Clearly the name Nomad is overused so I thought I might go for a re-brand with NO-EU because I hope to god Ukraine and other eastern European countries sever all ties with, or forget about joining, the European Union all together.

Recently I have observed a good amount of conflicting information in the Ukraine Thread despite their being a plethora of information lining its pages from experienced men. We're still getting hit with guys that have no interest in doing the work and persist in asking the same questions and theorizing about the same tired topics on marriage and relationships with women they've only seen pictures & youtube videos of.

I'm not here to tell men "how things are" I simply want to share my experience as an American from California that permanently relocated to Kiev. I spent nearly two years changing my life so that I could follow the vision I had to live away from western culture, in a place where the women met my ideal and society agreed with my traditional outlook on life.

Some of my posts about the mentality of the girls here. What they respond to and how they react to foreigners:
thread-37535...pid1178104
thread-37535...pid1168819


Update hot girl - thread-37535...pid1177582 :
She's come over to my place twice and still refuses to fuck. Yesterday she came over in the morning, gave me a handjob before spending two hours cooking me crape style pancakes and then gave me another handjob before leaving. She's been my biggest challenge and the tests continue to come. I made her late for class with the second handjob and then joked that she should have stroked faster. Today she decided to take that joke and emotionalize it into me making a disgusting remark that is in bad character. Whoop dee do, this is Ukraine. If she doesn't like it, good luck finding another guy at my level.

It's become easier taking a hard line with beautiful girls. As soon as they say or do something trips my happiness alarm, the sirens sound and I make it clear that I'm more than willing to walk. I never get angry and I'm getting better at being wired for rejection because I know that I only ever need to walk outside to find new girls worth approaching. I had to explain to her that the constant attempts to friend zone me were getting boring and that she adds nothing to my life as a friend, only takes away from it. I even said goodbye to her and believed I'd never see her again. Well I guess she felt the pressure of losing something valuable and this gave her the epiphany to come down from her ivory tower. It sucks but its necessary, the hotter they are the harder I have to be and most importantly - be absolutely willing to walk.

If anyone has ever watched Rick and Morty I would compare what Ukraine is giving me almost to how Rick feels about life: There are infinite dimensions and places he can go (the universe is his oyster) because of what he has achieved, thus he has developed a true abundance mentality with everything and is almost sociopathic as a result.

My life in Ukraine could be thought of as training to become stronger than the body. One thing I had to do for myself was take women off the pedestal and I'm getting there, slowly but surely.

Quote: (01-20-2016 07:06 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

We're still getting hit with guys that have no interest in doing the work and persist in asking the same questions

Yes, everyone is looking for some magic bullet to make life easy. I myself have been guilty of it.

The truth is pretty simple. There is A) Daygame, B) Nightgame, C) Social Cirlcle game, and D) Online game. You do one or all of these and repeat until you succeed.

I've realized the only thing you can do is to vary your approach until you find a method that works. For example, change your online opener, game at a different place/day/time, try new conversation topics, find new social circles, etc.

There's no magic to it.

I'm interested to knowing more about your experience.

Planning on visiting Ukraine in the next few months. Going to europe in April.

Still confused which is the best city to be at Lviv, Kiev, Odessa or Kharkiv.

From what I've seen Lviv seems are more open to talking, but that doesn't mean more sex results.

Kiev girls are hotter.

As Ukraine is a very conservative country, I know everywhere is not so easy. Interested in knowing more about how much can I go with just english (I'm trying to study Russian)

@NoEU (heh) - What's the end goal? Does traditional outlook on life = marriage + kids? Or is it more about happiness for now?

@marinhogomes - Here, let me use the search function for you: go to Kiev, where the English is highest. You'll still be playing "find the English speaker" though.

Quote: (01-20-2016 02:16 PM)262 Wrote:  

@NoEU (heh) - What's the end goal? Does traditional outlook on life = marriage + kids? Or is it more about happiness for now?

@marinhogomes - Here, let me use the search function for you: go to Kiev, where the English is highest. You'll still be playing "find the English speaker" though.

The end goal is always happiness, but I'm still transitioning from scarcity to abundance mentality, and all the implications that go along with that. Where I'll end up I honestly don't know.

Before coming to Ukraine I would have never thought to pursue a business idea, but being here has cleared my head (no more depression and far less anger) and alleviated my anxiety concerning my future with women so that I can focus on other things.

This may sound pathetic but for the first time in my life I've begun to define my happiness irrespective of women.

Good for you NomadofEU

There was a Cali dude I saw today that was getting attention from the females. Was that you? haha
I think I might start telling people I'm from Cali too....

Quote: (01-20-2016 03:48 PM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

Quote: (01-20-2016 02:16 PM)262 Wrote:  

@NoEU (heh) - What's the end goal? Does traditional outlook on life = marriage + kids? Or is it more about happiness for now?

@marinhogomes - Here, let me use the search function for you: go to Kiev, where the English is highest. You'll still be playing "find the English speaker" though.

The end goal is always happiness, but I'm still transitioning from scarcity to abundance mentality, and all the implications that go along with that. Where I'll end up I honestly don't know.

Before coming to Ukraine I would have never thought to pursue a business idea, but being here has cleared my head (no more depression and far less anger) and alleviated my anxiety concerning my future with women so that I can focus on other things.

This may sound pathetic but for the first time in my life I've begun to define my happiness irrespective of women.

You don't sound pathetic at all, you're absolutely spot on about this. The main reason why having abundance mentality (call it game, approaching or whatever) allows you to grow in other areas of your life is because of Maslow's hierarchy of needs. Now that you know that you can date women of your liking, you basically have one less thing to worry about. With that peace of mind you can pursue other things like starting a business as you've mentioned. For this very reason I'm always skeptical of guys that insist on staying in the west for ever, based only on better career prospects eventhough they clearly hate it there.

Quote: (01-20-2016 02:16 PM)262 Wrote:  

@NoEU (heh) - What's the end goal? Does traditional outlook on life = marriage + kids? Or is it more about happiness for now?

@marinhogomes - Here, let me use the search function for you: go to Kiev, where the English is highest. You'll still be playing "find the English speaker" though.

hahaha. Thanks.

I actually read many threads about it. Some people say Lviv has the highest percentage of english speakers, others say Kiev. So the threads get very complicated.

But it seems that is tough being there without knowing basic Ukranian or Russian. So I'll be studying it.

NoEU's what do you like about Ukraine (besides the chicks)?

Patriarchal Society - traditional and conservative
Zero Cultural Marxism - no political correctness, no feminism, no progressive (degenerate) ideology of any kind
Easy to live and work as a native English speaker - dollar goes miles here
Easy to make friends - can speak openly about women, sex, politics, religion, etc.
No car needed - top notch public transportation
Much safer than the US - I can walk home at 2am and don't ever have to look over my shoulder

I'm sure there's more

Nomad, you're in Kiev, right? What's your rent, apartment and general costs looking like. Could you get by on $1000 pcm out there? By that i mean cover all your costs, live semi frugally, cook at home but go out regularly and not have to think too much about money (within reason).

I'm thinking of studying in Ukraine. Getting a Masters in something, not that I need it. I have my own business. It's more for the experience of being there.

So I'm interested in what you have to say about your experience so far (I read what you said in other threads so far)

Yes $1,000 is more than enough to live on in Kiev, especially if you sign a long term lease on an apartment. I eat out way more than I should, if you're able to cook most meals at home you will save even more.

The #1 way to blow through money is to go out at night. Drinks are overpriced and cab drivers will fuck you over any chance they get. I'm always with Ukrainians whenever I'm out late. This cuts the cab fares in half and they always know local spots where pros are scarce and drink prices are fair.

Building a social circle is crucial for enjoying a long-term stay here. Luckily Ukrainians are warm and welcoming of westerners and I've had good experiences meeting locals who invite me into their group and introduce me to their friends when we go out.

Quote: (01-21-2016 04:17 PM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

Patriarchal Society - traditional and conservative
Zero Cultural Marxism - no political correctness, no feminism, no progressive (degenerate) ideology of any kind
Easy to live and work as a native English speaker - dollar goes miles here
Easy to make friends - can speak openly about women, sex, politics, religion, etc.
No car needed - top notch public transportation
Much safer than the US - I can walk home at 2am and don't ever have to look over my shoulder

I'm sure there's more

I would agree with all apart from the making friends part. I don't think making friends with Ukrainians is easy, it all depends on your lifestyle I suppose - if you are working as an English teacher for example I would imagine it's easier.

I find that Ukrainian men are inquisitive about you being a foreigner when they first meet you, but they rarely try and make a solid friendship with you.

If you are in a nightlife situation, Ukrainian guys will often be chummy with you to gain approval from girls they are with.

Other times, they want to practise English or find out more about your work. Recently I had a guy contact me on Facebook asking me to help him with an English translation, I haven't spoke to the guy in 2 years +, what a nerve, I said no and deleted him

If Ukrainian guys offer to buy me a drink, I refuse - quite often you will be presented with the bill afterwards.

There is also the issue of jealousy, most Ukrainian guys don't have the spending power than Westerners do. Hence they know that being friends with you is going to be costly, expensive pubs, nightclubs etc. They would much rather spend 300 Grivnas on trying to get laid instead

Quote: (01-22-2016 01:53 PM)BangBoy123 Wrote:  

Quote: (01-21-2016 04:17 PM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

Patriarchal Society - traditional and conservative
Zero Cultural Marxism - no political correctness, no feminism, no progressive (degenerate) ideology of any kind
Easy to live and work as a native English speaker - dollar goes miles here
Easy to make friends - can speak openly about women, sex, politics, religion, etc.
No car needed - top notch public transportation
Much safer than the US - I can walk home at 2am and don't ever have to look over my shoulder

I'm sure there's more

I would agree with all apart from the making friends part. I don't think making friends with Ukrainians is easy, it all depends on your lifestyle I suppose - if you are working as an English teacher for example I would imagine it's easier.

I find that Ukrainian men are inquisitive about you being a foreigner when they first meet you, but they rarely try and make a solid friendship with you.

If you are in a nightlife situation, Ukrainian guys will often be chummy with you to gain approval from girls they are with.

Other times, they want to practise English or find out more about your work. Recently I had a guy contact me on Facebook asking me to help him with an English translation, I haven't spoke to the guy in 2 years +, what a nerve, I said no and deleted him

If Ukrainian guys offer to buy me a drink, I refuse - quite often you will be presented with the bill afterwards.

There is also the issue of jealousy, most Ukrainian guys don't have the spending power than Westerners do. Hence they know that being friends with you is going to be costly, expensive pubs, nightclubs etc. They would much rather spend 300 Grivnas on trying to get laid instead

Agreed that its not that easy to make friends here, especially social and cool guys.
I strongly recommend meeting them away from foreigner heavy groups.
If the basis of your friendship is your foreigness or English skills then its not going to be a balanced or long lasting relationship. It may be obvious, but common interest groups are the way to go.
On the positive side, friendships here can be deep and longlasting once formed.

Kiev is a big place and there are always some events going on: http://kiev.vgorode.ua/afisha/

Quote: (01-22-2016 09:29 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

Building a social circle is crucial for enjoying a long-term stay here. Luckily Ukrainians are warm and welcoming of westerners and I've had good experiences meeting locals who invite me into their group and introduce me to their friends when we go out.

My guess is you met most of these Ukrainians through work? If not, how did you meet them? While Gaming?

It was you, NomadofEU, who mentioned indirect daygaming in a while back----very true. I went really indirect and had a great chat. I even pulled a move from the Roosh books and asked her to watch my stuff for a second while I got a lid. Then I just chilled for a few mintues before I started a convo. Turns out she's 9 years younger than me so I think the age difference is too big, but hey, I'll text her and see how it goes. Still had a good conversation, no matter what.

Gaming in a sit down place works much better than mobile situations such as shops or transit. Summer and fall were nice when they had more festivals and expos going on. That afisha website (http://kiev.vgorode.ua/afisha/) lists a an Alternative medicine tradeshow happening next week..might be good for some day game.

Quote:Quote:

Building a social circle is crucial for enjoying a long-term stay here. Luckily Ukrainians are warm and welcoming of westerners and I've had good experiences meeting locals who invite me into their group and introduce me to their friends when we go out.

Most foreigners I know in Ukraine have social circle with other Foreigners and girls, I don't think it's important to befriend the local guys personally, I have one or two local guy friends though

I never heard anyone describe Ukrainians as warm!, polite would be most accurate

Quote:Quote:

Turns out she's 9 years younger than me so I think the age difference is too big

Blake, i'm guessing you are pretty young yourself? the words "she's too young for me" are seldom uttered in Ukraine by foreigners Most girls would not even bat an eyelid if you told them you are ten years older than them

Yes, when I get asked my age, I state it and move on no matter the response.

Volume is the key.

She was a high achiever/school obsessed type so she might be an exception.
There's plenty of hard working, traditional, working class girls out there to meet.

I'd like to share a couple stories with you guys. Neither are game or female related.

Last weekend I went to Ocean Plaza with an American buddy. We shopped around for a while and then eyed a cafe with lots of pretty girls. When he went to order his drink from the barrister he got a typical Ukrainian reaction from someone who doesn't speak any English. The reaction was one of frustration and embarrassment manifesting as a desire for us to leave.

I've been here long enough to realize what this was. I tried to explain to him that the barrister didn't actually want us to leave, he just felt inferior and embarrassed that he couldn't communicate with us. And the common reaction that some Ukrainians have when they encounter westerners and can't speak English is to shy away from further interaction. But my friend couldn't understand this.

"Why do they feel embarrassed?" he asked. "I can't speak Russian, but I will still try. Just because I make mistakes doesn't mean I feel embarrassed about it."
"They feel embarrassed because they feel inferior" I told him.
"Why should they feel inferior because they don't know English?"
"Because they come from a poor country and they see English speakers as people that come from a better place."
"That doesn't make sense. The French don't react this way, neither do Mexicans."

I didn't feel like arguing so I talk about something else:

A few weeks ago during one of my business classes I was on the topic of job interviews. In these classes I want my students to speak as much English as possible and because of that days' topic we were also practicing more polite and professional English. One of the questions I wanted them to answer was one of the most common questions an employer might ask a prospective employee, the all important, "Why should I hire you?"

I got a few different answers from some students until I came to the last student who works in finance, his answer was to respond with the question, "Do you like foreign currency?" All the students laughed but I didn't get it. Looking confused I decided to move on.

However I kept thinking about why that was such a clever response and why it didn't register the same way for me as it did to my students. I finally remembered that I come from a country whose currency is the standard for the rest of the world. Currently, one US dollar is worth more than twenty five Ukrainian hryvnia. The joke was that his response to the question, "Why should I hire you?" essentially was him saying, "Because I'll make you rich."

After relaying this story to my friend at the cafe, he began to get a different perspective.


I'll switch gears now and tell you about my recent trip to Moldova.
I arrived in Ukraine back in August on a tourist visa which gives me ninety days to stay in Ukraine. Everyone had told me that this rule is loosely enforced when applied to Americans so when I stayed past my ninety days I wasn't too worried about it ("just pay the 850 hrn fine and it's no problem"x10). I had been meaning to apply for my temporary residence permit which would allow me to stay here legally for one year. To begin this process I must go to a Ukrainian consulate outside Ukraine. A friend of mine had done this a couple months earlier by going to Moldova and because Moldova is the closest and least expensive option it seemed logical that I should do the same.

I decided to take a bus from Kiev to Chisinau, however the bus was delayed because the road was too icy and we ended up sliding to a halt on the shoulder on the way there. We had to wait a couple hours for trucks to arrive, salt the road, and pull the bus back onto the tarmac. When we finally arrived at the Ukraine/Moldova border the bus driver collected the passports and gave them to the customs officer.

After waiting nearly an hour in a bus which was as hot as a sauna I finally hear some angry yelling, "American!" "American you come out here now!" Everyone on the bus looked shocked when I got up to go outside. The customs officer told me that I had to get my bags and get off the bus.

After sitting me down in an empty room without heat and sending my bus to Chisinau without me they asked why I overstayed my visa and told me (in broken English) that I had committed a major violation of their law. They said that because I overstayed the ninety days of my tourist visa I was not allowed back into Ukraine for six months. When another bus finally arrived (3 hours later) they gave me back my passport and sent me on my way to a country I had never been to with only a single bag of my belongings which I had packed to last me two days at most. Everything else was back at my apartment in Kiev.

Luckily I had brought all the necessary documents for my temporary resident permit. I went to the Ukrainian consulate the next day and they approved my visa within twenty minutes. I decided to take a train back to Kiev in order to avoid the officials I originally encountered when I traveled by bus, but it did not matter. As soon as we reached the border to Ukraine the customs officials saw my passport with the dates when I had first arrived and departed from Ukraine. Again they told me I could not enter Ukraine so I showed them the visa in my passport which seemed to frustrate them. Technically I had to stay out of Ukraine for six months as a tourist, however I was not re-entering the country as a tourist but as a temporary resident. They held up the entire train of two hundred plus people for an extra thirty minutes while they argued with each other until begrudgingly stamping my passport and allowing me entry.

It was three of the most stressful days of my life and I spent them in an extremely poor but surprisingly charming country. If you're interested in visiting Moldova I can only recommend Chisinau. It's small, it's poor, but I did glimpse a few beauties walking around the center. I also made a good local friend while I stayed there and he showed me a few landmarks and told me all about Moldovan history and their beef with Romania.

Another interesting fact: Moldovan is not actually a language. It's simply a mix of Russian and Romanian to form their native tongue.

Interesting report on the Moldova crossing. That region of Ukraine is well known for corruption and difficult officials.
Did you happen to get to Transnistria? Fascinating place....but to visit only of course.

^^Nomad, nice report on the border run, and cultural observations.
Just a small correction on your last sentence. Moldovan language has no mixture whatsoever with Russian, it is simply Romanian language written with Cyrillic alphabet.

Quote: (01-25-2016 06:13 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

Another interesting fact: Moldovan is not actually a language. It's simply a mix of Russian and Romanian to form their native tongue.

Nomad you were wise to get the residency permit, I hear stories of a tightening up of the borders.

Quote:Quote:

Everyone had told me that this rule is loosely enforced when applied to Americans so when I stayed past my ninety days I wasn't too worried about it

Being American doesn't make you any exception!

That's quite a story OP. I wonder how you would have gotten your stuff back if they didn't let you back in.

What language did you communicate with the boarder officials in? Did bribery cross your mind?

Quote: (01-25-2016 06:13 AM)NomadofEU Wrote:  

"Why do they feel embarrassed?" he asked. "I can't speak Russian, but I will still try. Just because I make mistakes doesn't mean I feel embarrassed about it."
"They feel embarrassed because they feel inferior" I told him.
"Why should they feel inferior because they don't know English?"
"Because they come from a poor country and they see English speakers as people that come from a better place."
"That doesn't make sense. The French don't react this way, neither do Mexicans."

Great post and I was having coffee with a mate this morning who just returned from France. He pretty much said the same thing, they hate Americans but they respect Americans. I would say Mexico would be the same.

Quote: (01-25-2016 01:30 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  

That's quite a story OP. I wonder how you would have gotten your stuff back if they didn't let you back in.

What language did you communicate with the boarder officials in? Did bribery cross your mind?

I communicated in English because they had a couple EU workers at the border, see: http://eubam.org/

You know it's funny, when the Ukrainian guard handed me back my passport for the first time I was very close to accidentally inserting some cash and asking him to check it again. I was happy I didn't though because the EU workers are there to specifically prevent such transactions from taking place.

Another update: One of my co-workers just got robbed pretty badly.
He was walking home last weekend and by his account: Met two beautiful women who, after a few minutes of small talk, propositioned him for a beer. He accepted assuming they were headed to a bar but when they ushered him back to their flat he became suspicious.

Being thirsty (to his admission) he proceeded anyway thinking there might be a couple guys waiting to jump him as soon as he walked through the door. But when they arrived and he was sure it was just the three of them alone at the flat (which turned out to be a crappy hotel room) he let his guard down and thought to let the good times roll. He said he got half way into his first beer when he became exhausted and passed out. He woke up two hours later, the room was empty as were his pockets. They got him for over 5k hryvnia, his cellphone, his watch, and his coat.

Careful out there fellas.