[PixelFree]

Hey guys, I'm planning a holiday to Eastern Europe with a natural mate. Our game level is high and we can only speak English (I know a handful of Russian words).

Looking to go for about 4 weeks, to Ukraine and Russia (say 2 weeks each country, 2 cities per country). Maybe even Poland and Estonia - although I'm concerned a week per country is too short.

Also looking to go to Thailand for a week on the way back - which I've found is great for holidaying Russians - their English is better and they're more relaxed on holidays.

Looking to go for general travel/fun, culture, women (both short term but also long term potential - marriage/kids). It'll probably be an 'intro' trip really.

I have very good experience with both Russians and Ukrainians, having seriously dated 5 and being engaged to one for years. I know the genuine ones can be a extremely tough nut to crack, but with the best rewards in regards to a great wife and family.

Questions

1. Any threads worth reading?
2. How many cities / countries would you go to and which ones?
3. Are cities like Odessa played out or would it still be the choice?
4. What is the general view on the Ukrainian dating agencies? I suspect they are only good for long term matches with a % of potential gold diggers (and scam companies) but are they still worth checking out? Seems like a great way to meet a high number of serious matches.
5. Also, how do most people 'do' Eastern Europe? Do they do a series of 1 month trips, do they move there for 2-6 months and live off savings (possibly with some kind of volunteer / low paid local job that allows them to expand their social circle), or do they get a job in a nearby high salary country like Germany or England and do frequent shorter trips?
6. Would it be strongly recommended to learn more Russian?
   

Thanks.

[LeBaron]

Hey mate I'll give you my 2 cents

1: yes the Ukraine thread and the Russia thread
2: personnaly If I would go wife hunting I would stay in one city in one country for as much time as I can, In your case I woud go to 2/3 tier Russia like Novossibirsk or Krasnodar (I would still visit Moscow and St petersburg for a few days)
3: Never been to Odessa but from what I heard it's gold digger central
4: stay away from them most of them are a pure scam
5: I am European so I won't talk from the same point of view as you. I think most people do short trips 1-2 weeks hence the poor results(especially in Ukraine) you won't find work in eastern europe as a short term visitor without fluent russian. I did long term trips. I'm not in wife hunting but mode from my experience the best way to score with hot girls are to be in Kiev and avoid the city center (khreshchatyk, Arena, CHI, Skybar etc...) and go to large shopping malls and bars and clubs on the outskirt of the city.
6: Yes if you decide to be in Ukraine most of the time. You can do without it in Moscow but the hottest girls 8's+ will have a poor english.

Avoid Poland and Estonia coming from Australia I would stick to Ukraine/Russia

oh and if you go to Moscow go to Icon club plenty of 7's and great ratios

[Fornication]

(02-27-2019 02:18 AM)LeBaron Wrote:  

Hey mate I'll give you my 2 cents

1: yes the Ukraine thread and the Russia thread
2: personnaly If I would go wife hunting I would stay in one city in one country for as much time as I can, In your case I woud go to 2/3 tier Russia like Novossibirsk or Krasnodar (I would still visit Moscow and St petersburg for a few days)
3: Never been to Odessa but from what I heard it's gold digger central
4: stay away from them most of them are a pure scam
5: I am European so I won't talk from the same point of view as you. I think most people do short trips 1-2 weeks hence the poor results(especially in Ukraine) you won't find work in eastern europe as a short term visitor without fluent russian. I did long term trips. I'm not in wife hunting but mode from my experience the best way to score with hot girls are to be in Kiev and avoid the city center (khreshchatyk, Arena, CHI, Skybar etc...) and go to large shopping malls and bars and clubs on the outskirt of the city.
6: Yes if you decide to be in Ukraine most of the time. You can do without it in Moscow but the hottest girls 8's+ will have a poor english.

Avoid Poland and Estonia coming from Australia I would stick to Ukraine/Russia

oh and if you go to Moscow go to Icon club plenty of 7's and great ratios

Icon is a hooker central club. It's hard to find a non pro/non gold digger over there.
Goto any nearby club in that area. I personally preferred Rolling Stones. Lots of cuties in the age range 18-24.

[Jungle]

1. Yeh, type "country name" into "Search (Via Forum)", a treasure trove of information there.
2. One city -> 2nd tier city e.g. ~ 1 mil population. Yes, it's true that English levels are lower in 2nd tier cities but there's disadvantages in bigger cities too such as high sex tourism stigma, low foreigner exotic factor, and less "traditional girls". For curiosity sake you could do a short trip in a 1st tier city just for fun / pipelined birds.
3. It's played out.
4. No, just NO.
5. Find a way to earn money from your Western country/currency... internet business, property investment, etc.
6. It's an incredibly difficult language to learn, it would take you thousands of dedicated hours. Of course learn basic phrases to get by, but realistically your ROI is not going to be worth it unless you spend over 1 year in the country.

[Adrenaline]

Why would you avoid Poland and Estonia if coming from Australia, LeBaron?

[LeBaron]

(02-27-2019 12:25 PM)Adrenaline Wrote:  

Why would you avoid Poland and Estonia if coming from Australia, LeBaron?

Well it's because these places are played out and too touristy I woudn't want to come all the way from Australia to end up in Poland just read the last few pages of the Poland thread and you'll understand. On top of that girls quality is higher in Ukraine and Russia.

[BlackFriar]

If you are wanting to find country girls, check out Saaremaa and Hiiumaa islands in Estonia.

[PixelFree]

What's wrong with the agencies? (apart from most of them being scams).

Surely there is at least 1 or 2 good ones. The quality I've seen the losers on the various YouTube's I've seen on them looks pretty good (obviously they'll load the TV footage with the best).

[BangBoy123]

I presume you met your old flames in Australia? If so then there's a huge difference between UA/RU girls living in the West, compared to being in their own countries. There's obviously a language barrier, and also you will have very little in common with most of them.

1. No (only joking!)
2. Go to Kiev and to Moscow if you only have 4 weeks
3. Odessa is only for bitches, not for wives.
4. Scams, and not for those with "high game levels"
5. Mostly guys do fishing missions to Eastern Europe, find the girls looking to escape, then reel them back into civilised shores
6. It's a shame you didn't learn with your previous girlfriends, but scarcely worth it unless you want to spend extended time in UA/RU, get your new wife to teach you in case it goes wrong again.

Quote:

Also looking to go to Thailand for a week on the way back - which I've found is great for holidaying Russians - their English is better and they're more relaxed on holidays.

Very much depends on the time of year, Bali is not far from Australia and attracts a lot of the Russian Instagram girls who want to live for cheap and look for a "serious man"

[edlefou]

To get a young hottie will not be easy unless you go there long term and do something like the Chinese ping pong guy.

Otherwise it will mainly be older women with kids looking for a provider.

[Pointer]

(02-27-2019 12:10 AM)PixelFree Wrote:  

[*]Also, how do most people 'do' Eastern Europe? Do they do a series of 1 month trips, do they move there for 2-6 months and live off savings (possibly with some kind of volunteer / low paid local job that allows them to expand their social circle), or do they get a job in a nearby high salary country like Germany or England and do frequent shorter trips?
[*]Would it be strongly recommended to learn more Russian?
[/list]

Thanks.

If you have some decent savings, let's say 5000-6000 euros you don't need to work to be able to live in EE for 6 months or more (especially if you're sharing a flat).
In Ukraine I found that many people don't speak English, Russian is definitely a plus but not for such a short trip.

[Deepdiver]

I like this site https://www.loveme.com/women/search.htm versus the much more ruthless fee/letter/skype/trips mill Anastasia date...

Every so often I scan for new talent in both RU (StP) and anywhere in UA Kiev Lvov Odessa etc...

I know a gent who grew up in Moscow and using native language skills and understanding of both RU and UA culture and modern conflicts does private matchmaking and meetups in Moscow/StP and Kiev/Odessa as may be necessary (His fee s $20K to $40K to find a good wife including trips and him as translator/filterer).

His two most important screening takeaways - 1. when with her is she as frugal with your money as if it was hers (long term thinking) vs short term spend it all on material stuff she can sell trade for cash to survive or invest when you leave. 2. The other big takeaway is her family dynamic - when visiting with her and her mother and father does she sit around on her butt like a pampered princess or does she take charge in the Kitchen with meals prep and keeping a tidy clean home? Obviously, the latter is wife material (if not a fetal alcohol syndrome psycho) versus the former pampered pain the ass princess type. If she is 21 or older and does not take care of you Cooking, Cleaning and in the bedroom ask yourself WTF why you are still seeing her.

Since the RU UA Conflict in the Donbass region of Eastern Ukraine and USA sanctions on Russia, in Russia I have noted a distinct drop in Russian Ladies looking at UK or USA men for marriage and a corresponding increase of UA women looking for marriage and willing to consider EU or USA, etc.

As my archetype female is Nordic Blonde/Blue Red/Green this is bad news for me as I like to scan StP every month or so. That said I am finding more of my archetype these days in UA.

All the best in your wife hunt...

[JWLZG]

OP — are you able to dedicate 6+ months to learning Russian intensively?

Your reach will expand exponentially among the 85% + of the FSU population who speak minimal to zero English

[jcrew247]

Have you thought about joining the Russian Orthodox church in your city and trying to pipeline or network through the church members?

[PixelFree]

(03-02-2019 08:39 AM)JWLZG Wrote:  

OP — are you able to dedicate 6+ months to learning Russian intensively?

Your reach will expand exponentially among the 85% + of the FSU population who speak minimal to zero English

Probably not... I'm old and lazy.

(03-02-2019 12:55 PM)jcrew247 Wrote:  

Have you thought about joining the Russian Orthodox church in your city and trying to pipeline or network through the church members?

Did go to our local Russian festival, wasn't much around.

[PixelFree]

Am going at the end of May. Was thinking of this itinerary:

- Kiev (I know some people in this city)
- Odessa
- St. Petersburg

Each about 9-10 days. Order is not important, will choose based on cheapest flights.

I figured 9-10 days is a decent amount of time to get a feel for the city and a reasonable chance to have some follow up dates. I know we'd have to stay for a month if we wanted a good chance at something more, but screw flying all that way to spend a month in one place. Can you train/day trip from the Ukraine major city to another to get another one in?

Purpose of the trip is 50/50 tourist/scoping trip for further visits.

Thoughts?

[LexisNexis]

A very important word to learn if you ever visit Russia or Ukraine is "skolko", use it when you open girls

[PixelFree]

"how much" ?

[luigi]

Which one would you choose, Poland or Ukraine?

[Obermarschall]

Try using duolingo before heading to your destination and as for Ukraine, due to the political situation, I would be cautious not confusing Ukrainian for Russian etc. Also you could consider leaving Ukraine and instead go to Poland, because nowadays you already have a lot of Ukrainians there, plus you can reach within 1 hour or less (by bus) 2nd or 3rd tier cities in Poland, which aren't that bad. Use the shopping malls and galleries to your advantage, as even 2nd or 3rd tier cities have a big mall. Use also the parks in Poland for daygaming.

[luigi]

Any alternative to renting airbnbs?

[Iconoclast007]

I am married to a beautiful, blue eyed blonde Estonian. I now live in Estonia. I think for Wife Material, Estonia is as good as it gets. Ive been to Ukraine and Russia. If i was going for lays id go to Ukraine or Russia. Wife hunting id go to Estonia and stay for 3 months and not in Tallinn. Viljandi, Tartu are good options.

[Rocha]

(03-25-2019 11:05 PM)Iconoclast007 Wrote:  

I am married to a beautiful, blue eyed blonde Estonian. I now live in Estonia. I think for Wife Material, Estonia is as good as it gets. Ive been to Ukraine and Russia. If i was going for lays id go to Ukraine or Russia. Wife hunting id go to Estonia and stay for 3 months and not in Tallinn. Viljandi, Tartu are good options.

Also agree that Estonians are top notch in terms of personalities, much more pleasant than any Slavs.

But Viljandi seems to have only 17k inhabitants, it is no more than a village. Why you refer it instead of Parnu or Varna for example, who though both also small, are relatively bigger (around 50k each)?

[Elmore]

Posted this on the Wife Hunting thread. Perhaps more pertinent here, given the subject matter. Be interested in any thoughts...



Long story short, wasted pretty much my entire 30s sleeping around, and chasing the player lifestyle. First half of my thirties (up to around 2013) was successful, had a lot of girls, but being a feckless idiot let many of them drift in chasing the player lifestyle. Second half of my thirties drifted into bad choices, at varying points depression, and ultimately failure and at points isolation. Now in recent couple of years got myself back on track, and at (a young) 42, feel i'm on my last go round to find a traditional and good woman to start a family and settle down with.

I'm in good physical condition from training boxing (my main hobby), looks wise am decent looking (i guess around a 7 fwiw), and am somewhat financially independent (i own outright a property in my home country, which is rented out and nets me around 1000USD pcm, also do a few bits and pieces online and teach english to supplement this). I am European, and do not want to go outside of European / Euro descended women. I am politically nationalistic, and value traditionalism. I am Christian. I have lived and worked in EE, and consider this the best region for me, and the kind of women i would like to attract.

In my experience as someone who moved East nearly a decade ago, is that the SMV of a westerner has fallen exponentially year on year in this region. Speaking with friends of mine (mostly Ukranian) they agree, that in Ukraine, a woman to be with a westerner is a low-status thing now, whereas a few years ago it was the opposite. They may string along foreigners in exchange for dates, attention, presents etc, but if they're any attractive or high value, they'll have a local boyfriend in the background. Now of course, you wouldnt want to attract those kind of girls as a future partner, but the point remains, that the legions of thirsty men who've travelled east having been sold a 'pussy paradise' by the last decades PUA industry, have pissed in the well out there.

I am in the process of looking at regions to live in, and give this 6 months. I dont believe you can attract any mate of value if you're passing through. You need to have some form of stability or work IMHO.

Currently I am thinking of:

Kiev - pros - standard of women, cheap cost of living. Negs - a prime example of a place jaded by Western thirsty males. Not a place i'd want to build a long term life.

South Balkans, specifically Macedonia / Serbia / Montenegro - I've never been, but being Slavic i am assuming the woman are attractive. Cheap living, beautiful country nature wise. Traditional cultures.

Spain - I speak Spanish, love the culture, and it is a great country and society to build a future. However it is not especially traditional these days, the Spanish in my exp are superficially friendly, but often not much beyond that. Being so sociable, all women of value have hosts of orbiters, or friends matchmaking for them.

I'm kicking around ideas at the moment, apologies if this post is unfocused. Given my criteria and situation, i'd be interested in any thoughts on it all...

[PixelFree]

Interesting thoughts on the pissing in the well comment.

I've been looking at flights and you can see the Russian-Ukrainian political tensions - no direct fights between the countries as far as I can tell. All go via Minsk (Belarus).

Am currently thinking of going to Ukraine and Poland now, simply to save on flights and also give us both a bit of a break in regards to language difficulties and Russia visa costs. We don't mind some language difficulties but a whole month might be too much.

So perhaps - Kiev, Odessa + Krakow over our month holiday (approx. 9 days each), with maybe a train day trips out to other smaller cities if possible.

FYI flights in June (summer) look to be around $2,400 AUD ($1,700 USD) return to Melbourne + one internal flight between the countries. Not cheap, but then again, not a very popular destination.