[flyinghorse]

Any other average or below average looking guys doing well with women?

Just come off a series of rejections (5 in a row over the past few weeks) and I'm feeling negative.


The facts:

Looks

-average face: maybe 5 or 6 out of 10
-good body (5'11 and 185lbs at 15% body fat)
-balding: Norwood 3 with diffuse thinning
-awesome beard though
-31 years old

Other factors:

-Average job (teacher)
-average social skills
-plenty of hobbies (writing, literature, cooking, travel, film etc)
-might be a bit boring but I like who I am (if that makes sense).

The situation:

So I know I'm not fucked because I can still get matches on tinder and I get interest from women in real life (usually 4s and 5s).

Unfortunately when I go for good looking women who are intelligent I tend to get rejected for some reason.


What i'm thinking;

Why would a good looking woman date me if they can date a looks matched guy? Theres plenty of full headed guys with a better face than me so why go out with me?

I actually think I'm interesting: I've been published in a few magazines and newspapers, I've travelled the world, climbed mountains, dodged death, read the finest of books, and dined with some incredible people.

However, I feel these things may be over looked by women and what they want beyond looks, status, and 'charisma'.

If this is true then i'm being trounced by my fellow males.

In short, my issue isn't my ability to get laid, but rather my ability to form a relationship with a smart and attractive woman.

[tobehero]

You got rejected 5 times and looking for answers... you could get rejected 50 times before getting one girl.

What are you working on / improving on to raise your rating/game?

[flyinghorse]

But why should it take 50 approaches if 4 out of 5 of them are single? Surely they should be interested - I feel like i'm a decent catch barring my looks.

I'm improving my body (bulking up to 190lbs); I'm finishing my novel; I'm making attempts to be more outgoing.

Another thing I'm doing is asking people out in real life instead of just using tinder.

I should also add that I think I've declined in looks in since hitting 30s: the hair loss and wrinkles may have taken me from a 6.5 to a 5.5 (hence it getting harder out there).

[DigitalNomad]

Your lack of confidence in your face is cock blocking you. Some girls will like it, some girls won’t, but all girls like a confident guy.

[Baphomet]

(06-05-2018 08:45 AM)flyinghorse Wrote:  

But why should it take 50 approaches if 4 out of 5 of them are single? Surely they should be interested - I feel like i'm a decent catch barring my looks.

The "4 out of 5" of them are swimming in a endless ocean of validation from their electronic iDicks, beta thirst, and delusional self-worth.

Online, 50 contacts with 1 success, sounds about average. 50 approaches in real life with zero results means that it's not your looks, it's your game.

Thinking "I'm a decent catch barring my looks.." says a lot about the poor condition of your inner frame. That's what you need to work on.

[Clint Barton]

Shave the head. Dress better (hire a style consultant).

(06-05-2018 08:32 AM)flyinghorse Wrote:  

Any other average or below average looking guys doing well with women?

Just come off a series of rejections (5 in a row over the past few weeks) and I'm feeling negative.


The facts:

Looks

-average face: maybe 5 or 6 out of 10
-good body (5'11 and 185lbs at 15% body fat)
-balding: Norwood 3 with diffuse thinning
-awesome beard though
-31 years old

Other factors:

-Average job (teacher)
-average social skills
-plenty of hobbies (writing, literature, cooking, travel, film etc)
-might be a bit boring but I like who I am (if that makes sense).

The situation:

So I know I'm not fucked because I can still get matches on tinder and I get interest from women in real life (usually 4s and 5s).

Unfortunately when I go for good looking women who are intelligent I tend to get rejected for some reason.


What i'm thinking;

Why would a good looking woman date me if they can date a looks matched guy? Theres plenty of full headed guys with a better face than me so why go out with me?

I actually think I'm interesting: I've been published in a few magazines and newspapers, I've travelled the world, climbed mountains, dodged death, read the finest of books, and dined with some incredible people.

However, I feel these things may be over looked by women and what they want beyond looks, status, and 'charisma'.

If this is true then i'm being trounced by my fellow males.

In short, my issue isn't my ability to get laid, but rather my ability to form a relationship with a smart and attractive woman.

[kuqezi]

I will try to summarize a couple of problems I see with what you wrote and try to suggest some things you can change:

Baldness: Looks like this is a big issue with girls recently and it makes you look much older than 31. This also makes your face look longer and ugly. FIX THIS ASAP! Either start a treatment (plenty out there) or shave it all off. IMMEDIATELY

Average face: What makes you think you have an average face? Do you actually show this insecurity when talking to women? Start by being more confident! CONFIDENCE IS KEY!

Average job: Well it's an ok job...you also say you publish...so how can you take it to the next level? What's your path? Your career? Answer these questions and make a goal!

Good body: What you mean is that you have an OK body at best, not fit, no broad shoulders and tight abs. FIX THIS! Start running every day, start lifting with a program (not just going to the gym and walking around)

I think the biggest cockblock here is your mind...it's all there. You're lacking CONFIDENCE and that is key and women smell that a mile away. Present yourself like you're Dan Brown and you have 10 best sellers out there, walk like you have the biggest dick in the room!

Some girls will never like you, nothing you can do about it...but if you keep improving and never stopping your path there will be women thrown at you!
The whole 5 and 6 is subjective...the problem is your mind thinks you're just good enough for 5s and 6s...Man the fuck up!

PS: Might help exploring some concepts like "abundance mentality".

GOOD LUCK!

[Akwesi]

Should be in newbie section, 5 rejections is nothing.

[YoungBlade]

I have the opposite, my cock blocks my face. Every girl loves my dick, but they don't remember what I look like.

[RexImperator]

This sounds like a “Lookism” troll.

[debeguiled]

(06-05-2018 10:57 AM)YoungBlade Wrote:  

I have the opposite, my cock blocks my face. Every girl loves my dick, but they don't remember what I look like.

So actually, your cock is AMOGing your face.

OP's problem is he mixes his metaphors.

A cockblocker is a sentient being who willfully messes up what you are trying to do with women.

Unless your face is a separate being from you and is deciding to mess you up, it is not *cockblocking* you.

Using that term for any and every thing that prevents coitus only muddies the language and makes it harder to communicate.

Forget fancy terminology.

You are worried you aren't good looking enough.

Most people are worried about that.

A lot of women want to be swept off their feet, and a strong frame washes away any concerns about looks.

Some women just have to have a pretty boy, and no game will change that.

So all the normal rules apply.

Maximize what you got and work on your game.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

You need to learn the basics of Game and get more Red Pilled. If you go down the face-way, then you can already join the lookism-puahate crowd who are measuring skull-ratio and other metrics.

Your face is not the problem - plenty of uglier shorter men get laid far more with more beautiful women. Getting down your body-fat to 10%, getting more ripped and doing something about your hair - either shave it or get a hair-transplant for 7000$.



Here is the guy from Entrepreneurs in Cars - no one cares that he is bald. (It's probably his daughter since he is in a relationship now.)

[Jack Gignac]

I've been rejected thousands of times and I used to model. I think you have an unrealistic expectation of the dating market.

[TigerMandingo]

Better yet, take a one week trip to the Dominican Republic and get laid there. You will most likely meet women who are not obsessed with mens facial features and are more sexual than the prudes you come into contact with here. This will help clear your mind about fucking and you will become more relaxed as a result.

[456]

@flyinghorse:

One thing I haven't seen mentioned is that you sound like you're conflating alpha fucks and beta bucks a bit -- before you cringe at the terminology, allow me to state in plain English one of the tenets many around here believe:

The route to a meaningful long term relationship is through her pussy, not her mind.

In other words, though you want an LTR and are searching for a suitable match (intelligent, appreciates your vibe, in the market for a relationship), meeting girls with the frame of "I'm also in the market for a relationship!" is likely to end you in the friend zone. At that point, sure, maybe looks "don't help".

Instead, go in with the frame of "gonna seduce and sweep this girl off her feet with my masculine power and sexuality, btw I'm a charming bastard" -- as if you just want to pump and dump. Focusing on that gets her INTO YOU on a visceral, physical and emotional gut level. She'll be rationalizing everything about you at that point "omg it's so hot how he's just this balding ANIMAL who devours me, there's just something about his wrinkled face, what a fucking MAN, oh my god Sally I shouldn't even be telling this to you..." -- you get the picture.

When the relationship starts with that sexual spark, and then you can ease into and tease out some aspects of your "good boyfriend material"-ness.

Guys fuck down and date up.

Girls fuck up and date down.

By getting at her on the "fuccboi" level at first, it's SMOOTH SAILING to ease into a meaningful loving relationship, if you so desire, because you've already got her attention in all the right ways, so she'll frame all your real long term qualities in a beneficial manner. You've gotten her attracted on a gut and emotional level (even post hoc because she already fucked you, see Cialdini's Influence), she'll never have to rationalize being into you. And if you're a great catch, you are her Alpha and Beta and everything -- the perfect combo.

By aiming for boyfriend from the jump, she's in "I'm doing this 'relationship thing', I guess it's not supposed to feel as exciting as guys I just fuck". And now she has to rationalize why she's attracted to you, because logically you hit all the LTR buttons, so now what's the emotion? You didn't lead with emotion. She's got the beta bucks, and is looking for the other side in you, and then it's easy to disqualify with looks or other things.

---

Trying to make my rant more actionable:

- Pretend you have no big accomplishments or intelligence -- how would you attract her, put her in your bubble (us vs. the world), get her emotions pumping?

Game that way.

Then when she "earns" it, you can show her holy shit you are so deep and experienced, wordly, the like.


---

When you win a girl's vagina and heart before her brain, she'll see all of your flaws as exotic and disgustingly sexy and unique.

When you try to win her brain and heart first, she'll use your flaws as first line of defense to her vagina.

Hope some of this makes sense.

Krauser discusses an aspect of this with his "r-selected vs K-selected game" -- you WANT to get that K-selected girl and do the LTR thing, but you have to get at her in an r-selected manner, win over that part of her, in order to unlock her K-side. [because you seem K-selected, you don't have to worry about her truly believing "this guy is just a player"... it's the authentic mix that is enigmatic.]

[flyinghorse]

To answer just a few questions:

- on the hair loss: I've been on the big three for 12 weeks and I'm going to wait another 6 months before I decide whether it works - if it doesn't then I will have to shave.

- on the body: I'm better shape than 95% of the population - I'm 185lbs and around 15% body fat - my lifts are good, my cardio is good, and I look muscular (I could post a picture if its needed of my body).

- on confidence: you read the original post and you can see I'm confident in who I am and I also think I'm an interesting person and relatively successful in comparison to where I have come from. Looks wise: my body is good, my face is average, but my hair probably drops me a point or two. I'm just trying to be objective here.

-on whether I'm a newbie: its cringe worthy to brag but I've slept with over 40 women and had two LTR's. Most of the lays were between 25 and 26 and 28 and 29. Lots of 5's here but probably a good six or seven beautiful women.

[Fortis]

Shave your fucking head. I don't understand why dudes would allow themselves to be "balding" when they could just be bald. Trust me, you will get more respect if you shave your head.

Before you say "B-B-But i'm white! we look bad bald," I want to point out that I've met at least 3 guy whites on RVF who are muscular and bald and they do fucking fine.

Honestly, I think shaving your head adds +1 point to your face unless you are really that ugly.

[RatInTheWoods]

Mate I have a head like a dropped pie, but women aren't like us and don't rate a pretty face highly.

Online will be a struggle, but if you got a good body, banter and game then you can still swoop in the flesh.

I do better once they can get the full presence of me rather than a pic.

[Rocha]

I just got myself acquainted now with the Norwood hair loss scale (always learning in rfv...). And Norwood 3 is not that bad of a place to be. If you take care of the remaining hair with coconut oil, a good diet, minoxidil, etc, you can hold that hair for a long while, and then in some years you go for an implant. A good/excellent barber can make good things about it. Depends of course on the tipology of your hair or shape of your head, but frequent visits to the barber shop (once every 2 weeks or lees) to cut really short on the sides and the back, and some adjustments (if needed) on the top, can make you hide the hair loss.

[blik_min]

Regarding the hairloss: I have made great experiences with ru58841. Good Looking Looser has written several articles about that matter if you are interested.

[Dulceácido]

(06-05-2018 10:57 AM)YoungBlade Wrote:  

I have the opposite, my cock blocks my face. Every girl loves my dick, but they don't remember what I look like.

So disappointed in you. When I started reading the first words of your reply, I was certain you were going to say, "my cock is so big that when it's erect, it physically blocks my face."

[Axel99]

I'm norwood 0 at 33, my grandpa is 85 and maybe a norwood 1.

[Mess O.]

(06-05-2018 02:48 PM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

Here is the guy from Entrepreneurs in Cars - no one cares that he is bald. (It's probably his daughter since he is in a relationship now.)

His is a great channel on YouTube I just stumbled upon.

[flyinghorse]

My Body. 5'11. 185lbs. 15% body fat. Better than maybe 98% of 30 somethings:



edit - doesn't let me copy and past my picture

[flyinghorse]

(06-05-2018 07:48 PM)Fortis Wrote:  

Shave your fucking head. I don't understand why dudes would allow themselves to be "balding" when they could just be bald. Trust me, you will get more respect if you shave your head.

Before you say "B-B-But i'm white! we look bad bald," I want to point out that I've met at least 3 guy whites on RVF who are muscular and bald and they do fucking fine.

Honestly, I think shaving your head adds +1 point to your face unless you are really that ugly.

I'm on the threshold where I can still look decent with hair.

I wish I could post pictures so I could get honest feedback!