[RexImperator]

This is all great advice, thanks very much. I was actually talking to her near the back of the store, not at the register (in the middle)...perhaps it would be smoother to move towards the front, and then try for the number out of earshot of the manager.

With regard to length of time, is what is the optimal length of time before it's too much? Lately my goal has been pushing my comfort zone and just trying to see how long I can go. She was actually kind of on the shy side and not too easy to read.

Now I had another interaction earlier in the mall that was more fun/flirtier. I was looking for dress shirts in a department store and a saleswoman came over asking if I needed help. Did all that very strong eye contact, relaxed body language, fun conversation, direct tonality stuff. So I let her help me pick some out and then I tried them on.

I even came out of the dressing room in my t-shirt to exchange shirts, which my past life I'm sure I would have been too self-conscious to do. (This was more about pushing boundaries for myself. I'm quite aware that I still have too much body fat but a few months of lifting has made me look sort of like a construction worker/laborer I guess. In any case I'm a lot more comfortable in my own skin now.)

She was kind of post-wall to be honest and I didn't go for the number, or anything; just had fun with it. However, she was really nice, enjoyed the attention, and ended up giving me an unannounced sale price on the shirt when she rang it up, hahah. I guess as Roissy says I guess there's no downside to being more "alpha"...

[Giovonny]

(11-16-2013 11:05 PM)markus85 Wrote:  

Has the business card honestly worked for you? Lizards will initiate the contact?

Well, yes, it has worked, but honestly, its way better to get her number. Girls are sometimes too scared to initiate. Usually, when it has worked, its been a younger girl.

I admit, its much better to get a girls number then to give her yours.

The only advantage to giving a girl your is that if/when she contacts you, you know that she is interested.

I do give girls my number but only in situations where it seems impossible to get hers.

(11-16-2013 11:05 PM)markus85 Wrote:  

but malls/stores I'll be looking down at my phone pretending to be doing something on it while they tell me verbally

Yes, exactly, this type of strategy is the key.

We have to find a way to get her number without anyone noticing. They are afraid they will get in trouble with their boss or look like a ho in front of her co-workers.

DISCRETION IS KEY!

(11-17-2013 11:00 AM)G Trooper Wrote:  

I've found the key is really timing, so I'll approach her directly after she leaves the coffee shop and well before she gets in her car.

Yeah, timing is everything!

Just like you, I often try to catch them as they walking out of the store. I like to stop them literally one step outside of the front door.

If its a store employee, I try to catch them walking thru the store by themselves or walking on their break.

Its always a challenge to try and catch them when no one else is around.

[Giovonny]

(11-17-2013 01:04 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  

perhaps it would be smoother to move towards the front, and then try for the number out of earshot of the manager.

There is no perfect location in the store. It's a "feel" thing, a "sense" thing. You have to be aware of her vibe and aware of your surroundings. When she seems into you (eye contact, smiling, laughing, personal ?s. etc.) and when no one is "in earshot" -- That's the time to act! This can 2 minutes or it can take multiple visits. You never know until you go into the store.

It's impossible to plan for every possible scenario. You have to ready for anything. You have to be alert. Any moment could be the moment that she laughs, looks at you, and you say, "lets get a drink or something sometime".

Again, this is why its often good to go into a store a few times and develop a relationship with the girl, if possible.

Talk to her a few times before you ask her out. Or, at least, flirt with her for a few minutes.

I've found success by letting a cute store girl help me to pick out and buy sunglasses, clothes, shoes, etc. A lot of the stuff I return later.

I sometime tell girls that I will memorize their number so I don't have to take out my phone. Or, I ask them if they have a card and this sometimes inspires them to write down their number. The actual exchanging of the number is the tricky part. Many times they don't want to be seen openly giving out their number. Do it calmly, quietly, and discreetly.

The fast approach is also fun sometimes, if you see a store worker that you like, just go right up to her and say, "whats up, whats your name?" Just real ballsy and macho. Spontaneous stuff like this is be fun too.

Trial and error is your best teacher.

(11-17-2013 01:04 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  

With regard to length of time, is what is the optimal length of time before it's too much?

There is no "optimal" length of time. "Optimal" is whatever time it takes you to get her number in such a way that she actually WANTS to hang out with you. Getting her number means nothing if she doesn't call you back. HOW you get her number is more important than just getting it, generally speaking.

Don't worry about time, worry about the vibe. When the vibe is right, go for the number. Don't force it but also be ready to act when the opportunity comes.

Optimal is whatever part of the store where no one is listening.

(11-17-2013 01:04 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  

I guess as Roissy says I guess there's no downside to being more "alpha"...

Haha.. Thats good. I think the "upside" far outweighs the "downside".

[Merenguero]

(11-17-2013 03:15 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(11-16-2013 11:05 PM)markus85 Wrote:  

Has the business card honestly worked for you? Lizards will initiate the contact?

Well, yes, it has worked, but honestly, its way better to get her number. Girls are sometimes too scared to initiate. Usually, when it has worked, its been a younger girl.

I've touched on this before and it is a very important point which is often overlooked by the forum. If you have a business card which does not have your cell number on it and has a number which appears to be a landline, there is about a zero percent chance that a girl will call if you give her your card. If the card does not have your cell number on it, but you write your cell number on it and give it to a girl, you can and should get great results. I learned this the hard way. I had a business card with a landline number on it, but I always wrote my cell number on it and gave it to girls. When I did this, 98% (no exaggeration) of the girls to whom I gave the card, called me. Of course, not all of the calls I got lead to notches. Not even close, but I consider that to be a really good response rate. I eventually had all of my landline calls forwarded to my cell and therefore changed my business cards so that they only had my cell number and didn't specify that the number listed was the cell number. Everything dried up. I had almost a zero percent call rate. I think the benefit of giving girls the card (if your cell number is on the card) is that it gives you some credibility and it is better than just giving them your number. Just make sure your cell number is on the card.

[Giovonny]

(11-17-2013 05:03 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  

but I always wrote my cell number on it and gave it to girls

That's a great little insight.

Writing your number on the card sort of "personalizes" the interaction and makes it more "real" for her. She can "feel" it more the just handing her a card.

The little nuances of Game trip me out sometimes. The subtleties that mean everything. I love those.

[markus85]

Thanks everyone for the insights.

In larger stores something that has worked for me is instead of asking "hey! where are the electric razors (example)" in which they'll usually just point me in the general direction which is what I don't want.

I'll keep my description vague about product x/y/z maybe even mention a product I know they won't have 9 /10 they will investigate themselves because they are unsure and BAM I've got instant isolation.

[RexImperator]

Gio, thanks for that advice. I can see that you're right and in some cases I'm rushing to suggest she give me her number, when instead I should be playing it in a more laid back way and just let the conversational vibe dictate that.

I also need to be better about not having managers around listening. Didn't really think about how that makes them uncomfortable. There was an RSD video which covers that concept, I now recall.

[paninaro]

I'd say don't chat them up too long at work, or they may get nervous. They're supposed to be working not socializing so they may be worried about the big boss.

As for number, another tactic is to say you may have misplaced your X (iPad, gloves, umbrella, etc) and here's your number.. give a call if someone turns one in to lost and found. Do this only if it's clear you're using this as a ploy to "safely" give her your number without getting in trouble with the boss.

[ObnoxiousStoner]

Well something like this happened to me today. I was at WalMart at the customer service desk
doing some random bs before heading to work

The cashier who was assisting me was an older lady and definitely not on my scope at all.
But her manager who i see as boneable was about 5 feet away doin some other shit.

I wasnt really thinking about the manager since she barely meets standards plus I was sort of in a rush. So I am small talking with the older lady and next thing the manager joins in the convo. I love when this shit happens! For one it shows that she was waiting on any opportunity to talk to me which secondly shows her massive interest.

So the next thing you know she starts talking about her preference in restaurants. Which gave me the opportunity to drop in a couple of negs of her food selection and be a bit playful with her. In result she recommended that i try it and INSISTED multiple times that i come back tomorrow and let her know how it was.

So this leads me back to the opening post. What I learned today is to rewrite your game/routines/openers for different situations like this one. If its a cashier have it constitute of something that will give you a non creepy way of seeing her again. For example, I act like I dont know what something is when im checking out like try to get her opinion on something and if she gives it a good review tell her that you will be back to let her know about "blahblahblah" whatever it may be. Then read her nametag back to her show her that you will remember her. Or if you need some extra time, act like you forgot something and completely interrupt the cashout process if she is interested she wont give a shit anyway. Get back in line and spit more game.

[RexImperator]

Follow up Q. How do you play it the next time you see them, when you've asked for their number on a previous visit and been denied?

[Merenguero]

(11-20-2013 11:02 AM)RexImperator Wrote:  

Follow up Q. How do you play it the next time you see them, when you've asked for their number on a previous visit and been denied?

Move on. Nothing good will come out of pursuing her when she has already refused to give you her number. You may want to read the Date Lab guy's experience with the Panera cashier in order to see what not to do. Getting numbers is the easy part. I can count on one hand the times a girl has refused to give me her number. To the best of my knowledge, I have only been given one fake number in my life and that fake number was given to me in the D.C. area.

[thegmanifesto]

(11-20-2013 12:29 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  

To the best of my knowledge, I have only been given one fake number in my life and that fake number was given to me in the D.C. area.

Ha.

I have gotten more than a few in my life (this was more of an issue back in the day, pre-cell phone era).

But I can say without a doubt that 90-95% of them were in DC.

(The only others I can recall were maybe as a kid in Hollywood).

Which is funny since such a small percentage of my nights out of my life were in DC.

I think I did a thread on this a long time ago.

[JackDavey]

My business card only has my cell number on it, but I'm going to try writing the same number on the back and giving it to girls, per Merenguero's tip. Never thought of that before; my card looks swank, I get a lot of comments on the design which would allow me to drop bait, since I did it myself.

[Merenguero]

(11-20-2013 12:41 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(11-20-2013 12:29 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  

To the best of my knowledge, I have only been given one fake number in my life and that fake number was given to me in the D.C. area.

Ha.

I have gotten more than a few in my life (this was more of an issue back in the day, pre-cell phone era).

But I can say without a doubt that 90-95% of them were in DC.

(The only others I can recall were maybe as a kid in Hollywood).

Which is funny since such a small percentage of my nights out of my life were in DC.

I think I did a thread on this a long time ago.

What's funny is that years after the fact, the one girl who gave me a fake number opened a business located literally feet from my office. I could go throw shit on her if I wanted to, but that's definitely not my style.

[iknowexactly]

(11-17-2013 07:42 PM)markus85 Wrote:  

Thanks everyone for the insights.

In larger stores something that has worked for me is instead of asking "hey! where are the electric razors (example)" in which they'll usually just point me in the general direction which is what I don't want.

I'll keep my description vague about product x/y/z maybe even mention a product I know they won't have 9 /10 they will investigate themselves because they are unsure and BAM I've got instant isolation.

a lot of times they'll walk you there so it's high time for mini-date-rape in the Walmart aisles!

[thegmanifesto]

(11-20-2013 11:11 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  

(11-20-2013 12:41 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(11-20-2013 12:29 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  

To the best of my knowledge, I have only been given one fake number in my life and that fake number was given to me in the D.C. area.

Ha.

I have gotten more than a few in my life (this was more of an issue back in the day, pre-cell phone era).

But I can say without a doubt that 90-95% of them were in DC.

(The only others I can recall were maybe as a kid in Hollywood).

Which is funny since such a small percentage of my nights out of my life were in DC.

I think I did a thread on this a long time ago.

What's funny is that years after the fact, the one girl who gave me a fake number opened a business located literally feet from my office. I could go throw shit on her if I wanted to, but that's definitely not my style.

Ha.

Have you tried this move?

"I then flicked my finger at her face painfully"

[RexImperator]

(11-20-2013 12:29 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  

(11-20-2013 11:02 AM)RexImperator Wrote:  

Follow up Q. How do you play it the next time you see them, when you've asked for their number on a previous visit and been denied?

Move on. Nothing good will come out of pursuing her when she has already refused to give you her number.

I figured that, but I was thinking more along the lines of: I'm still going to shop at this store, so how do I play it cool? It wasn't an unpleasant rejection. I think she was flattered, but I got the IHAB response.