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Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?
#1

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Have you made any significant strength gains on a super low volume program like Power to the People, 3x3, etc?

I've tried somewhat high-volume training (5x5) and made some decent progress on it, mostly because I'm still relatively new to lifting (going on my second year of 'serious' lifting) and the 5x5 gave me a lot of time to work on my form.

But I don't like volume training because it's time consuming and I have no use for extra bulk as a BJJ player. I just want to be strong as a goon.

I've also tried a PTP approach but I can't seem to make strength gains, just upkeep.

Mostly I want to increase my squat, dead and bench but I haven't gotten any of the much vaunted newbie gains. My lifts are creeping up very, very slowly.

Any advice appreciated!
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#2

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Are you gaining weight?

If only you knew how bad things really are.
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#3

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

I do low volume reverse pyramid training and so far I'm pleased. I add more weight or reps every week. I give 100% of myself on the first set every workout. By low volume I mean 2-3 sets [first set to failure] per exercise.

For example, my "Pull Day" [back and biceps] is.... deadlift: 2-3 sets of 3-5 reps, chins: 2-3 sets of 6-8 reps, rows: 3 sets x 5 reps [starting strength style, no more RPT because of fatigue], bicep curls: 2 sets of 6-8 reps. That's it. So far I stick to 2 main sets version, 3rd set is rather symbolic for example 3rd set of bench press is doing pushups to failure. The same gameplan [few intense sets, low range of reps, compound movements + accessory exercises, 5 min rest between sets] is for Push Day [chest / tricep / shoulders] and Legs Day.

I get stronger every week and I haven't even started counting macros or calories yet. I just keep proteins high every day and carbs high/fats low on training days and carbs low/fats higher on non training days. I eat 2-3 times a day within 7-8 hours window where the main dish is right after workout.

Detailed version.. thread-18371...pid1115253
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#4

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

VV, are you enjoying your lifts? Are you into them, or do you treat them like a chore?

It's hard to make serious strength gains if you're not -- at least occasionally -- very into the lift. I see dudes coming to the gym for years just going through the motions and they never really get any stronger.

A lot of what goes into gaining strength is neurological, not only (or even primarily) a matter of building muscle but a matter of teaching those muscles to engage and fire efficiently. And any given lift comes down to just a few key reps -- you either bite off these reps or you don't, and it's when you bite off those reps that you make serious gains.

It helps if you're either very happy or very pissed off -- very happy is much much better because anger can give you some raw strength but it's a tense strength and makes you prone to injury. Relaxed and laughing strength is always the best.

Notice that I haven't said too much about volume, and that's because it doesn't matter so much. As long as you're doing the large compound motions (squats, deads, weighted pullups, weighted dips) and doing them with good form, the exact regimen you choose is much less important than finding a way to lift which allows you to get into your lifts and enjoy the hell out of them.

If you're doing other things like BJJ, you may want to cut your lifting to twice a week or even just ONCE a week, as crazy as that sounds. Yes, you can make real strength gains lifting just once a week. But find a rhythm that allows you to get into it, and especially on days when you're feeling particularly good figure out a way to bite off those few crucial reps. That is how you'll get much stronger.

You may need to allow yourself to become more intuitive in the gym. Some days you may feel like just pushing up some real weight and forget about any kind of volume -- go for it, as long as you can keep great form, of course. Some days you may want to do more reps and concentrate on form. Find ways to get a little something out of lifts when you're not really feeling it, and make sure to get a LOT out of those precious lifts when you are.

And whatever else you do, don't get injured. The accumulation of injuries is probably the single biggest reason guys don't get stronger over time -- they miss time, they become limited in what they can do, and they lose the taste for it. Staying in the game is more than half the battle.

same old shit, sixes and sevens Shaft...
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#5

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Of course it's possible to make strength gains on a low volume routine.

Quote:Quote:

Powerbuilding: You Don’t Grow In The Gym


Over 90% of the questions I’m asked at the gym or via email are about the best weight lifting routine to get huge and strong. How many sets, reps, drop sets, super sets, rest time, frequency, duration etc…?

My answer is always the same. It doesn’t matter You don’t grow in the gym, you grow at the dinner table.

It’s never the training routine that’s limiting growth, it’s always the recovery phase, eating and sleeping. The vast majority of people who want to get bigger and stronger already train hard enough to grow, they just don’t eat and sleep enough to grow. They carry a notebook and want to show me every rep and set of every workout and routine they’ve done for the past three years, but there’s not one page with a record of their meals. I feel bad for them because I know they work hard in the gym and they rarely miss a workout, but the notebook just documents all the muscle they’ve broken down and has no record of what they’ve been doing to build it up. I know because I did it myself. When I started college nearly 30 years ago there was no Internet and few reliable resources to find information about getting big and strong. I started lifting two hours a day, six days a week, doing endless sets and reps of every exercise in Arnold Schwarzenegger’s Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding. I struggled to put on five pounds a year until I finally came across an experienced lifter who told me I was wasting my time with all that lifting and told me to go home and eat. By cutting my training back to an hour three days a week and hiking my calories up to over 5,000 a day, I was able to put on 20 pounds in less than a year!

In the book outliers, they speak of the 10,000 hour rule as the necessary amount of time to become an expert at any given sport. It doesn’t apply to bodybuilding or powerlifting. PowerBuilding is not a skill like pitching a baseball, sinking a three pointer, hitting a golf ball or even playing the piano. Those pursuits require thousands of hours of practice to perfect the motor skills necessary to become an expert. PowerBuilding is very different. Lifting weights is not a skill (Olympic lifting not withstanding), it is simply a stimulus for size and strength, and it doesn’t actually build muscle, it just breaks down muscle. And lifting light weights that don’t force the body to adapt provide little to no stimulus at all for growth. Don’t get me wrong, walking around the neighborhood and doing a few curls with the pink rubber hand weights is great for your mom to stay healthy, but you’ll never get huge and strong doing her workout – I don’t care how many hours a day you do it!!

It really is this simple:

Lift heavy weights three times a week for an hour. Eat lots of food and sleep as much as you can.

That’s it. There’s nothing more to add. I’d love to be able to just stop there and trust that the person asking the question will do exactly those two things and get huge and strong.

But, there’s always a million nit picky questions to follow, the answers to which really make very little difference. People have become well informed and read everything they can about the sport, so they want to hear me confirm or negate every last theory, belief, bias, research study, proposal, hunch, testimonial and Dr. Oz episode they’ve ever watched. The truth is, it doesn’t matter. It’s always a good idea to educate yourself and keep track of your training and diet, but there is no holy grail. Using a bunch of words nobody understands and trying to explain to yourself or others every detail of the Krebs cycle has very little effect on your progress.

I’m as bad as anyone about trying to learn all the latest training and nutritional information, but I understand that 99% of progress comes from those 2 simple rules: Lift heavy weights and eat and sleep a lot. Therefore, I don’t let myself stray from the basics and I don’t waste half my time chasing the 1%, I spend most of my time and effort making sure I’m doing the 99% as hard and as consistent as I can. Train heavy, eat and sleep. Repeat.

What is heavy? Don’t over complicate the answer. If its too easy, add more weight. Repeat.

How much is enough food? If you’re not gaining muscle, eat more. Repeat.

Sure, if you try to lift too much weight with horrible technique, you’ll get hurt. Duh!

Sure, if you eat hot dogs and pizza all day, you’ll get fat. Duh!

Beyond that, don’t get caught up with all the details spewed out of the mouths of every card-carrying-weekend-online-personal-training certificate holder trying to tell you that you HAVE to keep your elbows tucked to your sides, arms perpendicular to the floor, don’t go past ninety degrees, slightly bend at the knees, breathe in, now breathe out, don’t lock out, two seconds on the way down, four seconds on the way up, 10 more, 9, 8, good, 7, 6 more, you can do it … Somebody shoot me in my “$&@:/#” face so I don’t have to listen to that any more!

Likewise, don’t stock up on bags of shiitake mushrooms, seaweed and fish eyes because you heard Japanese people eat it and they live longer. They live longer because they have 1/10 the obesity rate of Americans so the fish eyes aren’t the answer, just stop being a fat ass and you won’t drop from a heart attack four years before a Japanese person!

Don’t chase the 1%, there is no magic training routine or diet that’s going to provide any measurable results over the basic principles for getting huge and strong: Train heavy, eat and sleep more.

Again, I should stop there because I don’t care if I piss off the wanna-be’s and know-it-alls we hear advising everyone who mistakenly comes within earshot of these self proclaimed experts and perennial advisers of the masses, but I know there’s some very hard working and passionate lifters out there who are struggling to get better results and need just a little more to chew on so they don’t keep wasting endless hours in the gym and untold dollars on the latest worthless pill or potion at the store.

For them, I will peel back one more layer of this simple recipe for results, but don’t be disappointed when you see behind the curtain and find out the Wizard of Oz has no magic powers. You’ll see it’s all common-sense stuff you already know and it boils down to hard work, discipline and consistency.

1 Train heavy
Hypertrophy is best achieved in the 5-10 rep range. Lift the heaviest weight you can handle for at least 5 reps and if you can lift it more than 10 times, increase the weight. Google “Dorian Yates Workouts” to learn all about “growth sets” so you understand that maximum intensity provides the stimulus for muscles to grow, not endless reps and sets. For example, If you’re doing incline dumbbell presses and you do 10 reps with the 60′s, then ten reps with the 70′s, then 10 reps with the 80′s, then finally go to failure with seven reps plus two more assisted with the 100′s, you didn’t do four sets. The only set that counts is the growth set. The set you put maximum effort into, the one where you failed and struggled through a couple more assisted reps. You did one set. The rest of those “warm up” sets were a waste of time and only served to put unnecessary repetitive strain on your tendons and ligaments. Just do a few reps of each lighter weight to warm up on your first exercise then even fewer warm ups on subsequent exercises. Save your energy and your joints for the sets that count, the growth sets.



2 Don’t sweat the small stuff
How many sets and exercises? It doesn’t matter. I can build an entire workout around one or two max effort growth sets and go home and grow. Volume doesn’t improve results, intensity does. Don’t train for more than an hour and don’t count all the warm ups. Do one or two Max effort sets of a couple multi-joint mass building exercises and go home. Don’t follow up a couple sets of 400 pound bench presses with cable crossovers and don’t do five reps of 500lb rack lockouts for triceps then try to follow that with some cable push downs, it’s a monumental waste of time!! If you can’t grow from heavy squats, the leg extension machine ain’t gonna help you one bit so skip it and do the squats! And quit doing curls in the squat rack simply because the lighting is better and the mirror is full length!



3 Less can be more
How often? Three days a week is plenty. Push, pull, legs is still a great way to grow. Chest, shoulders and triceps one day, back and biceps another and then legs. The basic movements like bench and dips work all the muscle groups in the push chain so you don’t need a bunch of isolation exercises if any. Same is true of T-bar rows and chins for the pull chain and squats for legs.

If you are powerlifting then transition from the hypertrophy phase into the powerlifting phase about 8 weeks out from a meet and begin doing heavy doubles and triples on the powerlifting movements followed by maybe one or two sets of one or two ancillary exercises afterwards. For example, work up to two or three sets of doubles or triples on flat bench then follow that up with a heavy set or two of rack lockouts or dips and go home.

When I squatted 905 lbs raw in training, I was only squatting every OTHER week. Twice a month! I deadlifted on the alternate weeks and benched once a week. You heard correctly, I trained twice a week when I hit my 2,303 pound raw total and set the all-time world record. I would bench on Mondays and squat OR deadlift on Saturdays. Wednesdays was stretching, balance and core work. That’s it!

It’s about recovery. I didn’t do any “light” days, waste of time. I have no idea what’s suppose to be accomplished by doing a few reps with 60% of your max. What about “Speed work?”. What about it? Waste of time!! If I don’t bench heavy on a Monday night then I sure as hell don’t do some really fast light reps or a bunch of push ups. I load up the incline press with 500 pounds or grab the 200-pound dumbbells and knock out as many reps as I can or behind the neck press 315 for reps. I try to take my body somewhere it hasnt been before so it will adapt and grow when I eat and sleep.

The only reason to lift weights is to stimulate a growth response. Lifting half what you’re capable of isn’t going to stimulate anything.

I really have come to believe that all these fancy machines and “cutting edge” routines are designed BY lazy people FOR lazy people who can’t or don’t want to do the hard work necessary to get results. How many years have you been going to gyms and see the same people lifting the same weights and looking the same as they did when they started?

Don’t let that be you. Take your body somewhere it hasn’t been before then give it enough food and rest so it can adapt and grow!!! I know it’s difficult to look yourself in the mirror and admit that it’s your own fault if you’re not getting results. It’s not because you don’t know something someone else knows or haven’t figured out the right set and rep scheme or bought the right blend of supplements, it’s because you need to get back to the basics and train heavy then eat and sleep with the kind of consistency and intensity that will create results.



4Eat lots of food and sleep as much as you can

The sleep part doesn’t need any explanation. Don’t run if you can walk, don’t stand if you can sit and don’t stay awake if you can sleep. Done.

What do you eat? The answer to this question has been made more confusing and complicated by everyone trying to sell you their version of the latest greatest diet or supplement program but it’s not rocket science either.

Eat numerous meals a day, each one consisting of a quality animal protein source (eggs, lean red meat, fish, chicken, milk) along with some complex carbs (rice, oatmeal, bread, pasta, vege’s). It’s that simple.

If you insist on percentages then go with 33/33/33 for fats/protein/carbs. If you’re gaining too much fat, reduce the calories. If you’re not gaining weight, increase the calories. Easy enough.

There’s your 99%. All the other stuff combined (meal timing, ratios, supplements, high carb, low carb, no carb, high fat, low fat, Atkins, Paleo, Zone, etc…) doesn’t add up to 1%. Most of the time, going to one extreme or another sets you back instead of improving your results.

I told you – it’s common sense. Problem is, executing a successful plan every day, every week, every month and every year is the stumbling block. It’s easy to understand, but are you doing it?

Every time I’ve reached a “plateau” in my results, I’ve never been able to solve the problem by implementing some new training routine or diet. I’ve always had to admit to myself that I wasn’t executing the 99% plan. You have to be honest with yourself about wasted workouts, missed meals or a few short nights of sleep. That’s always where the problem is. So if you see me at the gym or a show, just tell me you already know what the problem is and you’re gonna train harder and eat and sleep better. That way we can skip all the worthless postulation about the 1% and talk about something more meaningful like your family or your business.

All my best!

http://npcnewsonline.com/powerbuilding-y...gym/63930/

“I have a very simple rule when it comes to management: hire the best people from your competitors, pay them more than they were earning, and give them bonuses and incentives based on their performance. That’s how you build a first-class operation.”
― Donald J. Trump

If you want some PDF's on bodyweight exercise with little to no equipment, send me a PM and I'll get back to you as soon as possible.
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#6

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

What an epic post!!

Highlights worth quoting:

# You don’t grow in the gym, you grow at the dinner table.

# The vast majority of people who want to get bigger and stronger already train hard enough to grow, they just don’t eat and sleep enough to grow.

# By cutting my training back to an hour three days a week and hiking my calories up to over 5,000 a day, I was able to put on 20 pounds in less than a year.

# Lifting weights is not a skill (Olympic lifting not withstanding), it is simply a stimulus for size and strength, and it doesn’t actually build muscle, it just breaks down muscle.

# Lift heavy weights three times a week for an hour. Eat lots of food and sleep as much as you can.

# I don’t let myself stray from the basics and I don’t waste half my time chasing the 1%, I spend most of my time and effort making sure I’m doing the 99% as hard and as consistent as I can.

# Learn all about “growth sets” so you understand that maximum intensity provides the stimulus for muscles to grow, not endless reps and sets. The only set that counts is the growth set. The set you put maximum effort into, the one where you failed and struggled through a couple more assisted reps

# I can build an entire workout around one or two max effort growth sets and go home and grow. Volume doesn’t improve results, intensity does.

# Push, pull, legs is still a great way to grow. Chest, shoulders and triceps one day, back and biceps another and then legs. The basic movements like bench and dips work all the muscle groups in the push chain so you don’t need a bunch of isolation exercises if any.

# I have no idea what’s suppose to be accomplished by doing a few reps with 60% of your max. What about “Speed work?”. What about it? Waste of time.

# The only reason to lift weights is to stimulate a growth response. Lifting half what you’re capable of isn’t going to stimulate anything.

# Take your body somewhere it hasn’t been before then give it enough food and rest so it can adapt and grow.

# You have to be honest with yourself about wasted workouts, missed meals or a few short nights of sleep. That’s always where the problem is.
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#7

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Yes you can, for some lifts. I'll speak from direct experience.

3x3 (or 10 reps total for volume e.g 5x2, 2x5, etc) have worked great for my deadlift and front squat. I've put 40-50kg on those lifts in the last couple of years while losing weight, doing just 1-2 sessions per week (in which I directly train those lifts) with that volume per session.

This doesn't really work for my back squat, I need at least twice as much volume.

Doesn't work at all for my bench, I need many times more volume than that.

The reason is simply how difficult the required skill for each lift is. Deadlift is a relatively simple movement that most of us are used to (picking up things). Squat and bench are much harder - the former has a big balance issue (as we're top heavy) and the latter is an unnatural movement.

While my deadlift volume is very low and takes very little time to do, I spend a lot of time thinking about my technique and perform each rep as perfectly as possible. Also, most of my deadlift strength is already built via squatting and upper back work.

Lifting weight is a skill. Most of you would make big strength gains if you have better technique, with your current bodyweight and build. You may have got some significant gains from even a few simple tips, applied in one session.

The skill of lifting weight is only not too relevant if, whenever it gets hard, you get on bigger better juices, like Stan Efferding (author of the above article) does. Or you eat huge amount of foods, because you are already a super heavyweight - like Stan Efferding.

If you want to be a massive super heavyweight powerlifter or IFBB pro bodybuilder on the juice, then it's perfect advice. No need to learn any complicated training or nutritional knowledge, just eat, sleep and juice your way through every obstacle. Keep it simple, stupid.

If you want to learn how to punch harder, and someone tells you that you should eat and sleep more so you have more mass behind each punch, you'd think that it's rubbish advice (vs learning how to generate more power from your legs, hips and body rotation i.e better punching skill). For some reason, this dumb advice is acceptable when it comes to lifting, because lifting heavy weight is apparently not hard....
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#8

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

^^^
So if my technique is relatively sound and I'm not making strength gains (note that in the OP I specifically said STRENGTH not size/mass), then is it safe to assume that low volume isn't working for me and I need to amp it up?

In regards to the psychosomatic components:

I really love lifting and I prefer the low volume routine (3x3), so I definitely don't feel like I'm reluctantly grinding out the sessions unless it's a Friday and I'm beat to hell from jiu jitsu (in which case I'm probably not lifting anyway).

I only squat, DL, bench, OH press, barbell row and sometimes pull ups. I also break up my sets with spinal decompression hangs.

No accessory exercises.

I'm 77kgs and my 1RM break down like this:

High bar squat - 120kg
DL - 130kg
Bench - 110kg
OH Press - 55-60kg
Barbell row - not sure as I haven't tried to max on this one

I look really ripped, which is cool, but these numbers bum me out. Yet I'm reluctant to add volume when I'm training so much jits.

Hence this thread. Thanks for all the input so far fellas.
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#9

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

If you hit a plateau then review your diet and change something there first.

Changing programs just to confuse muscles is overrated. If lifting heavy part doesn't stimulate gaining strength then eating/resting part should.
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#10

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

There's a limit to the progress you can make with linear progression if you're not prepared to eat your way to strength gains (i.e. get fat as most do, and even then their relative numbers don't tend to go up). Have you considered something with cycles like 5/3/1? If you don't want to do a lot of volume then just don't do much assistance.
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#11

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Quote: (09-27-2015 01:42 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  

^^^
So if my technique is relatively sound and I'm not making strength gains (note that in the OP I specifically said STRENGTH not size/mass), then is it safe to assume that low volume isn't working for me and I need to amp it up?

In regards to the psychosomatic components:

I really love lifting and I prefer the low volume routine (3x3), so I definitely don't feel like I'm reluctantly grinding out the sessions unless it's a Friday and I'm beat to hell from jiu jitsu (in which case I'm probably not lifting anyway).

I only squat, DL, bench, OH press, barbell row and sometimes pull ups. I also break up my sets with spinal decompression hangs.

No accessory exercises.

I'm 77kgs and my 1RM break down like this:

High bar squat - 120kg
DL - 130kg
Bench - 110kg
OH Press - 55-60kg
Barbell row - not sure as I haven't tried to max on this one

I look really ripped, which is cool, but these numbers bum me out. Yet I'm reluctant to add volume when I'm training so much jits.

Hence this thread. Thanks for all the input so far fellas.

High bar squat - 120kg
Deadlift - 130kg

I find this to be surprising, especially that it's high bar squat. Usually deadlift maxes are 25 percent higher than squat max, and usually low bar squat at that.

Focus on deadlift for a while and I'd be willing to put serious money on the table that you will see obvious muscle and strength growth in legs, butt, back, traps.
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#12

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

^^
I definitely plan to give the DL more attention than I have in the past.

I just read Pavel Tsatsouline's Deadlift Dynamite and I'm sold on its merits enough now to do it more than once a week.
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#13

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

If you're really consistent and make every rep a max effort, yeah you can probably make pretty serious strength gains on not much volume.

Something like 5-10 singles of deadlift once per week and then pick a pet lift for upper body like headstand pushups or military press would cover most of your bases.

You can do Doug Hepburn's singles routine and see where that gets you. The gains will probably be somewhat slow but it might be what you're looking for.

I do recommend more volume for upper body though. You could just smash pushups and hspu on the regular and that would be good enough if you're looking to cut down on overall gym time (i.e; do nothing but lower body on gym days).
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#14

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Past a certain point you need some more size to get stronger. You can make gains at the same weight or while losing weight for a time but then you will plateau. I also found as Strikeback reported, that different lifts respond to volume differently. With the deadlift you don't need much volume, but back squats need more.

If only you knew how bad things really are.
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#15

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Quote: (09-27-2015 12:08 AM)StrikeBack Wrote:  

The skill of lifting weight is only not too relevant if, whenever it gets hard, you get on bigger better juices, like Stan Efferding (author of the above article) does. Or you eat huge amount of foods, because you are already a super heavyweight - like Stan Efferding.

Steroids or not, if you spend thirty years in the gym and you develop all the right habits, you're going to get somewhere.

“I have a very simple rule when it comes to management: hire the best people from your competitors, pay them more than they were earning, and give them bonuses and incentives based on their performance. That’s how you build a first-class operation.”
― Donald J. Trump

If you want some PDF's on bodyweight exercise with little to no equipment, send me a PM and I'll get back to you as soon as possible.
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#16

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

I had very good strength gains using Madcow 5x5 after a standard 5x5.

Less volume and quick workouts. I think you'll like it. http://stronglifts.com/madcow-5x5-training-programs/

Don't go to 5/3/1. It's an advanced program and you'll progress much slower on it. You're months, if not years, away from needing to go to 5/3/1.
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#17

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

All my lifts plateaued with 5x5 for awhile, 1RM stayed the same on all and I'd go though a cycle of messing up my shoulder doing bench/military press and then having to recover from that so during one of my recovery periods I switched to 5/3/1 with little assistance work and then added some more assistance when my shoulder was better.

At low volume I maintained the same 1rm I had with bench but the rest of my lifts actually improved (to varying degrees) to my surprise and I wasn't doing much assistance work to go with it. Now I'm doing the assistance work but it's still early days to tell whether or not it's working, but the point was made either way my 1RM went up on 5/3/1 for 3 out of 4 lifts at low volume so it certainly works.

Probably the only reason my bench hasn't gone up (just to clarify) is because I have truely plateaued that lift, it's the one I've done for longest and I can't see myself ever getting a better bench without putting on more fat (I have done so for competition, the 1RM goes up but the wilks stays the same).
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#18

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Quote: (09-29-2015 02:57 PM)RioNomad Wrote:  

I had very good strength gains using Madcow 5x5 after a standard 5x5.

Less volume and quick workouts. I think you'll like it. http://stronglifts.com/madcow-5x5-training-programs/

Don't go to 5/3/1. It's an advanced program and you'll progress much slower on it. You're months, if not years, away from needing to go to 5/3/1.

Ditto for Madcow, it's really good if you've lifted for a while. Definitely got stronger and doesn't take more than an hour give or take.
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#19

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Anyone here read or used Mike Mentzer techniques? I just started reading Heavy Duty which sounds similar to what you are doing.
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#20

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Quote: (10-01-2015 12:13 AM)offthereservation Wrote:  

Anyone here read or used Mike Mentzer techniques? I just started reading Heavy Duty which sounds similar to what you are doing.

I used it based on the Mentzer HIT youtube videos, gain some definition in a matter of week, the slow pace is really something else but the stiffness started to be a real problem.

A more recent bodybuilder who use this kind of training is lukas oslandil and there is a lot of things to learned about from him too.

Tell them too much, they wouldn't understand; tell them what they know, they would yawn.
They have to move up by responding to challenges, not too easy not too hard, until they paused at what they always think is the end of the road for all time instead of a momentary break in an endless upward spiral
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#21

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Quote: (09-28-2015 04:24 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  

^^
I definitely plan to give the DL more attention than I have in the past.

I just read Pavel Tsatsouline's Deadlift Dynamite and I'm sold on its merits enough now to do it more than once a week.

Your deadlift max also stood out to me as low relative to the others, especially since deadlift, being very taxing on your whole body, is supposed to be the lift that responds best to low-volume training. (But deadlift comes easy to me compared to squatting, so I am biased.) When I was doing BJJ and lifting I felt that deadlift-style strength was helpful on that mat, too--something about that feeling of strength through my torso.

What I'd say is that low-volume Tsatsouline-style training is meant to be done frequently. Doesn't Pavel recommend 2 work sets but done every other day if not 5 days a week?

If getting into the gym that often isn't realistic with your BJJ training, I had good results on a 5X5 program done in this specific way: pick a weight, do 5 sets "across," i.e. all sets at that weight. Shoot for 5 reps/set. So your first few sets you are stopping before failure. You might get something like 5,5,5,4,3. Stick with the same weight until you can hit 5 reps for all 5 sets, then increase. Don't set super-pumped and go all adrenaline-charged into the set, and don't try for any reps you aren't pretty sure you'll get. The idea is easy strength. Give your body the stimulus, let it adapt, don't tear yourself down. I think Pavel says you should walk out of the gym feeling energized, not worn down--especially important if your main focus is BJJ. In fact for deadlift in particular you might want to do 3 sets of 5 instead of 5 depending on how worn down you feel and how much deadlifting takes out of you.

An alternate program that I made strength gains on is, pick 5 exercises, e.g. deadlift, bench, squats, pullups, one more--maybe a hard core movement like ab-wheel rollout. Do them every day, or 5 days a week, for 2 sets of 5. The key is even though you are doing a bunch of the heavy whole-body exercises each day, you don't go that hard at them. Do the weight you think you can handle that day. Some days you'll feel tired and back the weight off. Other days you'll feel good--see what you can do. After awhile you'll find you can add weight and it just doesn't feel hard. The frequency 'greases the groove', gives you neural adaptation. Again, easy strength (that might actually be the name of that program if you want to google it). (I should say I got gains on that program for everything but pullups, for some reason.)
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#22

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

Quote: (10-01-2015 12:13 AM)offthereservation Wrote:  

Anyone here read or used Mike Mentzer techniques? I just started reading Heavy Duty which sounds similar to what you are doing.

Mentzer himself said one thing ("drug free lifestyle", short grueling workouts, long recovery phases), but did another (probably carried more gear in his gym bag than most geared lifters inject in their lifetimes, frequent grueling workouts, actually did bodybuilding type volume routines, etc).

I'm not saying HIT doesn't work, it certainly does, but if you're training for BJJ then pushing large muscle groups to ripshit failure twice a week or so might not be conducive to a useful training experience.

Power to the People type minimalist routines and possibly gymnastic isometrics would be better suited here.
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#23

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

When I started lifting, I read Starting Strength, and I read Bigger, Leaner, Stronger, which I ended up liking better.

http://www.amazon.com/Bigger-Leaner-Stro...B006XF5BTG

This book recommends 3 sets of 4-6 reps, pushing to the limit each set. Always try to increase either in weight or reps over your previous workout on each type of lift. I did this, and was able to double my strength over about 6 months. Now, this isn't as extreme as it sounds. I started from an beginners level, and I actually only doubled about 2/3 of the lifts. Some I barely increased 50%.

During this time, I read a lot about the subject, and found some recommend 8-12 reps per set, and others a smaller number. I think the consensus is that the smaller number of reps focuses specifically on strength, while the 8-12 range is considered best for hypertrophy. Since the OP is asking about strength, then I'd say short sets with max weight is the way to go.

I have had times where I reached plateaus on a given lift, and the only way I could break through was to switch to higher reps for a while, and build the weight I could handle while working the 8-12 rep range. Then after 6-8 weeks, I'd drop back down to the 4-6 rep range, and found I could now break past my previous plateau.

Unfortunately, I fell away from lifting regularly for most of the last year, and have just gotten back into it recently. I'm looking forward to building up to my previous best lifts, and surpassing them.

I'm the tower of power, too sweet to be sour. I'm funky like a monkey. Sky's the limit and space is the place!
-Randy Savage
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#24

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

just realized you said strength, not size, never mind.
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#25

Is it possible to make huge strength gains on a super-low volume routine?

I used to have somewhere along the same stats as Vincent but I had septoplasty and now I am struggling with my lifts again. I am 5'7 and weigh 75 kg. Change of diet needed or just keep pushing with starting strength? I always wondered why strength gains diminish when you decide to take time away from the gym.

In kg
Bench :one max 95,now I can barely do 5x3 80
Squat : one max 115 struggling now with 90
Deadlift : max 150. Working myself up for this. But I manage 5x3 at 120
Overhead press max used to be 70 kg but now I can barely do 50 kg.
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