[Dash Global]

Anyone have any experience with this? What would be the easiest way to obtain one for civilians.

[MiXX]

(01-06-2012 11:04 AM)Dash Global Wrote:  

Anyone have any experience with this? What would be the easiest way to obtain one for civilians.

security clearance and easy? First time I read those 2 in the same paragraph.

The only way civilians can get security clearance is by being sponsored by an employer who requires you to have access to sensitive data.

It is not an easy thing to get by any means as a civilian, and non-transferable on most cases to other jobs.


Bottom line: your escapades around the world would be an AUTOMATIC RED FLAG TO THE FEDS who conduct the background check, and you'd likely get turned down. You must also have impeccable credit rating 750 or higher, explain in detail ANY.ALL unemployment gaps, and you better, not ever have been arrested for anything!

I had security clearance (as a civilian) when I worked for a high tech company in my early 20's - then, a few years later, I discovered Colombia and told them to fuck off!


Mixx

[Dash Global]

Yea I read it would take longer the more out of country trips one has taken.,I've never been arrested and always paid my bills.

[jordypip23]

Nice post lol. Love the Colombia bit at the end. Something tells me there are exceptions to this, however. I'm sure GW Bush Jr. would be able to obtain a security clearance even with his prior arrest record for example lol. Kinda helps to be a good ol' boy, former president and part of a political dynasty.

On the other hand, someone like Lil Wayne (who would never apply for one in a million years anyway) could not despite his fame & fortune.

(01-06-2012 11:11 AM)MiXX Wrote:  

(01-06-2012 11:04 AM)Dash Global Wrote:  

Anyone have any experience with this? What would be the easiest way to obtain one for civilians.

security clearance and easy? First time I read those 2 in the same paragraph.

The only way civilians can get security clearance is by being sponsored by an employer who requires you to have access to sensitive data.

It is not an easy thing to get by any means as a civilian, and non-transferable on most cases to other jobs.


Bottom line: your escapades around the world would be an AUTOMATIC RED FLAG TO THE FEDS who conduct the background check, and you'd likely get turned down. You must also have impeccable credit rating 750 or higher, explain in detail ANY.ALL unemployment gaps, and you better, not ever have been arrested for anything!

I had security clearance (as a civilian) when I worked for a high tech company in my early 20's - then, a few years later, I discovered Colombia and told them to fuck off!


Mixx

[iknowexactly]

I think a second passport, which took me 7 years to get, also can get in the way.

[Smitty]

A second passport can, and most likely will, disqualify you. As Mixx said, good credit is important, although I will add that bad credit will not disqualify you. The important financial factor is how much debt you're carrying. The concern is the more debt you have, the more susceptible to bribery by foreign countries.

Foreign travel is a headache depending on the level of clearance. Secret and below is not much of a problem. Top Secret and travel to China, Middle East, Russia, etc is going to raise flags. Won't disqualify you as long as you give proper records of travel with a good reason.

Easiest way to obtain one? go in the military. Short of that, I'd say go with a gov't contractor, but these days there are many applicants with clearances in the job market so your best bet would be to get a gov't job that requires a clearance and they'll take care of it for you.

Traditional thinking is a clearance will earn you more money, but I'd recommend you consider a few points:
1) Depending on the level of clearance, your actions will always be scrutinized as will your travel.
2) We are at the beginning of big cuts to the DoD and the gov't budgets writ large and there will be a flood of cleared professionals in the job market so your earning potential will be less. The military is set to reduce in size and release about 100,000 workers into the market (many of them cleared already).
3) Once you're doing work that requires a clearance, you'll have a hell of a time transitioning back to the private sector and breaking free from the "industry." Your earning potential is VERY limited doing ANY work that requires a clearance. Trust me, you don't want to get stuck in an industry where you have limited potential.

[UrbanNerd]

(01-11-2012 10:35 PM)Smitty Wrote:  

A second passport can, and most likely will, disqualify you. As Mixx said, good credit is important, although I will add that bad credit will not disqualify you. The important financial factor is how much debt you're carrying. The concern is the more debt you have, the more susceptible to bribery by foreign countries.

Foreign travel is a headache depending on the level of clearance. Secret and below is not much of a problem. Top Secret and travel to China, Middle East, Russia, etc is going to raise flags. Won't disqualify you as long as you give proper records of travel with a good reason.

Easiest way to obtain one? go in the military. Short of that, I'd say go with a gov't contractor, but these days there are many applicants with clearances in the job market so your best bet would be to get a gov't job that requires a clearance and they'll take care of it for you.

Traditional thinking is a clearance will earn you more money, but I'd recommend you consider a few points:
1) Depending on the level of clearance, your actions will always be scrutinized as will your travel.
2) We are at the beginning of big cuts to the DoD and the gov't budgets writ large and there will be a flood of cleared professionals in the job market so your earning potential will be less. The military is set to reduce in size and release about 100,000 workers into the market (many of them cleared already).
3) Once you're doing work that requires a clearance, you'll have a hell of a time transitioning back to the private sector and breaking free from the "industry." Your earning potential is VERY limited doing ANY work that requires a clearance. Trust me, you don't want to get stuck in an industry where you have limited potential.

Ummmm.....not exactly true.

If you are a contractor supporting one of the "big 3"...FBI, CIA or the No Such Agency, you will be using government funding that will be given to those 3 agencies REGARDLESS of the status of the economy, because of national security. As long as the USA continues to keep their current foreign policies, stick their noses into other nations business and still want to "police the world", the USA will always have enemies. That means the USA will always have to keep up their national security.

I went from the private sector to government contracting because I can make more money and pretty much have less stress because of basically being guaranteed a job and the government "moves slower" than private sector companies as far as output of actual work. I don't know about cleared professionals being out of work...since just about every employer I have worked for (since getting my TS/SCI+Poly clearance) is offering between $5,000-$10,000 if I can find new employees.

Now YES, your credit must be very good and your travel COULD hamper you depending on where you go and the specific agency. The continuous "hearsay" is that FBI and CIA are not as hard on you on foreign travel as the No Such Agency. Now I have done Brazil, Panama, Costa Rica, Trinidad and MULTIPLE Dominican Republic trips while hold my clearance BUT Colombia is not exactly a country they want you traveling to. The KEY is to not continue staying in touch with any chick you bang because when it is time to take your polygraph (every 5 years), that chick may be on your mind and you will fail the "Do you have any relationships with foreign nationals?" question.

Of course I hate the travel restrictions that come with having a clearance but with the economy in the shape it is in now, I like having pretty much guaranteed employment.

[Aliblahba]

I agree with a lot of what Smitty and Urban Nerd say. Both made valid points. You always contact the security dept of your company before traveling abroad for pleasure. If there's an issue you'll be made aware.

Now for getting cleared. As it stands there are A LOT of people with a clearance, or specific backgrounds that are in line for the industry jobs. A college grad with no military background or degree in a highly demanded field is probably gonna be ass out.

My experience in the industry has given me a leg up on the "normal" job stateside. There's working in the technical field back home, then there's over here. It's a tough, demanding, cutthroat industry where you got to pay your dues.

As far as getting out of it? I'm working on that right now. I'll let you know how that works out.

[Riker]

Whats good about security clearance?

[jordypip23]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't most of these clearance-requiring jobs limited to the D.C. area ?

[UrbanNerd]

(01-12-2012 05:41 PM)Riker Wrote:  

Whats good about security clearance?

1) Get $30,000 to $50,000/year extra for the equivalent job in the private sector.

2) Get government funding REGARDLESS of the economy (subject to FBI/CIA/NSA)

[Aliblahba]

(01-12-2012 08:49 PM)reppin_the_847 Wrote:  

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't most of these clearance-requiring jobs limited to the D.C. area ?

You'll find lots of clearance jobs around any military installation worldwide. Most jobs in the embassy also require one also. The opportunities are there if you get one.

[Smitty]

(01-13-2012 02:29 AM)UrbanNerd Wrote:  

1) Get $30,000 to $50,000/year extra for the equivalent job in the private sector.

2) Get government funding REGARDLESS of the economy (subject to FBI/CIA/NSA)

The important caveat here is having a poly and working with one of the 3-letters (FBI, CIA, NSA).

A secret clearance (and even a TS) in the DoD is not going to get you 30k to 50k more than you would make in the private sector, and as mentioned in a previous post, with the military force, civil servant, and contractor reductions taking place, there are a lot of cleared candidates on the market...and the number is going to increase over the next four years.

I come back to the primary negative of working for the government -- there's limited growth and earning potential. If you're entrepreneurial and believe the "sky is the limit," then the private sector is where you want to be. If you're simply looking to make a paycheck, with some semblance of job security, try to pass the poly and work for a 3-letter.

[americanInEurope]

(01-13-2012 02:29 AM)UrbanNerd Wrote:  

(01-12-2012 05:41 PM)Riker Wrote:  

Whats good about security clearance?

1) Get $30,000 to $50,000/year extra for the equivalent job in the private sector.

2) Get government funding REGARDLESS of the economy (subject to FBI/CIA/NSA)

The biggest advantage is being able to live overseas for as long as you want. You don't have to deal with pesky things like visa's and work permits to live in countries where there are bases or US GOV offices. You'll have some immunity overseas under the SOFA agreements in the country you're in, so cops and local govvy's can't fuck with you. Oh and everything you make up to about $95,000 is tax free. Everything after that is just federal. That number increases every year. The defense contractors are the best of both worlds. Private sector money and growth with government job security.

I've had a security clearance since i was 18. First as a GI, then as a civilian. If you're marketable enough, companies other than the "big 3" will pay for your investigation (defense contractors). And you don't even need a Top Secret of Poly or any of that. Most jobs are just Secret. I actually prefer to work for defense contractors. The Full Scope Poly and CIA clearances pay more, but if you go overseas with just a Secret you're pretty much making more than those guys back in the states anyway. That's where the $30,000 - $50,000 boost comes from. The real money is made overseas, because you get all kinds of extra "hardship" pay for living in "dangerous" places like Germany, and "expensive" places like Panama lol. My last contract overseas I got a nice base pay, a flat rate for my apartment, money to rent a car everyday (even though I already had a car) and COLA (cost of living allowance) to offset things like the Euro, sales tax and gas prices. Plus you get perks like not having to pay that stupid 18% sales tax on everything, gas at American prices (yes if you think $4.00 a gallon is bad, go to Europe), English speaking assistance from the base, base access so you can get American food and goods, etc etc etc. And if all that wasn't enough don't forget you're living in exotic Europe. All that just from a security clearance! We have people come in all the time who are pretty much off the street but were able to talk their way into getting GDIT/Raytheon/Lockheed/Northrup/CSC/CACI to pay for their clearance because they had a degree, certs and loads of experience. They don't really trip off bad credit or anything like that. The biggest things are travel and foreign contacts. If you have loads of tie's to foreign stuff and organizations that could be a red flag. I don't know I've been in the gov't sights for so long my re-investigations are pretty much a formality because they already know everything about me. But for a guy fresh off the street be prepared for them to contact everyone you put on your list of known acquaintances, addresses, jobs, ex bosses, ex girlfriends, everything. And they WILL contact everybody. But it's not to look for mistakes, just to make sure there's nothing out of the ordinary like that time you flew to Morocco to demonstrate with the protesters or that $1,000,000 trust fund you have locked away in some Chinese bank. You may not think that stuff is a big deal but it matters.

A security clearance really is a trump card and it's the only way I've been able to float around the world for the past 10 years making loads of money. Without it I'd probably still travel as much as I do, but won't be able to live in those countries like I have. Going there for 2 months is one thing, going there for a year and living off your savings is another, but going there with a job set up that pays $150,000 a year while the local cost of living is like $3 a day for the rest of your life (or until the base closes down) makes you a rock star. If your thing is to actually live somewhere, to pack up and become a "resident" full time, then having a clearance and working for the gov't is the smartest way to do it. My re-investigation just finished so I've got a new lease on life with my clearance. For now I'm just chilling here and seeing what's good in the Americas before I decide to go back to Europe again. That clearance is what keeps me able to do that.

[Moreless]

Where does a civilian start applying for security clearance? Do I have to apply for a job that requires security clearance then the process begins or am I supposed to have it before hand?

[Basil Ransom]

"Do I have to apply for a job that requires security clearance then the process begins or am I supposed to have it before hand?"

The former. You can't request a clearance investigation, a company must request one for you. I believe companies must pay as well for it, it's not free. Many jobs will require a clearance from applicants, or the offer is contingent upon you getting one.