[Ski pro]

Saw an online ad today for the Audi e-tron. I couldn’t find any performance stats but no doubt it will easily match the range of the Tesla and it’s a million times better looking inside plus has the right badge.

No doubt the bmw and Mercedes versions will be here soon.

Tesla is fucked. Sell your stock if you’ve still got any.

[Deepdiver]

There is an old cliche in the markets often based on ancient wisdom and experience...

Bad news is like Vermin - where there is one Rat, Cockroach or Bubonic Plague Flea there is a lot more hidden where they can not readily be seen but doing their damage none the less...

TESLA Just went Bubonic... this flashed across my morning Markets news tickers...

Tesla shares slide 5.6% premarket after news chief accounting officer Dave Morton has quit after a month

Tesla Inc.'s (tsla) Chief Accounting Officer Dave Morton resigned on Sept. 4, roughly a month after he joined the company, according to a regulatory filing published Friday. "Since I joined Tesla on August 6th, the level of public attention placed on the company, as well as the pace within the company, have exceeded my expectations," Morton said in the filing.

I would make a wisecrack that it is the Rats who leave a sinking ship first only to be scarfed up by sharks...

In this case Dave Morton like all new C level officers especially a CFO/CAO (Begs the Question where is their CFO and what are they Up To???) with SEC personal liability to disclose a Publicly listed Corporations material facts affecting financial performance and operating status quarterly or face possible prosecution and major personal fines was likely very highly motivated to do a great job with a storied tech company - but - realized that he was working for a Drug-Addled (Prescription and or Otherwise) and now unstable erratic perhaps psychotic CEO and had just marched right into a colony of sewer rats, surrounded by cockroaches and covered in bubonic fleas with people dropping dead from Ebola... figuratively speaking.

In other words when a qualified and reputable CFO takes a position with a Tech company they hope to grow with it over the years and prosper like any of the major Seattle or Silicon Valley Tech Giants... However to leave in only one month on the job indicates that conditions were so adverse financially he does not want to be personally liable for Tesla's financials and possibly prosecuted by the SEC, FBI, DEA for whatever financial and other fraudulent crimes and or narcotics use he may have witnessed... Horrific news for Tesla employees, suppliers and long investors - YUUUUGE News for the shorts.

I stand by my analysis.

[MrLemon]

(09-07-2018 09:20 AM)Deepdiver Wrote:  

...just marched right into a colony of sewer rats, surrounded by cockroaches and covered in bubonic fleas with people dropping dead from Ebola...

How lovely. I was trying to eat breakfast.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

I was working directly for 2 founders who ramped up their businesses to over 100 mio. $ net worth each. One later tanked the business and the other lost millions on strange ego projects, but turned it around.

Both were good founders, good businessmen, but not the best managers. They also picked the wrong people for the job unable to understand that a good former salesman and personal bootlicker may not be the best choice for the job. The marketing manager and me sometimes spoke to one candidly that he would have to change too due to the growth of the company. He nodded, but continued along his ways.

The one whose company went belly-up simply hired best former friends, competent salesmen and people who told him stories of grandeur and a wonderful glorious future. I told him to stop all of that and return to the core strengths of the company - maybe focus more on other aspects again that had more lasting stable growth potential. He did not listen - he wanted to see all those new shiny big retail outlets be up and running with his name plastered on the top.

Entrepreneurs/founders really have to be aware of their strengths and their weaknesses. And they have to listen to honest advice of people who have a different skill-set. Founders are often doers who don't think much, but act. This is a wonderful thing when staring a company. Later they need to be more strategic thinkers who act on a well-calculated plan and who can think several steps ahead. Thus they most often need someone to help them along in that respect.

Elon Musk is a highly intelligent doer. They should have known that they had a limited window of opportunity and when Mercedes and Audi hit with their electric luxury models, then things are going to get tough. Obviously I have no idea what strategy would have worked for Tesla, but something tells me that this guy is not the most reasonable man around - he likely ran through a ton of engineers in his time - and likely managers as well.

[Truth Tiger]

I'll comment briefly as an entrepreneur / founder who has had to understand his limitations and who also sought to create products / services for Tesla vehicles. My company paid to promote at one of their events some years ago. A person came to our booth, identified himself as a Tesla design engineer, said 'they needed to attract companies who were doing what we were.' Naturally, we were pleased and excited. He said he could offer assistance, resources, etc. to help us in our design pursuits. Card offered and received, 'just email me after the event.'

We did so, but our experience ran opposite from what we were promised. We were stonewalled. 'Oh, contact this engineer and ask for the info.' We did, and they referred us back to the first guy. 'Oh, well it turns out we can't share this info - it's proprietary.' This was information that would help us develop products to better-serve your customer base. This was information other vendors freely provided to companies similar to ours to aid in product development.

At the time, we couldn't reconcile the appearance of willingness, all the excitement of 'performance and sustainability', i.e. the intentional Tesla hype, with the actuality of the inertia and push-back. It did not compute at all.

Having observed Musk over the years and tying the Tesla story in with our direct experience, it makes more sense now. It's like there's a sense of 'we've got an amazing idea that leads the industry, so no matter how many deadlines we blow, or how many cars catch on fire, or how disappointed our customers are with service, and the thousand little details, the CONCEPT is so good you just need to grin and bear it. You're on the frontline (so we say) of a revolution (nevermind that GM did this decades ago). So shut up, stop complaining, and just give us your damn money. You'll get your car when we say you will. Oh, and we really care about our customers!'

Their hype is a load of shit. I hope the board gets rid of him and anyone who shares his egomaniacal mindset. But better that other companies simply make them obsolete, or as archaic as a DeLorean.

[Icarus]

(09-07-2018 03:43 PM)Simeon_Strangelight Wrote:  

They should have known that they had a limited window of opportunity and when Mercedes and Audi hit with their electric luxury models, then things are going to get tough.

Are you sure? BMW launched the i3 in 2013. Did anyone even notice?



What do Mercedes and Audi have that BMW does not?

Are Tesla's troubles due to Tesla's management, Tesla's shareholders, U.S. laws and regulations, or is there something fundamentally wrong with the economics of electric vehicles?

[Thot Leader]

(09-07-2018 03:46 AM)CynicalContrarian Wrote:  

A lot can be said about Rogan, yet he is not a dumb guy.
Quite clever in many ways.
Yet there is still a great disparity on the perspective & operating wavelength from the likes of clever Rogan to whatever Elon is :

[Flux]

Just watched with him on Joe Rogan, and everything shows to him being a mathematical and creative genius, without any talent in the social realm.

The guy struggles to act like a normal person, lacks any charisma, and seems to be hypersensitive/unable to manage his mind. More importantly he lacks leadership and social dominance—although mentally he is extremely dominant—he doesn’t have the charisma to do it socially.

He is without a doubt a genius, but an unbalanced one, I doubt game would help him much.

[Dulceácido]

Flipping through channels and saw a clip on CNN of this guy smoking weed on the Joe Rogan show and people are freaking out (presumably because he was smoking weed?). Stock is getting ripped and the resignation mentioned above are being attributed to the Rogan interview and the weed smoking. Bad Elon. Bad.

[Saweeep]

I thought it was strange that he accepted the joint. He pretty much said that it was a bad idea.

Perhaps you guys more tuned to the situation can tell me whether this is possible or not:

Elon is bored and wants to do something else (I get this as an entrepreneur who's business is growing nice and rapidly and is way beyond the concept/startup phase that was interesting...it bores me half to death despite being a great business that has made me rich)...best way to do that is to get fired. Then sell his stock. Then fuck off and play with tunnels and shit.

Could that be the case?

I was fascinated by him on the podcast. I think I'd really enjoy his company. He reminds me so much of the super outliers at my academically selected (1/30 applicants accepted at 11yrs) school that all went on to be physicists and engineers etc.

Can't help but feel he needs to step aside and let the boring corporate drones take over the running of Tesla.

[Bienvenuto]

(09-07-2018 06:55 PM)Flux Wrote:  

Just watched with him on Joe Rogan, and everything shows to him being a mathematical and creative genius, without any talent in the social realm.

The guy struggles to act like a normal person, lacks any charisma, and seems to be hypersensitive/unable to manage his mind. More importantly he lacks leadership and social dominance—although mentally he is extremely dominant—he doesn’t have the charisma to do it socially.

He is without a doubt a genius, but an unbalanced one, I doubt game would help him much.

The guy is a very stiff, very unhappy little alien. "People wouldnt enjoy being me.."

I believe you buddy.

[questor70]

(09-07-2018 08:44 PM)Bienvenuto Wrote:  

The guy is a very stiff, very unhappy little alien. "People wouldnt enjoy being me.."

The paradox is that because he's a hopeless workaholic he is unable to enjoy the fruits of his labors. His status brings THOTs like Amber Heard or Grimes into his orbit, but once they get a taste of how little free time he has (and remember he also has to spend SOME time with his kids) then they won't stick around. This is also what killed his original marriage to Talulah Riley, who gave him two chances.

Working as hard as he does is the right thing to do on the way up, to build your empire, but after that you have to learn to slow down, delegate, and hold court.

[MarceoValet]

Leftist podcast, chapo trap house have a good sketch where they interview Elon. It's actually a decent critique and pretty funny considering their political stance. Sums up the big tech worldview accurately. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9w3rnm_mdgA&app=desktop

[Alsos]

A friend's kid is a huge admirer of Musk. Found out last weekend that I'd met the guy way back, excitedly asked me what I thought of him.

I recounted the unflattering details of our meeting (job interview: complete joke of an experience, insulting to boot, and I turned down the lowball offer). After pointing out a few other loony things that Elon has done, I said that he is a brilliant innovator but crazy, growing more crazy all the time, and like another crazy innovator (Howard Hughes) will end up fifteen years from now an unkempt recluse in a Las Vegas hotel shuffling through his private apartments with Kleenex boxes for shoes.

So, yeah, I got a good chuckle out of his antics the past couple of days, and imagining this kid's horror at Elon proving me right in real-time.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(09-07-2018 04:37 PM)Icarus Wrote:  

(09-07-2018 03:43 PM)Simeon_Strangelight Wrote:  

They should have known that they had a limited window of opportunity and when Mercedes and Audi hit with their electric luxury models, then things are going to get tough.

Are you sure? BMW launched the i3 in 2013. Did anyone even notice?

What do Mercedes and Audi have that BMW does not?

Are Tesla's troubles due to Tesla's management, Tesla's shareholders, U.S. laws and regulations, or is there something fundamentally wrong with the economics of electric vehicles?

There are many more electric cars out there in the budget segment, but not in the 80.000$+ luxury segment. They had that market to themselves.

Electric cars currently are still not viable, but strangely enough for a certain segment of the well-off population a big win. My buddy bought himself the top-shelf Tesla model. The acceleration was crazy, the quality overall not comparable to even a Porsche on almost all terms.

Wait until all the high-end offers of the big ones hit the market:



I think that one of the big surprises of the big manufacturers was how many units Tesla sold in that upper-tier price segment. They underestimated the market potential it seems. There are a ton of well-off people who don't travel long distances with their cars, like to virtue signal, like to have a for-show electric third car etc.

The BMW i3 or the Nissan Leaf does not fit that description.

https://evobsession.com/electric-car-sales/

They are currently the market leaders, but they are in a very competitive industry.

I rather tend to agree that it will go the way of the Delorean or at best one of the bigger ones gobbles up the company and moves production to China.

[loremipsum]

Elon Musk talked about soon revealing more details about Neuralink.
Even though he may seem like one of the good guys, I'd never merge with the machine.

[Icarus]

(09-08-2018 02:44 AM)Simeon_Strangelight Wrote:  

There are many more electric cars out there in the budget segment, but not in the 80.000$+ luxury segment. They had that market to themselves.

What about the BMW i8?



I have seen more i8s than i3s (unsurprisingly).

BMW has a lot of factories, a lot of installed capacity, a lot of expertise. Still, rich people are not buying that many i8s, are they? And, unlike the i3s, the i8s are actually pretty.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

I saw some BMW i8, but they look underwhelming and small in real life. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/...eat-review

It's actually not a real competitor to the Tesla - not only almost twice as expensive, but more of a small sportscar.

They sell some 2000 per year, which is understandable. I would compare it more to a Lotus, which has a far more limited market appeal.

The Mercedes SUV will be the first direct competitor of both utility/sedan-closeness and broader market appeal. We shall see their sales numbers.

[Kona]

^^^ Those things drive like shit, and I'm now loyal to BMW for life.

Aloha!

[kazz]

(09-08-2018 02:18 AM)Alsos Wrote:  

A friend's kid is a huge admirer of Musk. Found out last weekend that I'd met the guy way back, excitedly asked me what I thought of him.

I recounted the unflattering details of our meeting (job interview: complete joke of an experience, insulting to boot, and I turned down the lowball offer). After pointing out a few other loony things that Elon has done, I said that he is a brilliant innovator but crazy, growing more crazy all the time, and like another crazy innovator (Howard Hughes) will end up fifteen years from now an unkempt recluse in a Las Vegas hotel shuffling through his private apartments with Kleenex boxes for shoes.

So, yeah, I got a good chuckle out of his antics the past couple of days, and imagining this kid's horror at Elon proving me right in real-time.

I just signed into this thread and am wondering, where is this hate coming from? seriously? Some of the comments, like the one above, lol.

Of course Elon is crazy, normal people dont do what he has. He doesnt have charisma, he cant converse with someone like Joe Rogan, he doesnt know how to entertain people, he doesnt have to.

No problem with critiquing him, or anyone, especially with recent events, but not just talking shit for the sake of it.

[Leonard D Neubache]

Kona's been dark at Musk ever since he had to walk back to the Tesla dealership half way through his test drive.

[pants]

Interesting pod cast with JRE. JRE once again shows why he is so successful, his ability to get a vibe going with all kinds of different people is quite impressive.

Even if you don't agree about the problems increased CO2 level has on the climate, its hard to argue Elon is a hack working mainly for his own selfish goals.

Elon views carbon emission in the atmosphere a threat to humanity. And he is taking action to try to limit carbon emission.

Even if Tesla does not succeed, he has showed the car industry its possible to produce high end electrical cars.
Yes, he wants Tesla to succeed, but if he managed to light a spark in the car industry for a push for electric cars. I would call it a success even if Tesla is not around in 10 years time. From Elons view it might even be better if he sees the car industry is ready to move over to another energy platform. This means the future of Tesla is not that important, and he can move on to other projects.

[RexImperator]

The BMW i8 is an attention-getting exotic sportscar, but not practical. I’ve seen them around here, driven by Chinese college students.

[CynicalContrarian]

(09-08-2018 06:32 AM)pants Wrote:  

Interesting pod cast with JRE. JRE once again shows why he is so successful, his ability to get a vibe going with all kinds of different people is quite impressive.
...

Yep, a clear difference in intellect & mental operation as well as mere extroversion compared to introversion.

Even a simple question is liable to have an Elon type analyze & postulate from all manner of angles prior to answering.
Whereas a Rogan type can "improv" & "shoot the shit" with ease whether he's an actual comedian or not.

[Leonard D Neubache]

I would be interested to hear from Papayatapper whether high end electric sports cars fail or succeed in getting panties wet.

My gut guess would be no, since they might look nice but without the sound and the unmistakable growl of a rear engine beast the effect is greatly diminished.

My hick logic tells me that Teslas and their near sports-luxury competitors are for soy that think they know what girls want but actually don't.