[fenetre]

(09-02-2016 05:22 AM)OneEyedMonk Wrote:  

Oh sweet Jesus.

I disagree with much of my very respected brothers above are saying, and will give you the unadulterated, real talk:

You simply were not good enough for her. Objectively. Her mother did the calculus, and went straight into action to torpedo that union.
.........

Respectfully man I think you're reading into it too much on the kid. Girls at that age buy into your potential not just what you've managed to accumulate at such a young age for a man.

[General Stalin]

(09-02-2016 05:22 AM)OneEyedMonk Wrote:  

You simply were not good enough for her. Objectively.

<snip>

This is an inaccurate and unreasonably harsh evaluation of OP and his situation.

Sometimes people here do indeed need some "tough love" to get their head on straight, but this whole patronizing diatribe was unnecessary.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

As horrible as this is, I think you actually dodged a bullet here. Yes the mother is the source problem, but the daughter who lets herself be mindlessly controlled like that is ultimately the one that allows the problem to reach the surface. Just remember this bit of timeless wisdom:

"Who's the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows him? " - Obi- Wan Kenobi

The fact that you were good enough for her to accept your support and embrace upon her psycho mother causing her job trouble, but are not good enough for her when times are good and she doesn't depend on you, tells you everything you need to know. Loyalty fail.

Really scary story. It's very tragic, of course, but overall you should just be glad you got out unscathed.

[BlackFriar]

This kind of crap always happens at church. Especially with the holy rollers in the congregation.

[OneEyedMonk]

(09-02-2016 02:45 PM)General Stalin Wrote:  

(09-02-2016 05:22 AM)OneEyedMonk Wrote:  

You simply were not good enough for her. Objectively.

<snip>

This is an inaccurate and unreasonably harsh evaluation of OP and his situation.

Sometimes people here do indeed need some "tough love" to get their head on straight, but this whole patronizing diatribe was unnecessary.

Look at Rollo's SMV chart, Marshal Stalin: the OP is probably a 3.5 and Mary is a perfect 10. It is gigantic mismatch. And the analysis is accurate and fully reasonable. The numbers and facts speak for themselves. Should I have packaged this is cuter lingo? Maybe. The RP is some harsh truths. I understand too harsh for some. This is NOT personal at all.

[RBerkley]

The woman's family may be "Traditional Christian Conservative", but the mother sure acts like one raging, power-hungry, entitled woman like those feminists. They even trespassed into your house, stole your furniture and probably coerced the chick to drain your bank account which will mess up your credit score if you have no money to make your payments to Creditors.

The chick's family sounds like a hypocrite though. Aren't American tradcons the ones who threaten to release their arsenal of ammunition on anyone who trespasses their property? Yet this tradcon family broke into a man's home to steal his stuff like how Marxists behave in a riot?

It just shows that North American tradcons and feminists are two sides of the same coin.

[Travesty]

Evangelical is not real Christian. Any house where the mom seems to run things isn't traditional.

It also sounds like you are living some sort of West Virginia everyone lives with family lifestyle over there.

Lesson for the young ones:

1) Evangelical are not real Christians. They are fucked up.
1b) If you want traditional Christian go for Orthodox, Catholic (probably 30% of the girls are really fucked up the rest are pretty good), Anglican

2) The mother is the template for the daughter. Do not disregard this ever. Both in mentality and physicality. They are not separate!

3) Family is a package deal. Most people never change the vast majority of the time. If they do change usually the changes are very small and take too much time. This isn't some fucking romantic comedy where you win them over with your charm. If they dislike you that is something that will be present for all time in the vast majority of cases.

4) It is 5x easier to make any serious relationship with a woman work if you have your finances and own place completely together before the relationship ever begins.

[Travesty]

I also wanted to say you are acting like a champion by putting this past you and realizing that if you took her back anytime her family got together even 10 years from now and said they don't like the way you raise your sons.... they could just tell her to divorce you and take the kids and destroy your company or whatever wealth you have - because Jesus.

Great move in that thinking. Very strong.

[Gustavus Adolphus]

^ Good post, Travesty.

A daughter becomes the mother, in the good and bad. Either through genetics, or through the subversion of a million paper cuts of influence to your relationship. Or both.

I once was close to marriage with a virgin-at-first girl that I had met in college. When we were going through some things after moving in together, I found out her mother had told her "she could do better."

I ended it for good right then. Family-in-law factors too heavily to me to risk a future of personal and financial misery on the slim chance that she would not have developed the same poison in her veins.

My gut tells me "Mary" was never who you thought she was, you were just chasing a mirage.

Best of luck, man. Remember, possessions can be replaced. And so can she.

GA

[spokepoker]

You gonna be able to get your shit back?

[fenetre]

(09-03-2016 12:34 AM)Gustavus Adolphus Wrote:  

^ Good post, Travesty.

A daughter becomes the mother, in the good and bad. Either through genetics, or through the subversion of a million paper cuts of influence to your relationship. Or both.

I once was close to marriage with a virgin-at-first girl that I had met in college. When we were going through some things after moving in together, I found out her mother had told her "she could do better."

I ended it for good right then. Family-in-law factors too heavily to me to risk a future of personal and financial misery on the slim chance that she would not have developed the same poison in her veins.

My gut tells me "Mary" was never who you thought she was, you were just chasing a mirage.

Best of luck, man. Remember, possessions can be replaced. And so can she.

GA

A "mirage" - fucking bang on word choice. I've been balls deep in the red pill world for a couple of years now and have never come across this description. It's so apt. We seem to so often look at the mental image we have of the girl instead of what is right there in front of us.

The mirage is the memories, the hopes for the future but critically our rationalisation of why the red flags or serious faults of the girl are not important, leading us to overlook critical factors that will eventually blow up.

I know, slightly OT, but this mirage concept is fundamental to relationship game. Thank you for giving me this insight

[General Stalin]

(09-02-2016 11:40 PM)OneEyedMonk Wrote:  

(09-02-2016 02:45 PM)General Stalin Wrote:  

(09-02-2016 05:22 AM)OneEyedMonk Wrote:  

You simply were not good enough for her. Objectively.

<snip>

This is an inaccurate and unreasonably harsh evaluation of OP and his situation.

Sometimes people here do indeed need some "tough love" to get their head on straight, but this whole patronizing diatribe was unnecessary.

Look at Rollo's SMV chart, Marshal Stalin: the OP is probably a 3.5 and Mary is a perfect 10. It is gigantic mismatch. And the analysis is accurate and fully reasonable. The numbers and facts speak for themselves. Should I have packaged this is cuter lingo? Maybe. The RP is some harsh truths. I understand too harsh for some. This is NOT personal at all.

I don't care about some dude's charts, graphs, numbers, and bullshit PUA lingo. Dude was dating a girl for years who lived with him, loved him, and began building a life with him. No "3.5 vs 10 SMV" is relevant in that situation. If that were truly the case the girl wouldn't have even gone on a first date with him.

You're basically saying this girl is the female equivalent of Brad Pitt and OP is Lindy West. Over-analyzing and completely misjudging the situation. The fuck outta here...

[eradicator]

(09-03-2016 10:49 AM)General Stalin Wrote:  

(09-02-2016 11:40 PM)OneEyedMonk Wrote:  

(09-02-2016 02:45 PM)General Stalin Wrote:  

(09-02-2016 05:22 AM)OneEyedMonk Wrote:  

You simply were not good enough for her. Objectively.

<snip>

This is an inaccurate and unreasonably harsh evaluation of OP and his situation.

Sometimes people here do indeed need some "tough love" to get their head on straight, but this whole patronizing diatribe was unnecessary.

Look at Rollo's SMV chart, Marshal Stalin: the OP is probably a 3.5 and Mary is a perfect 10. It is gigantic mismatch. And the analysis is accurate and fully reasonable. The numbers and facts speak for themselves. Should I have packaged this is cuter lingo? Maybe. The RP is some harsh truths. I understand too harsh for some. This is NOT personal at all.

I don't care about some dude's charts, graphs, numbers, and bullshit PUA lingo. Dude was dating a girl for years who lived with him, loved him, and began building a life with him. No "3.5 vs 10 SMV" is relevant in that situation. If that were truly the case the girl wouldn't have even gone on a first date with him.

You're basically saying this girl is the female equivalent of Brad Pitt and OP is Lindy West. Over-analyzing and completely misjudging the situation. The fuck outta here...

Agree with everything except that you think Lindy West is a 3.5 She is a 1/10, basically a boner killer. How she has kids, I'll never understand.

[Plutoman]

I am stepping back today and wondering back if the girl I thought she was, she only tried to be to please me. Won't really know. But that mirage comment is fairly spot on. She was probably always more religious than I really wanted and wanted to deal with, and she pulled back for my sake. She will follow her mom.

On other notes, I am not a 3.5, since getting 6's and 7's is quite comfortable for me, which tells me plenty about my own SMV. Higher takes work, an 8 is challenging but doable. 9 and higher.. I will need more assets most likely. I can hit those goals though, and I am working towards it. I became much less of a thinker and much more of a feeler while dating her; probably in a subconscious attempt to relate to her more. I've had a fairly sudden reversal myself. Much more calculating, lately.

In some levels, I wonder if either of us were ever truly honest with each other. I think she was with me, but tried to come towards me and my own standpoints, for my sake. I know I was never truly honest with her. Until recently; over the last 4-6 months, I started becoming more and more honest, since I was facing pressure towards marriage. In some ways, that created conflict.

I'm not going to get my stuff back unless my lawyer thinks I should press a claim over it. I just want away from this, I want no part in it. It was a tremendous part of my life so far, and I do not want the constant reminders of it. I already got some new furniture, I have good people who have helped me out here, and I can manage my own future without needing to press a claim over, in the long run, small change. The lessons are worth the cost.

[robreke]

Your story is more a case of dealing with a religious-nutcase family than it is a lesson on AWALT, though there is some of that because, your girl did, technically turn on you in the end.

Of course she had to face the onslaught of an 'intervention' and like I said, nutty family (especially mom it sounds like) that was 100% against you from the beginning and in the end when they 'won' her back. That's a hard thing for a young woman to overcome and, of course, she couldn't.

When I first started reading, I thought this was going to be a typical tale of "met her, fell in love, took her virginity, everything was going great, making life plans, then she decides to leave because she is bored/caught her banging some other guy/ she cheats on me, etc. In other words, a woman you thought you could trust falling victim to hypergamy.

It's not that typical lesson but it is one that is just as important - dealing with her family when they're against you. This is a rather specialized and more rare case study.

A case study on when the girl is into you, but the family isn't and will do anything to sabotage you.

By the way, good thread title. Reminds of Dylan LeBlanc's tune;

[Plutoman]

(09-03-2016 03:08 PM)robreke Wrote:  

But no, this story is a rather specialized and more rare case study.

A case study on when the girl is into you, but the family isn't and will do anything to sabotage you.

The lesson is that you can never just focus on the girl, but also her influences. Any girl has multitudes of influences, and if you are going to be with one long-term, you must identify those, identify how they influence her, and whether it can be managed.

Could be a friend, or multiple friends - family - a church - anything. Identify the influences. Because they are out of your control, and by ignoring them, you set yourself up for failure. This story is specific... but the lesson isn't as specific.

The miscellaneous lesson is don't invest anything into a girl you don't want to lose. Expect anything invested to be lost. And in fact, stop considering it an investment; it's purely an expense. Anything shared is an expense you paid. You won't get it back. If you do, it's a lucky gift back.

Actually, let me add a real summary of the lessons I have learned here, that are core.

- You can never focus on the girl, but you must always consider every influence on her, and whether it promotes your goals or hinders them, and whether you can manage them.
- A woman will always take the course that is most self-protective, regardless of what you might want to believe. She will take the course that she believes is the least risky for herself. Always.
- Anything shared or put towards a girl is an expense, never an investment, be it time, money, or anything else. This is commonly found in other stories, but still important.

[Ivanis]

You seem to have come out of the situation with good lessons in what not to do in the future. So even though it didn't work out like you wanted, you still learned much from the encounter.

Life as a whole is a compilation of experiences that help you grow into the person you are now, and I guarantee that next year at this exact moment you will have changed due to other experiences whether it be in your love life or business or whatever else.


Two thumbs up from this guy for landing on your feet in the aftermath. Keep moving forward!