[Luckystar]

(04-07-2011 07:46 AM)Easy E Wrote:  

Scandinavian countries are expensive to visit and your success with the local women seems to be more based on your appearance & social circle than on any game skill. Not good...what if the chicks there don't dig you for some reason, you are fucked (or not, ha!).

There is a reason Scandinavian countries are not popular destinations for guys to go to get laid.

Still, it would be cool if Roosh visited Sweden just to get his take on it.

According to many cost of living sites, Stockholm is noticeably cheaper than Copenhagen, Oslo, and Helsinki. It seems to be on par with Toronto, which is expensive but not at levels of Norway.

Scandinavians I've talked to told me Stockholm is definitely cheaper.

You are right, it does seem very hit or miss at a macro level. That's not entirely a bad thing. Sometimes getting mixed results makes it difficult to decide whether you should stay or go.

[Screwston]

(04-07-2011 08:34 AM)Luckystar Wrote:  

(04-07-2011 05:06 AM)houston Wrote:  

(04-04-2011 10:14 PM)Kurupt Wrote:  

(04-04-2011 09:30 PM)Brian Wrote:  

I've heard stories about Russia that would make me nervous going there alone. I had a friend go into a bar w/a buddy, order drinks, and after about 10 minutes they both got that "uh oh" feeling where they knew they had been drugged. they left ASAP, ran back to their car, got in, locked the doors, and passed out for hours.

Hahaha drink spikes you!

If this is true i gotta add it to the very long list of epic stories I've heard from just about any foreigner visiting Russia. Which city was this, if you don't mind me asking? Sounds like St. Pete.

What people have to realize about Russia is it will never have western style democracy or freedoms. It will always be in this constant state of batshit fucked up. People say things like: "Russia should really clean up its act, it's going to lose so much money if tourism drops." The last thing Russia wants is tourists. The country barely cares about its own citizens, much less the satisfaction of visitors. There have been countless thinkers and intellectuals, Russian and foreign alike, who have proposed ways to "reform" and "modernize" Russia for the best. Some have even succeeded in ruling the nation and trying out the theories. At the end of the day, its a hell of a quirky country, and as such will never lose its appeal for the jaded few who are tired of travel to friendly nations.

I would love to check out Russia one day. Not for the girls but just to see how it is over there. I had a best friend in middle school from there. I wish I still talked to him to get some info but he'd probably ask why the hell I wanna go visit lol. If you're scared to visit a country, you're probably scared even to go to restaurants in certain american neighborhoods. Just keep your eyes and ears open and don't act like a retard

I don't think its about fear or being scared. Russia is a place where the vibe fuckin sucks IME. A lot of negative energy, especially if you are a colored person.

Have u been there? How bad is it?

[Excelsior]

(04-07-2011 07:46 AM)Easy E Wrote:  

I don't know if this is the case.

Scandinavian countries are expensive to visit and your success with the local women seems to be more based on your appearance & social circle than on any game skill. Not good...what if the chicks there don't dig you for some reason, you are fucked (or not, ha!).

I don't think you're really challenging my summary at all. We agree here.

Your success with women in the Scandinavian/Nordic region is not based on your "game skill". Women there "genuinely like nice guys", and those types of men are not known for their advanced game. They tend to be more passive, which works in places like Sweden(judging from anecdotes in this thread). If you're not a typical nice guy/beta and you rely on your "game skill", you're better off somewhere else. South America and South Asia offer far more opportunity for you with much less investment on your part(and a far lower cost of living).

If you ARE a typical American nice guy/beta, and you don't mind the idea of investing long term(more than just a few months), the trip might be worth it for you. Guys like that are willing to invest in social circle game and the like, so the downsides of Scandinavia will be felt less by them. For them, Scandinavia will likely be a pretty big step up from America(prettier girls who prefer their type more and are more sexually open).

As for your point about appearance, I can't see that being a huge issue. So long as you look presentable(stay in shape, don't dress like a slob, shave, etc) you should find women. Not a difficult thing to overcome.

Context is the key that's being overlooked a lot here. The viability of a destination might have a lot to do with who is visiting and what his demeanor/mindset is. This can be the difference between a place like Denmark being a solid destination or a waste of time, as it seems to be for Roosh.
There are different strokes for different folks, and we should always endeavor to find out what these strokes are in the places we want to visit.

[Luckystar]

(04-07-2011 11:18 AM)houston Wrote:  

Have u been there? How bad is it?

I don't want to go off topic, but I've been there 3 times and spend at least a month each time. There are some good things about Russia, but in the end I don't recommend the place. Russian people are about as racist as they come. The only people who really argue otherwise, are Russians. Russians are ignorant in behaviour, talk, and disposition. Worst of all, they are oblivious to it.

To be fair there are many good things about Russia (beautiful women mostly), but I never found it fun over there. There was always constant BS to deal with.

Let's get back on topic though...

[Luckystar]

(04-07-2011 11:50 AM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

If you ARE a typical American nice guy/beta, and you don't mind the idea of investing long term(more than just a few months), the trip might be worth it for you.

More than a few months? Even for long term, that sounds a bit much. Long term to me is 4+ weeks.

[Excelsior]

(04-07-2011 12:32 PM)Luckystar Wrote:  

(04-07-2011 11:50 AM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

If you ARE a typical American nice guy/beta, and you don't mind the idea of investing long term(more than just a few months), the trip might be worth it for you.

More than a few months? Even for long term, that sounds a bit much. Long term to me is 4+ weeks.

Yeah, you're right, but I wasn't sure exactly how people here would define long term so I just went to the extreme. I guess a a few months would be sufficient.

As for Russia, that is really to bad though it echoes a lot of what I'd been hearing. I'll definitely be staying towards the west of Eastern Europe should I choose to venture to that region.

[beebopaloo]

(04-07-2011 11:50 AM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

(04-07-2011 07:46 AM)Easy E Wrote:  

I don't know if this is the case.

Scandinavian countries are expensive to visit and your success with the local women seems to be more based on your appearance & social circle than on any game skill. Not good...what if the chicks there don't dig you for some reason, you are fucked (or not, ha!).

I don't think you're really challenging my summary at all. We agree here.

Your success with women in the Scandinavian/Nordic region is not based on your "game skill". Women there "genuinely like nice guys", and those types of men are not known for their advanced game. They tend to be more passive, which works in places like Sweden(judging from anecdotes in this thread). If you're not a typical nice guy/beta and you rely on your "game skill", you're better off somewhere else. South America and South Asia offer far more opportunity for you with much less investment on your part(and a far lower cost of living).

If you ARE a typical American nice guy/beta, and you don't mind the idea of investing long term(more than just a few months), the trip might be worth it for you. Guys like that are willing to invest in social circle game and the like, so the downsides of Scandinavia will be felt less by them. For them, Scandinavia will likely be a pretty big step up from America(prettier girls who prefer their type more and are more sexually open).

As for your point about appearance, I can't see that being a huge issue. So long as you look presentable(stay in shape, don't dress like a slob, shave, etc) you should find women. Not a difficult thing to overcome.

Context is the key that's being overlooked a lot here. The viability of a destination might have a lot to do with who is visiting and what his demeanor/mindset is. This can be the difference between a place like Denmark being a solid destination or a waste of time, as it seems to be for Roosh.
There are different strokes for different folks, and we should always endeavor to find out what these strokes are in the places we want to visit.

Now, Anthlone, I am sure you're nice guy, but this is the worst example of armchair philosophy I've seen in a while.

So before you book your ticket to go to the 'outgoing beta paradise' let me just warn you:
All Danish guys I know, who are getting laid regularly, are aggressive alphas, who approach like monsters!

I don't agree with Roosh at all at this point, and to be frank, with all due respect, I am questioning if he's approaching like a madman himself, cause this runs contrary to a lifetime of empirical research.

I am sure that other Danes and Scandinaviaphiles on the forum will be able to back this up.

[Easy E]

"I don't agree with Roosh at all at this point, and to be frank, with all due respect, I am questioning if he's approaching like a madman himself, cause this runs contrary to a lifetime of empirical research."

Could you break down why you think roosh is wrong? What do you disagree with?

I haven't ever known roosh to lie. He is pretty honest about his situation.

[beebopaloo]

(04-07-2011 02:07 PM)Easy E Wrote:  

"I don't agree with Roosh at all at this point, and to be frank, with all due respect, I am questioning if he's approaching like a madman himself, cause this runs contrary to a lifetime of empirical research."

Could you break down why you think roosh is wrong? What do you disagree with?

I haven't ever known roosh to lie. He is pretty honest about his situation.

I am not accusing anybody of lying, I am just stating that there might be more sides to the truth. So here is my perspective:

-It does make a difference if you're an aggressive alpha dude with game.


A)Because I am living in Denmark, B) I have met Roosh in real life, and C) gotten laid the same evening, in the same bar that I met Roosh.
She was Icelandic - I have to admit - but might as well have been Danish (cause they usually are..)

I'm not in anyway writing this to offend Roosh (who is doing an excellent job with the blog), but because it would seem weird to withhold knowledge that is more than specific about the whole situation.

[Roosh]

Quote:

She was Icelandic - I have to admit - but might as well have been Danish (cause they usually are..)

My Danish experience and Iceland experience have been like night and day. Icelandic girls are very different, even though they're basically the same blood.

Also, just because a guy approaches a lot doesn't mean he's an "aggressive alpha".

[Excelsior]

(04-07-2011 01:43 PM)beebopaloo Wrote:  

Now, Anthlone, I am sure you're nice guy, but this is the worst example of armchair philosophy I've seen in a while.

C'mon mate, surely its not that bad an example of armchair philosophy. I could understand that claim if I'd pulled it all out of thin air, but I did go off some solid anecdotal evidence from multiple respected members(LostGringo, GB, etc).
Can you blame me for connecting the seemingly plausible dots?

Quote:

So before you book your ticket to go to the 'outgoing beta paradise' let me just warn you:
All Danish guys I know, who are getting laid regularly, are aggressive alphas, who approach like monsters!

Ok, well I guess we need more anecdotes then to clear this all up. Anyone else with more experience in this region should speak up.

[OGNorCal707]

(04-07-2011 04:27 PM)beebopaloo Wrote:  

(04-07-2011 02:07 PM)Easy E Wrote:  

"I don't agree with Roosh at all at this point, and to be frank, with all due respect, I am questioning if he's approaching like a madman himself, cause this runs contrary to a lifetime of empirical research."

Could you break down why you think roosh is wrong? What do you disagree with?

I haven't ever known roosh to lie. He is pretty honest about his situation.

I am not accusing anybody of lying, I am just stating that there might be more sides to the truth. So here is my perspective:

-It does make a difference if you're an aggressive alpha dude with game.


A)Because I am living in Denmark, B) I have met Roosh in real life, and C) gotten laid the same evening, in the same bar that I met Roosh.
She was Icelandic - I have to admit - but might as well have been Danish (cause they usually are..)

I'm not in anyway writing this to offend Roosh (who is doing an excellent job with the blog), but because it would seem weird to withhold knowledge that is more than specific about the whole situation.

Hmm... interesting... Isn't there another forum member on here from Denmark (Quasi/?), I think he may have met Roosh as well, I wonder what his take on the situation is over there. Personally I haven't met too many Danish girls traveling, but one I met in Brazil a year ago was a major ho, like she fucked 3 different dudes in a week, but was like a 6.5 on the scale. The others were either pretty hot or just kind of average.

From what I've seen Swedish girls blow Danish girls out of the water and are consistently some of the hottest I've seen. I hear great things about Upsala a college town with a party scene, that has cool medieval architecture. Keep in mind that Scandanavian countries get like 20 hours of light in the summer, so people stay out late and party that time of year.

[Roosh]

Truth is beebopaloo's experience/knowledge with Danish women will not mirror the average guy traveling through Denmark because.... he's Danish. Danish girls interact with Danish guys much different than with foreigners traveling through, so it should be impossible that our experiences are identical. beebopaloo needs to look at it from a foreigner in, not what him or his buddies experience.

I am open to debate, but he hasn't highlighted specifically what he disagrees with, either with my take or Athlone's.

Though I will say that pointing out I'm wrong about Danish girls by highlighting the fact you banged an ICELANDIC girl is amusing.

[beebopaloo]

(04-08-2011 09:42 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Truth is beebopaloo's experience/knowledge with Danish women will not mirror the average guy traveling through Denmark because.... he's Danish. Danish girls interact with Danish guys much different than with foreigners traveling through, so it should be impossible that our experiences are identical. beebopaloo needs to look at it from a foreigner in, not what him or his buddies experience.

I am open to debate, but he hasn't highlighted specifically what he disagrees with, either with my take or Athlone's.

Though I will say that pointing out I'm wrong about Danish girls by highlighting the fact you banged an ICELANDIC girl is amusing.

Hehe, yeah I can see that it's not the best example in the world The fact is that 9 out of ten times it's probably a Danish chick instead of a foreigner.

The point that I disagree on is that pulling Danish chicks is any different from girls in other parts of the world.

My experience is that they go for the same traits as anywhere else. Then again, it might be harder being a foreigner here, I'm not in a position to tell. I know an American dude however, who did seem to do quite well.

So to recap, it is like anywhere else, being of higher value than the girls is key, and of course you can be that in a million of ways. Usually if you're sociable, well dressed and approach enough girls, you will get laid, period.

The guys I know who do well all do loads of cold approaches.
However, like anywhere else, if a girl actually approach you, half the work is done. But then again, the other method is 10x more effective.

So if Anthlone thinks coming to Denmark will be better than the states, my answer is NO.

Like you, Roosh, have pointed out, if you're not doing to well on your home ground, going abroad is not really the answer.

[Moma]

(04-03-2011 02:58 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:

So which is worse, Denmark or Argentina?

Denmark hands down. In Argentina the women are far more beautiful, sexy, and feminine. But Danish girls are easier. Yet Argentina is 4x cheaper.

Danish women are more masculine then American women, but not as fat, and harder to get the one-night stand. I'm trying to think of a reason why anyone would come to Denmark.

I'll let you know when I come up with something.

Tripping up men in a club is extremely alpha LMAO.

I always imagined that Denmark was easy, I had a friend from there and she always said sex in Denmark was straightforward and it was easy to get laid there.
Me and her did accomplish sexy time and she was an easy and fun lay.

Her friends from there also seemed easy to pipe, I didn't go for them out of respect.

Her landlady was also Danish and a freak too. Once she came in the room post sex and saw me asleep butt with my dingaling hanging out and she just giggled.

Another time the Danish landlady came down out of the shower butt naked. I saw her, she saw me and then she apologised (without shame) and went back into her room.

My friend also said that one of her friends buttraped her boyfriend with a strapon just to show him what it was like.

My friend also used to meet a lot of men to buttrape with strapons and I think her husband (fiancee) at the time was actually open to observing this behaviour.

That's Danish for ya.

[Moma]

(04-05-2011 01:46 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

(04-05-2011 12:38 PM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

Man, that sounds really promising. Can you maybe elaborate on this dynamic there and how you've seen it play out?
I've read this whole thread and understand the negatives as they've been presented, but statements like these make me think that it still might be a worthwhile destination for some guys.

No it's not promising because success is based less on game skill that another factors which are harder to grasp and optimize. Right now I can't elaborate on it because I don't completely understand things myself,.

A lot of these places in my opinion are based on annoying social dynamics which I think is based on socialism. A few cities that I have lived in have these factors in place i.e. London, England and Toronto, Canada.

There is no winning formula in these cities. If you are not in the social club, you have to just crank out a high number count which any chimp could do.

That's my take on Scandinavia but I could be wrong.

[Moma]

(04-08-2011 12:10 PM)BR88 Wrote:  

(04-03-2011 02:58 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:

So which is worse, Denmark or Argentina?

Danish women are more masculine then American women, but not as fat, and harder to get the one-night stand. I'm trying to think of a reason why anyone would come to Denmark.

Traveling the world is its own reward, Roosh.

Stop being such a slave to your dick, and look at the bigger picture.

Yea but this is a forum about getting global pussy, brah. There are lots of forums and guides on the bigger picture but very few that are honest about how to get pussy in other countries.

What I like about Roosh's account is that he doesn't look like the typical blond hair, blue eyed westerner. Which means that he can't coast on acceptance, he has to actually carve out the pussy himself.

Can you dig it, BR88?

[Excelsior]

(04-08-2011 10:35 AM)beebopaloo Wrote:  

The point that I disagree on is that pulling Danish chicks is any different from girls in other parts of the world.

My experience is that they go for the same traits as anywhere else. Then again, it might be harder being a foreigner here, I'm not in a position to tell. I know an American dude however, who did seem to do quite well.

So to recap, it is like anywhere else, being of higher value than the girls is key, and of course you can be that in a million of ways. Usually if you're sociable, well dressed and approach enough girls, you will get laid, period.

The failure of this argument rests in its simplicity, embodied in the first sentence of this quote.

You are stating that pulling Danish chicks is no different from girls in other parts of the world. Anybody who is nuanced in the art of travel and discovery knows that the probability of this statement actually ringing true is quite low.

Cultures vary. With these variations in emphasis come differences in a multitude of societal realms-social, political, economic and yes, sexual.

Hypergamy is real the world over, and women are wired similarly across the planet. This means that in actuality, there will always be some things that are generally effective nearly anywhere you go(fame comes to mind).

While overlap exists and likely always will, it must also be noted that cultural variation will have an effect on female mate choice. Nuances will exist in different cultures that can create significant variations in the effectiveness of different male mating strategies within these respective environments. To put it simply, what works in one culture/region may not work in another...or it could work, but not to quite the same extent...or it could work just as well, but not in precisely the same way(read: different consequences).

Let's take your statement about value. You're right when you say that the key in all cases is to be high value-that advice will ring true the world over.

The wildcard companion to this notion that you omit relates to the likely differences in the way various cultures perceive "high value". Many things will remain the same: wealth, fame, fortune, height and ripped abs, etc-these can work almost anywhere.
But not all cultures emphasize the exact same traits. Some value extroversion-others are more introverted. Some value aggression, others passivity. Some are highly traditional, others more liberal. a high value individual in one culture cannot always guarantee the maintenance of such a status in another.

The sheer complexity of cultural variation and its pervasive impact on nearly all sectors of our society(including those most intimate to us) makes it highly unlikely that picking up women in your country is without some significant difference from picking up women in my own. As I said, some basic things will remain the same, but those differences can have quite a large impact on one individual's success rate(assuming they have the basics down).

If you want to continue to go with this assumption (implying that Danish women are the same as American or other women), you'd be better served by comparing and contrasting two cultures (That of Denmark and another of your choice) and showing their specific similarities as they relate to dating-this would be the best way to show conclusively that there is no discernible difference between the nuances and value systems inherent to each one, and thus no notable difference in the sexual marketplace.

Challenging the anecdotes presented by Roosh and others in this thread would also help you. I would be willing to bet, however, that such a comparative analysis(should you complete it) would yield quite a few significant differences of the kind I am speaking of, enough to convince most that things are not precisely the same at all.

Quote:

So if Anthlone thinks coming to Denmark will be better than the states, my answer is NO.

My name is Athlone. Not Anthlone, ATHlone.

As far as coming to Denmark, I won't be doing so anytime soon. I'm a broke 19 year old college student as of now, I'm not going anywhere. My argument does not stem from an immediate need for personal self gratification in light of a planned trip.

Quote:

Like you, Roosh, have pointed out, if you're not doing to well on your home ground, going abroad is not really the answer.

Another highly debatable point. Once again, the answer is nuanced, and I will give an example from my own experience to illustrate this.

I'm in college right now. It is a school in the Ivy League. I don't do well here as far as girls go. I'm in my second year and while things have picked up, they haven't done so quite as much as I'd hoped.

I've had the fortune of taking a few trips back to my hometown, which is a three hour distance away by automobile. I got the chance to hang out and socialize there. I also took the time to reflect on my experiences there back in high school.

You know what I realized? I do far better with women back in that city, even amongst people there that I do not know well and didn't grow up with. I get far more eye contact and direct initiation from women, and a much larger number of them are willing to approach me and, in turn, respond favorably when I approach them. My experience with students at the nearby state university in my hometown were night and day when compared to my experience back at my school. I went from virtual radio silence with women to steady female-initiated approaches and blatant IOIs.

Do you know why this is? Cultural variation. I'm the same guy wherever I go. The differences come in the local cultural flavors I encounter in different places. At my Ivy school, the traits I offer are valued less. Even when they are valued, local cultural norms limit the likelihood of females expressing this preference openly even after you initiate contact (read: fewer indicators of interest, enhanced difficulty of approach relative to other places). It is the opposite in other parts of the country, which is why I see far superior results at the other schools I've visited and in other regions in general.

I'm not the only guy I know who actually realizes this, btw-on my campus, it is quite commonly acknowledged by a number of men who have had the chance to travel and experence different environments after being at the school for a while. Women are flakier and harder to get in this environment relative to others-travel just a couple of hours away and the difference will be noticeable.

Now, having delivered this anecdote, let us review your original claim:

Quote:

Like you, Roosh, have pointed out, if you're not doing to well on your home ground, going abroad is not really the answer.

I agree with you to an extent-going abroad is not an automatic fix for every guy, as his success will depend on:

-Where he's going and how well he may fit in to that culture.
-Whether or not he has the basics down(fat slobs with bad hygiene don't do well anywhere).

That being said, you take this argument a bit further and claim definitively that migration is "not really the answer", and that is where I must disagree. For some guys, migration very well could be the answer to increased success with women, especially if they take the time to educate themselves before traveling (helping them get a better idea as to where they will fit, something we do on this forum all the time) and have the basics down (are in shape, able to socialize on a normal level, etc).

As I've noted, one can see significant results even within just one small region of one nation (my anecdote takes place entirely in the Northeastern United States). A three hour drive can make a world of difference. Men on this forum have spoken extensively of the variation between cities and how even seemingly trivial factors like size can create big differences in their ability to pick up.
The chances of such significant regional variances not being possible on a more international level are quite low, to say the least.

[beebopaloo]

(04-08-2011 01:48 PM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  

(04-08-2011 10:35 AM)beebopaloo Wrote:  

The point that I disagree on is that pulling Danish chicks is any different from girls in other parts of the world.

My experience is that they go for the same traits as anywhere else. Then again, it might be harder being a foreigner here, I'm not in a position to tell. I know an American dude however, who did seem to do quite well.

So to recap, it is like anywhere else, being of higher value than the girls is key, and of course you can be that in a million of ways. Usually if you're sociable, well dressed and approach enough girls, you will get laid, period.

The failure of this argument rests in its simplicity, embodied in the first sentence of this quote.

You are stating that pulling Danish chicks is no different from girls in other parts of the world. Anybody who is nuanced in the art of travel and discovery knows that the probability of this statement actually ringing true is quite low.

Cultures vary. With these variations in emphasis come differences in a multitude of societal realms-social, political, economic and yes, sexual.

Hypergamy is real the world over, and women are wired similarly across the planet. This means that in actuality, there will always be some things that are generally effective nearly anywhere you go(fame comes to mind).

While overlap exists and likely always will, it must also be noted that cultural variation will have an effect on female mate choice. Nuances will exist in different cultures that can create significant variations in the effectiveness of different male mating strategies within these respective environments. To put it simply, what works in one culture/region may not work in another...or it could work, but not to quite the same extent...or it could work just as well, but not in precisely the same way(read: different consequences).

Let's take your statement about value. You're right when you say that the key in all cases is to be high value-that advice will ring true the world over.

The wildcard companion to this notion that you omit relates to the likely differences in the way various cultures perceive "high value". Many things will remain the same: wealth, fame, fortune, height and ripped abs, etc-these can work almost anywhere.
But not all cultures emphasize the exact same traits. Some value extroversion-others are more introverted. Some value aggression, others passivity. Some are highly traditional, others more liberal. a high value individual in one culture cannot always guarantee the maintenance of such a status in another.

The sheer complexity of cultural variation and its pervasive impact on nearly all sectors of our society(including those most intimate to us) makes it highly unlikely that picking up women in your country is without some significant difference from picking up women in my own. As I said, some basic things will remain the same, but those differences can have quite a large impact on one individual's success rate(assuming they have the basics down).

If you want to continue to go with this assumption (implying that Danish women are the same as American or other women), you'd be better served by comparing and contrasting two cultures (That of Denmark and another of your choice) and showing their specific similarities as they relate to dating-this would be the best way to show conclusively that there is no discernible difference between the nuances and value systems inherent to each one, and thus no notable difference in the sexual marketplace.

Challenging the anecdotes presented by Roosh and others in this thread would also help you. I would be willing to bet, however, that such a comparative analysis(should you complete it) would yield quite a few significant differences of the kind I am speaking of, enough to convince most that things are not precisely the same at all.

Quote:

So if Anthlone thinks coming to Denmark will be better than the states, my answer is NO.

My name is Athlone. Not Anthlone, ATHlone.

As far as coming to Denmark, I won't be doing so anytime soon. I'm a broke 19 year old college student as of now, I'm not going anywhere. My argument does not stem from an immediate need for personal self gratification in light of a planned trip.

Quote:

Like you, Roosh, have pointed out, if you're not doing to well on your home ground, going abroad is not really the answer.

Another highly debatable point. Once again, the answer is nuanced, and I will give an example from my own experience to illustrate this.

I'm in college right now. It is a school in the Ivy League. I don't do well here as far as girls go. I'm in my second year and while things have picked up, they haven't done so quite as much as I'd hoped.

I've had the fortune of taking a few trips back to my hometown, which is a three hour distance away by automobile. I got the chance to hang out and socialize there. I also took the time to reflect on my experiences there back in high school.

You know what I realized? I do far better with women back in that city, even amongst people there that I do not know well and didn't grow up with. I get far more eye contact and direct initiation from women, and a much larger number of them are willing to approach me and, in turn, respond favorably when I approach them. My experience with students at the nearby state university in my hometown were night and day when compared to my experience back at my school. I went from virtual radio silence with women to steady female-initiated approaches and blatant IOIs.

Do you know why this is? Cultural variation. I'm the same guy wherever I go. The differences come in the local cultural flavors I encounter in different places. At my Ivy school, the traits I offer are valued less. Even when they are valued, local cultural norms limit the likelihood of females expressing this preference openly even after you initiate contact (read: fewer indicators of interest, enhanced difficulty of approach relative to other places). It is the opposite in other parts of the country, which is why I see far superior results at the other schools I've visited and in other regions in general.

I'm not the only guy I know who actually realizes this, btw-on my campus, it is quite commonly acknowledged by a number of men who have had the chance to travel and experence different environments after being at the school for a while. Women are flakier and harder to get in this environment relative to others-travel just a couple of hours away and the difference will be noticeable.

Now, having delivered this anecdote, let us review your original claim:

Quote:

Like you, Roosh, have pointed out, if you're not doing to well on your home ground, going abroad is not really the answer.

I agree with you to an extent-going abroad is not an automatic fix for every guy, as his success will depend on:

-Where he's going and how well he may fit in to that culture.
-Whether or not he has the basics down(fat slobs with bad hygiene don't do well anywhere).

That being said, you take this argument a bit further and claim definitively that migration is "not really the answer", and that is where I must disagree. For some guys, migration very well could be the answer to increased success with women, especially if they take the time to educate themselves before traveling (helping them get a better idea as to where they will fit, something we do on this forum all the time) and have the basics down (are in shape, able to socialize on a normal level, etc).

As I've noted, one can see significant results even within just one small region of one nation (my anecdote takes place entirely in the Northeastern United States). A three hour drive can make a world of difference. Men on this forum have spoken extensively of the variation between cities and how even seemingly trivial factors like size can create big differences in their ability to pick up.
The chances of such significant regional variances not being possible on a more international level are quite low, to say the least.

Okay, you got me...

Of course there are differences.

But they aren't that fucking big. Thats what I am trying to get across.

More than 50% of Danish TV is produced in the states. If there is a market for that I guess we can conclude that the value system is more or less the same.

Scandinavians tend to think that Americans talk too much, are too self obsessed, but other than that it's pretty similar. Those are pretty small differences. Plus we are able to communicate in the same language, which means it's not like going to Mars or some parallel dimension where all values are turned upside down.

I am not saying that it's not easier or harder anywhere in the world. There are small differences everywhere. However if you're a cool dude, you will do well most places. If you're a beta dude, your low self esteem will travel with you - even though you go to the other side of the world. So be the cool dude and benefit, that's my line of thought.

Nobody likes to see fat old germans in Thailand or want to be those guys, though they definitely do better than they do back home.

[Roosh]

Athlone completely destroyed it. That's like a blog post right there.

beebop you lost me here as well: "The point that I disagree on is that pulling Danish chicks is any different from girls in other parts of the world."

The proof you are incorrect is the existence of THIS VERY FORUM.

One thing I've noticed is that Danish people are hypersensitive to foreigners criticizing their culture, much more than other cultures (even Americans). For example I've had Danish people self-criticize themselves, then I pile on with a critical observation about the culture as well, and then am attacked as being "wrong," implying that I'm arrogant and narrow to even generalize about Danes (even though they are the easiest to generalize because of their conformist and egalitarian culture where individual variation is slight). I have a feeling that at least unconsciously you don't like remarks that are critical of Denmark, since your attacks on me and Athlone didn't even have specific arguments.

Anyway, I'm glad we can have a civil discussion about this.

[Luckystar]

(Sigh) What a depressing thread. It's getting hard to read your tweets, Roosh. When are you leaving Denmark?

[Roosh]

Four more weeks. I made the mistake of getting into a 2 month lease before understanding how things really were. I had a friend here, I was riding high from good times in Iceland, and figured that Denmark would be similar. I was very wrong. Lesson learned... don't commit until doing the proper research. Never assume!

On the bright side I am getting a lot of work done.

[Duke Castile]

I'm just getting caught up. If you're locked in there isnt much that can be done but, remember your rule for cutting your losses in a club on a single night can be applied at the "macro" level of a country. I'm guessing this was the source of your blog about finding the perfect spot in the perfect bar etc.

[LostGringo]

"Simplicity is the Ultimate Sophistication" - Leonardo daVinci

Maybe he was onto to something. Thus, I humbly offer the following:

Go Solo
Go Local
Go Long

Solo: I always travel alone. Having said that, I'm usually not alone for long. Which leads to number 2;

Local: I get "local" as fast as I can. That means getting into the community you are engaging as fast as possible. Also, when I am solo and "local" - almost without exception, I learn the lay of the land much more quickly, learn the local woman angle, get invited into social networks and ultimately, get more pussy, faster.

Long: The "further" I go into a country, the better I do. Almost without exception. That doesn't necessarily mean going to some small city in Argentina instead of BA. But it does mean heading out to a barrio like Ramos Meilla instead of the standards of the turistas/rich people in a place like Puerto Madero.

[rudebwoy]

Could it be the time of year. I always assumed Danish girls were hot having seen so many in my travels. Now that you mention it a friend of mine did fcuk a Icelandic chick when he was visiting Copenhagen, which has been mentioned before.