[Beyond Borders]

(12-23-2013 11:08 AM)RioNomad Wrote:  

BB, you don't have to train hardcore for life. It's best to stay in shape and train when you can, but as you say, a couple years of boxing will put you way ahead of most guys out there.

Damn't. I was thinking maybe I could just watch one Bruce Lee movie per week and do a lot of affirmations.

[Aliblahba]

I punched fisto in the head and it made him talk funny, so I felt bad and kicked him, and he went back to normal. Well, normal for him anyways.

[Architekt]

If you could pick just 2 for a beginner to start on, what would you guys choose?

I'm thinking probably BJJ and boxing/kickboxing would be a good combination (I actually want to get into some MMA starting 2014, so I'd like some constructive feedback here). The combination of submission skills and general striking ability from those seems to me like a solid choice to me, but opinions from guys that actually train and fight would be appreciated

[txtraveler]

(12-23-2013 11:04 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  

(12-23-2013 10:55 AM)txtraveler Wrote:  

With me, BJJ is a passion. I don't train it just for sport or self defense. I do it because I LOVE the art for what it is. Of course it helps that you are surrounded by people that motivate you.

Not sure if you caught my initial post on the matter.

I'm well aware that most practitioners are driven by passion. A lot of people who train constantly feel that way, and that's pretty cool as far as interests go.

My post was focused on the question of whether there was an 80/20 for the rest of the world that made more sense.

It's like the idea of training for wilderness survival skills your whole life that you likely won't need. Sure, if you love being in the wilderness all the time and really have a passion for the stuff, that's fantastic - have at it. But for the general modern-day man who has other things he'd rather focus on, it seems to make more sense that you know the 20% that is imperative.

I understand. I re-read your post.
Just stating why I do it. I got hooked. There are other things I focus on as well. BJJ is a priority for me. I know as I grow older I'll have to make it less of a priority.
As for the 80/20, there really is no reason to train lifelong to protect yourself when you may in fact never get in a street fight. It'd be better to train for a little while, then go back to training just for a refresher. With BJJ it is a little different. Some can come back to training and it'll be like riding a bike, once you know how to do it, you know how. It's a lot different for others.
Does that make sense? lol

[Veloce]

There's this boxing gym two blocks from my place I've been curious about. If you go two blocks south of my neighborhood thing get a little rough and that's where the gym is. There's white security bars over all the windows, there's no phone number listed and I can't find a website for them.

I should probably check it out.

[Merenguero]

(12-23-2013 02:08 PM)thedude3737 Wrote:  

There's this boxing gym two blocks from my place I've been curious about. If you go two blocks south of my neighborhood thing get a little rough and that's where the gym is. There's white security bars over all the windows, there's no phone number listed and I can't find a website for them.

I should probably check it out.

If you live close to Wildcard, that might be an option for you.
http://www.wildcardboxingstore.com/shop/...-gym-info/

[PoosyWrecker]

(12-23-2013 11:23 AM)Architekt Wrote:  

If you could pick just 2 for a beginner to start on, what would you guys choose?

I'm thinking probably BJJ and boxing/kickboxing would be a good combination (I actually want to get into some MMA starting 2014, so I'd like some constructive feedback here). The combination of submission skills and general striking ability from those seems to me like a solid choice to me, but opinions from guys that actually train and fight would be appreciated

As long as you stick with the proven MMA subdisciplines it's probably more important that you choose a gym with athletic training partners who have the same goals as you.

If you are in Phnom Penh there is a boxing gym called Paddy's that offers private one on one lessons for $10 / hr.

[Checkmat]

The only fighting reference material you need

[Architekt]

There's a Muay Thai gym that seems to be an offshoot of an actual Thai gym and a BJJ gym that has a reputation for being one of the best in the state near where I'll be moving soon. Seems like it might prove difficult to get spots at the BJJ gym, though.

There's also another gym that's pretty close that teaches some weird ass combination that's supposedly "a practical, street-wise martial art, and is not competition oriented." Sounds dodge as fuck to me, but might potentially be useful?

"you will learn how to defend yourself using your hands, legs, knees and elbows through the arts of Karate, Muay Thai Kickboxing, Boxing and Taekwondo. You will also learn how to apply locks, chokes, holds, restraints, pressure points and take-downs through the arts of Ju Jitsu and Eskrima (also known as Arnis and Kali)"

There's also a separate Eskrima class, which actually sounds pretty interesting, but I think I'm still a lot more keen on the other options..

[PoosyWrecker]

Would you mind posting the websites of those gyms?

[Architekt]

PoosyWrecker,

The Arena MMA - For BJJ
Sangmorakot Muay Thai gym

The credentials of the trainers seems pretty legit

[reaper23]

i've had several muay thai fights and have trained both bjj and mma.

the one thing i wished i had started with when i was younger was wrestling

top control and sub defense go a long way towards a win
and if you can learn good hands, keeping it standing against a bjj guy will be good too

wrestling allows you to take the fight to where you have an advantage whether standing or on the ground

all that being said, muay thai seems like a good way to get into mma. hands, feet, knees, clinch work, foot work and it is the right range for mma. boxing has the wrong range and foot work (doesn't account for take downs, kicks or knees - but is still useful).

and if you get to a high quality gym they'll offer both and you can take both

[reaper23]

(12-23-2013 11:07 AM)Moma Wrote:  

A little bit of something is always better than a whole lot of nothing

not always. the false sense of security a lot of dudes get from a few months of training might lead them to avoid confrontations as arduously as they should

[reaper23]

interesting about BJJ vs the untrained. its white belt technique applied with a blue or higher belt's consistency that does get the job done. not much more needed than expertly applied take down, mount and arm bar to end the fight quickly (via broken arm not a 'submission')

brown and black belt level bjj really is all about the counter to the counter to the counter and it becomes a mental exercise in many ways similar to rock paper scissors haha

[PoosyWrecker]

Since you plan to compete I think the best thing you can do is to find 3 to 5 other guys around the same weight class, you all chip in to hire a private mma coach to run two a days for a few weeks, someone who can fill in the gaps at those two gyms. Someone who can teach you wrestling, what jits works and what doesn't when you're getting punched, the differences in standup wearing small 4oz gloves, how to fight against the cage, cutting weight, S&C etc

I heard Australians are loaded with cash maybe you can hire Fisto for a month?

[Architekt]

Haha I don't work in the mines, but that would be pretty sick

"Well, great session guys, let's go get a beer and more south-east-asian women than you thought possible"

[Bushido]

What do you guys make of Krav Maga? Is it a useful first step or would boxing be better? There are both near to where I live.

I know they are totally different disciplines but wondering which you would start out with if you had no martial arts/fighting experience.

[PoosyWrecker]

American Krav Maga is today's counterpart to the late 80s, 90s Karate & Tae Kwon Do McDojos.

[Bushido]

(12-25-2013 12:41 AM)PoosyWrecker Wrote:  

American Krav Maga is today's counterpart to the late 80s, 90s Karate & Tae Kwon Do McDojos.

So you're telling me it's good?

[The Beast1]

(01-02-2014 03:24 AM)dreambig Wrote:  

(12-25-2013 12:41 AM)PoosyWrecker Wrote:  

American Krav Maga is today's counterpart to the late 80s, 90s Karate & Tae Kwon Do McDojos.

So you're telling me it's good?

Yeah, be honest. I read an article on RoK about it and i liked what it offered.

I personally need to learn how to street fight. I don't see the point of sport fighting as I don't want to compete. I just need to learn how to fight.

The one Krav Maga gym i've looked at in my town seems to be connected with a lot of Israeli Krav Maga competitions. It looks legit heck they even have sparring.

[Duke Castile]

What turns me off about krav is that they have female instructors that think they could actually beat a man.

[samsamsam]

(01-02-2014 11:15 AM)Fisto Wrote:  

What turns me off about krav is that they have female instructors that think they could actually beat a man.

Wait, I am confused, I thought that was the truth

[Giovonny]

(12-24-2013 09:39 PM)dreambig Wrote:  

would boxing be better?

which you would start out with if you had no martial arts/fighting experience.

It depends which has the better teacher.

A shitty teacher will make any martial art useless.

A great teacher can prepare you much faster and better.

Visit both gyms and get a feel for which one would be best for you.

Try both, maybe a few months of one and then switch to the other..?

(01-02-2014 09:33 AM)frenchie Wrote:  

I personally need to learn how to street fight.

I don't see the point of sport fighting

Sport fighting will train and prepare you for a street fight.

You don't don't have to compete in competitions but you should definitely be sparring.

[rekruler]

Wow, this thread received lots of good feedback, thanks guys!

In general, would it be hard to find a gym that offered sessions backloaded to Fridays and weekends? I work for a consulting company and Monday through Thursday night I'm out of state, so weekday evening sessions wouldn't do it for me.

After reading through all the replies, I'm leaning to going the Muay Thai route with whatever supplemental training I can get in basic ground game and especially takedowns. How much should I be looking to spend a month for good Muay Thai instruction?

[DoctaWho]

I'm chimming in pretty late on this and I hate to be a naysayer but are you really sure it's for you? I don't know any amateur or pro mma fighters but I've known several boxers in my day and only two have ever fought pro fights. The rest have pretty much brawled it out on the amateur circuit or quit.

I can't speak for mma but at least in boxing you can generally get on an amateur card if you're willing to travel and have a trainer that will network on your behalf.

Where I live there are a couple of mma gyms that have fight teams and I met someone whose husband trains at one of the gyms. She told me that most of the guys on the fight team don't really make a lot and spend a lot of time in the gym training (often during the hours that most people are working). Every combat sport is full of guys who thought they were tough but dropped out because the training was hard or because they did not go anywhere with it or because once they bell rung they realized how real the shit was. For example, I knew a guy who was 6'2 205 but was athletically talented enough to cut 30 pounds. His first real fight he came out looking great. He was great with the foot work so he danced circles around the other guy until the last minute of the first round. The guy caught him with a beautiful left jab followed by an overhand right that did not knock him out but but him against the ropes for the rest of the round. He told his corner he couldn't keep going and the fight was stopped. He was a hell of an athlete and had never really been hit until that point and when it happened his visions of being a pro fighter died.


Given the little I know about mma I would say that if you are serious then do your best to find guys in your area who fight competitively and train in a way that gives you something to offer them as a sparring partner. One of the guys I knew who was a pro boxer was always looking for south paws who were quick counter punchers to spar with because that's what he struggled with. When he or his trainer found one they would usually keep the kid around and the trainer would work with him. From what I've seen all mma guys aren't well rounded so if you can put together a good striking or ground game then you'll have value as a sparing partner and can probably get some training for their coach because of that. IMO talent alone does not make a great fighter, the coaches they work with have a lot of impact on turning a regular fighter into a pro.

Someone talked about krav chicks thinking they could beat a man, I think the ones at a higher level could. For a lot of people krav is not a sport or a way to burn calories, it is a tool to do the most damage to anyone who messes with you as quickly as possible. No a smaller woman cannot beat a larger man if she tries to trade punches with him but we all have soft spots on our bodies. It doesn't matter if you're 75lbs or 300lbs the same force is needed to crush your trachea. Of course this is America, where in most gyms kickboxing is cardio kickboxing but if you find the right instructor (male or female) I think krav is legit.