Quote: (10-20-2016 05:52 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  

For each of these debates the following seems to happen for me:
- These rvf threads report a major win or minor loss for first one.
- I search "presidential debate news" on google
- All returns either have a title like "Hillary reportedly wins debate", or the MSM article (CNN etc) is comically biased against Trump.
- I think perhaps Putin and his ilk are right in their treatment of journalists. 99% human slime. As a libertarian I would never dream of freedom of the press being abridged. But I'm not saying I wouldn't silently and comfortably watch with a box of popcorn as things happened. I don't consider these political agents "journalists" anymore than I consider Paul Ryan a "conservative".

This is actually a brilliant example of where ideology fails to meet the pragmatic demands of reality.

The whole basis of enshrining ideals like "freedom of the press" is to stop individual court cases setting precedents whereby legislative creep can slowly allow the government to take control of people's information sources, and their ability to freely express themselves. By drawing a line in the sand, these issues are supposed to be placed entirely beyond the purview of governmental power.

The problem is, the state isn't the only apparatus by which people can influence reality. The function of the press as a check and balance to government power is now entirely compromised, not by legal, but by social and financial means. The people's ability to freely express themselves is also entirely compromised by similar means. It is functionally meaningless to frame this argument from a Libertarian perspective, because ideologies are supposed to be created to meet the demands of reality, not the other way around; and something is clearly very wrong with reality that Libertarianism cannot address.

I'm not sure any ideology can coherently address this problem, either. Government interfering with the media is undesirable. What is government? The group of people who can successfully claim a monopoly over the legitimate use of force. There doesn't appear to be any way to fix the state of the media without the use of some kind of force, and if it is not applied soon there may not be another chance, as the sophistication and totality of their influence on the population's perception of reality is increasing rapidly. These people need the fear of god put in the fast, one way or another.

Civil war may be the only thing capable of bringing these people in line now, but it's a scenario in which everyone loses.

Quote: (10-20-2016 06:37 AM)Ocelot Wrote:  

...It is functionally meaningless to frame this argument from a Libertarian perspective, because ideologies are supposed to be created to meet the demands of reality, not the other way around; and something is clearly very wrong with reality that Libertarianism cannot address.
...

Times like these remind me that from time to time the tree of liberty must be watered.

There is no perfect system. The only real limitation on tyranny is a willingness to rebel, whether lawfully or not.

Quote: (10-20-2016 06:37 AM)Ocelot Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 05:52 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  

For each of these debates the following seems to happen for me:
- These rvf threads report a major win or minor loss for first one.
- I search "presidential debate news" on google
- All returns either have a title like "Hillary reportedly wins debate", or the MSM article (CNN etc) is comically biased against Trump.
- I think perhaps Putin and his ilk are right in their treatment of journalists. 99% human slime. As a libertarian I would never dream of freedom of the press being abridged. But I'm not saying I wouldn't silently and comfortably watch with a box of popcorn as things happened. I don't consider these political agents "journalists" anymore than I consider Paul Ryan a "conservative".

This is actually a brilliant example of where ideology fails to meet the pragmatic demands of reality.

The whole basis of enshrining ideals like "freedom of the press" is to stop individual court cases setting precedents whereby legislative creep can slowly allow the government to take control of people's information sources, and their ability to freely express themselves. By drawing a line in the sand, these issues are supposed to be placed entirely beyond the purview of governmental power.

The problem is, the state isn't the only apparatus by which people can influence reality. The function of the press as a check and balance to government power is now entirely compromised, not by legal, but by social and financial means. The people's ability to freely express themselves is also entirely compromised by similar means. It is functionally meaningless to frame this argument from a Libertarian perspective, because ideologies are supposed to be created to meet the demands of reality, not the other way around; and something is clearly very wrong with reality that Libertarianism cannot address.

I'm not sure any ideology can coherently address this problem, either. Government interfering with the media is undesirable. What is government? The group of people who can successfully claim a monopoly over the legitimate use of force. There doesn't appear to be any way to fix the state of the media without the use of some kind of force, and if it is not applied soon there may not be another chance, as the sophistication and totality of their influence on the population's perception of reality is increasing rapidly. These people need the fear of god put in the fast, one way or another.

Civil war may be the only thing capable of bringing these people in line now, but it's a scenario in which everyone loses.

^^I've been calling for a peaceful split here in the USA for years, going back to the chaos of the 2000 POTUS Election. The schism that exists here is too great to be bridged and has only got worse over time. We see this everyday, especially when judges overrule the will of the people and rule by decree.

Thank god for RVF!
Reading the European news this morning you could think that the debate was a resounding victory for Crooked Hillary, Trump blown the fuck out.
FOOLS!

This is real, unabashed, textbook style propaganda. It's disgusting.
And to think that back then at school we were reading about propaganda in Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union and were all wondering: "How could they not see right through this? How come people were so stupid back then? How could they have fallen for this? It's so obvious and ridiculous, unbelievable."

How innocent we were!
Propaganda never went away, it didn't disappear, no. It developed, it evolved, and was refined to perfection.
Speaking in literary references:

Thesis: 1984
Antithesis: Brave New World
Synthesis: Today's world

But unlike previous generations, we don't have to rely on state controlled, centralized media anymore.
Today we have the Internet, the great equalizer.
Free, chaotic, decentralized, vast and boundless, a force of nature.
Their grip is weakening, and they are struggling to maintain control over an increasingly insubordinate populace. Free and unfiltered access to information is the thorn in their flesh, the most disruptive, dangerous and revolutionary invention since the printing press.

This is why we have to remain vigilant. Free and uncensored access to the Internet will be the next big battlefield in the war on freedom. They will try everything to control it, regulate it, segment and divide it. It has already begun, and most people don't see it, they don't even know. It's an invisible war, fought in the shadows, behind the scenes away from the public eye.

This election will be the next big indicator on who is going to win this war, on whether freedom will prevail in the end, or slowly perish. They are longing to extinguish the bright burning and proud flame of independent thought, the fire of justice and truth, smother it, wear it down in a patient war of attrition, and finally rule with a gentle iron fist.

Darkness is encroaching.
If we win this, we might live to see another day. If we lose, then we lose everything. The stakes have never been higher.
This is the final battle, this is Armageddon.

And it is not about Trump.
He's our chosen champion, fighting for us with the white-hot fury of a thousand suns. He's holding the darkness at bay, for now.
But he's not the light that guides us. It's what he embodies, what he stands for, it's the cause we fight for. It drives us just as it drives him.
Only together we can hope to stand a chance.
Only together we can fight back and preserve our independence, and only together we can ensure that our children will know what freedom truly means.

That's why on November 8 you need to go out there and vote!
Trust me, your children won't need to ask you were you have been on November 8, they will read about it in their history books, they will read about it on the free and unfiltered Internet, and they will be proud of you.

We will come back, and we will come back big league.
We will protect our rights, we will protect our values and beliefs, and we will protect our freedom.
And most importantly,

We will Make America Great Again!

Quote: (10-20-2016 04:36 AM)Cr33pin Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 02:03 AM)Penta Sahi Wrote:  

Quote: (10-19-2016 09:49 PM)iop890 Wrote:  

Katrina Campins on the stream.

WB WB WB WB WB WB WB

Holy shit fuck arg

If you google "Katrina Campins Tommy Hilfiger" you can see the whole titty

This picture disappoints me. Those titties are bolt ons, and she's wearing manish clothes.

[attachment=34029]

Also:

The irony of the current unfreedom of the press is that it's being created by wealthy corporations. (Or worse, one mutherfuckin guy - Soros!) So libertarians who push for Free Markets as if they're the perfect solution need to have an answer to the question, "How do we prevent the corporatist take over of, well, everything, in a libertarian system?" Most have no answer, and some even say, "Well, we've never really had a pure capitalist system..."

And then I stop listening, and indulge in murderous fantasies.

These huffpo faggots are working overtime to prep the bull.

I did a podcast post-debate with eskimobobseal:

https://wethevigilant.com/2016/10/20/the...w-samseau/

Talked about:

- How well Trump did on the debate
- How a man can use game to save America with door knocking
- Why Trump will win

Regarding the part about accepting the election result Trump picked the worst possible answer, he should have just said yes and then choose to challenge it later or just declare with conviction right away that "No, the election is rigged". Right now he's not standing for anything which is a very weak position for a presidential candidate.

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:11 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

Regarding the part about accepting the election result Trump picked the worst possible answer, he should have just said yes and then choose to challenge it later or just declare with conviction right away that "No, the election is rigged". Right now he's not standing for anything which is a very weak position for a presidential candidate.

I disagree.... I think it was the best possible answer. In fact I think it was a calculated answer. It controls the news cycle. It shines a spotlight on voter fraud and it aligns with his #draintheswamp talking points.

The thing people forget, is that if Trump didn't say this, the media would still pick something to attack Trump on. The difference is, the thing the media picks would be something Trump couldn't control.

By framing this as the big issue with the MSM [Remember the MSM aren't going to show anything positive regardless] - Trump forces people who have only been fed lies by the MSM to dip their toes down the rabbit hole, and ultimately win over their support.

Once again, if Trump didn't say this, the MSM weren't going to then go and show his highlights. These hyperbolic statements are the only way to beat a corrupt national media.

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:18 AM)Rush87 Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:11 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

Regarding the part about accepting the election result Trump picked the worst possible answer, he should have just said yes and then choose to challenge it later or just declare with conviction right away that "No, the election is rigged". Right now he's not standing for anything which is a very weak position for a presidential candidate.

I disagree.... I think it was the best possible answer.

Have you opened the papers today? Even Foxnews is saying it was a major mistake. This goes beyond just being about mainstream media.

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:18 AM)Rush87 Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:11 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

Regarding the part about accepting the election result Trump picked the worst possible answer, he should have just said yes and then choose to challenge it later or just declare with conviction right away that "No, the election is rigged". Right now he's not standing for anything which is a very weak position for a presidential candidate.

I disagree.... I think it was the best possible answer. In fact I think it was a calculated answer. It controls the news cycle. It shines a spotlight on voter fraud and it aligns with his #draintheswamp talking points.

The thing people forget, is that if Trump didn't say this, the media would still pick something to attack Trump on. The difference is, the thing the media picks would be something Trump couldn't control.

By framing this as the big issue with the MSM [Remember the MSM aren't going to show anything positive regardless] - Trump forces people who have only been fed lies by the MSM to dip their toes down the rabbit hole, and ultimately win over their support.

Once again, if Trump didn't say this, the MSM weren't going to then go and show his highlights. These hyperbolic statements are the only way to beat a corrupt national media.

Agreed.

It shows:

1. The Don's not going to lay there and get ass raped, like 90% of Republicans would.
2. He's daring them to up their brazenness; thus making their fucking around plain as day and that much easier to get caught doing.

Voter fraud needs to be checked. Ask Samuel Tilden and Richard Nixon.

Once again, The Don plays chess while they think they're playing checkers. When in reality, all they're doing is rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:34 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:18 AM)Rush87 Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:11 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

Regarding the part about accepting the election result Trump picked the worst possible answer, he should have just said yes and then choose to challenge it later or just declare with conviction right away that "No, the election is rigged". Right now he's not standing for anything which is a very weak position for a presidential candidate.

I disagree.... I think it was the best possible answer.

Have you opened the papers today? Even Foxnews is saying it was a major mistake. This goes beyond just being about mainstream media.

Fox News has been off the ball this entire election. For months now they have written Trump off at every hint of trouble, and for months now they have been repeatedly wrong.

Obviously there are afew excepts, but overall they have proved to be no better than the cuckservatives. Many of their hosts rehash the exact same talking points as CNN.

Regarding the comment itself, on the dial test, Independents and Republicans both responded positively. This won't hurt him in the slightest. Everyone's entitled to their opinion but I'm not worried.

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:40 AM)Rush87 Wrote:  

Regarding the comment itself, on the dial test, Independents and Republicans both responded positively. This won't hurt him in the slightest. Everyone's entitled to their opinion but I'm not worried.

What focus group with that be? I'm struggling to find a Republican speaking out in support of the reply anywhere. If I have to go to Breitbart to find a poll in favor of Trump that's a very telling sign.

   

Mainstream media propaganda is brutal. Not only in US but in Europe, absolutely lying trash. So called 'experts' calling Project Veritas for conspiracy theory despite democrats being fired for it.

Be honest with yourself, do you feel that insecurity? This is the matrix coming at you with full force. I remain convinced Trump wins, it will give great strenght to all of you who has a first run in with sticking to your worldview despite full on assault. After this you will never be swayed by popular opinion again. I do think a Trump win could lead to some instances of mass psychosis in liberals. I think their amygdala simply will not be able to cope. Their worldview is so different, the cognitive dissonance might figuratively blow their amygdala and the reaction can be difficult to predict. Crying, violence, suicide, catatonia.

If I was in US, I would actually very seriously prepare to take to the streets regardless, after Nov. 8. In a case of Trump win, Soros will attempt a Maidan coup using BLM and other leftist groups.

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:48 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:40 AM)Rush87 Wrote:  

Regarding the comment itself, on the dial test, Independents and Republicans both responded positively. This won't hurt him in the slightest. Everyone's entitled to their opinion but I'm not worried.

What focus group with that be? I'm struggling to find a Republican speaking out in support of the reply anywhere. If I have to go to Breitbart to find a poll in favor of Trump that's a very telling sign.

Most swing states ( eg Florida) have Republican Governors who appoint Republican Secretaries of State, which is usually the office that runs the elections.

If you get outside of alt-right sites, you'll find many swing state Republican secretaries of state-- the people who run the elections in their states-- openly protesting the idea that they are running crooked elections slanted against their own party.

The have openly requested that facts be offered to substantiate that they are not running clean elections.

But Trump does not seem to have offered facts to support his claims of rigged elections.

^This one must have missed Project Veritas.

Quote: (10-20-2016 10:16 AM)nomadbrah Wrote:  

Mainstream media propaganda is brutal. Not only in US but in Europe, absolutely lying trash. So called 'experts' calling Project Veritas for conspiracy theory despite democrats being fired for it.

Be honest with yourself, do you feel that insecurity? This is the matrix coming at you with full force. I remain convinced Trump wins, it will give great strenght to all of you who has a first run in with sticking to your worldview despite full on assault. After this you will never be swayed by popular opinion again. I do think a Trump win could lead to some instances of mass psychosis in liberals. I think their amygdala simply will not be able to cope. Their worldview is so different, the cognitive dissonance might figuratively blow their amygdala and the reaction can be difficult to predict. Crying, violence, suicide, catatonia.

If I was in US, I would actually very seriously prepare to take to the streets regardless, after Nov. 8. In a case of Trump win, Soros will attempt a Maidan coup using BLM and other leftist groups.

Portuguese media is utter trash. They know people will not bother to see the
debate so they just out right change facts.
I've seen that along the past year, the comment sections on news regarding US elections have been increasing in calling the bullshit and being pro-trump.

This election has been an eye opener. With Veritas, you can see exactly how dirty low-level-politics is. Actually is not much different from a dictatorship. It's a propaganda machine. No different from what the russians used... Pravda. Truly something Brave New Worldesque. I'd rather live in an 1984, mainly because it's easier to fight oppression than comfort.
I've started to see completely distrust any information from mainstream media. I have started to do my own fact checking. Whenever possible I will also stop using services from companies that endorse HRC, as well as stop supporting bands or artists that have endorsed HRC.

Seeing the constant barrage of shit from the media is also very demoralizing. Some times I do think I am alone, and I am the crazy one. Then I have to come to RfV to get a reality slap and charge my armory with High Energy.
I am involved in politics and many people will immediately say they are Pro-Hillary and I generally engage in conflict. Even women say in a group that they are pro-H and then a while after tell me that the big man is very good. I also see several GUYS shying in a corner, afraid to speak what's on their heads. If they either are pro-Trump, or don't want refugees, or something else which is not the current media narrative.
The pro-H guys are, interesting enough what we would call low-T ass-kissing beta orbiter dudes that would not lift a barbell to save their lives. Most of them also spend most of their time looking at their smartphone. Bunch of slimy cucks, most of them are not even worth the air they breathe, and it pisses me to know that such weak, both mentally and physically, people will be in charge of my country in a couple of years. I do not trust any of these guys.
The media barrage is an onslaught for the uninformed voter. Fortunately we still have the internet and people can still search exactly what Project Veritas is, or the wikileaks. That's exactly why governments want stupid and dependable people.

It may sound ridiculous as fuck, but everyday before I go to sleep, I do a short meditation and try to channel my energy to Trump (much like Goku does). He sure needs it.

I would never be able to find the post in the thousands of posts in the main Trump thread but I vividly recall a Samseau comment wherein he suggested that Trump actually was more susceptible to a rigged election in the Primaries, but should actually be safer in the General because the GOP for all of its faults would have his back and keep an eye out for shenanigans.

Do you think that is still the case Samseau? This is in light of the GOP establishment crusade against Trump (ie, bogus registration drives, low effort campaigning on Trumps behalf, belief in Ryan 2020 etc) and the Project Veritas videos.

Quote: (10-20-2016 11:09 AM)komatiite Wrote:  

I would never be able to find the post in the thousands of posts in the main Trump thread but I vividly recall a Samseau comment wherein he suggested that Trump actually was more susceptible to a rigged election in the Primaries, but should actually be safer in the General because the GOP for all of its faults would have his back and keep an eye out for shenanigans.

Do you think that is still the case Samseau? This is in light of the GOP establishment crusade against Trump (ie, bogus registration drives, low effort campaigning on Trumps behalf, belief in Ryan 2020 etc) and the Project Veritas videos.

I doubt it. He is going to get half of them voted out. They will back him somewhat but not like they would one of their own.

Quote: (10-20-2016 11:09 AM)komatiite Wrote:  

I would never be able to find the post in the thousands of posts in the main Trump thread but I vividly recall a Samseau comment wherein he suggested that Trump actually was more susceptible to a rigged election in the Primaries, but should actually be safer in the General because the GOP for all of its faults would have his back and keep an eye out for shenanigans.

Do you think that is still the case Samseau? This is in light of the GOP establishment crusade against Trump (ie, bogus registration drives, low effort campaigning on Trumps behalf, belief in Ryan 2020 etc) and the Project Veritas videos.

Yes I do still think this is the case, and I've always said Trump's biggest problems with voter fraud will be in Pennsylvania (and potentially NC).

They can try voter fraud in Ohio and Indiana, and go to jail. There are MORE than enough small town Republicans in these states to keep bullshit to a minimum.

Philly is a fucking basket case though, and run by corrupt democrats. They will need vigilant citizens to go to Philly on Nov. 8th and have a guard standing outside of every polling station with camera phone in hand.

I'm sure Charlotte is another hotbed of fraud, but there are tons of Republicans with guns in that state.

We all know there is massive voter fraud in NYC, LA, and Chicago, which keeps these states perma-blue, but Trump doesn't need these states to win and change things for the better. Trump is polling very close in PA, so keeping an eye on Philly there will ensure the election is a wrap.

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:34 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:18 AM)Rush87 Wrote:  

Quote: (10-20-2016 09:11 AM)Vicious Wrote:  

Regarding the part about accepting the election result Trump picked the worst possible answer, he should have just said yes and then choose to challenge it later or just declare with conviction right away that "No, the election is rigged". Right now he's not standing for anything which is a very weak position for a presidential candidate.

I disagree.... I think it was the best possible answer.

Have you opened the papers today? Even Foxnews is saying it was a major mistake. This goes beyond just being about mainstream media.

Vicious is one of the best contrarian indicators on RVF. If he says it's true, then you know it's false. He actually thinks Sweden is doing okay even though people fly the ISIS flag there, and he lives there!!! You're stuck in a corporate bubble world, you have no idea what's going on.

I agree with Samseau.

I've said this before in the Trump thread, but a scandal or "gaffe" only matters if it makes people less likely to vote for you, or more likely to vote for your opponent. That's why the "grab 'em by the pussy" thing was such a problem, it scared Samseau's "skittish women".

Who is more likely to vote for Hillary now because of this? Who is less likely to vote for Trump? What group is scared off by this?

I see a lot of virtue signalling on twitter, but I don't see anything that actually matters.