[redbeard]

(01-05-2019 10:33 AM)NoMoreTO Wrote:  

Could be the #1 reason to get her pregnant before marrying her is possibile infertility.

2nd Reason is if she divorces you, takes a chunk of your money, and doesn't even do the hard work of getting pregnant and delivering some kids.

3rd reason is to better protect your finances.

This is a great idea. If I was 100% sure I wanted to marry a girl, I'd just start "accidentally" nutting in her.

[Mufasa]

(01-05-2019 08:48 AM)redbeard Wrote:  

-Divorce
-Adoption
-IVF
-Impregnate another woman

If your frame is correct she will agree. I held the power in my last relationship and if my ex was barren I'm positive she would have felt so bad and insecure for letting me down that it wouldn't have taken much convincing. Question is will she unconditionally love the child? I'm a firm believer that the only unconditional love a woman can have is for her first born son. I wonder how her cucking combined with her self loathing alters her attitude to the child..

[Ouroboros]

[EndsExpect]

If you are struggling to have a baby with your wife... You picked her for a reason and life will be a lot easier for you if the baby is both of yours biologically.

IVF is stupid expensive in the US and about 3 to 5 years behind in technology. There are places around the world where IVF costs $4,000 a cycle. The technology is BETTER than the US and the medication is actually safer.

[Excalibur]

I saw this thread a few weeks ago, but now is probably a more appropriate time to post my story.

I am in the middle of a divorce with my wife who maybe infertile.

A little about my background -

I am already getting into my late 40s. I was a late bloomer, working on my graduate work and career well into my mid 30s until I discovered game. Took me another couple of years to get up to speed. Only really from 36-42 was I getting laid regularly. I did fine, got all sorts of experiences and was ready to settle down. Dated a few quality girls, won't elaborate, but didn't work out.

Prior to my wife I was dating a 26 y/o. I wanted to move the relationship forward, but these days 26 y/o are just not mature enough to make that move. She got cold feet, I got frustrated and dumped her. Then I met my wife. She is gorgeous, and has a cool personality. She looked really young but I found out she's 36. Initially I was hesitant, but she was eager to settle down, and because of the experience with the 26 y/o, I figure why not go for someone mature.

Things went well and 9 months later we were engaged. Knowing her age I figure we should get checkout in case we need fertility treatment. Sooner the better. After the check up we found out her egg reserve was very low so she doesn't even qualify for most IVF clinics.

My head started spinning and thoughts were swimming all inside my head. After not bring up the wedding for a while she got upset and probed me about it. I brought up the baby concern. I did not know she went to see a Chinese doctor already who gave her some expensive meds and told her in a few months she'll have no problem.

Obviously I have strong feelings for her by now being that I proposed to her. I could not bear the thought of abandoning someone at this stage when it's something beyond her control. But I also had said I cannot be married without children. After going though a lot of internal struggles I relented and we got married.

The few months after wedding things were great. Sex was great, but no baby of course. Unfortunately my sperm count, although adequate, wasn't great, and the Chinese doc wanted me to take meds too. I took it for 2 months and all I got was a headache.

Long story short, several months into the marriage I was having buyers remorse. "What have I done? what if I can't have children with this girl". Once in a while I would slip and say something regarding her egg reserve and how she should be careful, not drinking etc. She was very sensitive to my comments, and would totally breakdown or we would get into fights.

Of course she goes through her female mood swings. If it wan't for this underlying stress I would have handled it better, but this pressure and the thought of giving up a future of having children just possessed me. I admit I often over reacted to her misbehavior leading to many heated arguments, rivers of tears on her part, threats of divorce.

I was spending hours online reading up on IVF. I read too much and I started seeing information on the possible adverse outcomes of IVF babies. Although it is so widely used now, 1/15 babies in Denmark are IVF babies, apparently the long term health of these babies are still unknown. There is a increase of certain cancer, ADHD, depression, and possible hypertension and diabetes. I started freaking out. Although she doesn't qualify for conventional IVF, there are some docs that would still take her. It will take a lot more cycles with no guarantee of success. But by this time I was already paranoid and I would not commit to doing IVF. She had stopped taking her chinese meds since she did not see any results. And with me not moving forward with IVF, I could see her spirit started withering away.

One evening, after another tearful fight she told me she is slowly dying in this relationship. She knows I don't want to be married unless I have kids.

Through out this ordeal I can see her mood getting darker. She is always tired. From reading about other women who has fertility struggle, she was actually doing remarkably well. At times she was still cheerful and playful.

Anyways, this first year of marriage was filled with stress punctuated by fights, misspoken hurtful words on my part, endless tear on her part, and a few fun vacations

So this past week after another fight I told her I cannot take it anymore. Forgot to mention she actually had threaten divorce last year leading both us to go to several sessions of marriage counseling. Well, now we are going into the divorce paper work phase. She is not asking for anything, so we won't need a lawyer.

She is really a great girl. It is a very, very unfortunate situation. Looking back I really wanted to just take her on a long long exotic vacation and forget all this.

I really hope I do not regret this decision. But this back and forth, stress, fights and tears, and sleepless nights just cannot go on anymore.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

< Sorry to hear that mate. It's more or less how I expect it to go down. I witnessed a few women in the late 30s who were childless - some in my family. They went through a massive crisis. My mom said that that it gets better for them in the mid 40s when they have given up on having children.

One woman she met did that in the 1980s being a full-on 8.5 to 9 looks-wise - just waited too long everyone telling her that she could do better with every man who proposed to her.

Some women are fertile between 35 and even 45, but not that many.

I doubt that you could have made it work with her unless you would give up on having kids. The reality is that it was already over when you have met her. Our current system tricked her.

IVF babies - I doubt that there is much wrong with the children. That is overblown - it's still just normal fertilization with a few technical aspects changed, but of course some women don't qualify even at age 36.

Oh - and sperm counts can be upped with solid orthomolecular supplements - 10.000mg vitamin C (pure powder by Nowfoods) and a good high-potency multi by Swanson will do. But men can boost their fertility much much easier than women.

[Fortis]

I'd keep her around but I'd demand that I get to choose a woman to have a surrogate of sorts. Might compromise on a surrogate and an adopted kid. In family adoption though. Hers or mine. I'm not into strangers in the house.

The only reason I'd marry a woman is for kids. Otherwise, I don't see the value. I'm not sure I'd punish her with a divorce for something outside of her control.

By Surrogate, I don't mean IVF, I just mean knock up another chick, take the kid and tell the woman to take a hike.

[John5000]

What would I do if my wife was infertile? Nothing. I have donor babies already. Donate sperm to a sperm bank. Then rest easy that your lineage will be continued.

[Excalibur]

Want to add that dealing with infertility is a vicious cycle.

3 years ago my Total testosterone level was 800, and last year when I got tested due to my low normal sperm count, my T level was down to 400. Studies have shown as high as 60% of guys in situation of infertility has anxiety disorder, and of course many have depression.

It's even harder when you are older. I suspect my T level was on a slight decline already given that I am in my 40s. I believe low T is associated with anxiety, depression, poor sleep which in turn worsens anxiety, depression.

I wouldn't be surprised the low T was the source of my lack of decisiveness in going through with IVF.

@Simon_Straighlight - Yeah you are right, the side effects of IVF is overblown - IN MY HEAD. Yeah everything has risks. Flying in an airplane has risk. I was acting like a guy who is scared of flying in a plane. The oldest IVF babies are 40 y/o and have already have their own children. Sure they may still manifest some disease later in life, but realistically, looking at most chronic illness, the longer you are exposed to it, the more detrimental it is to your health. Even type I diabetes who have diabetes since their teenage years live to 70 y/o. So if IVF babies are at higher risk for DM and hypertension in their 40s and 50s (no ivf babies are that old yet), most likely it'll only decrease their life expectancy a little bit. Also I'll be 90 y/o or dead by the time my kid is 40-50 y/o so why am I worried about it.

I got a girl preggo in my late 30s. Looking back wish I had kept the kid

As a matter of advice, don't put off having kids to long. Not just for women, for men it comes with its own set of challenges.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

I got a few women pregnant in my 20s, but I paid for the abortions.
If I had done the same with older women, then they would have kept it for sure. Most of them were between 19-24.

And as I am joking to my family:

"Hey - I am childless now, but next Christmas I could come with 10 kids and 10 women on the holiday table. I am a man after all. It's all a matter of will." Of course - what you also require is to find 10 women willing to get pregnant pronto with you - though since I am above average in looks and intelligence, then the only factor is whether I am rich enough to pay the her massive child-support. If you have that, then you can sire kids like Genghis Khan - though of course there is a limit to sanity there too. How many children can you have with single mothers? That is why some wealthy men have set out massive stipulations to the child support money - like kid not being able to live too far away from him, mother not being an irresponsible whore with weekly new boyfriends etc.

Though the best is a nuclear family and I have a girl for that. But I am not excluding further children when later with a younger woman.