[Rocha]

(01-27-2016 06:40 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

(01-25-2016 01:30 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  

That's quite a story OP. I wonder how you would have gotten your stuff back if they didn't let you back in.

What language did you communicate with the boarder officials in? Did bribery cross your mind?

I communicated in English because they had a couple EU workers at the border, see: http://eubam.org/

You know it's funny, when the Ukrainian guard handed me back my passport for the first time I was very close to accidentally inserting some cash and asking him to check it again. I was happy I didn't though because the EU workers are there to specifically prevent such transactions from taking place.

Another update: One of my co-workers just got robbed pretty badly.
He was walking home last weekend and by his account: Met two beautiful women who, after a few minutes of small talk, propositioned him for a beer. He accepted assuming they were headed to a bar but when they ushered him back to their flat he became suspicious.

Being thirsty (to his admission) he proceeded anyway thinking there might be a couple guys waiting to jump him as soon as he walked through the door. But when they arrived and he was sure it was just the three of them alone at the flat (which turned out to be a crappy hotel room) he let his guard down and thought to let the good times roll. He said he got half way into his first beer when he became exhausted and passed out. He woke up two hours later, the room was empty as were his pockets. They got him for over 5k hryvnia, his cellphone, his watch, and his coat.

Careful out there fellas.

He was "thirsty" in every sense of the word.

[Blake2]

I think a lot of guys have unrealistic expectations. Why did he think 2 women were so interested in him, lol.

[Eddie Morra]

(01-27-2016 07:48 AM)Rocha Wrote:  

(01-27-2016 06:40 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

(01-25-2016 01:30 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  

That's quite a story OP. I wonder how you would have gotten your stuff back if they didn't let you back in.

What language did you communicate with the boarder officials in? Did bribery cross your mind?

I communicated in English because they had a couple EU workers at the border, see: http://eubam.org/

You know it's funny, when the Ukrainian guard handed me back my passport for the first time I was very close to accidentally inserting some cash and asking him to check it again. I was happy I didn't though because the EU workers are there to specifically prevent such transactions from taking place.

Another update: One of my co-workers just got robbed pretty badly.
He was walking home last weekend and by his account: Met two beautiful women who, after a few minutes of small talk, propositioned him for a beer. He accepted assuming they were headed to a bar but when they ushered him back to their flat he became suspicious.

Being thirsty (to his admission) he proceeded anyway thinking there might be a couple guys waiting to jump him as soon as he walked through the door. But when they arrived and he was sure it was just the three of them alone at the flat (which turned out to be a crappy hotel room) he let his guard down and thought to let the good times roll. He said he got half way into his first beer when he became exhausted and passed out. He woke up two hours later, the room was empty as were his pockets. They got him for over 5k hryvnia, his cellphone, his watch, and his coat.

Careful out there fellas.

He was "thirsty" in every sense of the word.

Why was he walking around with 5k=$200 more or less, in his pocket? Looks like the Player got played.....

[marinhogomes]

Well. You have to be aware of this stuff all the time, every where.

That's the reality of the game.

I'm from Brazil so I'm always suspicious of everyone, although after living in the US for a while, you let your guards down a tiny bit.

[Akula]

wow little suprised about the OP's recent bad experience but not shocked as I knew the border down there is pretty dicey (it was partially closed last Summer and one guy I knew had to drive way north to cross apparently).

For the record I've overstayed my 90-days on two occasions in the past year. First one the woman didn't even stop me or figure it out (was only like 5 days). 2nd time the guy sat there and counted it up, but was very professional about it and said I need to pay a fine - he first checked to make sure I had time to catch my flight. Got back here with no problems on the way back at the airport. It supposedly "re-sets" each time you pay.

I seriously don't think they are "cracking down" in any case & you just a bad experience due to a land border crossing. But man that sucks you had to experience that!

[samsamsam]

^^^^ What a jerk rubbing in the Fantasy Football Championship! Congrats.

Akula how big was the fine?

[Akula]

(01-29-2016 10:16 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  

^^^^ What a jerk rubbing in the Fantasy Football Championship! Congrats.

Akula how big was the fine?

heh, thanks man

Think it was around 850 Hryvnia if I recall correctly. They basically tell you that you've overstayed your 90 days, need to pay a fine, etc. then another guy comes to you (nice guy who was very helpful actually) and you have to go to a bank to pay your fine, and then return with the receipt.

Unfortunately you need to exit the passport control area so you have to go though security again Lot less troublesome than getting stopped at the border though!

[Slay it Forward]

Last summer I over-stayed in Ukraine by 2 months. I left from the Kiev airport. It took about 45 min to process the fine and cost me around $45 USD.

I've heard that if you over-stay repeatedly there can be more serious reprecussions but I've never talked to someone firsthand whose experienced said repercussions.

[Barron]

Mafia (party game)
I'd never heard of this game before moving to Kiev. My students introduced me to it and playing this game with Ukrainians has been an eye-opening experience. Only a game like this could have come out of the USSR, and I'm shocked to have never heard or played it before now.

Mafia is incredibly simple to play:
Cut up some pieces of paper and write down the roles on each (best played with 8+ people). Throw them in a hat and have players blindly draw without revealing their roles.

There are two teams: Mafia and Citizens.
The citizens never know who is mafia and who is a citizen because they make up the majority of the players. In a group of ten people, one would be the judge (role that directs the game), two players would be mobsters, and the rest citizens.

The game has two alternating phases: night, during which the mafia may covertly "murder" a citizen, and day, in which surviving players debate the identities of the mafiosi and vote to eliminate a suspect. Play continues until all of the mafia have been eliminated or until the mafia outnumbers the citizens.

At night, The judge directs all players to shut their eyes (city goes to sleep). When this is done the mafia may awaken and signal to each other whom they wish to kill. When the judge confirms (usually with a nod or a point of the hand) the mafia players close their eyes. The judge then tells all players to wake up and informs everyone who was killed during the night.

Overall, Mafia is an excellent perspective on lying, on deceit, on group think mentality, and how to use it for personal gain. I play as the judge most of the time so that my students get maximum English practice. Watching all these different forms of lying and manipulation happen live is remarkably foreign to me. The way the mobsters deceive the other players and are happy to go along with the momentum of group thought is impressive. The way women will act and vote on emotion as well as instinctively following the advice of more dominant men in the class has also given me some good chuckles.

Best game I've played in years

[Barron]

This girl is completely misleading men about "meeting their future wives" in Kiev. I thought she was going to recommend parks or cafe's, instead she just goes over a list of night clubs. One need only scan over the comments to see the thirst in her subs.

Retitle: Where To Meet Pro's and Fight Turks In Kiev

My roommate claims he fucked a girl in the bathroom stall at Caribbean Club a couple weeks back.
... so its got that going for it

[Nasty_Joe]

Your roommate probably did, I saw turkish guys doing it too, there. Only thing they first negotiated a price, I saw one doing 5 with his hand and then accompanying the lady downstairs, not sure were 500 or 5000 hrv, or dollars, or whatever.

[BangBoy123]

Quote:

Retitle: Where To Meet Pro's and Fight Turks In Kiev

Yes i'm glad she didn't give any of the good places away.

Based on how she looks in this videos then I would bang her, but on other videos probably not

[samsamsam]

Maybe she was paid by the clubs to mention them? Gotta be careful the slick/evil ones are always capable of more calculated thinking than a decent person.

I don't know her channel or what her purpose is. But it seems odd to have some girl say come here and pick up our women and these are the best spots. I could see if you became friends with some Ukrainians and they genuinely liked you, they would help you out.

[Barron]

It's a holiday weekend here in Ukraine. Women's Day is on Tuesday the 8th and most people have Monday and Tuesday off. I didn't realize what a big deal it was here, lots of guys were talking about congratulating each other while buying tons of flowers and chocolates to give away and my first impression was that of thinking "beta suckers" but I see now that my western sensibilities (mainly influenced by the joke that is valentines day) lead me astray.

Both Friday and Saturday night have seen tons of people happy in the streets in good spirits. The guys and girls are drinking, singing, and dancing. The men are far more hyped about it than the women, and now I know why. When your country is filled with beautiful feminine women, why not celebrate them?

Couples are happy to be out and about and groups of single ladies have nothing but gratitude and appreciation for random guys coming up to them, singing to them and handing them a flower before strolling off. The entire atmosphere has been completely absent any sort of entitlement, bitterness, or narcissism of any kind.

As I stated in one of the other Ukraine threads, Ukrainian men are acutely aware of the beauty of their women and this is their opportunity to celebrate it openly, and they really do. I was expecting this weekend to reek of women trying to gouge men for some kind of shopping holiday or expensive dinners, instead I was met with an amazing surprise in that the men are enjoying it the most and the women are just happy to be around so many men in good spirits.

Best holiday ever.

[peterfoo22]

Hey Nomad,

What kind of visa did you apply for? Can you explain the process here on the forum.

I am looking at stayin in Kiev for a long term stay and wanted to the process of getting a visa.

Best

Peter

[Barron]

My visa is known as a TRP or Temporary Resident Permit.
Specifically, I believe it's a D-visa or religious visa. My work sponsored me for this (no money required on their part, just documents).

$200 for the visa + 900 grn for the below:
-Passport translated & notarized
-Ukrainian health insurance
-6 passport sized photos

My work supplied documents from the minister of immigration verifying that I was a "religious volunteer" as well as validating my place of residence, transportation, food, etc., all supplied through my "religious organization".

To start the process I had to leave Ukraine and apply at a Ukrainian consulate outside of the country (see my adventure to Moldova write-up for more information). Once the Ukrainian authorities in Chisinau verified all my documents they gave me a single entry visa in my passport that I take to the immigration office (OVIR) upon my arrival back in Ukraine. OVIR processed my visa and in one week I was given my very own temporary resident permit that I can renew within Ukraine as long as I work for my employer.

The final step was registering the TRP with my landlord. This was a pain in the ass as the office of immigration registry is in Brovary, a satellite town on the outskirts of Kiev. The office was packed and it took six hours of going back and fourth between offices, waiting in lines, waiting for bureaucrats to go on their breaks/lunch hours and come back, etc. But when all was said and done everything was approved and I'm happy to be living here legally and can now enter and exit Ukraine as often as I choose.

Was it a headache? Yes.
Was it worth it? Yes, because I plan to stay here long term.

If you're only going to be here for a few months or less than a year I wouldn't do it. Just overstay your tourist visa and depart the country via Boryspol. You can easily pay the fine (850 grn) at the window in the airport and they won't give you any trouble.

[peterfoo22]

Okay thanks NOeu!

Yeah I didn't realize that you were going through your work.

I guess I will just pay the fine or I will leave before the 90 days and hopefully over time I will be able to find something more permanent.

P

[Barron]

Update: I'm on my first official tear.

I don't see the point in posting numbers of notches and their rating (neither can ever be confirmed) but I can say that Ukraine has proven to absolutely be a worthy time investment.

It took ten months but the dividends are finally coming around. Establishing a large enough social circle has not been easy due to my being an introvert. I'm sure there are lots of guys who have more experience and could have done it in less time than it has taken me. Ukrainians are not trusting people but the friendships I've made here couldn't have been made back home. Ukrainian men don't do much approaching, but when I've met cool guys on the street and when they watch me daygame it has scored me a lot of respect with locals that I now consider good friends.

Shoes are a big fucking deal here.
I don't know why but it's a huge psychological trigger for Ukrainian women to be innately more receptive to a well dressed man sporting stylin kicks.
You'll be walking, you'll see her coming your way, you both make eye contact, she breaks first to look down at your shoes, if her brain subconsciously approves she'll look back up and make eye contact again, if not her eyes will trail off and you might as well be invisible to her.
Fashion Lesson: if you're on a limited budget and you want to invest in your wardrobe for Ukraine, invest in a sleek pair of shoes.

The benefits of social circle validation are great however the more easy access I have to girls the less interesting they are due to lack of chase. Kiev and daygame go together like bread and butter and every time I overcome anxiety and approach a stunningly beautiful girl in the street I feel like a better man.

[Barron]

On EE Corruption:
In Ukraine, corruption can be defined as Theft - Ukrainians stealing from Ukrainians.

As the presidential elections edge closer, I'm hearing more and more rumors and stories about acts of corruption committed by the leading candidates. I've also heard some pretty crazy stories from locals about corruption in business. What makes it crazy to me are the contrasting tones with which the tales of corruption are told. In a business context, corruption is spoken about like two men discussing sports. In a political context, corruption is met with condemnation like two men discussing pedophilia.

The past week in particular motivated me to update this thread. I'd met with a longtime acquaintance from Switzerland about some IT business. He was telling me stories that his interpreters relate about working with high-profile Russian and Ukrainian business men in the gas and technology industries. One of them was interpreting a negotiation with a Chinese manufacturer for distribution in a number of Russian regions when the three Russian businessmen discussed amongst themselves how they expected the deal to afford them houses in Sochi, building hotels in Crimea, yachts, etc. All in all, they expected the Chinese manufacturer to agree to pay them around $250 million in cash for the distribution channels they were offering.

I heard another story about a Ukrainian who achieved some success with opening coffee stands and expanding them to city corners throughout Kiev. Only to wake up one morning and discover that every one of his stands had been bulldozed overnight and was being replaced with an "official" corporate-owned coffee kiosk business.

All you guys who walk up and down Khreschatyk and give hryvnia to the poor beggars on the sidewalks are just filling the pockets of the mobsters that run that street.

Mark my words:
Every performer, beggar, person dressed as Disney character or dude holding a monkey/fancy looking pigeon for pictures is allowed to be there as half their take goes to the boss.

Just this morning I'm walking to lunch and there's a homeless guy with a cup in front of him. There couldn't have been more than 20 hryvnia in that cup (about 75 cents) when two dudes in pleather jackets walk up, pick up the cup, pocket most of what's in it, put it down and keep walking. Not a peep from the homeless guy.

A long standing cultural tradition here is to divorce what a man does in his "professional life" from what he does in his personal life.
You see, the terms "business" and "professional" are used as instruments of mitigation and alleviation. And for the most part it works, as long as you're not involved in politics, but even then it still works.

A business man here can be extremely kind and generous in his personal life: with family, friends and acquaintances. But then go on to carryout crimes of mass theft and brutal violence in a professional context. As long as no one is killed, his actions in his professional life are all but overlooked.
Politicians endure more heat from the public because they're known for killing not just other corrupt men but for making random whistle blowers suddenly disappear.

Anyways, just thought I'd share this with you guys
Good luck with your approaches in 2019, Ukraine is still daygame paradise!

[Constitution45]

@nomad, how old are you if you don’t mind me asking and what do you do in terms of career or business ?

[Barron]

Mid 30s, work IT - digital marketing

[sterling_archer]

Nomad, your post was very interesting to read. Since I see on your profile that you have visited Russia, would you say that same things can be said about Russia or there is a difference? I am talking about this rampant mafia infiltration into everyday life.

[Barron]

A big difference between Russian and Ukrainian corruption is that in Russia, all the power ultimately filters up to Putin - the sole Russian Oligarch.

In Ukraine there are still many Oligarchs, in higher and lower positions of power - Ahkmedov & Kolomoiskiy (higher), Poroshenko, Tymoshenko, Yanukovich etc. (lower). In Russia, corruption is more organized at higher and lower levels as every politician and most businessmen are directly connected to Putin.

In Ukraine, political and business corruption is carried out by Oligarchs of varying degrees operating independently. My best guess is that because power has not been consolidated by any one person in Ukraine, corruption is less organized and therefore more rampant at lower levels than in Russia (at least for the big cities).