[FretDancer]

Just read through this whole thread after Hades suggesting removing grain and dairy from my diet, regarding bacne.

I want to give it a try for some time and analyze the results. I've probably been some weeks off milk in the past, but this time it will be a little more "monitorized".

Sadly, I went to buy some milk from the supermarket yesterday, so I'm gonna start right after I finish this milk.

Back on topic, milk does bloat me a lot too, a hell lot. After making my protein shake with milk I get very bloated. It sucks, but after sleeping and waking up the next day the bloating is gone. I might replace my current milk with almond milk for my protein shake.

[Mon]

The best milk for the lactose-intolerant would be kefir (fermented milk) made from raw milk of grass fed ruminant animals (cows, goats, sheep, buffalo, camels, etc.)
It's best you make this yourself with fresh, raw milk . In addition to the benefits of the healthy bacteria in kefir, the fermentation process consumes the lactose.

A high quality ghee, made from the raw butter of grass fed cows contains neither casein (that infamous protein found in cows' milk) nor lactose. Just the pure fat.

Pasturized milk is pretty much useless as a food, if health is what you're after.

I personally gave up dairy in 1995. I recently added High Vitamin Butter Oil (from raw butter of grass fed cows) and bovine colostrum.

[Basil Ransom]

Mon, does the casein become more digestible once fermented?

Unfortunately, anything calling for raw milk is prohibitively expensive, as it runs $18 a gallon.

I'm going to start a thread on fermented foods when I get home.

[Mon]

Yeah BasilRansom...the kefir fermentation process "predigests" (breaks down) the casein making it more digestible. Nearly everyone that I talk to who say they don't do well with casein, say that kefir gives them no problem.
Of course, if you can, you can try and get access to the raw milk of grass-fed ruminant animals other than cows. It is most cows which produce the problematic casein known as A1-beta casein. Humans, goats, sheep, buffalo produce the A2 form.
I know several people making their raw milk kefir with the milk of grass-fed goats, sheep, & buffalo. I know of a farmer who raises camels and swears by the raw milk, kefir & cheeses of camels.

DEFINITELY start the thread on fermented foods. I'm a fermentation FANATIC. Before leaving the house this morning, I had a smoothie with two tablespoons of fresh, homemade almond-coconut "yogurt." It's made with...you guessed it...raw, unpasteurized almonds; straight-from-the-coconut, coconut meat; and starter bacteria.

[JayJuanGee]

Actually, this news is worth a bump of this thread:

I get so worked up about some nutrition matters, and the misinformation that is proliferated by industries attempting to contaminate our food supply, and the recent news about man made milk, gets me extra worked up, too.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/inno...a-reality/

I find the appeal of this as ridiculous and more propaganda and movement away from real food and ways to make money and to deceive regular people into thinking that the processed shit is better than the real deal - which would be raw milk.

[rudebwoy]

Don't touch the stuff, maybe cheese once in a blue moon.

[Sonsowey]

Yes. Good quality wherever you can but butter, ghee, cheese and yogurt are great. Whole grass fed milk in your coffee is amazing.

[Tail Gunner]

(07-26-2014 07:48 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  

Actually, this news is worth a bump of this thread:

I get so worked up about some nutrition matters, and the misinformation that is proliferated by industries attempting to contaminate our food supply, and the recent news about man made milk, gets me extra worked up, too.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/inno...a-reality/

I find the appeal of this as ridiculous and more propaganda and movement away from real food and ways to make money and to deceive regular people into thinking that the processed shit is better than the real deal - which would be raw milk.

I hear you. From the article:

Quote:

“The beauty of this method is that we can use the same DNA since the difference between various kinds of milk, like donkey’s milk or goat milk, has mostly to do with ratios of fat, sugars and proteins,” Ghandi says. “So the most important thing is to get the flavor as close to exact possible.”

No kidding. One of the reasons that autoimmune disorders are now so prevalent in our society is that milk and wheat proteins are both so similar to proteins made in the human body that they pass through the human intestines and into the blood. After hunter-killer cells finish attacking the invading proteins they then turn around and attack the body, whose proteins are quite similar. "An autoimmune disorder occurs when the body's immune system attacks and destroys healthy body tissue by mistake." Gee, I wonder how that happens.

Having a gluten intolerance or lactose intolerance is just the beginning of the long slide into poor health.

[JayJuanGee]

(07-26-2014 09:18 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(07-26-2014 07:48 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  

Actually, this news is worth a bump of this thread:

I get so worked up about some nutrition matters, and the misinformation that is proliferated by industries attempting to contaminate our food supply, and the recent news about man made milk, gets me extra worked up, too.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/inno...a-reality/

I find the appeal of this as ridiculous and more propaganda and movement away from real food and ways to make money and to deceive regular people into thinking that the processed shit is better than the real deal - which would be raw milk.

I hear you. From the article:

Quote:

“The beauty of this method is that we can use the same DNA since the difference between various kinds of milk, like donkey’s milk or goat milk, has mostly to do with ratios of fat, sugars and proteins,” Ghandi says. “So the most important thing is to get the flavor as close to exact possible.”

No kidding. One of the reasons that autoimmune disorders are now so prevalent in our society is that milk and wheat proteins are both so similar to proteins made in the human body that they pass through the human intestines and into the blood. After hunter-killer cells finish attacking the invading proteins they then turn around and attack the body, whose proteins are quite similar. "An autoimmune disorder occurs when the body's immune system attacks and destroys healthy body tissue by mistake." Gee, I wonder how that happens.

Having a gluten intolerance or lactose intolerance is just the beginning of the long slide into poor health.

Thanks for that commentary, TG.....

Yep, I wonder what can go wrong???...


these agribusiness fuckers are continuously manipulating.. including GMOs and also shrinking the seed supply by patents and bullshit like that.... all in the name of profits and "health."

The healthy condition of the bottom line.

Maybe the europeans will be more likely to disallow these kinds of products b/c the USA Govt seems to be more than willing to kiss the asses of agribusiness interests.

[cmrocks]

The only dairy that I really eat is cheese.

[ElBorrachoInfamoso]

I gave up cow dairy, but still eat foods with goat and sheep milk. Lactose intolerance isn't a problem but I read some people had good experiences giving up cow dairy so I tried a little experiment. After a few weeks I noticed the following changes.

1. Cravings for sweets dramatically reduced - I usually had milk with sweets or a milk-based sweet in the past
2. Self-control is better - this could just be due to exercising self-control in not eating dairy
3. Coffee addiction is weaker but still present - maybe some of the cravings were due to the milk I used to put in my coffee
4. Definition in triceps and jawline is better - this is strange and maybe just due to general fat loss
5. Exercise-induced asthma is dramatically reduced - I don't even use my inhaler before high intensity cardio now, that would have been unthinkable in the past.

I didn't have a problem with acne so I can't tell if giving up cow's milk helped me there. Acne practically disappeared after I gave up gluten.

[JayJuanGee]

(07-28-2014 04:19 AM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

I gave up cow dairy, but still eat foods with goat and sheep milk. Lactose intolerance isn't a problem but I read some people had good experiences giving up cow dairy so I tried a little experiment. After a few weeks I noticed the following changes.

1. Cravings for sweets dramatically reduced - I usually had milk with sweets or a milk-based sweet in the past
2. Self-control is better - this could just be due to exercising self-control in not eating dairy
3. Coffee addiction is weaker but still present - maybe some of the cravings were due to the milk I used to put in my coffee
4. Definition in triceps and jawline is better - this is strange and maybe just due to general fat loss
5. Exercise-induced asthma is dramatically reduced - I don't even use my inhaler before high intensity cardio now, that would have been unthinkable in the past.

I didn't have a problem with acne so I can't tell if giving up cow's milk helped me there. Acne practically disappeared after I gave up gluten.

I would surmise that your giving up Pasturized and Homonegized and low fat versions of these products. You may NOT need to give up raw dairy products, if they were available to you. Which they are NOT really available to most of us people in the USA at any reasonable price...

[ElBorrachoInfamoso]

(07-28-2014 04:36 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  

I would surmise that your giving up Pasturized and Homonegized and low fat versions of these products. You may NOT need to give up raw dairy products, if they were available to you. Which they are NOT really available to most of us people in the USA at any reasonable price...

Yes on the first two, but no on the last. I hate low fat crap. I always drank full fat milk.

http://www.betacasein.org/index.html?p=variants

It was the studies on A1 casein that convinced me to give up cow dairy. If I found A2 cow's milk, I would try it for a while to see if the positive effects remained.

[JayJuanGee]

(07-29-2014 03:47 AM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  

(07-28-2014 04:36 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  

I would surmise that your giving up Pasturized and Homonegized and low fat versions of these products. You may NOT need to give up raw dairy products, if they were available to you. Which they are NOT really available to most of us people in the USA at any reasonable price...

Yes on the first two, but no on the last. I hate low fat crap. I always drank full fat milk.

http://www.betacasein.org/index.html?p=variants

It was the studies on A1 casein that convinced me to give up cow dairy. If I found A2 cow's milk, I would try it for a while to see if the positive effects remained.

Certainly, I do NOT claim to be an expert on any of these milk matters; however, I had read up on the benefits of raw milk over processed milk, which makes a lot of sense to me that the processing removes nutrients and adds toxins to milk.

This A1 / A2 casein discussion also makes quite a bit of sense to me, even though the write-up does NOT really get into any description of the difference between raw and processed and whether or how that affects these caseins. Aspects of this article's discussion makes sense especially when discussing that human milk does NOT contain A1 casein, and accordingly, it appears that a lot of negative human health effects seem to come from the A1 casein in the milk and the variants of milk that contain the A1 caseins.

Certainly, it would be good to know and to label milk accordingly regarding this kind of important information.

[Mercenary]

Dairy makes my skin oily.

When I spend long periods of times in Asia (where few people eat dairy) I have less problems.

[Rudideviz]

edit: deleted

[ChicagoFire]

I do but I think this varies with everybody. Certain types of cheeses and grass fed milk contains K2 which is purportedly an anti aging nutrient. Don't get cheap butter shoot for Kerry Gold or equivalent. Same thing with whey protein, don't get the buckets at Walmart preferably get grass fed.

[ADEBISIGARANA]

Nope. Cancer

[Mike0060]

Not really. Just a bit of cheese and occasional butter. Causes me oily skin and thus acne.

[Johnnyvee]

Put as simply as possible when it comes to dairy consumption, I would say that the best parts of dairy/milk is the fat and the whey.

You want to avoid the lactose, galactose and casein. (Also bovine insulin is problematic.) This is both due to the leaky gut and allergy-autoimmune-systemic inflammation promoting element of the casein protein. (Whey seems to not have these issues.) And the blood sugar/insulin elevation and glycation (and inflammation-oxidative stress again) promoting sugars lactose and galactose. Hyperglycemia in general definitely accelerates the formation of AGES, (advanced glycation end products) one of the main causes of ageing and disease in general. But galactose in particular seems to generate AGES even faster than lactose, probably due to humans lacking the enzymes to reduce galactose. (Which is also true for about 70 percent of the worlds pop. when it comes to lactose.)

Bovine insulin is associated with many autoimmune disorders like MS and diabetes type 1. According to Loren Cordain, (a man with a lot of credibility in this field) childhood onset DT1 is almost always caused by dairy, and in particular bovine insulin. (Via a process called biological mimicry/cross reactivity.) But also, bovine insulin promotes excessive growth. So you do get taller drinking more milk, partly as a downstream effect of the bovine insulin, but that growth can also translate to myopia (excessive growth of the eyeball) and cancer. (mostly later in life of course)

So again, I would stick with butter/Ghee, maybe some hard cheeses and cream now and again, and avoid all low fat dairy. I think that`s very important in order to avoid disease. But from the research I`ve seen 100 percent whey protein in association with resistance training is beneficial. But only take it after your training of course. You don`t wanna snack on that stuff, since it does cause transient growth. (via mTor translocation)