I read the full article but there's several inconsistencies.

First, the dive to reach these kids are so treacherous and small, sometimes you have to put the oxygen tank ahead to dive through. So how the hell are you supplying these kids with water and food?

And if there's a way big enough to get boxes of food and water in there I don't see how a thin kid can't get out the same way.

@Saweep

Have them hold on to it while an operator navigates the robot to safety. Will obviously take multiple trips. Just a suggestion...I understand the robot could explode or not fit but I'm just tossing in an idea. The point is it's pretty futile to send in more humans to potentially die. They have robots that detonate bombs right?

@Dalaran
This is why I don't watch the news. Is this some distraction that will quickly go away once certain indiscretions involving high profile people are revealed? To end this on a positive note I wish the kids the best of luck.

Quote: (07-06-2018 10:08 AM)Dalaran1991 Wrote:  

And if there's a way big enough to get boxes of food and water in there I don't see how a thin kid can't get out the same way.

The problem isn't that the kids can't fit, it's that none of the kids know how to swim. It's a five-hour swim - at best - that killed an experienced military diver, and they're already exhausted but will be expected to navigate this expert-level escape.

It wasn't full of water when they entered, but now they're trying to pump the water out before the rains come, and that doesn't look good, either.

Quote: (07-06-2018 10:10 AM)ChicagoFire Wrote:  

@Saweep

Have them hold on to it while an operator navigates the robot to safety. Will obviously take multiple trips. Just a suggestion...I understand the robot could explode or not fit but I'm just tossing in an idea. The point is it's pretty futile to send in more humans to potentially die. They have robots that detonate bombs right?

I don't know much about cave diving other than it is possibly one of the most dangerous activities known to man.

It's a bloody long way at underwater swimming speeds and there are lots of problems with masks, disorientation, panicking etc etc etc.

I don't think "because they have robots that detonate bombs" is much help here.

This is a race against time; flooding is expected imminently.

If there was a simple, obvious solution, this whole issue would have largely gone by un-noticed.

In Thailand now. Was out with some locals when the news broke. They were so happy. Really heartwarming.

Quote: (07-06-2018 10:20 AM)Rush87 Wrote:  

In Thailand now. Was out with some locals when the news broke. They were so happy. Really heartwarming.

which news? that they've been found?

The trapped group consists of 12 boys aged 11 to 16, and their 25-year-old football (soccer) coach.
They disappeared after deciding to explore the Tham Luang Nang Non cave in Chiang Rai province following a football game on June 23.




Something about this story stinks to high heaven....why would a coach lead 12 boys many miles into a series of dark caves ?

There are a lot of fishy stuff here. I'm calling bullshit on the pics.



Like nigga for real? You've been trapped in a cave for 12 fucking days in frozen conditions (we have similar cave in Vietnam, and believe me it's freezing cold), with little food nor water, your coach/leader is barely alive, and you are smiling?

Maybe just some staged shots/smile for the camera (and still...) but if it's the case then the news are fucking pathetic. Or these kids are fucking war heroes. I've seen calm, stoic adults break down under much less stress. Shit most people freak the fuck out when they lose internet access.

And then, how the hell are they getting so deep in there in the first place? Supposed the cave wasn't flooded then. What people in their right mind go 1km deep inside underground tunnels where some places go as low as 1m? And how did they even get the words out that they were trapped? Who found them? How?

The omission of details about the beginning of how this happened just seems real fishy to me. Given this is Thailand I'm not surprised if this is smoke and mirror for something else. If so those who stage this are beasts for using children like that.

Quote: (07-06-2018 10:39 AM)Dalaran1991 Wrote:  

Like nigga for real? You've been trapped in a cave for 12 fucking days in frozen conditions (we have similar cave in Vietnam, and believe me it's freezing cold), with little food nor water, your coach/leader is barely alive, and you are smiling?

I'd be smiling too if I'd been trapped down there, a rescuer found me, and nobody told me I'm not even close to safety yet. Search operations began after their bicycles were found at the cave entrance.

Quote: (07-06-2018 10:26 AM)Mercenary Wrote:  

Something about this story stinks to high heaven....why would a coach lead 12 boys many miles into a series of dark caves ?

That's the great joy of cave exploration, I guess.

As I understand it, they went in to carve their names on something and then it started raining, so they had to keep going to avoid the rising water.

Could have been worse, check this guy out. You can't go in the cave anymore because he's still in it:



EDIT: No announcement yet, but seems to be a consensus forming that they're going to try to swim the kids out urgently.

I get uncomfortable in elevators.

Just reading this story makes me queasy.

I'm made to be in wide open spaces, under a blue sky.

At the very least, a large room with windows.

Rainy season in Asia is no joke. Surprise typhoons, this shit, flash floods out of nowhere. Asians cannot swim to save their lives making you wonder how could people that live in an area like these avoid swimming all their lives.

Looking at these infographs I would just give up. I think I am too claustrophobic to crawl through some shit like this, especially with water in it. I feel like I am suffocating from looking at those photos of John that Jetset posted. YECH!

Youth, poor judgement, a lack of skills, bad luck, and testosterone is one hell of a combo fellas.

How did the kids get down there? That doesn't seem to be strange to anyone?

*find dangerous cave*

*take a bunch of young, twitchy kids*

*cave floods with no escape*

*inexplicably forget it was rainy season*

I really don't fucking get it. Is this one of those "you need to be thai to understand" things?

Quote: (07-06-2018 10:54 AM)Spaniard88 Wrote:  

I get uncomfortable in elevators.

Just reading this story makes me queasy.

I'm made to be in wide open spaces, under a blue sky.

At the very least, a large room with windows.

When I was 5 year old I got my dumb ass trapped between a bed and some other furniture piece. I freaked out like I was going to die. I don't recall if I could still breath okay or not, but I certainly could not move. My mom got me out, but I never crawled into tight spaces again.

I guess some of us get that lesson early in life.

My son recently got stuck behind the couch and freaked out. Waaaah I want mama!!! I bet he will do it again too. He's younger than 2 and is very stubborn. Oh well.

Quote: (07-06-2018 11:04 AM)Fortis Wrote:  

How did the kids get down there? That doesn't seem to be strange to anyone?

*find dangerous cave*

*take a bunch of young, twitchy kids*

*cave floods with no escape*

*inexplicably forget it was rainy season*

I really don't fucking get it. Is this one of those "you need to be thai to understand" things?

According to one of the posts above, they thought they could still do it because the rainy season officially started a week later.

The Thai stuff is that they go in there for fun outside the rainy season.

They cannot swim for the exact same reasons Chinese cannot swim. You can use Chinese people for that reference point.

Dalaran also forgets that Thailand is the Land of Smiles. They just like to be positive as much as possible. They know they fucked up.

I blame that coach. That was a dumb idea and he is old enough to know better but then again..... he is 25 which these days is hardly mature anywhere on Earth for a male.

I'm surprised that cave is not full of deadly snakes. Thailand is full of dangerous snakes, scorpions, etc. It's like an Asian Style Australia or something. A reticulated python or a King Cobra would not find a place like that comfortable? Russell's vipers?

Quote: (07-06-2018 10:10 AM)ChicagoFire Wrote:  

@Saweep

Have them hold on to it while an operator navigates the robot to safety. Will obviously take multiple trips. Just a suggestion...I understand the robot could explode or not fit but I'm just tossing in an idea. The point is it's pretty futile to send in more humans to potentially die. They have robots that detonate bombs right?

@Dalaran
This is why I don't watch the news. Is this some distraction that will quickly go away once certain indiscretions involving high profile people are revealed? To end this on a positive note I wish the kids the best of luck.

I always find it amusing and mildly frustrating when someone with absolutely no experience in said particular field(s) chimes in with an "obvious" solution. In this case underwater ROVs and technical cave diving.

Just have them hold on, and breath water? Or get on of these ROVs that can haul a man, but can navigate hair pin turns with and are less voluminous that a dive kit?

"I understand the robot could explode"? You're understanding is based on what exactly. You might as well also caution against the robot going rogue in a terminator-esqe scenario.

It was the same thing with the BP Horizon/Macondo blowout. Armchair quarterbacking from people who've never been involved in the oil industry beyond a visit to the gas station suggesting that halting a literal river of oil a mile under the sea coming out at a pressure strong enough to lift a car for every square inch ain't no thang.

Quote: (07-06-2018 09:20 AM)Mage Wrote:  

It's amazing how something basic, like ability to swim that is a basic thing for any western child, is almost a rare superpower in most parts of the world.

West is the best.

We should accuse all Asians and blacks, trying to learn swimming, of cultural appropriation.

As a child I was captivated by the exoticism of East, the more I learn the more I get disappointed in the East and the more I appreciate West.

We should talk about these facts and differences more so that the young generation understand how blessed they are and stop hating their culture like leftists program them to do.

People talk about swimming like it's some luxury good, why? When I was like 3, I got taken down to the lake, played around in the water, and swimming just came to me. I had an aunt who helped guide me through the motions of diving until I was doing it on my own, and then you just get better. And this is in Canada where you can access water maybe 4 months of the year. This could just be cultural too, I had family who would go to the water, and if I had kids I would do the same. It's like a reinforcing cycle either way.

I have however crossed paths with Asians who did grow up in the water, and these guys were literal fish. Like poor kids who grow up spending 40 hours a week kicking around a ball of tape becoming soccer stars, kids who grow up where diving/surfing are a way of life can become monsters of the sport.

When I heard the Navy SEALS were involved, I was like "they'll be out of the cave in no time". Then I realized it was the Thai Navy SEALS...

Quote: (07-06-2018 11:11 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

Dalaran also forgets that Thailand is the Land of Smiles. They just like to be positive as much as possible. They know they fucked up.

I blame that coach. That was a dumb idea and he is old enough to know better but then again..... he is 25 which these days is hardly mature anywhere on Earth for a male.

Well the coach is 25 and Thai, which makes it even worse. I love Thailand, I love the culture and the people, but I'll also admit that they're not the brightest bulbs on the global string. They also have a genius to turn something simple, like making a cappuccino or going to the beach, into a complete clusterfuck. The trapped kids and coach were likely not intelligence and self-aware enough to understand the seriousness of the situation when they started and they probably still don't understand the full implications of their predicament. And I doubt the Thai rescue workers are telling them when they communicate with them.

Quote: (07-06-2018 11:14 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

I'm surprised that cave is not full of deadly snakes. Thailand is full of dangerous snakes, scorpions, etc. It's like an Asian Style Australia or something. A reticulated python or a King Cobra would not find a place like that comfortable? Russell's vipers?

I went through a cave tour in Khao Sok. The cave entrance was full of bats handing upside down on the ceiling. Inside the cave, the only wildlife I came across were small fish that didn't have eyes. Sections of the cave you had to swim through. The guides watched the weather very closely. About an hour after leaving the cave, it poured rain.

My girlfriend (now wife) asked one the guides what happens if it rains whilst we are in the cave. The reply: "we all die".

I would say the best solution would be to run a line and oxygen tube into the cave to pressurize it. Then, focusing on keeping water levels as low as possible until they're low enough the kids can walk out. The problem is medical problems are inevitable but honestly it's the only real option. I'm an experienced diver and have cavern dived extensively (that's a cave where there is ambient light and a fairly clear path to the surface) and even that can be dangerous.

I suppose another option could be sedating the kids, putting on full diving masks and helmets and attaching them to the line via a harness, then towing them by the line and the oxygen tube slowly, with the professional divers guiding the tow operator via radio. A far fetched idea.

This situation will most likely result in tragedy. Also, to the earlier poster calling out the kid smiling... A Thai could be on the gallows with a noose around his neck and still be smiling.

Quote: (07-06-2018 11:57 AM)RIslander Wrote:  

I would say the best solution would be to run a line and oxygen tube into the cave to pressurize it. Then, focusing on keeping water levels as low as possible until they're low enough the kids can walk out. The problem is medical problems are inevitable but honestly it's the only real option. I'm an experienced diver and have cavern dived extensively (that's a cave where there is ambient light and a fairly clear path to the surface) and even that can be dangerous.

This situation will most likely result in tragedy. Also, to the earlier poster calling out the kid smiling... A Thai could be on the gallows with a noose around his neck and still be smiling.

Elon Musk has suggested some sort of blow up tube and offered use of his power bank things.

The problem with all the ideas regarding pumping or pressurising is the distance to the boys. The water pumps are basically doing nothing as a result.

Quote: (07-06-2018 11:48 AM)TheFinalEpic Wrote:  

When I heard the Navy SEALS were involved, I was like "they'll be out of the cave in no time". Then I realized it was the Thai Navy SEALS...

Shit, our SEALS couldn't even beat the Taliban. What makes you think they'd succeed in this case?

Quote: (07-06-2018 11:48 AM)TheFinalEpic Wrote:  

When I heard the Navy SEALS were involved, I was like "they'll be out of the cave in no time". Then I realized it was the Thai Navy SEALS...

Promise you US Navy Seals are present right now. They might not be running the show, they might not have much to do but some will be on site.