https://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2019...eties.html

Out of all people imaginable - George Soros has voiced opinion, shared with many in this forum, that electronic surveillance and total control are biggest threat to freedom in modern world. This total surveillance is currently championed by China and their citizen credit system as well as Facebook, Google and similar silicon Valley big tech companies.

I find it surprising that he out of all people says something I have felt for a long time - China as raising economic and military power, with it's communism, censorship, soft colonization of Africa, most advanced prototype for a technocratic total 1984 type control system, it's export or oppression to other countries like Venezuela and even dumbing down of consumer products like movies and video games is the biggest global threat to freedom in modern times.


What do you think? is Soros pretending? Trying to turn coat? Afraid of raising nationalism? Maybe simply jealous China has surpassed him in successful implementation of social engineering of total control?

Who do you think is more the enemy of freedom? Soros and his supposed covert Cultural Marxism or China with open and unashamed censorship and communist dictatorship?

A cashless society, which logically and eventually follows from unchecked surveillance state growth (and which China is already moving toward), would require all transactions to be electronic, which would mean they would be recorded or, in other words, surveilled. I doubt that guys like Soros don’t also use cash for their more private deals.

The government or some other entity that Soros and pals don’t run directly would likely have the authority or at least technical capability to turn of digital wallets for any (or no) reason and would also just be one more vulnerable point for hackers and/or natural disasters, wars, and things of that sort (physical hardware being disabled or destroyed).

This is of course saying nothing of human incompetence and error. Imagine that plane and train tickets can only be purchased online but then the system they use to process payment is shut down because of a hate speech incident on part of the system’s programmer or because the owner of the company that runs the system hired a 17 year-old-but-looks-like-18-and-lied-about-their-age hooker in some shady place and then said hooker got into their laptop, which they forgot to close, and wound up blasting photos of themselves (which would technically be illegal pornography) across the planet by inserting them into the automatic email that was about to be sent to 800 million people in attempt to create a scandal, for which they could later file charges and demand payment, and then the owner shut the whole site down suddenly, to try and cover up and also because the system was at that point a distributor of illegal porn and therefor must be shut down by law, leaving no replacement because he was an oligarch with a monopoly on that particular type of software, Now imagine that this software monopoly was also the only vehicle through which to pay for groceries because cash has been phased out and crypto has been regulated into irrelevancy. I suspect that such a thing would eventually at least add unnecessary complication to the life of a Soros.

I think he is correct to be concerned but I am not fooled by his fake nobility. I think his motives are based purely in cynical self interest. That said, I’m happy to have him and, more importantly, his finances, on my side as long as it benefits me.

I do not like Soros but, if he can be a temporary and conditional ally on this particular issue, then so be it and, if he and the surviellance state cyber tyrants both destroy each other in their battle for our information and freedom, then I see that as killing two birds with one stone.

That said, Soros, given what we know of him, would surely be fine with extreme surveillance as long as he, and not the Chinese Communist Party or something, personally controlled it so the standard rule of it trusting him or his word still applies even he he makes himself a temporary ally on one particular issue such as this.

Also, consider that he may be lying for public image, probably because his servants have informed him that the majority of the public opposes such a thing, while doing something else behind the curtain like secretly funneling money to a company that is developing such technology for his own use so that he can eventually flip a switch and become the biblical antichrist, marking everyone with his number, while sitting safely in one of his compounds, knowing that his divide and conquer strategy has confused and fragmented everyone else to the point that nobody even notices that he betrayed them.

When any shadowy globalist oligarch says anything, always consider the possibility that they may just be lying to put those who are too dumb or too busy to look into anything at ease while they gradually turn up the flame on the stove so that the frogs don’t notice they are being boiled alive until it’s too late.

Of course Soros is the bigger threat to Western Civilization.

Here’s what is really happening.

Soros has invested in electronic surveillance. He has no problem with Surveillance. He just means electronic surveillance that he or his tribe doesn’t control worries him.

A few months ago, Bill Kristol tweeted about regime change/coup for China. Everything that Bill Kristol says is meant to suck up to some billionaire somewhere.

The plan is for the tribe to mass migrate to China once Western Civilization is a finished off hellhole, but conditions in China aren’t such where that is possible yet.

Western governments are the biggest enemy of freedom. I hear what you are saying about china, but I don't see how their system can really directly effect western countries unless they physically invade, which, let's assume, they won't.

Theres way too much chatter online about China and its supposed threat. We got enough on our own plate with the police state, the encroachment of civil liberties, lying media, and insane living costs.

As far as I know, China isn't responsible for any of this shit. It's a good distraction, that much I'll tell you. I blame Trump since it was his favorite topic of discussion during the campaign.

Quote: (01-25-2019 08:06 AM)Rotten Wrote:  

Of course Soros is the bigger threat to Western Civilization.

Here’s what is really happening.

Soros has invested in electronic surveillance. He has no problem with Surveillance. He just means electronic surveillance that he or his tribe doesn’t control worries him.

A few months ago, Bill Kristol tweeted about regime change/coup for China. Everything that Bill Kristol says is meant to suck up to some billionaire somewhere.

The plan is for the tribe to mass migrate to China once Western Civilization is a finished off hellhole, but conditions in China aren’t such where that is possible yet.

Dunno about that last part but the rest of the post is spot on. Soros and Xi have the same end goal. As they started from different points their strategies have to be somewhat different, but some of the tactics--in this case, mass electronic surveillance/censorship--are the same. Xi is the leader of one of the two most powerful nation states in the world so he can simply do this openly and unapologetically, at least within his own country. Soros doesn't technically control a government and the countries where he has influence are in the west and therefore have to at least pay varying degrees of lip service to concepts like freedom of speech, so he has to use more surreptitious means.

Both are evil. Neither has humanity's best interest in mind. That said, at least Xi loves his own country/civilization and seeks supremacy at least partially for it, whereas Soros has only his own self interest and that of his offspring in mind.

China is the biggest threat to western civilization right now because they have nuclear capabilities. George Soros as much as he is a disruptor does not.

I'm glad somebody else has noticed this, but conclusions about what this means are understandably lacking.

As I've elaborated elsewhere, Xi Jinping is an oddity in the Chinese Communist Party. He openly attacked the system of "collective leadership" that fostered massive corruption and social degeneration in China since the Tiananmen Massacre. Because of this bad blood between Xi and other CCP elites, he is engaging in life-or-death political struggle behind closed doors.

Soros and other globalists hate Xi because like Trump, he is a masculine leader standing in the way of the forces of globalist cultural Marxist corporate oligarchical collectivism.

It isn't in the linked article, but in this one, Soros is quoted as saying:

Quote:Quote:

So, I wasn’t surprised when Xi Jinping ran into serious opposition at home; but I was surprised by the form it took. ... Although there was no official communique, rumor had it that the convocation disapproved of the abolition of term limits and the cult of personality that Xi had built around himself.

It’s important to realize that such criticisms were only a warning to Xi about his excesses, but did not reverse the lifting of the two-term limit ... Xi remains the supreme leader, possibly for lifetime. The ultimate outcome of the current political infighting remains unresolved.

I’ve been concentrating on China, but open societies have many more enemies, Putin’s Russia foremost among them. And the most dangerous scenario is when these enemies conspire with, and learn from, each other on how to better oppress their people.

Soros' comments confirm two things that I have been saying all along:
1) there is intense factional struggle in the CCP (But people just assume that Xi is successfully calling the shots because he's president for life or something, and because Chinese names are too hard to remember).
2) Western globalists are at least indirectly in cahoots with Xi's political opponents, based on his praise for them as following the so-called Confucian tradition. This is not hard to understand. Under "collective leadership," CCP leaders were basically all connected with frontmen in business who would handle deals with foreign wealth. That was also the time when China was getting full exposure to doses of globo-homo cultural degeneracy. Of course the globalists want this to continue so they can turn China into another America or Europe.

Obviously, Soros doesn't care about "open society" in China unless it involves the same severe atomization and commodification that he and his ilk hope to spread everywhere else. If he did, he would have spoken out about the numerous human rights abuses in that country happening in recent history. This is all about taking Xi down a notch.

Due to the Sino-US trade war and all kinds of malaise in the Chinese economy, Xi is stuck between a rock (Trump) and a hard place (the CCP system). Something will have to give, and Soros is probably speaking out now in hopes that Xi will be the one to crack. Reversion to "collective leadership" would doom Trump's chances of successful negotiations (no clear leader to talk to) and make things easier for the globalist fiends.

The infighting in the CCP is Xi taking out Jiang Zemin and those loyal to him.

Quote: (01-25-2019 05:20 PM)CaptainChardonnay Wrote:  

The infighting in the CCP is Xi taking out Jiang Zemin and those loyal to him.

That was the stage between 2012 and 2017 (i.e. to the 19th Party Congress). By now most of the main Jiang factionalists are gone. Reading the CCDI and state media reports though, you'll see that they still keep talking about removing the "remaining poison" of the big tigers. The fact is that the "remaining poison" includes basically anyone who isn't immediately in Xi's camp. And Xi's overall policies are not conducive to building a big-tent "collective leadership" the way Jiang did (by selling out to the globalists and letting state power spiral into powerful modern-day fiefs).

Of course, Jiang's faction still sort of exists even though the man himself is 92 and bedridden. The main enemies are untouchable Party elders like the retired official Zeng Qinghong who helped get Jiang in power back in the 90s.

Better to side with Xi than Soros. Xi cares about his people, Soros, only himself.

Some of you need to read up and understand what are some common practices with the CCP. Saying Xi cares about his people is beyond absurd. The only thing Xi cares about is maintaining and expanding the power of the CCP through increasing China's worldwide influence.

The majority of Chinese still live with less than $10 USD a day on top of being stuck to wherever they are born due to freedom of movement being limited.

Don't forget about the people in Xinjiang and Falun Gong practitioners.

It is in Soros` best interest to voice his concern in public when X poses a threat to his cash flow and/or organisations.

Quote: (01-25-2019 07:27 AM)Mage Wrote:  

https://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2019...eties.html

Out of all people imaginable - George Soros has voiced opinion, shared with many in this forum, that electronic surveillance and total control are biggest threat to freedom in modern world. This total surveillance is currently championed by China and their citizen credit system as well as Facebook, Google and similar silicon Valley big tech companies.

I find it surprising that he out of all people says something I have felt for a long time - China as raising economic and military power, with it's communism, censorship, soft colonization of Africa, most advanced prototype for a technocratic total 1984 type control system, it's export or oppression to other countries like Venezuela and even dumbing down of consumer products like movies and video games is the biggest global threat to freedom in modern times.


What do you think? is Soros pretending? Trying to turn coat? Afraid of raising nationalism? Maybe simply jealous China has surpassed him in successful implementation of social engineering of total control?

Who do you think is more the enemy of freedom? Soros and his supposed covert Cultural Marxism or China with open and unashamed censorship and communist dictatorship?

OP are you Chinese? If not can you please explain how are the Chinese threatening your freedom? Or the freedom of your countrymen?

Quote: (01-26-2019 01:58 AM)NikNik Wrote:  

Quote: (01-25-2019 07:27 AM)Mage Wrote:  

https://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2019...eties.html

Out of all people imaginable - George Soros has voiced opinion, shared with many in this forum, that electronic surveillance and total control are biggest threat to freedom in modern world. This total surveillance is currently championed by China and their citizen credit system as well as Facebook, Google and similar silicon Valley big tech companies.

I find it surprising that he out of all people says something I have felt for a long time - China as raising economic and military power, with it's communism, censorship, soft colonization of Africa, most advanced prototype for a technocratic total 1984 type control system, it's export or oppression to other countries like Venezuela and even dumbing down of consumer products like movies and video games is the biggest global threat to freedom in modern times.


What do you think? is Soros pretending? Trying to turn coat? Afraid of raising nationalism? Maybe simply jealous China has surpassed him in successful implementation of social engineering of total control?

Who do you think is more the enemy of freedom? Soros and his supposed covert Cultural Marxism or China with open and unashamed censorship and communist dictatorship?

OP are you Chinese? If not can you please explain how are the Chinese threatening your freedom? Or the freedom of your countrymen?

Are you low on IQ? If not then can you please explain how you don't see that?

China has big and increasing global influence. Western countries and companies change their politics all the time to cater to china. The question of Taiwan, the question of Tibet, the content of movies and TV shows exported to China, the content of social networks. It's many things.

Also China will support raising socialist and communist governments elsewhere even on other continents like evident with Venezuela.

Also China serves as excuse for many communist sympathizers to show that communism can be working, because on the outside China is successful. At cost of health and liberty of it's people of course. if we would have no lingering communism states, there would be less communist sympathizers among western youth and academia.

Also there is something called precedent. China sets a precedent with it's citizen surveillance and evaluation system. Once a precedent is set the whole world is in danger of fallowing it. Another dictatorship willing to introduce such a system will no longer have to design it, they may just buy it from China. This can lead to oppression in many poorer dictatorship countries and can make them somewhat dependent from China too, increasing their power.

World is global, if you think something needs to be close to influence you you just ain't too smart.

You may argue about what is more dangerous China or Soros, but if you mean do declare then China is nothing to worry about you are not credible.

You might even be a Chinese commy yourself, they have their state sponsored net of influences in internet too.

Some people on this thread said Xi cares about his county and people. No, communism has destroyed the traditional culture of China to avoid ideological differences. Only in Taiwan can you still see traditional Chinese culture still practiced in an unmolested form.

Quote: (01-26-2019 03:14 AM)Emancipator Wrote:  

   

This explains everything.

World is ruled by Disney. Politicians are just their puppets.

Btw, Vinnie the Pooh is banned in China, because of similarity to Xi. That's if you had any doubts about freedom there.

I just hope that the Chinese state and the globalists weaken each other to the point where grassroots Western nationalism can once again thrive.

I think for the next few decades we will be increasingly poor, but once we've passed through the period of adjustment we will be much happier among our peoples.

What's all this talk about Social Credit Scores about I wonder. Does any of you know what it really is apart from Western media reportings? Anyone on the ground in China with street cred here (Suit, Kai, Fortis, etc.) cares to explain what Social Credit Scores really are?

Bring out chicom state security trolls!

This is one of those don't cares. One of our least favorite (((bankers))) versus totalitarian scum.

I can totally see Soros using his ill-gotten gains try and break the Bank of China. See how well that off shore RMB amount gets battered.

And the best part? We get to sit here and watch it all happen!

The thing with that is China's reserves are too big. The reason he could short the UK and Thai currencies was because their economies didn't have that much reserves to continue their respective DM and USD peg.

Agreed CaptainChardonnay.

Soros is most likely biding his time for some sort of Chinese economic calamity. There needs to be some sort of problem internally that stresses their reserves before he can swoop in and give them a crack.

Quote: (01-26-2019 08:57 PM)Liberty Sea Wrote:  

What's all this talk about Social Credit Scores about I wonder. Does any of you know what it really is apart from Western media reportings? Anyone on the ground in China with street cred here (Suit, Kai, Fortis, etc.) cares to explain what Social Credit Scores really are?

Thus far I haven't heard too much about this.

You have to remember that implementing something of this magnitude on a scale of 1+ billion people would take time even if it's automated. You would need to groom your regular Chinese person to the point where they only want to electronic currency and no cash.

A lot of the old guard here does not like that shit. Sit in a local grocery store here and every middle-aged to old person pays with cash.

I save up my coins and RMB notes and bring them to the store and exchange them for wechat pay. The clerks have a smile a mile wide when I bring in all these coins and rmb notes. Many businesses are mostly cash still.

I think That the youngest generation is very anti-cash though. I could see social credit going into full effect in 10+ years when the youngest generation is running things.

That said I think this system would be easy to play around with. Knowing what I know about the people here, the Chinese would simply use their digital currencies to buy "approved" items to boosts their scores and then they'd barter these items to trade for things that would drop their scores.

I'd like to add that the reason China got this big is that too many Western nations simply ignored them. Whenever you bring up China you get *shrugs* and this is exactly why they're in our backyard now buying up property on the Iberian peninsula and Australia.

You guys really need to understand that this is not the same as Europeans buying property in Europe.

China is absolutely buying property to make moves AGAINST Europe and the West. They have a long memory and haven't gotten things like the Opium wars, Nanjing and the other shameful events they've endured when they were too weak to do anything about it.

I'm not saying you all need to up in arms, but if you see an influx of Chinese capital into your cities be suspicious. They do not do things out of the kindness of their hearts. I can't accurately say what they're setting up for but you should be as suspicious of Xi as you are of Donald, Putin, Soros, Hillary or anyone else.

The concern being raised about Chinese tech companies putting government-funded backdoors in their programs should be taken seriously. They do not have to invade us to manipulate us via technology. Think about the culture war being waged against us by "globalists" and now think about how much a powerful nation with values diametrically opposed to ours could accomplish in that arena?

I don't mean to fearmonger but ignoring China will only make things worse for your kids and grandkids. They're playing to win, not simply to "rise peacefully" or whatever bullshit they always say.

Let them fight.