount of money some people have out here is unreal. Renting a house in Hollywood Hills with a view and an infinity pool will cost $10k/mth at LEAST, probably $15k. I've seen bottle service bills of $15k in a night multiple times. People spend ridiculous amounts here. I'm not saying that this lifestyle is for everybody (in fact I think it isn't for most), but it would be hard to put a number on it below $20k/mth.

Man 15K on bottle service....that half my measly yearly salary. If that is not baller not sure what is.

Quote: (04-09-2018 03:00 PM)RDF Wrote:  

In Los Angeles, I would say that you need to make at least $9-10k/month net (so ~$200k gross) to have a semblance of a baller lifestyle.

- $3-4k for rent. This should get you a one-bedroom apartment in a new building with pool/jacuzzi/gym, in a central location. On the low and high ends, think $3k for downtown, $4k for Samo. This might sound expensive, but keep in mind that 1) LA rents have gone up a lot over the past few years, and 2) because it is such a spread out city, there aren't a lot of places in walkable areas, so they come at a premium.

- $1k for car expenses. You can lease a mid to high-end German car for surprisingly little (think $450/mth for an Audi A5 or a BMW 4-series, or ~$700 for the high end ones), but then you get fucked by insurance especially if you're younger, and you still need to spend on gas, maintenance, etc. High-end German cars are super common out here so it actually pays to have a more unusual car.

- $1-2k for other expenses - food, gym, clothes, furniture, etc. Perhaps count this as $2k if you like to travel a lot, otherwise can assume travel comes from savings or leftover money.

This leaves ~$3k for lifestyle spend - nightlife, drinks, nice group dinners, etc etc. Obviously this is the most flexible cost, and you can party in LA for pretty little if you have connections and go to the right spots. But, even being a borderline "baller" should mean that you aren't opposed to buying bottles once or twice a month, buying a few rounds of drinks for your crew when you go out, or going to a nice spot for dinner on Fridays/Saturdays. This shit adds up QUICK.

How much does it cost to be a true baller in LA? I would say the sky is the limit. The amount of money some people have out here is unreal. Renting a house in Hollywood Hills with a view and an infinity pool will cost $10k/mth at LEAST, probably $15k. I've seen bottle service bills of $15k in a night multiple times. People spend ridiculous amounts here. I'm not saying that this lifestyle is for everybody (in fact I think it isn't for most), but it would be hard to put a number on it below $20k/mth.

I agree you need to net at least over 8k in La but it won't grant you baller lifestyle, at least not LA baller lifestyle. You will have a very good life no doubt but you will not be even close to baller unless you have an entertainment niche to go along with that income.

However, if you have the money down for house and that income to go along with it, you don't need to go clubbing or spend money on useless shit, you will do very well.

I would say a baller lifestyle is a lifestyle that plays a big part in getting you a constant flow of the top girls in your city.

Not a girlfriend, and not an occasional stunner, but access to consistent top quality.

NYC, LA, SF:

If you have to ask, you can't afford it.

I can play "high end professional" game in any of those cities: luxury apartment, nice car w garage, dinner 2x/week, cover+2 drinks at a bougie club, monthly clothes shopping.

Once you get to that lifestyle, you'll start to see how many 22 year old students from UAE or Hong Kong who are living in a $4k apartment right next to you.

Blow $2k on a table and you'll see the club promoter and his boys getting theirs for free.

Splurge for the penthouse and see a 25 year old Jared Kushner buying out the building.

Pull out of your $500/mo garage in your Benz and see the Saudi oil heir pull up in his Rolls.

Money is a highly inefficient game in any of these cities-you will always get one-upped. Most 300k/yr guys got there by being really smart in undergrad and busting ass the first few years out of college. Most of them sock away half of their take-home pay so they can be actually wealthy in their 40's and 50's. Tables at LAVO/PHD and 10k/mo penthouse apartments are for people who don't work 70 hour weeks for $300k/year. They work too hard to waste like that.

I've seen plenty of young guys in NYC making $200-400k. None of them live the "baller" lifestyle. Most of them have roommates, modest apartments, 401ks, etc.

Passive money, dividends-that's different. You can take home 80% and blow every penny.

We should change the thread to something more tangible than "baller":

1 BR apartment in a "wow" luxury building.
3-4x weekly sit-down dinner.
Nice car+parking
10 weekend drinks at club/bar with good ratio.
Monthly clothes shopping.