[MrLemon]

It just occurred to me today, reading Rooshv, there is a lot of discussion of the excessive power being given to women in the world today. We talk about that a lot here.

But we don't talk about another issue, that I propose is the mirror-image of "too much power for women" ... and that is....that we have lost our cultural heritage as men, in which young men are mentored and trained by older men, "silverbacks". Older men are handing off power to women, instead of to their fellow men.

These things go together. If you don't have a strong culture of older men training their young brothers and sons, and handing power to them at the right time, you don't have a healthy patriarchy and almost by default, women's hysteria and crazyness creeps into parts of society where it doesn't belong.

I'm going to speculate here: the loss of mentoring is based on a lot of factors. Yes, the globalists have a plot to get rid of male-led family life. But also technology is partially to blame....old men lose track of the speed of technology so quickly, so in many ways, young men have to ignore them and re-invent themselves and their careers by themselves.

Also the baby boomers are a particularly noxious breed of narcissists...they don't mentor younger men, they are too busy trying to stay 30 years old forever and don't care about anybody else.

Of course all this is very self-centered...I'm an older man so naturally I would claim that we older men have more to contribute. Well, ok that's probably true. I was lucky as a younger guy that I hooked into a respected group that had a lot of grayhairs, and I listened to them, so I think about this issue.

In any case, those of you who want to restore the power of the Patriarchy and prevent the coming gender wars, remember, to do that you have to reconnect experienced men and young men.

[Geomann180]

I wouldn't be anywhere close to where I am today without the help of my Father, two other role models, and my best friend.

G

[N°6]

Words from a man of equal or inferior status: mansplaining

Words from a man of higher status whose position is wanted: mentoring

It’s Morgana la Fey wanting Merlin’s mentoring only to eventually betray him by using black magic. Her last words to the dying wizard, “I am no man’s servant.”

[Longshanks]

I'm entirely self taught really. Being the eldest child, I would guess it's easier.

[Aurini]

This is something I have noted often; the silverbacks are mentoring the women, while abandoning the boys.

I was lucky enough (and I sought out) mentoring from older men during my early twenties. They were far from perfect - they'd never been properly mentored, either - but I learned what I could from them.

As noted, part of it has to do with Boomer narcissism, and part of it with the internalization of the "male oppressing women in history" narrative. Fathers seem to be threatened by their sons surpassing them, so they hobble them, while training their daughters to become men.

[Days of Broken Arrows]

(11-29-2018 03:32 PM)Aurini Wrote:  

This is something I have noted often; the silverbacks are mentoring the women, while abandoning the boys.

I was lucky enough (and I sought out) mentoring from older men during my early twenties. They were far from perfect - they'd never been properly mentored, either - but I learned what I could from them.

As noted, part of it has to do with Boomer narcissism, and part of it with the internalization of the "male oppressing women in history" narrative. Fathers seem to be threatened by their sons surpassing them, so they hobble them, while training their daughters to become men.

THIS! My lord, 1000 times this. If I could award Aurini 50 Rep Points for that comment, I would.

I went through life mistaking the entire relationship my dad had with me. I was under the impression that if I was successful it would be met with pride and/or praise.

Wrong.

It was always met with derision (and continues to be). For some reason I never made this connection. This started when I started dating and only amped up from there. One really bad example is when I bought a house with my ex-wife. We were proud of it and invited people over that Thanksgiving. The whole time my father never stopped giving me shit in front of everyone -- to the point of bringing up things I did as a teenager.

The problem is that I misinterpreted this kind of criticism. I assumed it was about me being flawed (which I am -- we all are). Turned out it was petty jealousy. He couldn't take that I'd gone out on my own and made something of myself.

But this is difficult to discuss. It comes off as arrogant to say all this. It makes it look like I think of myself as so wonderful that others make it their mission to drag me down.

That's not the case. Jealousy never has a logical target.

The funny thing is that as early as age 16 I was able to see jealousy a mile away....but when it was middle-aged moms resenting their daughters for being better looking!

What I was blind to was the jealousy of middle-aged men towards their sons for having sex with those daughters.

Had someone explained this to me at 18, I'd have had a much easier life. I can't be the only one who experienced this, can I? In a way it shaped my life. Not in a good way.

[debeguiled]

They don't want it.

[Thot Leader]

(11-29-2018 03:56 PM)Days of Broken Arrows Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 03:32 PM)Aurini Wrote:  

This is something I have noted often; the silverbacks are mentoring the women, while abandoning the boys.

I was lucky enough (and I sought out) mentoring from older men during my early twenties. They were far from perfect - they'd never been properly mentored, either - but I learned what I could from them.

As noted, part of it has to do with Boomer narcissism, and part of it with the internalization of the "male oppressing women in history" narrative. Fathers seem to be threatened by their sons surpassing them, so they hobble them, while training their daughters to become men.

THIS! My lord, 1000 times this. If I could award Aurini 50 Rep Points for that comment, I would.

I went through life mistaking the entire relationship my dad had with me. I was under the impression that if I was successful it would be met with pride and/or praise.

Wrong.

It was always met with derision (and continues to be). For some reason I never made this connection. This started when I started dating and only amped up from there. One really bad example is when I bought a house with my ex-wife. We were proud of it and invited people over that Thanksgiving. The whole time my father never stopped giving me shit in front of everyone -- to the point of bringing up things I did as a teenager.

The problem is that I misinterpreted this kind of criticism. I assumed it was about me being flawed (which I am -- we all are). Turned out it was petty jealousy. He couldn't take that I'd gone out on my own and made something of myself.

But this is difficult to discuss. It comes off as arrogant to say all this. It makes it look like I think of myself as so wonderful that others make it their mission to drag me down.

That's not the case. Jealousy never has a logical target.

The funny thing is that as early as age 16 I was able to see jealousy a mile away....but when it was middle-aged moms resenting their daughters for being better looking!

What I was blind to was the jealousy of middle-aged men towards their sons for having sex with those daughters.

Had someone explained this to me at 18, I'd have had a much easier life. I can't be the only one who experienced this, can I? In a way it shaped my life. Not in a good way.

I've been through the same thing and it's been one of the most destructive forces in my life. Getting picked on and fucked with by my dad and other male authority figures. I was often punished not because I had fucked up but because my dad or whoever felt like punishing me (I'm a tall, good-looking, articulate man, which turned me into a tempting target).

I wonder if fathers were like this this throughout history? It seems that if they had been, then our species would never have come this far. But then in the past there was a frontier and so wayward young men had a place to go when kicked out of the home or village. There definitely had to be more mentoring than there is now. I think Boomer narcissism is the proximate cause.

BTW, this is something Chuck Palahniuk talked about on his appearance on Joe Rogan's podcast. Definitely worth checking out.

[Kid Twist]

^ Any father that doesn't want his son to be better in every way than he was (deep down) is truly pathologic. This is not normal.

And I'm not talking about "But I'd beat you one on one." That is normal, because playfighting and competition in that matter is healthy.

[MrLemon]

(11-29-2018 05:23 PM)Thot Leader Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 03:56 PM)Days of Broken Arrows Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 03:32 PM)Aurini Wrote:  

This is something I have noted often; the silverbacks are mentoring the women, while abandoning the boys.

I was lucky enough (and I sought out) mentoring from older men during my early twenties. They were far from perfect - they'd never been properly mentored, either - but I learned what I could from them.

As noted, part of it has to do with Boomer narcissism, and part of it with the internalization of the "male oppressing women in history" narrative. Fathers seem to be threatened by their sons surpassing them, so they hobble them, while training their daughters to become men.

THIS! My lord, 1000 times this. If I could award Aurini 50 Rep Points for that comment, I would.

I went through life mistaking the entire relationship my dad had with me. I was under the impression that if I was successful it would be met with pride and/or praise.

Wrong.

It was always met with derision (and continues to be). For some reason I never made this connection. This started when I started dating and only amped up from there. One really bad example is when I bought a house with my ex-wife. We were proud of it and invited people over that Thanksgiving. The whole time my father never stopped giving me shit in front of everyone -- to the point of bringing up things I did as a teenager.

The problem is that I misinterpreted this kind of criticism. I assumed it was about me being flawed (which I am -- we all are). Turned out it was petty jealousy. He couldn't take that I'd gone out on my own and made something of myself.

But this is difficult to discuss. It comes off as arrogant to say all this. It makes it look like I think of myself as so wonderful that others make it their mission to drag me down.

That's not the case. Jealousy never has a logical target.

The funny thing is that as early as age 16 I was able to see jealousy a mile away....but when it was middle-aged moms resenting their daughters for being better looking!

What I was blind to was the jealousy of middle-aged men towards their sons for having sex with those daughters.

Had someone explained this to me at 18, I'd have had a much easier life. I can't be the only one who experienced this, can I? In a way it shaped my life. Not in a good way.

I've been through the same thing and it's been one of the most destructive forces in my life. Getting picked on and fucked with by my dad and other male authority figures. I was often punished not because I had fucked up but because my dad or whoever felt like punishing me (I'm a tall, good-looking, articulate man, which turned me into a tempting target).

I wonder if fathers were like this this throughout history? It seems that if they had been, then our species would never have come this far. But then in the past there was a frontier and so wayward young men had a place to go when kicked out of the home or village. There definitely had to be more mentoring than there is now. I think Boomer narcissism is the proximate cause.

BTW, this is something Chuck Palahniuk talked about on his appearance on Joe Rogan's podcast. Definitely worth checking out.

Reading this just breaks my heart.

When I started this thread I honestly wasn't even thinking to this kind of story. It's catching me off-guard. Sure I know a lot of dads who have been absent but wasn't thinking about active sabotage. That's a betrayal.

[Paracelsus]

Based on a lot of the above posts: is it necessarily such a bad thing that today's fathers and grandfathers are providing no support to their sons or younger brothers?

Why would we go to learn about how to hold a marriage together from the generation that has the highest divorce rates in history?

Why would we learn about the value of families from fathers who put possessions above their own flesh and blood?

What do our fathers have to tell us about how to manage money when they have -- as a generation, as multiple generations -- let us inherit a national debt that is literally impossible to pay off? Let alone their own personal chains of debt that hang around their necks, the chains of college debt they hang around our own necks to assuage their own guilt for not raising us?

What do our fathers have to tell us about civic virtues when they elect leftists and oligarchs to rule over us?

What do our fathers have to tell us about morals when they tolerate homosexuality, pederasty, relativism, and pronounce all these things as good? When they abandon God and higher values of all kinds on the rationale that they -- unique in all humanity -- think they've got the world all worked out?

What have our fathers got to tell us about values when they have been raised to value the self above all other things - including above country, God, children, democratic institutions?

What do our fathers know about the preciousness of life when they blithely send Somebody Else's Child to die in far-off countries with no understanding of why we are there? (It's been 70 years since an appreciable fraction of Western men ever risked their lives in combat or knew what it was to accept the duty that compulsory national service amounts to. That generation understandably but foolishly swore in its soul that their sons would never know that danger, and the result, in less than a century, has been the fast rot of the masculine soul.)

What do our fathers know about nature, and therefore their real place in this world, when most of them never venture out of smog-choked cities and cookie-cutter suburbs into the wild, where the wind can be heard to blow and the night sky is on fire with starlight? When most of them don't realise how abhorrent and how constructed the zoo that holds exotic animals is?

This is why the classics are so important. They were written for a generation other than the mass of stinking narcissists the West has become, written back when the water was pure, when the sky was clear, and when man's blood was still red.

[Thersites]

Wisdom from the forums provide by Roosh and other older members about game, life, or general subjects are surrogate many men looking for guidance in my personal opinion. Many young men do not have a chance due circumstance out of their control to get guidance and experience for older men, thus become rudderless in the river of life. Things my father didn't taught me, I learn from Aurini's, DoBA's or MrLemon's posts for example.

(11-29-2018 07:12 PM)Paracelsus Wrote:  

This is why the classics are so important. They were written for a generation other than the mass of stinking narcissists the West has become, written back when the water was pure, when the sky was clear, and when man's blood was still red.

I recall a line from Malcolm X that I can't find at the moment that talk about how books become the missing fathers that many black men needed while he was in prison. For some, fictional character can become a paragon for a person emulated and teach the lessons that a man need to thrive.

[kurtybro]

can somebody explain this 'boomer narcissism' that keeps being repeated? Why and how, exactly, are boomers narcissists vs any other generation?

[The Father]

(11-29-2018 07:59 PM)Thersites Wrote:  

Wisdom from the forums provide by Roosh and other older members about game, life, or general subjects are surrogate many men looking for guidance in my personal opinion. Many young men do not have a chance due circumstance out of their control to get guidance and experience for older men, thus become rudderless in the river of life.

And a big part of providing wisdom is slapping down made-up nonsense when it is posted on this forum. Like the "work for lesbian boss thread", where someone said you can game 5 out of 6 of them and have them eating out of your hand, but the SIXTH one MIGHT not like you. That's a good way to get some young man fired. "Hey, Brunhilde, I know you are into bumping fuzz and all, but check out my DHV! So, you're cool if i just take the lead on all projects from now on, m'kay?" {Visits urgent care to have severed arm removed from rectum}

[Days of Broken Arrows]

(11-29-2018 05:23 PM)Thot Leader Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 03:56 PM)Days of Broken Arrows Wrote:  

(11-29-2018 03:32 PM)Aurini Wrote:  

This is something I have noted often; the silverbacks are mentoring the women, while abandoning the boys.

I was lucky enough (and I sought out) mentoring from older men during my early twenties. They were far from perfect - they'd never been properly mentored, either - but I learned what I could from them.

As noted, part of it has to do with Boomer narcissism, and part of it with the internalization of the "male oppressing women in history" narrative. Fathers seem to be threatened by their sons surpassing them, so they hobble them, while training their daughters to become men.

THIS! My lord, 1000 times this. If I could award Aurini 50 Rep Points for that comment, I would.

I went through life mistaking the entire relationship my dad had with me. I was under the impression that if I was successful it would be met with pride and/or praise.

Wrong.

It was always met with derision (and continues to be). For some reason I never made this connection. This started when I started dating and only amped up from there. One really bad example is when I bought a house with my ex-wife. We were proud of it and invited people over that Thanksgiving. The whole time my father never stopped giving me shit in front of everyone -- to the point of bringing up things I did as a teenager.

The problem is that I misinterpreted this kind of criticism. I assumed it was about me being flawed (which I am -- we all are). Turned out it was petty jealousy. He couldn't take that I'd gone out on my own and made something of myself.

But this is difficult to discuss. It comes off as arrogant to say all this. It makes it look like I think of myself as so wonderful that others make it their mission to drag me down.

That's not the case. Jealousy never has a logical target.

The funny thing is that as early as age 16 I was able to see jealousy a mile away....but when it was middle-aged moms resenting their daughters for being better looking!

What I was blind to was the jealousy of middle-aged men towards their sons for having sex with those daughters.

Had someone explained this to me at 18, I'd have had a much easier life. I can't be the only one who experienced this, can I? In a way it shaped my life. Not in a good way.

I've been through the same thing and it's been one of the most destructive forces in my life. Getting picked on and fucked with by my dad and other male authority figures. I was often punished not because I had fucked up but because my dad or whoever felt like punishing me (I'm a tall, good-looking, articulate man, which turned me into a tempting target).

I wonder if fathers were like this this throughout history? It seems that if they had been, then our species would never have come this far. But then in the past there was a frontier and so wayward young men had a place to go when kicked out of the home or village. There definitely had to be more mentoring than there is now. I think Boomer narcissism is the proximate cause.

BTW, this is something Chuck Palahniuk talked about on his appearance on Joe Rogan's podcast. Definitely worth checking out.

No. Not all fathers are like this. What I found is that petty, jealous people make petty, jealous parents. Sadly, you don't just suddenly mature when you have a kid. You end up treating the kid like you treated the rest of the world.

How do I know? Because in high school I had friends who had fathers who were super cool. Usually these were successful ex-jocks who were very comfortable with themselves.

True story: I was over at my friend Ronnie's. Super cool football dude, as was his dad. At some point his dad mentioned Ronnie having to mow the lawn. Ronnie asked if they could talk later because he had a few things to do. The dad said "sure" and left the room.

Then a couple of girls came over, Jenifer (with one "n") and Julie. Both were extremely good-looking and dressed in very little clothing because it was late spring. This apparently did not escape Ronnie's dad's notice.

Ronnie and I went into the kitchen to get some drinks and his dad was sitting at the table. He motions Ronnie over, points in the direction of the room where the girls were, and quietly says something like: "If that's one of the things you have to do, I think the lawn can wait!"

We practically collapsed laughing. The girls were like "What's so funny?" We're like "Oh, nothing..." The dad wasn't just doing it for my benefit. He was just a funny, upbeat guy who stayed funny and upbeat when he had kids.

I can assure you nothing like the above story ever happened in the house where I grew up.

[StrikeBack]

The way the OP worded this makes no sense. It is the responsibility of young men to seek out older male mentors, not the other way around. That has always been the case throughout history, in fact the reluctant older mentor is even a novel/movie trope. If most young men these days do not have older male mentors, that is their bloody fault.

I had a few older male mentors, and I actively seeked them out, asked for their help, made myself as coachable as possible so they could teach me. I didn't sit on my arse waiting for older more experienced men to find me and teach me. I am the one who needs help and reaps the benefits, they are not my servants, therefore I should be the one doing the leg work. No man wants to mentor a young guy with entitlement attitude.

Prove me wrong: the young guys here, how many older male mentor figures have you approached and asked for help, and got turned down?

Older successful men can be surprisingly generous with their time and help, so young guys, seek them out.

[Truth Tiger]

Strikeback's post most closely reflects my feelings and experience. I've run a business where the majority of workers I've hired were young men (20-somethings). I dislike generalizations about generations but sometimes they do seem to apply. I'm old enough to be most of their fathers, but aware enough to understand, recall myself at that age, know better now how the world works, and what they're likely to look forward to based on their life choices.

I've always made myself available for talks, mentoring, coaching, and offering an ear. There is a fine line between solving a problem and offering insight or options. I've had to learn the hard way that guys especially need to solve their own problems but sometimes need a helping hand or fresh perspective. But I've also seen less determination in many of this younger generation. Attention spans are so much shorter, it seems harder to get to work on time, stay focused on tasks, stay off the phone, not sing along to every song when doing mentally-demanding work, follow through on tasks, and even remember clean-up or shutdown procedures.

It's been perhaps one out of 10 young men I've had work for me that stood out as dependable and open to inner growth beyond just doing a job. I've paid more than minimum wage for work that isn't as dirty as flipping burgers, though slightly more attention-demanding.

I had one group that conspired to steal company methods and secrets with the intent to start their own venture. I found out when an older contractor told me he'd been asked to join. His integrity led me to unveil this subversive episode. I was honestly floored. It broke much of my trust and generosity, like giving women too much unearned respect. I recovered - more mentally than otherwise - and ended up with a few workers who stood out. But I don't plan to hire anyone else when they've moved on. Unsurprisingly nothing came of it but burned bridges.

We get what we tolerate. I feel there's a divide between many younger Gen Z or Millenials and the Gen X or Boomers who would want to mentor them. I am very generous with time and insights to those who earn my trust and show me respect for my experience and care.

I owe so much to my mentors, teachers, father, uncles. I remember their generosity with me and always look for ways to pay it forward. If you ask with an open heart and mind you're very likely to receive. But entitlement closes off every good opportunity, like rolling up your windows at the first hint of a skunk.

[tomzestatlu]

I have been thinking about this recently. Since childhood, we are being told, that we should learn from elders, but there is always question I always ask myself and that sumarize it all.

How can I respect as a wisdom authority someone, who spent last 30 years of their life watching TV?

Of course there are many wise men, who built their kingdoms and were successful in their lifes, but none of them appeared in my life.

I can like my family members, because they are my family members. But I totally disrespect them, beside my grandfather, who passed away 2 years ago. I try to meet them on some basis, I try to convince myself I want to meet them, because they are my family. But sometimes I have problems even speaking with them, because I have zero respect to them.

I´ve never met a person, that I could look up to and say, this is what I want to become. The only persons I have around is my family, friends, people I work with and they are actually images what not to become.

I am 26 now and I feel it more and more. The hole in myself is something what feels unbearable to me sometimes. I have no real direction in my life, but not because I chose to, but because I must find it on myself without any help and that´s pretty difficult.

[hv123]

A lot of young wimpy types are affronted by masculinity and can't handle it. It's the old adage about leading a horse to water. I think a lot of young guys are too conditioned by the school system to be benefit from male leadership at the age of 18. As their only real life experience is often in the education system.

[sebip]

This is a very interesting thread. I've always been frustrated of the fact that I never could have a relationship with my dad. While I do understand some of the motives now that I am a bit older(23 years old), I still resent the fact that he never even tried. One of the reasons I believe is the fact that he had me at a very young age(22), when he basically didn't have his life sorted at all. While I do wish that I had a better childhood and a father figure to look up to, at the same time I think, beeing left on my own, to observe and figure things out myself, I think it made me mature a lot faster. One thing I really hate about him though, is that after all these years, even now when I prooved to him that I am a mature and capable person, having my own business, my own place; I don't see any sign of him wanting to create a relationship between us. I see him beeing very bitter of the fact that I don't agree with some of his life philosophies regarding religion and other things, but at the same time I made something of myself that not many young people at my age manage to do, I guess I expected him to open up a little more and at least have some sort of relationship, but I guess he's a very difficult person.

I think the relationships we have with our fathers as sons, are really important, it affects your confidence, your thinking mechanisms, the way you act around people. The more I think about it, beeing a parent is one of the toughest jobs in the world. It's just sad that many people have children without giving it too much thought and just go along with it. I guess most people don't really have a high sense of self-awareness. I this this is a really interesting topic.

[Paracelsus]

(11-29-2018 08:06 PM)kurtybro Wrote:  

can somebody explain this 'boomer narcissism' that keeps being repeated? Why and how, exactly, are boomers narcissists vs any other generation?

Because they were the first generation brought up to believe they mattered more than the larger things of which they form a part.

I despise Wikipedia, but for the executive summary: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Me_generation

[Fortis]

I think a lot of women do their best to alienate boys from men.

My mom tried to do that, but I grew out of her influence and sought out older men to teach me the things that women simply cannot know.

[Leonard D Neubache]

I think young men instinctively sense when a "successful" man is successful because he's agreed to jump through every hoop the ringmaster sets out for him. Most so-called successful men (boomers) of this day and age fall into this category. The first piece of advice (paraphrased here) they're going to give you if you bother to ask is "cut off your nuts, it will go easier that way".

But the reality for younger men is that the boomer days are over. There is no more easy money to be earned in a society where men are still treated as equals and not marginalised on every cultural front in existence, if not outsourced into oblivion. The reality is that the boomers are pampered dipshits who can't comprehend the idea that a young man these days isn't able to just fall ass backwards into a 6 figure job. That last sentence encapsulates the bizarre rift between myself and every boomer I ever talked to that until recently I just never understood. What I never understood was how these borderline alcoholic salary workers were so well off, until I realized that their salaries in relative chronological terms bought them a house per decade instead of a house every 30 years.

So when you talk to a "successful" boomer you're just talking to a dumb fucking simp who happened to live through the most prosperous era of the modern age.

You can't learn anything from a "successful" boomer because their "success" cost them nothing except whatever change they had in their pockets after yet another hard night at the pub. If you want to learn how to be a man, you're better off talking to a former Rhodesian. They're one of the few Western(ish) demographics that ever had to grow a pair of real actual balls.

[Oak]

(11-30-2018 04:45 AM)Paracelsus Wrote:  

I despise Wikipedia, but for the executive summary: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Me_generation

Try infogalactic instead

This forum and the manosphere as a whole are a testament to the willingness of men to help one another out. But if we're talking about general life advice, the problem is that you need a male-space to pass down the uncomfortable truths that confront men, and in the feminized west these male-spaces can only be found on the internet.

I think a more interesting question is why women are totally failing to pass down uncomfortable truths to their younger counterparts. There seems to be no awareness that the biological clock begins for women at 18, starts accelerating at 23, reaching a crescendo at 30. Or that the overwhelming majority of men willing to bang a girl would never actually commit to them. Yet these are facts older women should be aware of through experience.

Previously mothers, and I think especially grandmothers, would make young women very aware of these truths out of love for them. If men were making the mistakes young women are today, I think we would have a flurry of poignant memoirs from older men, warning younger men not to repeat their mistakes. Titles such as I Let My Ovaries Expire On A Desk Chair would fill the shelves. However, now older women seem to do the opposite, hamsterizing these mistakes away, often blaming men.

Assanova had a good article on this

Quote:

Why The Women Are Losing

Women around the country are celebrating feminism. They all think that they’ve won the war of the sexes. Women appear to be winning, while the men appear to be losing. However, ultimately, it is the women who are losing.

Why would I say that? I say it because older men are actively educating younger men on the fallacies of women. We have an entire community dedicated to teaching men about the dangers of marriage, the free paycheck(s) that women get in divorce, how men get screwed in the court system and child custody battles, how women only have their own self-interests in mind, etc. And we have more and more men speaking-up about their own very bad experiences with women.

However, when you look at the other side of the sexes, older women don’t appear to be educating the up and coming generation about men that make terrible fathers, men that constantly cheat, men that have no intention of committing, etc. All you have are women educating women about how to get the guy that is the most alpha, handsomest, richest, etc. All of this with a rose colored tent.

[redpillage]

I've tried but the vast majority are not just completely unreceptive, they are outright hostile to anyone over 30. So I gave up and they will have to learn the hard way.