[MidWest]

I always thought the way to lose fat and gain muscle was to 6-7 meals per day rich in protein and whole carbohydrates in order to speed up your metabolism. This IF thing in theory would slow your metabolism if we go by that logic. Im interested to see all your guys results on this?

[K Galt]

This IF thing in theory would slow your metabolism if we go by that logic.

Try this on for logic.

If you eat 6-7 meals a day, your body becomes entirely dependent on using the food you are consuming for energy. You always have food in your belly digesting, providing nutrients and sugar to your blood stream.

Now, if you eat one meal in a 24 hour period, your body will digest that meal in a few hours at most. Once it's all digested, where is it going to get the energy to continue to function?

From the stored energy...aka your body fat.

If you're eating 6-7 meals a day, you are never burning off your stored fat. In fact, eating like that over a long period of time, your body actually "forgets" how to burn fat for energy. Then you turn into one of those folks who gets all weak and shaky and feeling nauseous when their blood sugar gets too low.

[FitAsFuck]

(02-10-2013 11:36 AM)ElJefe Wrote:  

Where is FitAsFuck?

That guy is a fucking beast. Ask him for advice.

Haha thanks for the credit!

I just skipped over all the replies very quickly, so I might have missed someone else saying this but here goes.

Rant:On

First of, it is beyond my belief how coffee with any amount of butter, can be seen as fasting. In my opinion you either fast or you take in calories - keep it simple.

The beauty of IF, is exactly the fasting periods. I hear people using, and/or asking all sorts of different questions, about what is okay to have during the fast - well it is simple NO calories. Drink your coffee black, pure tea, water etc.

Rant:Off

I have followed IF for well over 2 years now, and could write on and on about it. I think it works incredibly for what it is. There are all sorts of claims, some of which has been mentioned in the first post, but most importantly for me - it has kept me extremely lean with less sacrifice than before.

Okay before I turn this into a total IF informational posts, which I can feel I would if not stopping myself, on to bulletproof coffee.

I have heard quite some claims about it. Read and heard quite a bit from Dave Asprey, but in the end I just got sick of his focus on microtoxins. Following his advice to the extreme, you would almost not be able to eat anything, that regular people are able to get their hands on - again - keep it simple. But I really thought about trying the coffe, atleast for the apparently awesome taste.

I totally get why he recommends to start the day with this extremely fatty rich coffee, and if it helps you, please keep doing it. He also made me use butter in my coffee from time to time, but that is in the feeding window of IF. I can understand why it enables people to keep their "fast" easier or it seems nice in their fasting, because they are in my opinion breaking it. If I read correctly he recommends as much as 80-100 grams of fat from butter and oil in it. No wonder it tastes good, we as people love the taste of fat and there you have like a third of your total calories of the day.

I would though, recommend the first meal of the day, to be very high in fat. But if you are on a IF protocol then this is not until you break your fast.

[Aliblahba]

Will instant coffee, margarine, and vegetable oil work?

[ElJefe]

(02-10-2013 03:59 PM)FitAsFuck Wrote:  

I would though, recommend the first meal of the day, to be very high in fat. But if you are on a IF protocol then this is not until you break your fast.

Thanks for sharing.

I did bulletproof coffee last year. Did squat for me.

What did work was paleo or near-paleo principles and having a varied diet and plenty of work.

I haven't tried intermittant fasting, yet. I fucking love breakfast, but I'll try and get started from week 14 onwards.

I think you should elaborate on your IF experiences and what worked well for you, and, if you can be bothered, post up a few pics to demonstrate progress. This is after all a lifestyle forum. It'd be tremendous value added!

[Aliblahba]

This is what I got. Will it get me in the ballpark?

   

Normally I don't eat breakfast, and drink coffee, so this isn't going to be difficult for me to adjust too. Paul C. Bragg (ACV) wrote in his book about not eating whole foods in the morning. He claims that the body needs time to wake up before the organs can process food properly. Goes along with drinking a glass of water first thing to jump start the organs.

I know a lot about fasting, having done The Master Cleanse for over a decade. As for the Paleo Diet? My ancestors killed wooly mammoths, then beat up the Paleo tribes, made them carry the meat and cook it, then they killed them and fucked their women. Don't count on Ali going Paleo anytime soon, but I'll try the coffee stuff.

[kosko]

(02-10-2013 04:09 PM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

Will instant coffee, margarine, and vegetable oil work?

Use MILO and Crisco instead!

[FitAsFuck]

(02-10-2013 05:46 PM)ElJefe Wrote:  

Thanks for sharing.

I did bulletproof coffee last year. Did squat for me.

What did work was paleo or near-paleo principles and having a varied diet and plenty of work.

I haven't tried intermittant fasting, yet. I fucking love breakfast, but I'll try and get started from week 14 onwards.

I think you should elaborate on your IF experiences and what worked well for you, and, if you can be bothered, post up a few pics to demonstrate progress. This is after all a lifestyle forum. It'd be tremendous value added!

I would not suspect it to do anything, but how was the taste?

Yes I will try to keep it short. IF did not do anything to me that I could not obtain by doing regular diets with 6 meals a day etc. I had been cutting down to single digit BF-levels before I started IF. That is why I am reluctant to say IF actually does anything. It is a diet, a way to plan your meals. It will not magically turn your world around.

I am very good at putting on weight. I love eating big meals and actually hates all parts of dieting - apart from looking fucking good in the mirror! Where IF really shines through for me is in the fact that I can eat much larger meals, while still eating the same total amount of macronutrients. Instead of spreading it on 6 small meals and eating like a little girl, I can now enjoy much larger meals. Yes one time during the day I have to withstand some hunger, until I break the fast, but only doing this once a day, sure ass hell beats being hungry all the time.

That is why I say that IF has felt as dieting with less of a sacrifice. It just makes it easier on my mind. I do not feel as dieting even though I keep sixpack all year round.

I would not recommend IF to hardgainers. If you have trouble putting on weight, then decreasing the window of time available to meet your macronutrient goals is not the solution.

What I also shortly touched on, was the fact that I keep my carbs rather low, for the first one or two meals. This means that most of my carb intake is after my workout.

Just to touch Paleo. I tried a few times following the Paleo high fat/low or no carb, but that just did not fit with my body and activitylevels. I was unable to maintain as low bodyfat levels as I are by the approach mentioned above. I did not feel bad or lacked performance, but from an aesthetic point of view it just did not meet my demands. Adding the fact that it is more expensive and inconvenient, just made me stop doing it after 2 trial periods of more than two months each.

[Smooth]

Sitting down to my first cup this morning. Made mine with Kerrygold and coconut oil. Taste is very different than with milk or cream (I usually drink my coffee black) and it does leave a more noticeable film of fat around your mouth. I've been fasting since 8 last night, but I never had a problem skipping breakfast; my problem has always been eating in the evenings. Currently 6'2" 240lb and hoping to lose 30 lbs in the next 60 days before my 40th birthday. Hope to report back with positive results soon.

[ElJefe]

A few problems:

1) One pound every other day = 1750kcal deficit per day. Unrealistic and will almost certainly be catabolic. Bad.

2) The 1-2 weeks you CAN lose up to 10lbs, but only if you cut out 90% of carbs. The loss will be entirely due to less water in your muscles (carbs bind water).

This is not what you want, unless you want to look skinny-fat.

[Smooth]

Thanks for the feedback, ElJefe! You're right, I want to lose the weight, but I want to do it in a healthy way that spares the muscular gains I've made in the gym over the past 8 months. I DO NOT want to look skinny-fat. What would you say is a reasonable time frame for losing 30lbs from a 240lb frame with the IF and coffee diet? And what would be a reasonable goal for my b-day in mid-april?

[ElJefe]

I have never tried IF but everyone says it's great.

As FitAsFuck indicated, the bulletproof coffee in the morning is breaking the fast. Either do IF, or do Bulletproof. You can't do both (at least not with the latter in the morning, but go ahead during your feeding).

Keep on lifting heavy, and do sprint work. At your age, I'd also make sure to warm up properly.

Eat good stuff - so cook your own meals, if possible. Depending on your bodytype (ecto, meso or endo) eat more, medium or fewer carbs.

With adequate rest and intelligent planning, you can train 5-6 times a week resting different bodyparts on different days and lose 1lbs of fat a week and keep or increase muscle mass. That would be EXCELLENt results.

A lot of guys are running around claiming to have lost +2lbs of fat a week. I'd be wary of such claims.

[Aliblahba]

Drinking my first cup right now. 1 tbsp of coconut oil and butter. I nuked them for 20 seconds before adding the coffee. It is a bit rich. I may try to add ice and blend into a smoothie.

I know where you're coming from ElJefe. Bulletproof may not be fasting, but being liquid, it is close to fasting. If that makes any sense.

[Aliblahba]

Good stuff. I starting sweating, almost threw up, and shit pure grease.

[Smooth]

Hi ElJefe.

I started on the 5x5 program about 4 months ago, but quickly realized that my body couldn't keep up with the weight progressions. I got sidelined for a while with a back pull. I am back on the program now, largely as described, but have cut the progressions to 1/3. I lift 2-3 times/week and am now seeing weight increase without all the aches and pains. I also take a kickboxing or Krav class at least once a week.

The key for me is recovery. I quickly realized that my mind wants what my body can't deliver. I am much better looking at this as a life-long change and being consistent, rather than overworking and getting injured.

I've picked up juicing and am eating better now than I have in my life. The goal is to be in the best shape of my life in my early 40s. Not a stretch because I never put any effort in to my physical well being.

Thanks a lot for your feedback!

[GameTheory]

this was featured in a recent mean's Health issue

http://www.menshealth.com/weight-loss/8-hour-diet

[ElJefe]

(02-11-2013 07:24 PM)Smooth Wrote:  

The key for me is recovery. I quickly realized that my mind wants what my body can't deliver. I am much better looking at this as a life-long change and being consistent, rather than overworking and getting injured.

I think it sounds like you know what you're doing and you're obviously listening to your body. Just stay on course, you're doing fine. Maybe in a year or two you can up the volume when your body is prepared.

[Aliblahba]

I still got the shits from yesterday. Felt bad all day. I'll give it another go in a couple days, and cut back on the oil/butter to see if it makes a difference. If not then this is a no go for me. How many cups do you guys normally drink in the morning?

[el mechanico]

Ali-b that coffee is trash go back to the store and get some DD or starbucks in the bag.

[Hencredible Casanova]

Just tried this stuff this morning. Used regular Trader Joe's house brand coffee (whole bean, not ground). I'll upgrade to organic when this stuff runs out. For butter, I used Kerrygold and I also used Coconut Oil. Hope this stuff works out. Sounds interesting.

[Fujiwara]

(02-12-2013 08:22 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

I still got the shits from yesterday. Felt bad all day. I'll give it another go in a couple days, and cut back on the oil/butter to see if it makes a difference. If not then this is a no go for me. How many cups do you guys normally drink in the morning?

Lose that butter blend you're using, get yourself some of this:



Recently it's been about 4tbsp of that in my coffee, first thing in the morning.

I dig it. Always one cup, sometimes I have a half-cup later (with half the butter). This is always what I have in lieu of a solid breakfast in the morning, though I might dip a buttered croissant into the coffee if I've got some around.

How much butter and oil did you put into your coffee? Maybe your body just wasn't ready for the amount you used (though I'll say that using a cream blend instead of straight butter may have been a contributing factor)

try coffee with 2tbsp of silver Kerrygold and 1 tsp coconut oil and increase butter/oil as you like...

[GameTheory]

(02-12-2013 08:22 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  

I still got the shits from yesterday. Felt bad all day. I'll give it another go in a couple days, and cut back on the oil/butter to see if it makes a difference. If not then this is a no go for me. How many cups do you guys normally drink in the morning?

too much MCT will give you a bad case of the runs

[ManAbout]

(02-09-2013 06:17 PM)kosko Wrote:  

Would organic/free range cream be a suitable alternative if access to butter is not available? Fresh butter can be made from shaking up heavy cream for a few minutes so maybe this can be an option for those abroad or like me have no access to grass fed/ quality butter.

Yeah, it's strange that grass fed butter isn't available in a big city like Toronto. I looked into Whole Foods and Pusateris, but no, they don't stock it.

But, I have a found a farm about an hour north of the city on the 400 that claims to have grass fed butter, and grass fed beef as well. The prices aren't too bad either. If anybody else is interested, I might make a trip up there.

[slubu]

(02-11-2013 07:24 PM)Smooth Wrote:  

I started on the 5x5 program about 4 months ago, but quickly realized that my body couldn't keep up with the weight progressions. I got sidelined for a while with a back pull.

This is exactly what happened to me. How long were you sidelined for? I'm at 2 weeks now and my back is still hurting. Sucks, I am watching the muscle gains melt away.

[kosko]

(02-13-2013 01:24 AM)ManAbout Wrote:  

(02-09-2013 06:17 PM)kosko Wrote:  

Would organic/free range cream be a suitable alternative if access to butter is not available? Fresh butter can be made from shaking up heavy cream for a few minutes so maybe this can be an option for those abroad or like me have no access to grass fed/ quality butter.

Yeah, it's strange that grass fed butter isn't available in a big city like Toronto. I looked into Whole Foods and Pusateris, but no, they don't stock it.

But, I have a found a farm about an hour north of the city on the 400 that claims to have grass fed butter, and grass fed beef as well. The prices aren't too bad either. If anybody else is interested, I might make a trip up there.

That could be a nice little side gig since a lot of people in Toronto would want the stuff.

What kind of prices was he giving you for per/pound?

I am actually going to attempt to make my own cultured butter while I got some time off school - the process isn't to hard.