Quote:Quote:

Citing a series of geopolitical, economic and social setbacks faced by the United States since the turn of the century, geopolitical analyst and Sao Paulo Business School Professor Antonio Gelis-Filho argues that global policy planners must prepare to deal with the “improbable, but by all means possible, Soviet-style collapse of the United States.”

[...]

He cites the conflict in Ukraine, where Russia has been able to stand up to Washington to defend its strategic interests, and China’s building of artificial islands in the South China Sea, “in spite of US warnings not to do so. In fact,” according to Gelis-Filho, “American warnings are ignored by Beijing as if they were the buzz of an annoying but harmless fly.”

http://sputniknews.com/analysis/20150608...z3cxuZFtao

Unlike the Soviet Union, there is a bountiful supply of armed weapons in the US, so any type of collapse would lead to violence, but along what lines (race, state, ethnic, class)? And judging by how quickly and unexpected the Soviet Union collapsed, would it be unreasonable to start preparing for an American collapse to occur within our lifetimes?

It's hard not to notice how anything the American touches turns into stone: Libya, Afghanistan, Yemen, Iraq, Ukraine. I think it was over at Club Orlov I read that this is America "projecting" its internal chaos onto the world, and that the ineptness of their foreign policy is a reflection of what's happening within the country.

Quote: (06-14-2015 02:47 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

It's hard not to notice how anything the American touches turns into stone: Libya, Afghanistan, Yemen, Iraq, Ukraine. I think it was over at Club Orlov I read that this is America "projecting" its internal chaos onto the world, and that the ineptness of their foreign policy is a reflection of what's happening within the country

Yes, I remember reading that line in one of his posts on his blog as well, I will try to dig it up for the rest here. Also from him, and very relevant for this thread:

Closing The Colapse Gap

He also wrote a couple of books on the subject.

I personally can't foresee this happening... unless there is a currency which credibly challenges the dollar.

As long as the demand for dollars is there the U.S. can keep on borrowing.

But collapses do happen fast. In the case of the U.S. it would happen when there was something which caused a worldwide loss of faith in its ability to make good on its debts, pay bonds, etc.

People can say what they want to about the possibility, but this move (within the United States itself) is a move of preparing for the very possibility of a collapse. Make no mistake: Americans will think this is no big deal, but you can bet that the political leaders in China know exactly what this means - even within the US, people are realizing this empire isn't sustainable anymore.

Americans like to assume that the US will always be one country, but history shows that when an empire collapses it often breaks into pieces. For instance, Rome was divided East and West, with the East prospering for a period of time. Like you mentioned with the Soviet Union, we saw pieces of it break off as well when it collapsed. The Ottoman and Mongolian Empire were also no different. The United States isn't even functioning as one country anymore; it's just a matter of time before it simply doesn't and we see where the pieces fall.

The unsustainable national debt is one example of the writing is on the wall: the United States will break apart someday and the probable scenario is that it will become 4-7 separate countries (possibly more). How difficult that transitional process will be remains to be seen; from what I've been told, after the Soviet collapse, it wasn't a pretty sight.

I've been waiting since 08. Check out the RVF Preppers Thread.

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-47424....light=prep

In the event of a collapse, expect the southern states of Texas, Louisiana, Miss., Alabama, Florida to detach itself from any other cancerous welfare state in order to save it's own citizens.

If you got gangrene on the leg in the Civil War, you knew what you had to do.

Most southern states will be fine. It's deadbeat states like Illinois, New York, Maine and California that will get the lion's share of grief.

Keep preparing.

With the Eurozone in tatters, the USD will remain strong for the foreseeable future. And a strong dollar means a strong America.

The gold bugs and doom-sayers have always been wrong -- and will continue to be.

The foreign policy "failures" cited above actually benefited the U.S enormously. They were unethical, and ruined entire nations, but Uncle Sam only acts in his own interests.

Frankly, there's umpteen reasons to be concerned about the U.S (and to get out of dodge), but a domestic collapse is not one of them.

Quote: (06-14-2015 04:10 PM)Soothesayer Wrote:  

In the event of a collapse, expect the southern states of Texas, Louisiana, Miss., Alabama, Florida to detach itself from any other cancerous welfare state in order to save it's own citizens.

If you got gangrene on the leg in the Civil War, you knew what you had to do.

Most southern states will be fine. It's deadbeat states like Illinois, New York, Maine and California that will get the lion's share of grief.

Interesting.

Can you elaborate on this? You can on the prepper thread if it's not suited for this one.

Quote: (06-14-2015 04:10 PM)Soothesayer Wrote:  

In the event of a collapse, expect the southern states of Texas, Louisiana, Miss., Alabama, Florida to detach itself from any other cancerous welfare state in order to save it's own citizens.

If you got gangrene on the leg in the Civil War, you knew what you had to do.

Most southern states will be fine. It's deadbeat states like Illinois, New York, Maine and California that will get the lion's share of grief.

Ironically those southern states you mentioned are the biggest welfare leeches, they take in more federal tax money than they make.

There are many good writings about this subject. In the 1990s, a cultural conservative named Bill Lind wrote about the collapse of the US:

http://www.vdare.com/articles/william-li...ca-breakup

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_S._Lind


My personal views are a bit different. I think the collapse will likely play out slower than expected. There will be increasing authoritarianism from the centralized state, as social institutions are unable to keep order. Democracy--what is left of it--will be replaced by total autocracy.

It will be similar to what the Roman Empire underwent during the reign of Diocletian and those who came after him. "Reforms" will focus on dividing the empire into manageable regions.

The Congress will be completely bypassed. State and municipal governments will become increasingly irrelevant as authoritarianism is needed to keep order in the face of social unrest.

Social mobility will stagnate, laying the foundations for a new form of feudalism.

China and Russia are making big alliances as we speak, this is not being reported too strongly in the western media. Currently they are trading oil and its not using the petro-dollar, they are trading in Yuan. Both of these countries are buying Gold like it is going out of style, so they seem to be preparing for something.
Also the BRIC nations formed a new bank last year and Germany reportedly wanted in on the act.
Being heavily aligned to the USA, I hope the scenario which they are calling for doesn't happen. It will be all out anarchy and SWHTF overnight.
The big question is how long can the US debt keep going, it will have to break at some point. Jobs are being outsourced on a weekly basis, the retail industry is dying a slow death. The writing is on the wall.

^ China needs the USD to survive. If I ran shit I'd block their ships from bringing all their junk here which would spark our economy.

Yes we'd have to make our own plastic spiders, Iphones etc.

Then I would take down Canada, Mexico, Cuba and Central America. Regain control of the canal, send their junk back from those countries as well unless 100% tariff at least. Call Putin on facetime and tell him to suck my balls as well.

Also all of the Caribbean.

0% interest gov loans to build industry back.

Edit: And Iraq would become a US state.

El Mech 2016.

You have my vote.

Who is going to make the iphones in America? How much would you have to pay them and what would the productivity be like in comparison to the slave shops in China.
What about the natural resources you get from other countries. For example Hydro power Canada supplies the USA.
I guess you going to stop immigration, since you are blocking their ships. Are you forgetting the amount of property in the USA owned by foreigners not living in the US.
Chinese are buying buildings in NYC like a monopoly board. You going to give them back their money?
Another troll job I suspect!

Quote: (06-14-2015 05:56 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Who is going to make the iphones in America? How much would you have to pay them and what would the productivity be like in comparison to the slave shops in China.
What about the natural resources you get from other countries. For example Hydro power Canada supplies the USA.
I guess you going to stop immigration, since you are blocking their ships. Are you forgetting the amount of property in the USA owned by foreigners not living in the US.
Chinese are buying buildings in NYC like a monopoly board. You going to give them back their money?
Another troll job I suspect!

This is whats going to happen to the chinese.

http://www.rooshvforum.network/thread-15015-...#pid250159

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I've had this tried on me before more than once. They always give it away somehow but I went along with it anyway because I'm a little sick. Once at huge park two dudes dragged me out into the woods and I blasted one in the head with a boulder I swooped off the ground straight across the face and beat the other one to near death then fucked the girl. I stole their Cutlass supreme and smashed that, stole all their money, drugs and weapons. The one dude I hit with the rock someone told me his half his row of front teeth were dis attached he was in intensive care.

Quote: (06-14-2015 05:56 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Who is going to make the iphones in America? How much would you have to pay them and what would the productivity be like in comparison to the slave shops in China.
What about the natural resources you get from other countries. For example Hydro power Canada supplies the USA.
I guess you going to stop immigration, since you are blocking their ships. Are you forgetting the amount of property in the USA owned by foreigners not living in the US.
Chinese are buying buildings in NYC like a monopoly board. You going to give them back their money?
Another troll job I suspect!

Mexicans will make the phones no problem as they will be Americans.

We take Canada which the power is ours as also Canadians are now Americans

Maybe give back their money. Unless they want to stay and open a heavily taxed foreign entity until things get streamlined. They will have a grace period.

Immigration will stop until further notice undesirables will be deported.

"Girlfriend" visas will be on the fast track in industrial or any male heavy demographic areas.

Quote: (06-14-2015 04:57 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  

There are many good writings about this subject. In the 1990s, a cultural conservative named Bill Lind wrote about the collapse of the US:

http://www.vdare.com/articles/william-li...ca-breakup

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_S._Lind


My personal views are a bit different. I think the collapse will likely play out slower than expected. There will be increasing authoritarianism from the centralized state, as social institutions are unable to keep order. Democracy--what is left of it--will be replaced by total autocracy.

It will be similar to what the Roman Empire underwent during the reign of Diocletian and those who came after him. "Reforms" will focus on dividing the empire into manageable regions.

The Congress will be completely bypassed. State and municipal governments will become increasingly irrelevant as authoritarianism is needed to keep order in the face of social unrest.

Social mobility will stagnate, laying the foundations for a new form of feudalism.

I remember Max Keiser talking about Neo Feudalism back in 2010.

Quote: (06-14-2015 04:47 PM)Cattle Rustler Wrote:  

Quote: (06-14-2015 04:10 PM)Soothesayer Wrote:  

In the event of a collapse, expect the southern states of Texas, Louisiana, Miss., Alabama, Florida to detach itself from any other cancerous welfare state in order to save it's own citizens.

If you got gangrene on the leg in the Civil War, you knew what you had to do.

Most southern states will be fine. It's deadbeat states like Illinois, New York, Maine and California that will get the lion's share of grief.

Ironically those southern states you mentioned are the biggest welfare leeches, they take in more federal tax money than they make.

Glad I scrolled down before posting the facepalm meme, thank you for pointing this out. Every state he lists as a "leech" except Maine, pays out at a higher ratio than every single state he lists as "self-sufficient". So much irony. Citation here, for one: http://www.theatlantic.com/business/arch...rs/361668/

Furthermore, there will be no detachment. TX wasn't even able to detach themselves from the effects of a financial crisis half a world away in Greece, let alone the collapse in '08. TX can't drink oil any more than IL can burn water. When we fall, we're all going down together.

I have the guns and know-how to survive better than 99% of my fellow countrymen but frankly, I'm not sure it will be a life worth living. Having spent several months living in a tent, sponge bathing in a frigid stream, beating back the mosquitoes and cooking on a fire, I can say that the first few days were an adventure. But even with the my next meal and the luxurious hot water sponge bath at the gas station only a few miles away and even without marauding gangs looking to steal my food and rape my wife it started to suck pretty quickly.

I do have a bug out location in mind and can only hope that the QC is right about the collapse happening more slowly so that I have time to stash up a hot young wife, toothpaste, and toilet paper.

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When we fall, we're all going down together.

Or could trade commodities. That's what we used to do. We don't need Wal-Mart to step on it or outsource it.

I'm sure Texas would trade crude oil for Citrus. You may not think Florida is the go to place for spring water but it's literally pouring into the ocean 24/7.

Could be bottled? Pipeline? Create jobs?






Fresh clean water dumped into the gulf 24/7 365 since the beginning of time.

Thousands of places just like it. Where do you think Pirates/ explorers got water from?

Quote: (06-14-2015 02:47 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

I think it was over at Club Orlov I read that this is America "projecting" its internal chaos onto the world, and that the ineptness of their foreign policy is a reflection of what's happening within the country.

I remember back in the days of the Lewinsky Scandal Bill Clinton suddenly decided to bomb several weapon storages in Baghdad turning the night into New Year's Eve event. My father and I were watching this on TV and we were like "WTF".

Even if it wasn't planned as a distraction from the scandal the timing was just horrible.

Google the Free State Project - New Hampshire was their initial state to resettle in - Live Free or Die - our State House and Senate both passed 2nd Ammendment Constitutional Carry - however Michael Billionaire Feminist Bloomberg himself met with our feminist SLW female governor and promised her a blank superpac check if she vetoes it - so currently a tooth and nail fight. There should be NO "police authorized" Concealed Carry Permits because we already have the right granted in the constitution but over the years the Feminist Nanny Stater SJWs started requiring permits under the well regulated militia language - the issue is permits go into modern databases and when the autocracy comes to seize your means of self defense to implement their Orwellian totalitarian SWAT, Prisons, Industrial Police States - these databases are what enable Obama to sneak national gun registrations clauses in the latest Patriot Act (which shreds the constitution) and Rand Paul is filibustering against which is shining light on the Obama Administrations intentional subversion of the US Constitution.

The first decision when TSHTF and bugout time comes I would suggest the list of states that feature full constitutional carry and then the states like NH working on it as these states respect your right to defend hearth and home.

I would strongly suggest considering membership in NRA, NAGR and local preppers groups...
http://nagr.org/concarryfb.htm NAGR is especially focused on Constitutional Carry and these will be the people you can ban together to form well self regulated local Militias as no one man is an effective Army you will need fellow soldiers.

I met with my lawyer to create a bugout services Real Estate biz under the guise of providing public safety services to Metro NY/NJ/CT tri staters for when the next hurricane Sandy hits - there are many Business Opps in SHTF scenarios -and it requires advanced preparation and is therefore a great biz model - anyone waits to prepare for SHTF events then it is already too late for them and they are phooked. For example http://www.survival-warehouse.com/

Yes even socialist Bernie Sanders' Vermont has Constitutional Carry - go figure...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitutional_carry
1 U.S. States that have constitutional carry
1.1 Alaska
1.2 Arizona
1.3 Arkansas
1.4 Kansas
1.5 Vermont
1.6 Wyoming (for residents)
2 U.S. States that have a limited form of permitless concealed carry
2.1 Idaho (outside city limits while engaged in lawful outdoor activities)
2.1.1 Exemption for public employees
2.2 Montana (outside city limits)
2.3 New Hampshire (unloaded weapon & loaded magazine)
2.4 New Mexico (unloaded weapon & loaded magazine, vehicle carry)
2.5 Oklahoma (residents of constitutional carry states)
3 U.S. States that have introduced but not passed constitutional carry legislation
3.1 Colorado
3.2 Georgia
3.3 Indiana
3.4 Iowa
3.5 Kentucky
3.6 Louisiana
3.7 Maine
3.8 Mississippi
3.9 Nevada
3.10 North Carolina
3.11 Ohio
3.12 Oregon
3.13 Pennsylvania
3.14 South Carolina
3.15 South Dakota
3.16 Tennessee
3.17 Texas
3.18 Utah
3.19 Virginia
3.20 West Virginia
3.21 Wisconsin
4 See also
5 References

Quote: (06-14-2015 05:56 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

Who is going to make the iphones in America? How much would you have to pay them and what would the productivity be like in comparison to the slave shops in China.

Not only cheap labour, but they also have the advantage of industrial power.

Theres this story where Steve Jobs decided to change the screen of the Iphone (4 I believe?) weeks before its launch. He found some new stronger material and wanted all of the screens of the millions of devices already ordered to be changed to that.

The chinese said, yeah sure, and they set up a factory within days, staffed it, and set a production line for the new screens. Millions of Iphones changed and they where still released on time.

Be it electronic shit or plastic spiders, with the chinese you can have them by the end of the week. A world economy without China would be thrown back to pre WW2 Europe, with reliance on agriculture and local, boutique like industries, and under a constant threat of war.

Quote: (06-14-2015 04:47 PM)Cattle Rustler Wrote:  

Quote: (06-14-2015 04:10 PM)Soothesayer Wrote:  

In the event of a collapse, expect the southern states of Texas, Louisiana, Miss., Alabama, Florida to detach itself from any other cancerous welfare state in order to save it's own citizens.

If you got gangrene on the leg in the Civil War, you knew what you had to do.

Most southern states will be fine. It's deadbeat states like Illinois, New York, Maine and California that will get the lion's share of grief.

Ironically those southern states you mentioned are the biggest welfare leeches, they take in more federal tax money than they make.

^ I've heard this argument before, from SJW and prog classmates in college.

The underlying argument, from my perspective, is that these red states are guilty of hypocrisy, because they advocate reducing dependency on the government while extracting welfare payments and other gubmint cheddar.

I'm personally skeptical - part of me thinks that the areas in these states most heavily dependent on federal aid are in the major cities, like Atlanta, New Orleans, Birmingham, etc. By no small coincidence, aren't these population centers going to drift leftward anyway?

Maybe it's just a subject of my own personal prejudice, but I'd like to see the breakdown on a county-by-county basis as far as the apportioning of federal aid is concerned. If it *is* concentrated in the major cities, which in all probability voted for the present administration in '08 and '12, then I think the hypocrisy argument falls somewhat flat.

But I digress.

Relevant videos:











The point is collapses happen pretty quickly once imperial decay sets in. I would definitely say the US Empire is in decay much like the British Empire was in decay in the early 20th century.

However, I agree with others that as long as the USA continues to have the world's reserve currency, then it can continue to borrow and limp along. That is why what the Chinese are doing is telling. They are taking the steps necessary to make the Renminbi (aka the Yuan) a reserve currency. They are lobbying hard to have it included in the SDR basket of the IMF, they have created the AIIB, they have helped create the BRICS bank, they are entering into currency swap agreements with numerous countries, and they are settling more and more of their trade in Yuan.

Maybe a collapse is not in the cards in the next ten years or so, but beyond that things begin to get murky really quick.

Just as a heads up, Sputnik News is funded by the Kremlin. This does not mean the site is worthless, in fact I use it for research I do on Russia, but keep in mind that like Russia Today they want to portray the US in the worst light possible.

As far as the collapse goes, culturally we're already there. I don't think there will be, however, a sudden economic implosion. I see a long, drawn out decline in the form of economic stagnation.

Quote: (06-14-2015 05:16 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

China and Russia are making big alliances as we speak, this is not being reported too strongly in the western media. Currently they are trading oil and its not using the petro-dollar, they are trading in Yuan. Both of these countries are buying Gold like it is going out of style, so they seem to be preparing for something.
Also the BRIC nations formed a new bank last year and Germany reportedly wanted in on the act.
Being heavily aligned to the USA, I hope the scenario which they are calling for doesn't happen. It will be all out anarchy and SWHTF overnight.
The big question is how long can the US debt keep going, it will have to break at some point. Jobs are being outsourced on a weekly basis, the retail industry is dying a slow death. The writing is on the wall.

Yep, this is something that interests me immensely. I don't think that China, Russia, BRICS bank etc. will knock the USD off anytime soon though, although they will create an appealing alternative.

I think they are gaining significantly more ground though in terms of military influence and geo-politcs:

-China has basically recolonized Africa, is building a canal in Nicaragua (bye bye Monroe Doctrine), funding other ventures in Latin America and is marking its territory in the South China Sea

-Russia is also gaining back ground in SEA (I was just reading about the revival of the Russian naval base in Vietnam), wooing Greece as well as some MidEast countries, giving arms to Iran etc.

I could go all day. I used to lean towards being an isolationist but seeing how much ground Russia and China are gaining, compared to the foreign policy messes we have on our hands, I think we need to reevaluate our strategy abroad, without starting any more wars.