[Simeon_Strangelight]

Roosh tweeted this little video

http://imgur.com/7VHHzvZ

Quote:

It's almost as if males were genetically programmed to please/impress females without any expectation of return

I responded at first glance:

Quote:

White Knight indoctrination starts early. She will throw the ball into trash before she is 18. He would have kept it forever.

Roosh:

Quote:

I'm not convinced that 100% of his behavior here is from environment. He's young and the speed of his behavior suggests instinct.

Now I was criticized for being too jaded and maybe I am - be the judge:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...ocess.html

Here a longer video - this time it actually paid off to the boy since he got more signed balls in return:

Now - I want to make it clear. I am all for charity and spreading the happiness around.

But was it really instinct - an automatic instinct to serve women without reward?

My take on it:

1. He saw it on TV and wanted to replicate that deed since it was often praised on TV.
2. The girl likely won't appreciate it as much as him when he is older, because let's face it, she is not going to be so much into baseball.
3. Was it really such a pure act of love or was it rather something learned or even a sexual undertone.
4. He is 12 and doesn't look like the brightest light on the block, but of course we can't be all super-smart.
5. At 02:30 as the girl was about to pick her nose, the little guy continues to give her gifts, but you can see that she was ever less impressed by that. If that had been an approach - this would be the moment he would have lost her.

Now that said - I am not denying that this is something of the form of "spreading happiness", but somehow I loathe those public pre-learned displays of charity. Also it is clear that he did not give it to his younger brother who would have cherished the gift much more. He gave it to a girl out of the erronous belief that future sex and blessings will be showered upon him.

I foresee a grim future for the young man as he tries his giving and nice Game-strategy. Unless he grows up to be very good-looking which I doubt, then I think that there are some very dry years ahead of that little fellow.


Here is a smarter way of doing it in an equally pre-meditated way (saw it on TV), but with way more cunning:

Well done champ - that guy will go far - heh.

I believe that we all have this giving instinct within us, where we like to see everyone happy. But somehow I doubt it was pure selfless charity that motivated him and maybe that is not what Roosh had in mind. It is pure male charity that compells us to do stupid things for women no matter whether we get any reward or they even hate us for it.

[Lights]

The first gesture was nice. Instinctual. Keep in mind they're 12 year olds.

He OD'd giving the girl the bracelet, of course, but hey.

He hasn't learned yet that years later, she'll fuck his best friend when he's at work. Let them enjoy their childhood.

[Mr. Brightside]

Jesus, it was a simple gesture and you guys are trying to pull it apart. Kid is nice, gives ball to little girl. End of story. In the second video, the kid gave the ball to the hot girl to impress her. You think he's a 12 y.o. white knight who should've spent his time day-gaming instead? Giving a baseball to a girl to impress her is not "useless charity".

[kosko]

This is Red Sox vs Blue Jays at Fenway. Kid is obviously a Blue Jays fan and from Toronto. They groom them early here to pander to women.

This kid will be Cuck unless he snaps out of it early. Maybe this exposure will be good for the kid as when he grows up he can realize very quickly that it is not the way to go.

Also if note is where is his Pops? Was he at work or is he not in the picture. Who knows really but , typically you go to those games with your father.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(11-04-2015 12:19 PM)kosko Wrote:  

This is Red Sox vs Blue Jays at Fenway. Kid is obviously a Blue Jays fan and from Toronto. They groom them early here to pander to women.

This kid will be Cuck unless he snaps out of it early. Maybe this exposure will be good for the kid as when he grows up he can realize very quickly that it is not the way to go.

Also if note is where is his Pops? Was he at work or is he not in the picture. Who knows really but , typically you go to those games with your father.

I was wondering about the lack of his father too. Could be a coincidence, but more likely single motherhood.

It was just a small gesture for sure, but it's interesting that he did not even consider giving it to his brother who actually had his hand outstretched for the ball.

I wonder how I would have behaved if I caught the ball at his age. Depending on how often I would have been at baseball games and how important the ball was, then I would have either kept it as it would represent a cherished moment or given it to my little brother. No way would a girl be as happy about it as my brother - I did not catch a little pony there. But hey - I wasn't raised by a single mother, but a conventional nuclear family in a non-feminist non-feminine pandering country - albeit Christian.

[debeguiled]

He didn't actually catch it himself. It was caught by that ball girl or whatever she is supposed to be. A ball boy maybe. It was handed to him and he handed it to someone else.

He didn't earn it, it was just some more free shit. He passed it along.


I think Zelcorpion is probably right about his motivation. He is just repeating what he has seen on tv or youtube. You watch it on a screen, it seems to go over well, so you try it out yourself. Ohh, did you get positive attention for doing it yourself? Do it some more, give her a bracelet.

It is only worthy of discussion somewhere like this forum because we know how it will work out in the long run. We are like the audience at a horror movie screaming:

"Don't go down those stairs!"


As Bill Burr says, she will take that ball home at put it on the shelf she has reserved for all the amazing shit people have given her that she doesn't appreciate.

[Game_Started]

Kids behavior is learned, not innate. Anyone who's been around 2-3 year olds long enough knows how selfish they are. Sharing is a learned behavior.

[kaotic]

This is the only way you give a girl a baseball:

[richler]

It's the Western tradition of courtly love. Poor kid just doesn't know the castle burned down.

[OGNorCal707]

I don't know about the kid in the video, who knows what his intentions were, he's 12 so he's still really young, but the girl he gave the ball to looked to me to be a few years younger.

Going off my experience I remember when I was a kid in elementary school around the age of 9-12 when I'd get crushes on girls there were two ways I'd act, I'd either kind of be a mean jerk to them, because I was nervous and confused about my feelings and didn't know how to act, which didn't work then, but ironically works a lot better as an adult.

The other thing I would do is I'd be overly nice at times, perhaps to compensate, but I think even at that young age I had this conception that if I gave a girl a gift, or did a huge random favor for her I'd get something in return from her... her attention, affection, acknowledgment, a kiss?

So in a way I think this beta supplicating behavior is somewhat ingrained in our psyche as youths, it could have possibly come partially from indoctrination from the tv, cartoon, movies, commercial, stories, etc., that I was exposed to as a young child, but I think a lot of it was instinctual.

Before I was even old enough to really think logically or with any depth, I remember around the 4th or 5th grade having a lot of crushes on girls. Here is an example directly from my life, when I was in the 4th grade I had a huge crush on this girl Amanda, over the summer time I lived in a community where there were public pools for people in that community to use, and every year at 4th of July they'd have a party and celebration for the kids and families.

On the 4th of July the lifeguards had a greased up watermelon that they threw in the pool and had all the young kids jump in and see who could be the one to get the watermelon out of the pool. I ended up winning and getting the watermelon, but it's what I did that is telling, I took the watermelon and marched over to Amanda's house to give it to her, a token of my love and affection. Ofcourse I had never outright told her that I liked her, and by the time I got to her doorstep I chickened out, only to leave the watermelon on the front porch without any explanation.

The point of my story was that as a child I thought that these kinds of displays would win a girl over, whether it was from her thinking that you're a strong and honorable guy, or gregarious and generous, I think males will always somewhat try to impress females and present them with gifts or resources as part of this process.

That and it's possible that on some level as being logical creatures our simple young minds think by giving a girl something or doing something for her we are therefore entitled to her attention or affection, in sort of a tit for tat kind of a way, I give you my cookie at lunch, you give me a kiss on the cheek kind of deal. Of course in reality as children and as adults it doesn't really work that way, unless it was a direct exchange of goods and services.

As adults a lot of men who haven't discovered game, taken the red pill, or are just beta to their core will perpetuate these ways of thinking and acting. A lot of it is the basis for white knighting, the thinking that by doing something honorable or chivalrous they will gain a woman's affection.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

^
I already instructed my young nephews when they were 12/13 to tease the hell out of girls playfully rather than give them compliments, flowers or presents. Their aunts and mother protested, but my nephews were smarter than to listen to female dating advice.

[Roosh]

(11-04-2015 11:05 AM)Mr. Brightside Wrote:  

Jesus, it was a simple gesture and you guys are trying to pull it apart. Kid is nice, gives ball to little girl. End of story. In the second video, the kid gave the ball to the hot girl to impress her. You think he's a 12 y.o. white knight who should've spent his time day-gaming instead? Giving a baseball to a girl to impress her is not "useless charity".

You're a female, aren't you?

[Mr. Brightside]

(11-04-2015 02:34 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

(11-04-2015 11:05 AM)Mr. Brightside Wrote:  

Jesus, it was a simple gesture and you guys are trying to pull it apart. Kid is nice, gives ball to little girl. End of story. In the second video, the kid gave the ball to the hot girl to impress her. You think he's a 12 y.o. white knight who should've spent his time day-gaming instead? Giving a baseball to a girl to impress her is not "useless charity".

You're a female, aren't you?

No, just poking fun at posters over-analyzing the actions of a 12 year old and basically agreeing with your original premise.

Sharing is a learned trait, but trying to impress women after puberty starts isn't.

[Sam Malone]

(11-04-2015 01:15 PM)kaotic Wrote:  

This is the only way you give a girl a baseball:

Sleight Of Hand game recognized

[Veloce]

Anyone claiming "they're just 12 year olds" is missing the point by a long shot.

Their body language and reactions are the same as what I've seen in people.

It's an awkward situation because there's adults around. It may sound wrong to sexualize children's behavior but I'll say I had a few sessions of "playing doctor" with a couple girls when I was around 6 years old and I still have vivid memories of how it all went down. What's going on in this video is sexual interest. Yes, children express sexual interest in each other well before puberty or before knowing how their own equipment works. The boy is interested in the girl, and after he gives her the ball she's interested in him. However her interest wanes, EXACTLY the same way a grown woman's interest would wane if you had made eye contact with her or bought her a drink at the bar and just sat there grinning like an idiot like this boy did. Once you get that interest you're on a countdown to do or say the next thing that entertains her.

Of course, this is at a baseball game with adults around so nothing can happen. The boy looks around, knowing in his gut that he has to have a next move but of course he doesn't, which is why he's moving around so awkwardly. His only move to get another positive feedback is to keep giving her gifts, but at this point that's all he's become to the girl: a gift-giver. She'll naturally accept the gifts but won't look upon him with the same level of interest.

Anyone thinking that I'm breaking this down too much needs to observe adult humans a little more closely.

[The Beast1]

Yeah.... I save upped like 25$ as a kid and my mom matched it to let me get a Gameboy for this girl who was 5 years old than me. I think I was like 7 or 8. I had a huge crush on her, but damn the chick was hot. She was into volleyball. Honestly she's my definition of attractive.

One time when she was babysitting over night she took a shower after we had gone out for the whole day. I was walking upstairs and saw her walk out of the shower. Needless to say she didn't cover her top well and I saw some nice teenage titty. Ahh those were the days.

Strangely, i've never been able to find her on social media. She was a true dime.

[OGNorCal707]

(11-04-2015 04:36 PM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

Yeah.... I save upped like 25$ as a kid and my mom matched it to let me get a Gameboy for this girl who was 5 years old than me. I think I was like 7 or 8. I had a huge crush on her, but damn the chick was hot. She was into volleyball. Honestly she's my definition of attractive.

One time when she was babysitting over night she took a shower after we had gone out for the whole day. I was walking upstairs and saw her walk out of the shower. Needless to say she didn't cover her top well and I saw some nice teenage titty. Ahh those were the days.

Strangely, i've never been able to find her on social media. She was a true dime.

That's interesting it almost sounds like your Mom was trying to enable you're beta tendencies or encourage them if she gave you money for the Gameboy knowing that you were intent on giving it to the girl you had a crush on.

Like Veloce is saying, I don't think we're necessarily overanalyzing here, although as intellectuals we often do over-analyze, a lot of us are old enough now where we don't really think about or remember our childhoods or how we were thinking or acting then.

Interestingly though a lot of who we are now as adults has been shaped and molded by our childhoods and the identities we formed at those young ages, as well as our upbringing, social structure, peer influence, etc.

What I think is telling is how in the first video the boy's mom almost encourages him and cheers him on when he gives the girl the ball, as did the girls' mom and all the other adult females sitting around.

I feel like our mothers, teachers, family members encourage certain traits in boys like being overly kind and sweet to girls, in red pill terms kind of treating them like "special snowflakes", etc., which in turn can subconsciously create a mindset of pedestalizing these females.

Shit I remember my school grade crushes and how I would pedestalize them thinking they were so special and different and perfect, etc.

Ironically our mothers, female teachers, relatives, etc., may teach us to treat women with great respect, to be generous and kind to them, but in the modern day 2015 dating world, women do not respond well to these traits. Not to say that the simple solution is to be a jerk, but often gratuitous acts of kindness or generosity usually makes men look weak, needy, desperate, etc., in the eyes of modern females. Therefore a lot of the ideas we are programmed with backfire when we become adults and have to navigate the minefield of modern day hook up culture.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

^ Some good points there.

The more I think of it, the worse his behavior seems.

It's less that we men have an instinctive desire to help women. What I meant with the IDF comment is that they did realize that men do protect women instinctively in joint combat units. Sometimes they will all sacrifice themselves or a mission to protect one young 20 year old girl. We have the same instincts to our children. That's what ingrained in us. We may also have a provider instinct for our women, but the focus is on "our women and children".

I think it is correct that our mothers do have the tendency to create us into Better Betas. You can even see in the video how the likely father of the girl just laughs, while the mother and his own mother thank him profusely for being such a good boy. On that day the boy just got confirmed in his bad Game assumption that gifts and kindness will be met with equal interest by women.

And yes - children do dabble in some sexual interests and spikes, that come and go. I remember as a 11 year old having a birthday party. We were 3 boys and one girl, who was of course more mature than us. We ended up groping for fun in the dark and I grabbed hold of her pussy in the melee - heh. But most of the time I was not yet aware and that greatly interested in girls.

Still - this little scene is actually more a tragic Blue Pill moment of bad Game reinforcement by our fem-centric and mother-shaped society. It's less a matter of kindness "to spread happiness" as he was obviously interested in the girl. That was just his cover story for his actual semi-conscious interest. It's interesting how our Blue Pill world from the mothers to the TV commentators replicated the same viewpoint and most comments online followed suit. Blue Pills for everyone!

[Suits]

He should have committed himself to feminist doctrine and given her half the ball.

[eradicator]

If it was a cubs fan, the kid would have just thrown the ball back on the field.

[Suits]

(11-04-2015 02:34 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

(11-04-2015 11:05 AM)Mr. Brightside Wrote:  

Jesus, it was a simple gesture and you guys are trying to pull it apart. Kid is nice, gives ball to little girl. End of story. In the second video, the kid gave the ball to the hot girl to impress her. You think he's a 12 y.o. white knight who should've spent his time day-gaming instead? Giving a baseball to a girl to impress her is not "useless charity".

You're a female, aren't you?

Only females start sentences with "Jesus." Even gay men have the good sense not to do this.

[Easy_C]

(11-04-2015 11:05 AM)Mr. Brightside Wrote:  

Jesus, it was a simple gesture and you guys are trying to pull it apart. Kid is nice, gives ball to little girl. End of story. In the second video, the kid gave the ball to the hot girl to impress her. You think he's a 12 y.o. white knight who should've spent his time day-gaming instead? Giving a baseball to a girl to impress her is not "useless charity".

Plus she's still freaking 12.....it takes longer than that to condition them into raging millenial bitches.

[Oz.]

Maybe it's female instinct to take without payment?

[Tactician]

^ You might be on to something there.

I remember hearing somewhere that if you complement a girl, she acts as if you are merely giving to her what is due.

If you complement a guy, most of the time they will act abashed. Exceptions are the rare guys who receive a lot of complements, or guys who consciously just say, "thanks," but most guys will act humbled.

Edit: To clarify, this is when the average guy is doing the complementing to either a female or another male. The dynamic changes when a girl is doing the complementing.

[Captainstabbin]

What struck me...the girl didn't even say "Thanks". Her mom didn't even buy the kid a coke. A self-centered mom is teaching her daughter to be the same. She doesn't say thank you even when he gives her the bracelet! She looks around and shows the bracelet to her family. If she was a few years older she would have instagrammed the bracelet and friendzoned the kid. Who knows how long she can milk freebies out of him.