[Kona]

^^^ OK no bullshit.

Is that guy involved with monero? Is he the maker of it or something? Truth time.

Aloha!

[Savage]

(01-27-2018 08:21 PM)Kona Wrote:  

^^^ OK no bullshit.

Is that guy involved with monero? Is he the maker of it or something? Truth time.

Aloha!

That is Vitalik buterin the co-founder of ethereum.


Here is the project leader of Monero. (Riccardo "fluffypony" Spagni)

[Brodiaga]

^This guy fucks

[DVY]

Any cash-generative business where cash is a problem- moving it, storing it. etc.

In general, any bulk cash is hard to move point A to point B especially privately!

The long case is pretty clear.

Medical marijuana very likely will go to BTC to settle debts.

[Kona]

(01-27-2018 08:48 PM)Savage Wrote:  

(01-27-2018 08:21 PM)Kona Wrote:  

^^^ OK no bullshit.

Is that guy involved with monero? Is he the maker of it or something? Truth time.

Aloha!

That is Vitalik buterin the co-founder of ethereum.


Here is the project leader of Monero. (Riccardo "fluffypony" Spagni)

OK. Fluffypony I can get behind. That skinny fucker though, I'm selling.

Aloha!

[Samseau]

(01-27-2018 03:26 PM)RichieP Wrote:  

(01-27-2018 12:57 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

But none of this changes the fundamentals.

Even if a massive crypto crash would occur, Monero would still be King with it's 5% actual value vs the 0% value on the other cryptos. Monero still the best long.

At it's current price it may be overvalued, even given it's ultimate use case. If I buy at $300 and it crashes to it's $25 but appreciates to $100 because that is ultimately it's "actual value" given it's use case, I've lost a shit ton of money.

Current levels of speculation clearly matter when considering ROI.

Quote:

And by the way, the use value of Monero makes up far more than 5%. It's literally being adopted by a multi-trillion dollar industry (drug trade). You're telling me that's 5%?

That's the real question - how much more of that value is Monero likely to capture? I find it hard to believe every purchase will be in XMR and every drug dealer will be holding it. Some people will get in and out quickly i.e. $ -> XMR -> $, and it will only be used for a subset of transactions. If you think Monero will hit $100bn or $1tn or whatever market cap, do post your reasoning behind that.

You're not making an argument against XMR. You're making one against every single crypto except Monero.

[RichieP]

Nope. The TL;DR is that it could be overvalued now relative to whatever it settles at due to it's use case.

Current speculation might have the price higher now than the private transactions use case justifies. "It's a multi trillion dollar industry" isn't saying anything about how much of that will sit in Monero, or why it will do that.

[Samseau]

(01-28-2018 10:27 AM)RichieP Wrote:  

Nope. The TL;DR is that it could be overvalued now relative to whatever it settles at due to it's use case.

Current speculation might have the price higher now than the private transactions use case justifies. "It's a multi trillion dollar industry" isn't saying anything about how much of that will sit in Monero, or why it will do that.

Again, the fact that Monero is used for ANYTHING is already more than you can boast for the competitors. Not difficult to understand. So whatever speculative value XMR has is no different than every other shitcoin.

[SamuelBRoberts]

Yeah, that's what everyone is saying.

Monero's profit potential is no different than any other shitcoin.

Today is a great day to test this theory since we're in the middle of a big downturn.

I'm thinking that Monero's drop will be within 10% of the average downturn of the top 20 coins.

What are you thinking, Samsaeau? Will it be more resistant than the others?

[RedPillUK]

The market is irrational and it doesn't care about whether a coin is used for something or not.

Trying to change the public's opinion into liking a coin because it is the most private, actually has a use, will actually provide true freedom from governments, banks and taxes is just as futile as trying to red pill everyone on women and race.

It might be stupid, but people are more interested in potential, what potential does Monero have? It's already private, what's it going to do in the future? It's going to be more private? That sounds kind of boring.

Other coins are going to completely revolutionise AI! cloud computing! live streaming! social media! payment systems! And it's all on a decentralised blockchain that people can't take down and censor!

Even if that's unrealistic in the near future, that gets people more excited.

You should try and think more like an average normal person, not idealistically to win at this game.

The market is never wrong.

If people decide to use Ripple over Monero, then privacy and freedom is not as important to people as it is to you, Samseau. There is no point in saying they are wrong, if that happens, it will be you who is wrong. Why? Because the market is never wrong. It's so important to accept this.

[Blancpain]

The market is always wrong, thats why the price fluctuates everyday.

[RedPillUK]

I don't know if you just like to play devil's advocate or maybe I didn't explain that saying well enough.

One of the first chapters in this book, The Disciplined Trader by Mark Douglas, is called 'The Market is Always Right' and it explains this concept in more detail;

Quote:

If all trading stopped at any particular price, what would this last posted price = represent? At the most fundamental level, this last price (or any current price) would represent the consensus belief about value, relative to the future, of all the traders who are in the market in that moment. The current price is a direct reflection of the beliefs of all the traders who choose to act as a force on prices by putting on a trade.

So, when there are two traders, one wanting to buy and one wanting to sell at a price and do so, they have made a trade, and they have also made a market.
All that is needed to make the market right are two traders willing to trade at a price. Regardless of the criteria they used to determine value, how rational, irrational, meaningful, or meaningless by your or anyone else's belief system, if two traders are willing to express their belief in future value by making a trade, they have made a market. Unless the trade can be undone, it has to be right by virtue of the fact that it was made.

What you wanted, thought, believed, or expected is of no consequence in the overall scheme of things unless you can trade with enough volume to control the market and move prices in the direction you deem to be correct.

To do this, you would personally have to represent a buying or selling force strong enough to absorb all the counteracting buying or selling represented by the traders who didn't happen to agree with you, at any given moment, with enough financial power left over to bid or offer the price where you want it to be.

For example, if prices penetrated all-time lows, the fact that you may have believed that they would not do it is meaningless, unless you can personally trade with enough volume to move the price back above the old low.

You have to consider that for prices to have penetrated all-time lows, there must have been more traders who believed that the current price was above what they considered to be of value, at least enough to where they believed the all-time low was a selling opportunity or they would not have sold.

For prices to follow through and continue to go lower would indicate that there are more traders willing to act on their belief that prices are high and as a result sell than there are traders who are willing to buy at those prices (all-time lows).

What you believed about value and your reasons for believing it may be of highest quality, but if the market doesn't share your belief, it doesn't really matter how "right" you are based on your superior reasoning process or what you believe to be the quality of your information, because prices are going to go in the direction of the greatest force.

The point here is that right and wrong as you may traditionally think of them don't exist in the market environment. Academic credentials, degrees, reputations, even a high I.Q. don't make you right in this environment as they would in society. Traders, acting on their belief in the future by putting on a trade, are the only force that can act on prices to make them move. Movement creates opportunity to make money, and making money is what trading is all about. This is also true for the hedger trading to protect the value of his assets.

Each individual trader will define what market condition represents enough of an opportunity to put on a trade for whatever reason suits him. Regardless of how wrong you think he may be, if the net result of the collective actions of all the traders participating is moving prices against your position, then they're right and you're the one who is losing money.

The market is never wrong in what it does; it just is. Therefore, you as an individual trader interacting with the market—first as an observer to perceive opportunity, then as a participant executing a trade, contributing to the overall market behavior—have to confront an environment where only you can be wrong, and it's never the other way around. As a trader, you have to decide what is more important—being right or making money—because the two are not always compatible or consistent with one another.

[SamuelBRoberts]

Shockingly, at the end of the day Monero's drop was within the average of the other top 20 coins despite the power of the DARK WEB.

[Blancpain]

Zcash only dropped 10%, Monero dropped 20%
Not bad.

Alts dropped an average of 25% today.
Bitcoin dropped 15%

[Samseau]

Never have I thought Monero would be the winner in the short-run. When it comes to the short term, RedPillUK is correct in that the market is never wrong. The market just is.

If people want to trade, go for it, just don't bitch when you get clobbered. Few make money with active trading.

I don't trade. I make longs. Trading is too much of a gamble for my tastes. I put a long down on Trump back in 2015. His stock fell and rose many times before election day, but in the end his price won out.

The same shit will happen for Monero. Relative to BitCoin or ETH, I have yet to lose anything on my Monero. In dollar terms, we're all getting killed. But the rebound will come, not just for crypto, but Monero no matter what as billions will continue to flow through it to fund secure transactions.

It's like if someone told me oil prices dropped. Who fucking cares? People will always need oil. It's called inelastic demand.

In a Darknet reddit, someone asked another user, "What do you think the price of Monero will be a year from now," and the +100 upvoted reply was, "Who cares?" The implication being no matter the price people are still going to use it, which is why Monero is a safe long.

[SuperMaleVitality]

Reacting to small short term movements is pointless. A lot of it is completely random and impossible to explain.
So if one day all crypto drops 20%, and A drops 15% and B drops 20%, really who gives a F? OMG A dropped 5% less than B...

Samseau is making an educated guess that XMR will perform well based on many variables. At the end of the day he might be right, he might be wrong on something that is completely out of his control.
There is a lot of luck and randomness in life. The Patriots might not win the Superbowl but that doesn't mean they weren't the better team.

Overall, I like Monero but I do have some reservations:
1) is it not possible a better privacy coin comes out that overtakes monero in the darknet?
2) What happens if governments start making monero illegal?

[whiteknightrises]

1) AFAIK, there isn't anything that it's doing poorly. Also, I think some people at Princeton University (aka fuckin prodigies) were able to crack every privacy coin except Monero

2) What happened when the government made alcohol illegal during The Prohibition?

[RedPillUK]

It's all trading. You're buying something and hoping to sell it for a higher price later, the only difference is the length of time you are prepared to wait.

And holding something for a long time without taking profits is also a high risk/high reward strategy. You should be taking profits regularly unless you like high risk/high reward. I can understand people not wanting to pay crazy high taxes though.

Theoretically, I'm not sure day trading is a riskier strategy, turning all your money back into cash at the end of the day does protect you if something goes wrong over night. And you decide how much you're willing to lose or gain with disciplined use of stop losses and exit strategies.

I just think not many people have the mental fortitude to do it, people become overconfident, fearful, too ambitious etc etc because people aren't rational.

By the way, I agree that Monero does have a use case, which makes it more likely it will retain it's value over time.

[Australia Sucks]

Deleted.

[Durango]

Recently installed the wallet, and am very impressed. However, to those that actually will transact in Monero fairly regularly, do your homework. The fees are very high, and I just found out that a way to avoid this is to change the transaction priority from default to low. Due to Monero's decentralization, it creates growing pains but it's worth it for the ultimate privacy coin.

Also if you have windows, I suggest syncing the wallet every week or so to make sure it won't take too long to load when you want to access the wallet and send/receive funds.

[Blancpain]

Is it a wise strategy to bet on one coin though? After all we are human we can be wrong? Wouldn't it be better to diversify a bit?

[Samseau]

(01-14-2018 09:33 AM)Samseau Wrote:  

Fascinating link on Monero.

https://www.tradingview.com/chart/XMRBTC...in-crypto/

XMR Monero Best long in crypto

I went back to this link today, and saw a new update:

Quote:

Comment: I've spent a bit of time this week deep diving even harder into the capabilities of the lightning network. Don't believe the fud. My main fear was that lightning would result in centralization. I promise no matter what you hear that's not going to be the case. Decentralization is built into the protocol. Lightning generates it's own routes across the network. They aren't set up manually through centralized hubs by default. Even if centralized hubs are manually set up, those using the defaults of the protocol will take advantage of the centralized hubs that may have been set up and route around them.

The reason this interests me so much is because it creates a possibility for Bitcoin to increase it's dominance in the markets. It's yet to be seen how much privacy can be built on top of lightning and other layer 2+ protocols. If this privacy is determined sufficient, it could take away the edge that Monero currently has in the upcoming years. For now, I have around 10x more BTC than XMR. I plan to retain this ratio until more information is available on the direction that the lightning network is headed.

I'm not going to follow my own advice here but from a traders perspective I'd say XMR is near its top. It could certainly break through this top and go much higher but IMO the odds are better for it to run back down through its channel. If not shorting, watch the lower range of the long term trend for a crystal clear buying opportunity and enter heavily.

While I am not worried about the lightning network taking away the advantage Monero has over security, I do see how Monero is testing the support line it had against BTC of around .025xx BTC. It keeps dipping below this, and given how hard all Cryptos are crashing, I think in the short to medium term (1-3 months) we will see BTC regain market share relative to XMR. XMR could fall back down to .015 BTC, which would be a major buying chance.

As a result I have traded back to BTC. I made about 10% going from BTC to XMR and back to BTC. Too bad I did not sell XMR at $500! But it will be there again someday, and I plan on moving back into XMR after BTC experiences it's next leg up with the upcoming lightning upgrade.

I expect all Cryptos to get slaughtered with if the Dow keeps crashing though. In such an environment it makes no sense to measure your holdings in dollars, use BTC instead. The dollars will come back after our FED decides it needs to print a few trillion more.

[SamuelBRoberts]

(02-06-2018 02:45 AM)Samseau Wrote:  

I expect all Cryptos to get slaughtered with if the Dow keeps crashing though. In such an environment it makes no sense to measure your holdings in dollars, use BTC instead. The dollars will come back after our FED decides it needs to print a few trillion more.

You got a 10% return in the greatest bull market in history, in the single greatest transfer of wealth our generation will ever see. And that's in BTC terms.
Why are you giving people trading advice, particularly advice you took from a random guy on tradingview, an idiot who can't chart and who thought the top was on the 27th?

In a massively volatile market that's trending hard bear, measure your losses in dollars and cents because you can always pull to fiat and rebuy.

[Kona]

(01-05-2018 05:14 PM)Kona Wrote:  

I'm getting more monero today. Looks like we got a little dip.

If any of you are kidnapped, pm me and maybe I'll help with the ransom.

Aloha!

I still stand by this statement from 30 days ago. I'm not finding much beyond ransoms and fake watches that this stuff is easily used as money. Even the Korean hostess/strip bars won't take it. And Korea is a huge market.

But I do stand by my word, so please try to be kidnapped by budget-minded gangs of bandits.

Aloha!

[Blancpain]

Time will come when only the likes of Monero will be accepted on the deepweb.