[Parzival]

Well those empires are gone and the brute and barbaric nature of Islam is something that will not survive in the long term. What we see now from Islam is a last breath of violence before they vanish. Like a hunted down animal that try to fight even harder. Just don't know that its dead already, in the trap. Only those that are stupid enough will walk into the fangs of a dying animal.
Islam is for losers, it offers nothing for the future. Its also for backward people that fear the new. Islamic terror do this because they can not win against us, but they want to create a reaction. We have to be careful not get into their trap.

Bring the middle east shopping malls and smartphones will dry out more terrorist then drones in the long term. Till then the elites want the clash to take over.

[Going strong]

Another case, but this time not terror-related, where the use of enhanced interrogation would be absolutely crucial, life-saving and justified:

Half of the French Law Enforcement forces are currently engaged in massive search and (hopefully) rescue operations, in vast wooded areas and on lakes and rivers, to try to find a 9 years old girl, Franco-Portuguese Maelys. She was obviously kidnapped by a monster, an ex-K9 specialist called Nordhal L, below pictured.



This Nordhal monster even cleaned the trunk of his car with a special anti-K9 chemical product, to thwart and put off the police dogs... he now pretends that the little girl "climbed into his trunk from the inside of his car", willingly, "to see, outta curiosity, if some dogs were hiding in the trunk"... yeah sure...

Left, the victim of abduction, let's pray God she is found alive:


By the way, the Investigating (instructioning) Judge (a Napoleonic invention, he's not a DA) was brilliant in his interrogation of Nordhal, leading him to believe that the girl's DNA had been found in the trunk, when actually it had been found on the dashboard: Nordhal then confessed to Maelys entering his vehicle's trunk...

Anyway, Nordhal, incarcerated, day after day refuses to say where he hid the girl, alive hopefully, or deceased... hundreds and hundreds of cops, and thousands of volunteers, are checking the woods, lakes, streams, while hope is diminishing.

So I am very sorry, but in such a case, I would have advocated for an urgent waterboarding of the monster, to possibly save the girl, or at least find her body for proper Christian burial.

[Going strong]

The motherfucker surviving terrorist, Abdeslam Salah, has just obtained what he wanted from the weak Leftist government of France.

He will have, by court order, published today, the plastic fence removed, between him and his brothers, on visiting days (he can hug them)... he will get 2 hours per day of protected outdoor strolling... he gets a cable TV...

All of this, in spite of his sustained refusal to give any name and detail on his accomplices...
http://www.lefigaro.fr/flash-actu/2017/0...deslam.php

Truth is, the French globalist government is terrified of him, cause Salah could reveal during a public trial the truth about the attacks; especially that French natives were castrated (for males) or had broken bottles stuffed into their vaginas (for females), during one hour, while the leftist government hesitated on the necessity of ordering an assault on the Bataclan...

No vengeance has been exerted, no name has been extracted from Abdeslam, who makes a mockery out of our civilization... Western European governments are a faggoty joke!

Give me Abdeslam two hours, or Nordhal (from above, the gansta pedo), five hours, and I would save lives, time, resources and money in huge amounts, by enhance-interrogating them. Mother of God, they would talk and sing.

By the way, in his latest tweets today, president Trump also acknowledged that we, as a (Western) civilization, are too soft on terrorists and monsters. Make no mistake, president Trump is 100% with us on that, he is for the enhanced-interrogation of monsters.

[Going strong]

Well, today most of the Conservative leaders of the Western world openly agree with this thread, I guess.

Senator Graham first, then President Trump, have been mentioning these past hours the need or possibility of sending the NY truck terrorist to Guantanamo, for enemy-combatant questioning... Senator Graham was particularly adamant in advocating for detention and logically enhanced interrogation of the Islamist in Guantanamo, and President Trump, asked by a journalist, said that he is definitely open to this Guantanamo option.

[Going strong]

As I predicted here, thread-65066...pid1689059 , the gangsta-looking, ex-K9 handler Nordhal, has still not revealed where he hid the poor kidnapped (and probably starved by now, God have mercy on her soul) girl, and had a major judicial win today, as investigators had forgotten to read him his rights (about lack of videotaping): Nordhal's partial and de facto confession has therefore been thrown out, voided, on a technical basis. Also, he has been granted not one, but three lawyers, to assist him in the investigating judge's office!

So, monsters and terrorists not only never confess or reveal details about their massive crimes, but they actually score wins in courts, in our Western countries! Madness.

http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/...uspect.php
"le suspect avait obtenu l'annulation de ses premières déclarations en garde à vue le 31 août en raison d'une erreur de procédure, les déclarations de l'ex-militaire de 34 ans n'avaient pas été filmées, alors que le Code pénal l'exige pour une affaire criminelle."

[El Padrone]

For Nordhal, a baseball bat on the kneecap should do the trick in less than 2 minutes. Europe seems so void of masculine virility. Sad.

[Going strong]

(11-30-2017 07:08 PM)El Padrone Wrote:  

For Nordhal, a baseball bat on the kneecap should do the trick in less than 2 minutes. Europe seems so void of masculine virility. Sad.

Actually, the Nordhal monster would require more than that, I guess, because, and it's a shame for the Army, he's a former soldier , and has shown some resilience and even fierce temper in front of Law officers and judges (he's also a brutal drug dealer)... he would actually require (and fully deserve) waterboarding.

Myself, I would deliver him to the Portuguese (his victim is ethnic Portuguese) community of Paris... he would talk, in details, and speak in tongues, after half an hour.

[infowarrior1]

A counterinsurgency strategy that have proven useful in Iraq:

Quote:

Combat Scrum Framework:
Fighting for Intelligence to Overcome the Information Gap

It was a bad day in Iraq, one of 900 bad days that I experienced over the course of four tours. Nothing was going right; the war seemed endless. During this tour, which would be my last, our recon squadron was tasked to find, fix, and finish a series of al Qaida training camps in Diyala Province. To achieve this goal, we lived out in the countryside amongst the people far away from the relative safety of the larger Army bases.

We had an idea about what we wanted to achieve, but we did not know exactly how to get there. The overall mission to bring democracy and peace to the region was untenable. Iraq is still a mess. We could not solve their problems for them. Instead, we focused on incremental, iterative steps.

As a commander with 90 US paratroopers and 200 Iraqi Army soldiers, I was responsible to define the vision and scope just like a product owner. For the first ninety days, I asked to team to try and stop the violence. If we could achieve this goal, then we could move towards peace negotiations. But, first, the boys had to figure out how to stop people from blowing themselves up in the market, planting bombs in the road, and beheading their neighbors.

While Jeff Sutherland adapted John Boyd’s Observe, Orient, Decide, Act (OODA Loop) for software development, United States Special Operations Forces evolved this open system into a framework called Find, Fix, Finish, Exploit, Analyze, and Disseminate (F3EAD) to help break through the information gap that exists in small wars. Basically, the enemy could see us, but we could not see them. It’s the same type of problem a business initially faces when they are trying to understand the next evolution of the market. We borrowed this approach for our operations.

The boys were heading back in from patrol, and I headed into my company tactical operations center for our nightly huddle. I grabbed a cup of coffee, and the Platoon Leaders, Platoon Sergeants, key squad leaders, and intelligence folks made their way into the building. The teams took turns briefing what they discovered that day, how it nested into our larger mission, and what actions they planned for the next day.

During their briefings, I mostly listened. I would ask probing questions as necessary to clarify, and I would make sure that I understood any impediments that were blocking their advance. These gaps or friction points could be anything ranging from requested air-support to clarification of my intelligence collection priorities.

At the end, I would conduct a quick re-planning session…

review our short-term objectives (2-4 weeks),
provide an overall assessment based on what we had learned, and
provide any deconfliction needed across teams.

After this meeting, the team would sit and listen to the radio as I went through the same exercise on the squadron level with my fellow commanders to ensure that our operations were synchronized and aligned. In Army terms, it is called unity of effort and unity of command. In software, it is better known as Scrum-of-Scrums. The squadron represented 500 paratroopers covering a zone of control for 150,000 civilians. At the end, our squadron commander would review the objectives to ensure that our plans were nested into the larger operational plan.

The leaders would leave the meeting and head back out on their night reconnaissance patrols. Day-in and day-out, house by house, block by bloody block, and village-by-village, the teams went to work. To this day, I am still amazed at what they accomplished. Over 90 days, they got to know the Iraqi people, earned their trust, and found a way to stop the violence through dismantling the bomb-making network. In our next iteration, we were unable to broker peace, and the war still goes on.

I have mixed feelings about our involvement there, but I’m hopeful that maybe I learned some things that can help out back home particularly in helping other Veterans who learned the same, analogous Agile skills find work like I did.

Maybe you gained a deeper understanding of our military ops and their hunger to win. Hopefully you gained insight that combat vets bring an edge to the table that helps business win, too. Seek us out looking for a ScrumMaster, Product Owner, or Program Manager for your organization.

Sure, wartime military and business are different, but in a lot of ways remarkably similar. Your new hire will need some time to assimilate and learn the technical lingo, but odds are that they have been practicing agile creatively and successfully for years.

https://fabiusmaximus.com/2016/02/04/mik...ess-93775/

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(11-30-2017 05:38 PM)Going strong Wrote:  

As I predicted here, thread-65066...pid1689059 , the gangsta-looking, ex-K9 handler Nordhal, has still not revealed where he hid the poor kidnapped (and probably starved by now, God have mercy on her soul) girl, and had a major judicial win today, as investigators had forgotten to read him his rights (about lack of videotaping): Nordhal's partial and de facto confession has therefore been thrown out, voided, on a technical basis. Also, he has been granted not one, but three lawyers, to assist him in the investigating judge's office!

So, monsters and terrorists not only never confess or reveal details about their massive crimes, but they actually score wins in courts, in our Western countries! Madness.

http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/...uspect.php
"le suspect avait obtenu l'annulation de ses premières déclarations en garde à vue le 31 août en raison d'une erreur de procédure, les déclarations de l'ex-militaire de 34 ans n'avaient pas été filmées, alors que le Code pénal l'exige pour une affaire criminelle."

That's a rare case where torture is viable in my book. He likely killed her already or she was dead, but in that case I would allow torture and he would talk, so that the torture stops. Also the information is quickly verifiable - not like with terrorists, POWs etc.

Though - to be fair - rule of law in our system is designed to allow the occasional monster being treated more leniently, so that the legion of innocents don't get tortured and killed. Because that was the norm in the medieval/aristocratic legal systems around the world up until very recently. The ones in power could simply take anyone off the street and throw them into prison, then torture them slowly. We have to remember that this is a slippery slope and doing this would require an incredibly ethical system. We are nowhere there, so in this case it is better for the guy to not be tortured. He should have the same rights as the innocent bloke down the street who gets wrongfully accused.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

Anyone seen the movie "Unthinkable" with Samuel L. Jackson? It really makes you think about this topic...

[Samseau]

(12-01-2017 01:11 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

(11-30-2017 05:38 PM)Going strong Wrote:  

As I predicted here, thread-65066...pid1689059 , the gangsta-looking, ex-K9 handler Nordhal, has still not revealed where he hid the poor kidnapped (and probably starved by now, God have mercy on her soul) girl, and had a major judicial win today, as investigators had forgotten to read him his rights (about lack of videotaping): Nordhal's partial and de facto confession has therefore been thrown out, voided, on a technical basis. Also, he has been granted not one, but three lawyers, to assist him in the investigating judge's office!

So, monsters and terrorists not only never confess or reveal details about their massive crimes, but they actually score wins in courts, in our Western countries! Madness.

http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/...uspect.php
"le suspect avait obtenu l'annulation de ses premières déclarations en garde à vue le 31 août en raison d'une erreur de procédure, les déclarations de l'ex-militaire de 34 ans n'avaient pas été filmées, alors que le Code pénal l'exige pour une affaire criminelle."

That's a rare case where torture is viable in my book. He likely killed her already or she was dead, but in that case I would allow torture and he would talk, so that the torture stops. Also the information is quickly verifiable - not like with terrorists, POWs etc.

Though - to be fair - rule of law in our system is designed to allow the occasional monster being treated more leniently, so that the legion of innocents don't get tortured and killed. Because that was the norm in the medieval/aristocratic legal systems around the world up until very recently. The ones in power could simply take anyone off the street and throw them into prison, then torture them slowly. We have to remember that this is a slippery slope and doing this would require an incredibly ethical system. We are nowhere there, so in this case it is better for the guy to not be tortured. He should have the same rights as the innocent bloke down the street who gets wrongfully accused.

Dirty Harry touches upon this subject. Clint Eastwood, rogue cop, uses torture to find a girl a psychopath kidnapped. Of course the psychopath is given leniency while the girl is found dead, and Dirty Harry is then stripped of his badge.

[C-Note]

French General Paul Aussaresses (now stripped of his rank) detailed in his account of the Battle of Algiers (I've read an English translation) how his counter-insurgency team kept the insurgents from making any headway. Once they captured someone who was connected, they would immediately, within the hour, get the dude into isolation and torture the hell out of him until he gave up all he knew. They would then quickly execute him and bury him to keep his death a secret and, without taking a break, send the team to round up all the other individuals that he had identified. Those would then be immediately tortured and the cycle would repeat until the entire terrorist cell had been captured, interrogated, and summarily executed. He said that if allowed to continue with those tactics, the French would have prevailed in the Algerian War.

This is a very cold, brutal, and morally dubious way to wage a counter-insurgency. Unfortunately, however, it might be the most effective in certain situations.

[Going strong]

(12-01-2017 11:37 AM)C-Note Wrote:  

French General Paul Aussaresses (now stripped of his rank) detailed in his account of the Battle of Algiers (I've read an English translation) how his counter-insurgency team kept the insurgents from making any headway. Once they captured someone who was connected, they would immediately, within the hour, get the dude into isolation and torture the hell out of him until he gave up all he knew. They would then quickly execute him and bury him to keep his death a secret and, without taking a break, send the team to round up all the other individuals that he had identified. Those would then be immediately tortured and the cycle would repeat until the entire terrorist cell had been captured, interrogated, and summarily executed. He said that if allowed to continue with those tactics, the French would have prevailed in the Algerian War.

This is a very cold, brutal, and morally dubious way to wage a counter-insurgency. Unfortunately, however, it might be the most effective in certain situations.

One of the most effective ways to destroy terrorist cells and groups - and President Trump twitted about this a few weeks ago - might be the Pershing way, used in the Philippines (especially against Islamist insurgents, as proven by "Black Jack" Pershing)...

(About the Pershing bullet-in-pig-blood strategy: It reminds me of a post written a few days ago on the Trump thread, where a member noted that "Liberal" MSM are always claiming that such or such historical fact has been "debunked" , where no such "debunking" has taken place, and interpretations are still possible on both camps)

Below, the Chicago Tribune pretending that the Pershing story has been debunked, but confessing that the original story might well have been published by... themselves!
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/histo...story.html


But anyway, there's another way, proven as successful, and I'll probably make a thread about it someday. A way that was tested by a proud Western country not so long ago, and it worked just fine. I wonder if members interested in History might guess which anti-terrorist strategy I'm referring to? The only one that fully worked, recently, in the West... Maybe I'll ask Roosh first for his authorization before making such a thread, as it might be controversial, though very interesting and valuable.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(12-01-2017 11:37 AM)C-Note Wrote:  

French General Paul Aussaresses (now stripped of his rank) detailed in his account of the Battle of Algiers (I've read an English translation) how his counter-insurgency team kept the insurgents from making any headway. Once they captured someone who was connected, they would immediately, within the hour, get the dude into isolation and torture the hell out of him until he gave up all he knew. They would then quickly execute him and bury him to keep his death a secret and, without taking a break, send the team to round up all the other individuals that he had identified. Those would then be immediately tortured and the cycle would repeat until the entire terrorist cell had been captured, interrogated, and summarily executed. He said that if allowed to continue with those tactics, the French would have prevailed in the Algerian War.

This is a very cold, brutal, and morally dubious way to wage a counter-insurgency. Unfortunately, however, it might be the most effective in certain situations.

You would have won the war, but the only way to control a Muslim country is by installing a "on-paper" Muslim shitlord who will do exactly what the general did. Muslims will accept another Muslim ruling over them.

From what we know - there were so little terrorist attacks in countries like Iraq or even Egypt, because the shitlord dictators would not only torture and kill survivors, but also everyone they knew. Sometimes they would instantly torture and kill the entire family or clan of a suicide bomber. That kept a lid on things. Now there are not repercussions and the parents praise their son as a martyr.

Though the best way to create a modern Algeria would have been to ban Islam, convert forcibly everyone to something else. Then you would not have had any uprising in the future - except legitimate reforms.

[Going strong]

Some update about the two monsters of this thread:

1. the Bataclan terrorist has been moved to Belgium for a second, separate trial, and his lawyers have succeeded in giving him more time in Belgium, who knows, maybe to plan some escape or simply enjoy an even more luxurious (well, relatively speaking of course) jail. He still refuses to talk, has not given any name of accomplices.

2. I was right concerning the Nordhal kidnapper: he is indeed a monster. It has been revealed today that he is a gay predator, having probably killed another person, a young reportedly-gay soldier, a few months ago, after partying in LGBT nightclubs. In any case, he too still refuses to talk, has not said where are the two corpses. Hundreds of policemen are still spending their days in the woods looking for the victims...

I'm Jack's total lack of surprise here: he's yet another gay turning out to be a sodomite pedophile assassin.

[Going strong]

Some update on the Nordhal case...

I was darn right to call him here, weeks ago, a monster. Because as it turns out, he did kill the little French-Portuguese girl (he 'fessed up three days ago), and is heavily involved in a string of gay murders. No less than twelve murders of young men, most of them young recruits from the Army, are now linked to Nordhal. Of course MSM is totally downplaying the gay aspect of the case...

Anyway the Nordhal (imported, he's apparently a half-Swede or some) monster has revealed where he hid the corpse of the poor girl, in exchange for his transfer to a -relatively- comfy psychiatric hospital. No more harsh jail-cell for him... he still refuses to tell how he killed her, though, as he keeps bargaining for more comfortable conditions of detention.

The gay sodomite-killer angle, here: http://www.francesoir.fr/societe-faits-d...isparition
http://www.20min.ch/ro/news/faits_divers...e-18322347

And, a common point between both monsters described in this thread: both were bisexual.
http://www.araigneedudesert.fr/la-potent...lelandais/

The faggot sodomite monster below, gay-radar triggered:

[Marmite]

Enhanced interrogation isn't effective, that's why it's use is limited. I would happily use waterboarding as an approach to punishment, after conviction though.

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/oc...ir-secrets

Interesting article discussing how psychologists from University of Liverpool have developed a scientific approach to interrogation, by studying tapes of terrorist interrogations. Very long article, so haven't quoted it.

As of yet I haven't been able to find the research paper. I'm assuming it is classified, considering the content.

[C-Note]

(02-21-2018 03:42 AM)Marmite Wrote:  

Enhanced interrogation isn't effective, that's why it's use is limited. I would happily use waterboarding as an approach to punishment, after conviction though.

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/oc...ir-secrets

Interesting article discussing how psychologists from University of Liverpool have developed a scientific approach to interrogation, by studying tapes of terrorist interrogations. Very long article, so haven't quoted it.

As of yet I haven't been able to find the research paper. I'm assuming it is classified, considering the content.

I'm not trying to give you a hard time, but I think saying that enhanced interrogation is ineffective is a sweeping generalization professional interrogators would say they could disprove with a few examples. It likely depends on the situation, the interrogation subject, and the skill/experience of the interrogator as to how effective it is.

[Horus]

(02-21-2018 03:42 AM)Marmite Wrote:  

Enhanced interrogation isn't effective, that's why it's use is limited.

Bullshit. Can you convince me that Ahmed the Somalian Islamist wouldn't rat out his own grandmother, or even his favourite goat, after ten minutes of waterboarding?

[ed pluribus unum]

(02-21-2018 11:14 AM)Horus Wrote:  

(02-21-2018 03:42 AM)Marmite Wrote:  

Enhanced interrogation isn't effective, that's why it's use is limited.

Bullshit. Can you convince me that Ahmed the Somalian Islamist wouldn't rat out his own grandmother, or even his favourite goat, after ten minutes of waterboarding?

This is one realm where I've always felt that there are a lot of really smart guys who know about this kind of thing, and if they do it, it's not just for kicks.

James E Mitchell is probably the world's leading authority on enhanced interrogation techniques; he's the guy that waterboarded KSM. I have not read his book but it is next on my list: Enhanced Interrogation.

Here he is in interview with Mark Steyn:

[PapayaTapper]

(02-21-2018 11:14 AM)Horus Wrote:  

(02-21-2018 03:42 AM)Marmite Wrote:  

Enhanced interrogation isn't effective, that's why it's use is limited.

Bullshit. Can you convince me that Ahmed the Somalian Islamist wouldn't rat out his own grandmother, or even his favourite goat, after ten minutes of waterboarding?

Of course he would. He's tired of fucking them both anyway

[Dulceácido]

It's (waterboarding) so horrible we (used to) do it to our own service members in Survival Escape Resistance Evasion (SERE) training. I can say with 100% accuracy this has happened to forum members here.

It is extraordinarily uncomfortable, but there are worse things you could do to someone: toss them off a building, cut off their heads, burn them alive, stone them to death, etc. I'm not promoting it, just pointing out some glaring contradictions in procedure.