Atlantic article: Why Are Young People Having So Little Sex?
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If you're an average guy in your 20s, where the hell do you even go to meet girls and have sex these days?
It can't be Tinder, that place is a horror show. Do girls still go to bars? Is it clubs? Or do you literally just have to start chatting up random girls on the street and hope it goes somewhere?
It can't be Tinder, that place is a horror show. Do girls still go to bars? Is it clubs? Or do you literally just have to start chatting up random girls on the street and hope it goes somewhere?
Who is in charge of keeping track of how much people are fucking and whether or not they are being honest about it?
Quote: (12-17-2018 05:26 AM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:
If you're an average guy in your 20s, where the hell do you even go to meet girls and have sex these days?
It can't be Tinder, that place is a horror show. Do girls still go to bars? Is it clubs? Or do you literally just have to start chatting up random girls on the street and hope it goes somewhere?
Gotta go to the docks man. All the action is down at the docks.
Quote: (12-16-2018 10:01 PM)Shemp Wrote:
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/arc...on/573949/
>>Accordingly to a November 2017 Economist/YouGov poll, 17 percent of Americans ages 18 to 29 now believe that a man inviting a woman out for a drink “always” or “usually” constitutes sexual harassment
>>Over the course of a year, he reports, only 50 percent of heterosexual single women in their 20s go on any dates—and older women are even less likely to do so.
Polls mean jack and shit when it comes to sex in the West. You will never get a straight, truthful answer out of a girl in regards to how much sex she has because, even in anonymity, she is compelled to not want to be seen as a whore.
As for the sexual harassment part, that's all mental gymnastics.
Quote: (12-17-2018 05:33 AM)Waqqle Wrote:
Quote: (12-17-2018 05:26 AM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:
If you're an average guy in your 20s, where the hell do you even go to meet girls and have sex these days?
It can't be Tinder, that place is a horror show. Do girls still go to bars? Is it clubs? Or do you literally just have to start chatting up random girls on the street and hope it goes somewhere?
Gotta go to the docks man. All the action is down at the docks.
That's my kind of funny right there. Down by the docks. I don't know how you make the big blue ribbon post of the day, if i did i'd do it.
This autism guy gets a rep point.
Aloha!
Some guys here calling BS on whether this poll can be trusted... did you read the article? Did you see that this trend has been observed outside the United States and is a general phenomenon in a lot of industrialized countries? I won't cite the entire thing, but countries include Britain, Australia, Finland, Netherlands, Sweden, and Japan. I wonder if there are other examples.
I'm all for tin foil hats and conspiracy theories about people not being honest in polls, and it worked out that way in the US election, but as the article points out... slutdom is pretty much celebrated now. The logic that women would lie about sexual partners wouldn't hold especially true today compared to the past. If they lie today, they lied in the past. Yet there is still a pattern of less sex today. And it doesn't make sense that today women would be more interested in preserving their 'virtue' to some pollster more than their mothers and grandmothers would.
But that's beside the point. I think it was very interesting they proposed so many reasons for the decline.
I put my money on porn, tinder/technology/option paralysis, and the demonization of masculinity, conflating flirting (especially awkward flirting) as sexual harassment.
But I also put my money on there being a reversal. I don't know when, but from my limited anecdotal evidence, I've met women who yearn for a guy with actual social skills who can talk their way into their pussy. It's not THAT bad.
I'm all for tin foil hats and conspiracy theories about people not being honest in polls, and it worked out that way in the US election, but as the article points out... slutdom is pretty much celebrated now. The logic that women would lie about sexual partners wouldn't hold especially true today compared to the past. If they lie today, they lied in the past. Yet there is still a pattern of less sex today. And it doesn't make sense that today women would be more interested in preserving their 'virtue' to some pollster more than their mothers and grandmothers would.
But that's beside the point. I think it was very interesting they proposed so many reasons for the decline.
Quote:Quote:
Over the course of many conversations with sex researchers, psychologists, economists, sociologists, therapists, sex educators, and young adults, I heard many other theories about what I have come to think of as the sex recession. I was told it might be a consequence of the hookup culture, of crushing economic pressures, of surging anxiety rates, of psychological frailty, of widespread antidepressant use, of streaming television, of environmental estrogens leaked by plastics, of dropping testosterone levels, of digital porn, of the vibrator’s golden age, of dating apps, of option paralysis, of helicopter parents, of careerism, of smartphones, of the news cycle, of information overload generally, of sleep deprivation, of obesity. Name a modern blight, and someone, somewhere, is ready to blame it for messing with the modern libido.
I put my money on porn, tinder/technology/option paralysis, and the demonization of masculinity, conflating flirting (especially awkward flirting) as sexual harassment.
But I also put my money on there being a reversal. I don't know when, but from my limited anecdotal evidence, I've met women who yearn for a guy with actual social skills who can talk their way into their pussy. It's not THAT bad.
I've mentioned this before in another post, but i feel social media, Netflix, smartphones etc affect women way more than they affect men. It's created a blanket of comfort for young women to basically sit in their parents houses and live precariously through instagram/facebook tags. Communicating with their girlfriends through memes and all else, free from the anxiety and burden to present yourself that comes with actually going out in public and meeting people face to face, or developing a relationship with a real individual.
It's toxic because it's like having all the dopamine benefits of socialising, without the all important 'feedback' that may come if you behave disrespectfully or callously to someone in the flesh. The lives some women lead just seem so tame and pointless, they never put themselves 'out there' or do anything that warrants merit - but will still be rewarded with praise for dolling up and posting a selfie by their legion of imaginary mates online. They simply strut around in some narcissistic bubble of false praise, failing to realise their lives have nothing going on.
Women used to look for men because men were better than women in a societal sense. And also because, what else was there to do? read the newspaper? watch all 5 TV channels there were? There was an onus to seek men and to do so quickly. Distractions such as instagram now market a lifestyle that doesn't exist of why be responsible when you could be drinking coconut water by the pool and having weird Indian dudes messaging you paying for pics of your 'bobs and vagene'.
I know theres always the narrative that men are all too soft these days, or 'don't know how to talk to women'. It's bollocks, when you look at how things were; most old guys who had seemingly happy LTR's with their wives throughout their entire lives etc they're not exactly some aged Steve McQueen. Most men today aren't ever given a real chance to have proper conversation with girls because they're nowhere to be found.
It's toxic because it's like having all the dopamine benefits of socialising, without the all important 'feedback' that may come if you behave disrespectfully or callously to someone in the flesh. The lives some women lead just seem so tame and pointless, they never put themselves 'out there' or do anything that warrants merit - but will still be rewarded with praise for dolling up and posting a selfie by their legion of imaginary mates online. They simply strut around in some narcissistic bubble of false praise, failing to realise their lives have nothing going on.
Women used to look for men because men were better than women in a societal sense. And also because, what else was there to do? read the newspaper? watch all 5 TV channels there were? There was an onus to seek men and to do so quickly. Distractions such as instagram now market a lifestyle that doesn't exist of why be responsible when you could be drinking coconut water by the pool and having weird Indian dudes messaging you paying for pics of your 'bobs and vagene'.
I know theres always the narrative that men are all too soft these days, or 'don't know how to talk to women'. It's bollocks, when you look at how things were; most old guys who had seemingly happy LTR's with their wives throughout their entire lives etc they're not exactly some aged Steve McQueen. Most men today aren't ever given a real chance to have proper conversation with girls because they're nowhere to be found.
Quote: (12-17-2018 08:47 AM)Kamikaze Wrote:
But I also put my money on there being a reversal. I don't know when, but from my limited anecdotal evidence, I've met women who yearn for a guy with actual social skills who can talk their way into their pussy. It's not THAT bad.
Well if all these average women that don't want to have sex or get into LTR's with average guys follow through and have less sex in general, they won't have kids (or they'll have less kids anyhow). So then the women that do have kids are/will be the ones that are more willing to engage in sex, both casual and committed.
Hence, the next generation of women will be more sexual than the last. Just find some place to hibernate for 20 years. Just think about it. All the girls with the super high standards for sex, their genes aren't making it to the next round. The girls that put out, their genes are more likely to make it to the next round.
Throughout human history, virtually every woman's genes made it to the next round, but for men, that's never been the case, only some men got to pass on their genes because a large chunk of every cohort died in wars before they could pass on their genes. Because of the changes in gender relations in modern times, though, a huge chunk of our generation's female cohort will not pass on their genes to the next. Many men will not pass on their genes also, but that's nothing new, that's always been the case.
No idea if the above will actually happen, but just throwing it out there.
Two things.
1. Surveys are the worst way of doing research because people surveyed always lie. Even in s circumstance where total anonymity is guaranteed, people lie. Why use them? Pick a better method for gathering data. That’s right, in many cases a survey is your only choice.
2. Kamikaze makes an excellent point about option paralysis. Look at the video of the girl who did the real life tinder experiment. She chose no one. If you had given her 2-3 guys to pick from, and not had a camera on her, she would have picked one. Even among average girls, and I’m sure plenty of men as well, getting likes on social media is a form of validation. A regular person with about 250 friends on Facebook can feasibly get 40-50 likes for any random pic. Why get out and be social if you can have a lot more validation from tapping on your phone screen? And the best part of this? It’s totally one sided and risk free. You don’t have to do any work. Your feelings won’t get hurt.
Have you ever seen a kid at a toy store who’s been given too many options? What do they do? They tend to shut down. Maybe even have a tantrum. When you’re an attractive female on IG, you will have followers all over the world. You don’t have the time to ponder your options much less pick one.
1. Surveys are the worst way of doing research because people surveyed always lie. Even in s circumstance where total anonymity is guaranteed, people lie. Why use them? Pick a better method for gathering data. That’s right, in many cases a survey is your only choice.
2. Kamikaze makes an excellent point about option paralysis. Look at the video of the girl who did the real life tinder experiment. She chose no one. If you had given her 2-3 guys to pick from, and not had a camera on her, she would have picked one. Even among average girls, and I’m sure plenty of men as well, getting likes on social media is a form of validation. A regular person with about 250 friends on Facebook can feasibly get 40-50 likes for any random pic. Why get out and be social if you can have a lot more validation from tapping on your phone screen? And the best part of this? It’s totally one sided and risk free. You don’t have to do any work. Your feelings won’t get hurt.
Have you ever seen a kid at a toy store who’s been given too many options? What do they do? They tend to shut down. Maybe even have a tantrum. When you’re an attractive female on IG, you will have followers all over the world. You don’t have the time to ponder your options much less pick one.
Delete. There is a technical glitch w/the forum.
Whenever there is an article in the Atlantic, you can bet that the real answer to their question is the answer that they will NEVER admit to.
For example: "Why aren young people having so little sex"
Answer: "Um -- could it be -- because we've turned sex between teenagers into a felony and have swat teams beating down people's doors, dragging them screaming off to jail, throwing their parents into the street so we can steal their house to pay lawyers and jailhouses, all because some 16 year old girl and 21-year old boy did what young girls and boys have been doing for a million years? Duh."
Note that this article isn't a "question". It is taunting.
This article is actually a way for the man-hating lesbians, angry old baby-boomers, suburban teen-hating soccer moms, and gay men, the people who staff the Atlantic, to say "nyaa nyaa, fuck you!" to the young straight people and men. They created the sex-fearing nature of teenagers, it is part of their long effort to destroy straight society, or in the case of the boomers, part of their long effort to hand their grandchildren a nation in smoking ruins, and this article is a way for them to passive-agressively wallow in their triumph.
For example: "Why aren young people having so little sex"
Answer: "Um -- could it be -- because we've turned sex between teenagers into a felony and have swat teams beating down people's doors, dragging them screaming off to jail, throwing their parents into the street so we can steal their house to pay lawyers and jailhouses, all because some 16 year old girl and 21-year old boy did what young girls and boys have been doing for a million years? Duh."
Note that this article isn't a "question". It is taunting.
This article is actually a way for the man-hating lesbians, angry old baby-boomers, suburban teen-hating soccer moms, and gay men, the people who staff the Atlantic, to say "nyaa nyaa, fuck you!" to the young straight people and men. They created the sex-fearing nature of teenagers, it is part of their long effort to destroy straight society, or in the case of the boomers, part of their long effort to hand their grandchildren a nation in smoking ruins, and this article is a way for them to passive-agressively wallow in their triumph.
@MrLemon: article focused on Americans but there are references to similiar trend towards less sex in Europe and Japan. Situation in Japan is especially bad, but sexuality has not been criminalized or demonized there like in the USA, so that's not the full explanation.
Quote: (12-17-2018 01:29 PM)Shemp Wrote:
@MrLemon: article focused on Americans but there are references to similiar trend towards less sex in Europe and Japan. Situation in Japan is especially bad, but sexuality has not been criminalized or demonized there like in the USA, so that's not the full explanation.
Yeah, that's true. Oh well, it was fun to write the post. A little fire and brimstone helps me wake up in the AM.
Quote: (12-16-2018 11:57 PM)Spaniard88 Wrote:
On the female side, they just don't need men anymore, we're accessories, like a smartphone, but not as important, not as necessary. But if she has the chance to test drive a guy that's easy on the eyes, she'll do it. Just don't expect her to bring anything more than a vagina to the test drive, being a decent human being would be too much effort for a lot of Western women. We've been reduced to on-call dildos. The "lucky" guys, anyways. The incels are just out of luck. That's an extreme portrait, but it's not too far from the reality for a lot of men in the West.
Basically, since less guys and girls are in relationships nowadays, it follows that less sex is taking place, overall.
This pretty well covers my experience with dating in the smartphone era. Females feel so empowered that they no longer feel the need for male partnership. It's not just that they don't need to offer anything but sex, it's that the don't need to offer anything besides the chance for sex. Roosh and others think this has been brought about by design. The Anti Sex League of 1984 comes to mind:
Quote:Quote:
The aim of the Party was not merely to prevent men and women from forming loyalties which it might not be able to control. Its real, undeclared purpose was to remove all pleasure from the sexual act. Not love so much as eroticism was the enemy, inside marriage as well as outside it. All marriages between Party members had to be approved by a committee appointed for the purpose, and – though the principle was never clearly stated – permission was always refused if the couple concerned gave the impression of being physically attracted to one another. The only recognized purpose of marriage was to beget children for the service of the Party. Sexual intercourse was to be looked on as a slightly disgusting minor operation, like having an enema. This again was never put into plain words, but in an indirect way it was rubbed into every Party member from childhood onwards. There were even organizations such as the Junior, Anti-Sex League, which advocated complete celibacy for both sexes. All children were to be begotten by artificial insemination (artsem, it was called in Newspeak) and brought up in public institutions. This, Winston was aware, was not meant altogether seriously, but somehow it fitted in with the general ideology of the Party. The Party was trying to kill the sex instinct, or, if it could not be killed, then to distort it and dirty it. He did not know why this was so, but it seemed natural that it should be so. And as far as the women were concerned, the Party's efforts were largely successful. (1.6.9)
Quote: (12-17-2018 11:21 AM)mr-ed209 Wrote:
I've mentioned this before in another post, but i feel social media, Netflix, smartphones etc affect women way more than they affect men. It's created a blanket of comfort for young women to basically sit in their parents houses and live precariously through instagram/facebook tags. Communicating with their girlfriends through memes and all else, free from the anxiety and burden to present yourself that comes with actually going out in public and meeting people face to face, or developing a relationship with a real individual.
Most men today aren't ever given a real chance to have proper conversation with girls because they're nowhere to be found.
I think this is a key point. I think that women just don't leave the house as much to engage in the public sphere. As a matter of fact, I have been noticing how many public places have turned into sausage parties. Even places like Starbucks where I see the women going through the drive-through where available or just buying their Frappa-thingies and leaving.
As to the why;
-Lower T levels in men due to dietary factors/endocrine disruptors. (Libido, penis size etc.) This element also effects men`s general desirability with women. So less viable men seen from women`s perspective.
-Women getting their needs for validation fulfilled via social media etc.
-Decades of scaremongering when it comes to STD`s and teen pregnancy etc. (STD`s are of course a real danger. But getting pregnant when you`re 16 is a good thing in my book. Few gamete mutations and very viable offspring. That`s how it`s meant to happen.)
-All the legal liabilities that goes with dating and sexing up Western women. It`s in fact very dangerous these days, and getting worse.
-Poor social skills, due mostly to communicating via screens and apps etc. Maybe poor parenting plays a role here also.
-All the downstream effect of Feminism like; Women using all their energy and time on acquiring some BS degree. All women feeling entitled to the very best quality men, which they will usually not find, and they will rather go without sex. (Hypergamy)
-Lower T levels in men due to dietary factors/endocrine disruptors. (Libido, penis size etc.) This element also effects men`s general desirability with women. So less viable men seen from women`s perspective.
-Women getting their needs for validation fulfilled via social media etc.
-Decades of scaremongering when it comes to STD`s and teen pregnancy etc. (STD`s are of course a real danger. But getting pregnant when you`re 16 is a good thing in my book. Few gamete mutations and very viable offspring. That`s how it`s meant to happen.)
-All the legal liabilities that goes with dating and sexing up Western women. It`s in fact very dangerous these days, and getting worse.
-Poor social skills, due mostly to communicating via screens and apps etc. Maybe poor parenting plays a role here also.
-All the downstream effect of Feminism like; Women using all their energy and time on acquiring some BS degree. All women feeling entitled to the very best quality men, which they will usually not find, and they will rather go without sex. (Hypergamy)
We will stomp to the top with the wind in our teeth.
George L. Mallory
The number on the body weight scale is too high.
Quote:Roger F Devlin Wrote:
It is possible, however, to enable women to mate hypergamously, i.e., with the most sexually attractive (handsome or socially dominant) men. In the Ecclesiazusae of Aristophanes the women of Athens stage a coup d’état. They occupy the legislative assembly and barricade their husbands out. Then they proceed to enact a law by which the most attractive males of the city will be compelled to mate with each female in turn, beginning with the least attractive. That is the female sexual utopia in power. Aristophanes had a better understanding of the female mind than the average husband.
Women have replaced husbands with tinder until they are ready to settle but only the most attractive men may mate, starting with the least attractive women first.
Testosterone levels are the lowest they have ever been.
Soy consumption.
Young men are told that all heterosexual sex comes with a connotation of rape.
There is a rise in obesity rates.
A drastic rate of porn consumption, lowering sex drives.
#MeToo.
Tinder skews sexual marketplace to the top X% of men, most guys are not successful on online platforms, and many women simply use them as a way to pad their Instagram follower count.
Social media is causing mass depression. Nobody wants to have sex when they're depressed.
Social media is also creating the 'have - have not' dichotomy in the Western World.
One night stands are far more common - Personally I put up one of my better years for numbers however most were one time things, so that even though my number count went up, the instances of sex was probably lower than had I been in a relationship (definitely lower than if in a relationship).
Economic times of uncertainty, I run into a lot of girls that treat their job like their boyfriend and really have no time for dating and encounters. I am seeing more of this.
Night life on a slow decline. Social skill also on a decline.
I could keep going, but there are dozens of reasons for this phenomena.
Soy consumption.
Young men are told that all heterosexual sex comes with a connotation of rape.
There is a rise in obesity rates.
A drastic rate of porn consumption, lowering sex drives.
#MeToo.
Tinder skews sexual marketplace to the top X% of men, most guys are not successful on online platforms, and many women simply use them as a way to pad their Instagram follower count.
Social media is causing mass depression. Nobody wants to have sex when they're depressed.
Social media is also creating the 'have - have not' dichotomy in the Western World.
One night stands are far more common - Personally I put up one of my better years for numbers however most were one time things, so that even though my number count went up, the instances of sex was probably lower than had I been in a relationship (definitely lower than if in a relationship).
Economic times of uncertainty, I run into a lot of girls that treat their job like their boyfriend and really have no time for dating and encounters. I am seeing more of this.
Night life on a slow decline. Social skill also on a decline.
I could keep going, but there are dozens of reasons for this phenomena.
"Money over bitches, nigga stick to the script." - Jay-Z
They gonna love me for my ambition.
I think that porn and masturbation are factors as well. Hardcore porn has never been easier to access and it has never been more specific and niche than it is now. A lot of guys get desensitized before they even enter university and develop fetishes, that become their only turn ons, which can likely never be experienced in real life.
I think people also underestimate the effect porn has on women’s sexual development as well.
Young girls curious about sex are educated and exposed to men with giant cocks slamming plastic whore’s, black men banging white women, white cuckolds, lesbianism and all sorts of weird and degenerate shit.
This is what they will learn to be aroused by. Your normal man just won’t offer her the triggers she has been programmed to be stimulated by. Perhaps men the same.
It’s not surprising who the big industry porn (((players)) are that peddle this crap.
Young girls curious about sex are educated and exposed to men with giant cocks slamming plastic whore’s, black men banging white women, white cuckolds, lesbianism and all sorts of weird and degenerate shit.
This is what they will learn to be aroused by. Your normal man just won’t offer her the triggers she has been programmed to be stimulated by. Perhaps men the same.
It’s not surprising who the big industry porn (((players)) are that peddle this crap.
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