[Shortest Straw]

The "Jordanian pilot burned alive" thread, and the "Roosh is on Stormfront" thread, and a gif I saw pointing out that the Red Pill may result in racism, inspired me to crystallize some thoughts on the subject.

Why is this happening? Why do we see kike-this and nigger-that on ROK comments? Roissy (an astute observer of the human condition) is close-the-borders isolationist and cross-connects with MPCdot.com on occasion. What's the connection?

Is it because, as Roosh has brilliantly observed (no, I'm not being a hopeless sycophant), we long for traditional values, a traditional structure in which men and women each had clear roles, and we see that this new world is not so clear?

Is it because in finding the freedom to complain that women are abusing their rights and privileges, we also find the freedom to complain that blacks are abusing their own rights and privileges? Once we see that people naturally abuse their victim status, we suspect all such claims, and are free to voice our concerns?

Or is it because the world we long for is one that also has cultural and racial homogeneity?

Or is it a sense of abandonment: Everything is coming apart, so why pretend to be civil anymore?

I enjoy the commentary on MPCdot.com, but I recognize it for the silliness it is, while I know there are more than a few that take it very seriously. Ditto for the dick measuring threads on Stormfront.

I'm curious what others have thought on observing this connection.

[pheonix500000]

(02-07-2015 12:13 AM)Shortest Straw Wrote:  

The "Jordanian pilot burned alive" thread, and the "Roosh is on Stormfront" thread, and a gif I saw pointing out that the Red Pill may result in racism, inspired me to crystallize some thoughts on the subject.

Why is this happening? Why do we see kike-this and nigger-that on ROK comments? Roissy (an astute observer of the human condition) is close-the-borders isolationist and cross-connects with MPCdot.com on occasion. What's the connection?

Is it because, as Roosh has brilliantly observed (no, I'm not being a hopeless sycophant), we long for traditional values, a traditional structure in which men and women each had clear roles, and we see that this new world is not so clear?

Is it because in finding the freedom to complain that women are abusing their rights and privileges, we also find the freedom to complain that blacks are abusing their own rights and privileges? Once we see that people naturally abuse their victim status, we suspect all such claims, and are free to voice our concerns?

Or is it because the world we long for is one that also has cultural and racial homogeneity?

Or is it a sense of abandonment: Everything is coming apart, so why pretend to be civil anymore?

I enjoy the commentary on MPCdot.com, but I recognize it for the silliness it is, while I know there are more than a few that take it very seriously. Ditto for the dick measuring threads on Stormfront.

I'm curious what others have thought on observing this connection.

Starting a race thread huh

[MdWanderer]

Probably because the Manosphere shuns political correctness and speaking your mind. Sometimes the reality of that can be harsh. Some people have deep seeded prejudices and the Manosphere is one of the few places you can do that, as long as you're civil and professional about it. We all have personal experiences with certain groups that have been for the most part unfavorable, and the BS that the SJWs try to feed us (we must love EVERYBODY!) is not only unrealistic, but dangerous as well.

[jariel]

[Daedmo]

This thread won't last long.

Racism/nationalism/tribalism or whatever you want to call it is masculine in nature. Hence the popularity or sports (which is really a tribal conflict analog) among men and not women. This is why a masculine themed forum will veer towards racialism.

Men go out and fight for their tribe while women watch on the sidelines. It's just how our species evolved.

[MdWanderer]

Guess I took the bait. I'll leave this in the hands of the powers that be.

[eclipse]

As a libertarian, I really dislike any form of closed borders. Hell, I would be so open borders- as to say that I dont believe in (national)borders as a legitimate concept at all.

So far, I think western civilisation has clearly been the most superior. Muslim civilisation is clearly ass backwards. I am very very "misogynistic"(as close you can get to it without actually hating bitches) but even I find myself white knighting for stuff like women getting honor killed, stoned, having to wear hijabs, not being allowed to drive etc. I would agree with Roissy and all that blank slate theory doesnt seem very likely at all.

I wouldnt agree that you should judge people on their race, but races are definitely different, and depending on what your criteria are, superior and inferior in certain ways. I judge people on their individual merits but race can be a shortcut for screening.

Ive seen Roissy attack the open borders people on twitter and its just embarrassing. That being said- what should immigration be like? Allowing violent people in seems rather bad. A lot of open borders agree not to. Then it comes down to- what is violence? Like doing actual harm to people/property? Or could it be broader- like Muslims trying to create sharia law and other immigrants trying to make government more backwards, just the way they like. The extreme libertarian ideology is that anyone who is statist(believes government is good/necessary) is violent or has violent beliefs, so if you deny all statists entry, that actually is more "closed borders" than quite a lot of actual closed borders plans.

[Geomann180]

As times get tough, people get tribal. They prefer company of those who look, talk, and act like them. This can turn violent, as history shows.

/Thread

G

[Shortest Straw]

Thanks so far. It's been the object of my curiousity. Closed borders, open borders, self inflicted white genocide ... it's a confusing situation.

I absolutely do not want to stimulate the airing of racist beliefs, and if it turns to that, I would be more than happy to see the thread closed. I am only curious about the deeper principles.

One parallel I saw that got me thinking: A left-wing belief is that all people are the same underneath the skin. The manosphere rejects this as it pertains to men and women.

The racists reject the belief that people are the same underneath the skin, regardless of skin color.

The problem I see is that the racists and the misogynists both allude - but don't quite come out and state - that those difference ought to justify unequal rights. I don't hear very many stating that women ought to not have the right to vote, but more than a few seem to think that might not be a bad idea.

It's a very confusing situation. It's as though the left-wing ideology both brought the issues to the forefront through sheer silliness (gender is a social construct) and simultaneously inspired people to "fight fire with fire".

[Shortest Straw]

(02-07-2015 12:31 AM)MdWanderer Wrote:  

Guess I took the bait. I'll leave this in the hands of the powers that be.

I am in no way baiting the airing of racist or sexist beliefs. I'm just curious about how humans, myself included, handle such changing times.

Thanks for rising to the bait, anyway.

[Brian Shima]

The manosphere is largely made up of angry white guys who dont do well with women, it is easy to point the finger and hate on people different than you when your life sucks "hate is a cheap drug but dangerous high"

[samsamsam]

(02-07-2015 01:15 AM)Brian Shima Wrote:  

The manosphere is largely made up of angry white guys who dont do well with women, it is easy to point the finger and hate on people different than you when your life sucks "hate is a cheap drug but dangerous high"

Egos are pretty fragile. Too painful for some egos to accept any blame for where they are in life, so they turn the blame on others. For racists (whatever color you hate), if they were all gone you would hate people within your race for stealing your girl, your job, blah blah blah

[dads]

I think as a black guy in the manosphere, it gets hard to overlook some of racist stuff, especially over at CH. I do appreciate a lot of what he writes, but I don't appreciate being talked about as if I am a problem. The issue seems to be that people come to the red pill with a NAWALT mindset, and end up flipping it, but they do the same when it comes to race, when that is not the case. When you talk about women and hypergamy being in their nature, it's true. All women, at their core, are subject to what's been sewn into their DNA over thousands of years. However, with Black people, or other races we really aren't "All Like That", and it really gets to me when some of the writers around the manosphere can't seem to conflate their logical political arguments with that fact.

[2Wycked]

(02-07-2015 01:15 AM)Brian Shima Wrote:  

The manosphere is largely made up of angry white guys who dont do well with women, it is easy to point the finger and hate on people different than you when your life sucks "hate is a cheap drug but dangerous high"

The manosphere has nothing on the Asian corners of the web. Check out this trainwreck:

Angry Asian Man Blog

If you were to combine these faggots with PUAHaters, you would get a horrific maelstrom that would make Stormfront look like a friendly carnival ride for your five year-old.

I have yet to understand why so many bother with discussing the racism (does this term even have a real definition anymore?) of the Caucasian aspects of the manosphere -- much less Stormfront -- when these folk have absolutely no platform to reach the masses. These are ignored corners of the Web unless they are bashed by sites like Jezebel or PuffHo.

Yet, Suey Park, Brianna Wu and every manner of Asian, tranny or whatever mindless bigot has a mainstream voice.

A couple of side notes: It is true that left-wingers believe that deep down, every single person is equal (interchangeable). They -- by and large -- abandoned biological and scientific theories about differences in populations quite some time ago. However, ancient prejudices and false beliefs still haunt liberal thought: they now just blame "deeply-ingrained" cultural beliefs, practices, etc.

Second, don't buy the myth that "inequal" rights between men and women is a result of misogyny. Nobody even really used the term misogyny until the 1960's, and first-wave feminism had been dead for generations.

[Deluge]

inb4 the lock

(02-07-2015 01:26 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

Egos are pretty fragile. Too painful for some egos to accept any blame for where they are in life, so they turn the blame on others. For racists (whatever color you hate), if they were all gone you would hate people within your race for stealing your girl, your job, blah blah blah

Nail on the head. It's the exact same ego preservation reaction that makes guys blame their race for why they can't date interracially, rather then face up to the fact that their losers and that even girls from their own race won't date them. I suspect it's the same deal with Slavic, non-white or mixed race neo-Nazi's and White Nationalists, like the Asian neo-Nazi SJW from GamerGate. Their ego's cant handle admitting to themselves that they're not Aryan or what have you.

Any forum that's primarily about helping guys who aren't good with girls, is bound to attract a lot of losers. I've yet to meet someone with extreme views who was socially normal. Read certain Manosphere blogs and it becomes apparent that a fair few and their commenters straight up hate Black men in particular, and I'm not just talking about Heartiste. I remember a while back Excelsior and speakeasy were posting quotes of blog comments of guys saying the thought of White women dating Black guys made them physically ill and kept them up at night. Asian men being obsessed with White guys dating Asian girls is another side of the same coin. It all makes you wonder what kind of person is sitting on the other end of that screen.

[bacan]

What's the story behind mpcdot.com? Just checked it out and it's pretty weird.

[speakeasy]

I think it was Roissy/Heartiste that started the trend of politicizing the manosphere with right-wing/libertarian/ultranationalist values.

What never makes sense to me is why are white nationalists on game forums? Their main crusade is stopping the disappearance of the white genotype. Well then their message in the case should be getting married at 18 and starting a large family. Not advocating game and promiscuity in the West. Seems rather counterproductive to me. Why don't they join Christian or Mormon sites instead?

[Deluge]

(02-07-2015 02:27 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

I think it was Roissy/Heartiste that started the trend of politicizing the manosphere with right-wing/libertarian/ultranationalist values.

What never makes sense to me is why are white nationalists on game forums? Their main crusade is stopping the disappearance of the white genotype. Well then their message in the case should be getting married at 18 and starting a large family. Not advocating game and promiscuity in the West. Seems rather counterproductive to me. Why don't they join Christian or Mormon sites instead?

Yeah, and they're taking game advice (although not necessarily implementing it) from a hairy Middle Eastern man who makes a living off of fucking European women.

Instead of doing this:

[speakeasy]

(02-07-2015 02:38 AM)Deluge Wrote:  

(02-07-2015 02:27 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

I think it was Roissy/Heartiste that started the trend of politicizing the manosphere with right-wing/libertarian/ultranationalist values.

What never makes sense to me is why are white nationalists on game forums? Their main crusade is stopping the disappearance of the white genotype. Well then their message in the case should be getting married at 18 and starting a large family. Not advocating game and promiscuity in the West. Seems rather counterproductive to me. Why don't they join Christian or Mormon sites instead?

Yeah, and they're taking game advice (although not necessarily implementing it) from a hairy Middle Eastern man who makes a living off of fucking European women.

Instead of doing this:

Interesting. Never heard of that program. The wikipedia says they believe in something called Christian Patriarchy and they seem pretty traditional conservative. The funny thing is that if anyone saves the white race, it will be these type of people. Not crybabies on Heartiste and Stormfront.

[TigerMandingo]

delete

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(02-07-2015 01:57 AM)dads Wrote:  

I think as a black guy in the manosphere, it gets hard to overlook some of racist stuff, especially over at CH. I do appreciate a lot of what he writes, but I don't appreciate being talked about as if I am a problem. The issue seems to be that people come to the red pill with a NAWALT mindset, and end up flipping it, but they do the same when it comes to race, when that is not the case. When you talk about women and hypergamy being in their nature, it's true. All women, at their core, are subject to what's been sewn into their DNA over thousands of years. However, with Black people, or other races we really aren't "All Like That", and it really gets to me when some of the writers around the manosphere can't seem to conflate their logical political arguments with that fact.

As a white guy I agree & approve the message above.

I read Heartiste ignoring his rather racist parts.

The racial aspect regarding IQs and behavior patterns are not really set. IQs improve with superior nutrients and lack of toxins during pregnancy and early childhood (also stimulation) and behavioral patterns are often created by religion, language, society you live in, climate, economic model etc.

I think that Heartiste just had too many experiences with underperforming DC blacks - if he were to venture out and meet second generation Christian blacks in Germany or would travel through Africa and see how extremely different the people in those countries are - he might reconsider some of his viewpoints.

I don't think we need to enforce PC-culture here, but those things tend to cross a line which is not necessary. We generally agree that outright racism is counter-productive - there may be racial tendencies of people, but they are just that - tendencies - as humans we are way more advanced and can be malleable way more by a multitude of factors.

[speakeasy]

@cunnilinguist

^^^ I'm guessing you're referring to me with that last line. I don't make fun of all Indian men. Just the ones that fit the IRT stereotype. I don't see that as any different than making fun of SWPLs or rachet black women.

[Switch]

Nevermind.

[TigerMandingo]

(02-07-2015 03:09 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  

@cunnilinguist

^^^ I'm guessing you're referring to me with that last line. I don't make fun of all Indian men. Just the ones that fit the IRT stereotype. I don't see that as any different than making fun of SWPLs or rachet black women.

Eh, all good. Truth is, I contributed there too. It's late and I shouldn't be getting sucked into these types of discussions. I'm always interested in your take on things.

[MMX2010]

(02-07-2015 03:08 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  

As a white guy I agree & approve the message above.

Me, too.

My parents are quite racist, and I've struggled against harboring racist beliefs for quite some time. And the contributions of the Black men on this forum have done the most to finally eliminate those racist feelings.