[Frank Sicosus]

(08-13-2017 01:30 AM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

Frank Wrote:

If you believe the American society is collapsing then why not advocate for a fight back that has more than 0% chance of gathering support?

Because the types of people who ask these types of questions used to be the primary challenge to Progressivism from about 1980 until 2016.

These most powerful adversaries of Progressivism scored exactly zero victories against Progressivism - (I know this, because I have asked more than fifty True Conservatives this question on Twitter, and 95% of them don't attempt an answer. And the strongest answer I got was, "Paul Walker winning the governor's race against the Union opposition in Wisconsin.")

Despite scoring zero victories against Progressives, and despite seeing Donald Trump win a totally unexpected Presidency, these same True Conservatives want to dictate that Trump isn't really winning, and if only we followed this strategy...

Enough!

Trump's profligate immorality is the perfect slap in the face against Morally Preening Perfect Strategists With No Victories Against My Enemies (And No Sense of the Rules That Dictate 2017 Politics).

Respectfully, you are not making much sense or addressing the point.

Why exactly does the fight back have to be "Nazi theme or bust"?

It adds nothing, it takes away virtually everything, and is not required.

Everything you desire, if it can be obtained, can be obtained without that laughable and useless garbage.

[Disco_Volante]

Their hysteric shouting is based on fear because they are weaker and they know it. Surely this is the only time in history a leftist force is completely outgunned.

There are civilized ways to solve problems in a democracy.

1. Soap box
2. Ballot Box
3. Judicial Box
4. Ammo Box

We're between 3 and 4 right now, getting closer to 4 every day. I don't think Trump is a sellout but he severely underestimated how ruthless and hatefull the left is, so he has started to play along with them.

I don't want violence either but I'm aware that young men are far, far, more capable mentally and physically of delivering destruction than any other group on Earth. It's better for them to solve it democratically.

I think Trump will play along with them more and more to save his own ass, and they will bide their time for a few years down the road.

[The Beast1]

(08-13-2017 01:38 AM)Frank Sicosus Wrote:  

(08-13-2017 01:30 AM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

Frank Wrote:

If you believe the American society is collapsing then why not advocate for a fight back that has more than 0% chance of gathering support?

Because the types of people who ask these types of questions used to be the primary challenge to Progressivism from about 1980 until 2016.

These most powerful adversaries of Progressivism scored exactly zero victories against Progressivism - (I know this, because I have asked more than fifty True Conservatives this question on Twitter, and 95% of them don't attempt an answer. And the strongest answer I got was, "Paul Walker winning the governor's race against the Union opposition in Wisconsin.")

Despite scoring zero victories against Progressives, and despite seeing Donald Trump win a totally unexpected Presidency, these same True Conservatives want to dictate that Trump isn't really winning, and if only we followed this strategy...

Enough!

Trump's profligate immorality is the perfect slap in the face against Morally Preening Perfect Strategists With No Victories Against My Enemies (And No Sense of the Rules That Dictate 2017 Politics).

Respectfully, you are not making much sense or addressing the point.

Why exactly does the fight back have to be "Nazi theme or bust"?

It adds nothing, it takes away virtually everything, and is not required.

Everything you desire, if it can be obtained, can be obtained without that laughable and useless garbage.

He already did make his point. It stands to reason if you were able to decipher it (you didn't).

The definition of insanity is trying the same thing and expecting results after multiple attempts.

[MMX2010]

Suits Wrote:

Any other belief is a simple crafting of a personal moral system to justify ones own lack of effort to pursue a better life for themselves and their children.

The political system represented by the United States is the pinnacle of human thought, and no trinkets from China, nor a life of idleness punctuated by adoring sighs of Chinese waifs will compensate for the loss.

Every man can make his personal decision to abandon America, but abandonment means abandonment. It doesn't mean trying to influence the political outcomes in the country you abandoned, just because you abandoned it.

Save the psychologizing and snarky GIFs for those who will appreciate them.

[Frank Sicosus]

(08-13-2017 01:41 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  

He already did make his point. It stands to reason if you were able to decipher it (you didn't).

The definition of insanity is trying the same thing and expecting results after multiple attempts.

Perhaps you correct that waiting for a non-spin, non-"vox day", honest and plain response from MMX is futile. I will not try more.

[Disco_Volante]

I'm starting to be more concerned what China will do once USA breaks into a civil war. They will laugh their asses off at our multicultural malaise and move in to take whatever the phuck they want.

[MMX2010]

Frank Wrote:

Why exactly does the fight back have to be "Nazi theme or bust"?

I asked you a question, Frank. If you're not the target of Richard Spencer's political tactic, then why should your dismissal of the tactic be taken seriously?

It's like this, dude.

Every political tactic should be evaluated by the target of the tactic - not the audience. You = audience = irrelevant.

The target of Richard Spencer's Torch March was ANTIFA / Black Lives Matter. Known chants of both groups, "This is what democracy looks like." "Whose streets? Our streets! Whose streets? Our streets!" "No Trump! No KKK! No Fascist USA!"

When Richard Spencer ran the Torch March, his 500 people surrounded about thirty BLM/ANTIFA who were rendered invisible because they were standing in darkness. Their chants were not only drowned out, but they were made to look stupid because they were being uttered by an invisible group.

Most importantly, did the leader of BLM/ANTIFA respond with, "hahahaha. Torches are Nazi symbols, so you're all lame!"? No, she had a screaming "Where the fuck is everyone meltdown?" because she was being chanted at by Richard Spencer's group.

For the last time, any political tactic should be evaluated by its target, and Richard Spencer's Torch March made its target respond as if they had been severely beaten by it.

[stugatz]

Normally, I would be aghast at Richard Spencer, but when we're up against people who are saying stuff like "abolish whiteness" and "deny white males the vote", I'm going to quietly tolerate him just in case things get *really* bad.

My roommate had SNL on, and I had to make an excuse to leave the room when I saw Black Lives Matter propaganda pop up in one of the sketches. If these guys are openly sympathizing with movements that are racist and borderline terroristic...what in the hell am I supposed to do, not hedge my bets?

[Suits]

(08-13-2017 01:42 AM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

Suits Wrote:

Any other belief is a simple crafting of a personal moral system to justify ones own lack of effort to pursue a better life for themselves and their children.

The political system represented by the United States is the pinnacle of human thought, and no trinkets from China, nor a life of idleness punctuated by adoring sighs of Chinese waifs will compensate for the loss.

This is gibberish.

A man has every right to build the life for himself that he desires.

Men with an abundance mentality and a belief in their own ability will seek to do so.

Men who live in fear with seek to attach themselves to movements that give them a sense of power.

(08-13-2017 01:42 AM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

Every man can make his personal decision to abandon America, but abandonment means abandonment. It doesn't mean trying to influence the political outcomes in the country you abandoned, just because you abandoned it.

You are creating a maxim that doesn't have legs to stand on.

People are perfectly entitled to make self-serving decisions.

Seeking the best life that you can live is a perfectly reasonable and decent thing to do, provided that you don't trod on the reasonable rights of other people in the process.

[Disco_Volante]

It's like Venezuela when the government collapses and gangs of young males take over, the state's attempt to impose reality on people ultimately fails, which is why they're terrified of young males organizing.

Who the fuck is going to stop groups like this? Nancy Pelosi? Lena Dunham? Bernie? Title IX compliance officer? They're all fucking losers and completely physically incompetent.

You think the trannys, queers, muzzies with 6 kids would put up much of a fight? The left needs men to fight for them and I strongly suspect they're lacking.

It's the same reason a 5'2 loud-mouth girl shit-tests you. It's inferiority.

[Leonard D Neubache]

(08-13-2017 01:38 AM)Frank Sicosus Wrote:  

...
Respectfully, you are not making much sense or addressing the point.

Why exactly does the fight back have to be "Nazi theme or bust"?

It adds nothing, it takes away virtually everything, and is not required.

Everything you desire, if it can be obtained, can be obtained without that laughable and useless garbage.

You're bordering in paid opposition with this constant insistence that we're arguing for Nazi imagery to be the mainstay of right wing rallies.

Stop muddying the waters. It got old pages ago with Zigzag's nonsense. If you're here to score cheap personal points then kindly re-evaluate your goals in life.

This is not complicated. The left trampled the right for decades because they operated on a simple guideline.

No enemies to the left.

You don't have to join the alt-right or the neo-nazis, but it's pretty simple to just ignore them and say "no enemies to the right."

Posts like yours and Suits' make it clear to the left that they can stun-lock the right wing cucks by simply trotting out a nazi every now and then. Guys like you concern yourself with gnashing your teeth, pulling your hair and flagellating your own side because "we're not like that,waaaaah!" While the left gains political grounds by any means all you do is sit there and concern yourself with purity tests and intellectually masturbating toward the goal of concocting the peak of theoretical political immaculacy, at which point you presume what? That upon reaching the height of correctness that everyone is going to get on board? That the alt-right, the alt-light and the alt-reich are all going to be BTFO? That the cuck moderates will suddenly be inspired to get off of their fat asses?

Give it a break. Not a single moderate gives a shit how many people on the right tut-tut the nazis. Boomerfags are not studiously running through news feeds thinking "that's it, I'm throwing in with the freaks on the left".

No enemies to the right. It's not hard. Don't agree with the nazis? Ignore them. The Overton window has a long way to be dragged before it goes past Roosh-V forum and beyond it to a place that we're not comfortable with, so please, stop clutching your pearls because I'm all out of smelling salts.

[Leonard D Neubache]

(08-13-2017 02:01 AM)Suits Wrote:  

...
You are creating a maxim that doesn't have legs to stand on.

People are perfectly entitled to make self-serving decisions.

Seeking the best life that you can live is a perfectly reasonable and decent thing to do, provided that you don't trod on the reasonable rights of other people in the process.

Thank God for the internet so you can snipe people with skin in the game from the safe space you've created in a far away land.

We get it. Nobody said you're not allowed to piss off and leave the West to its fate. But if you've cashed out then please stop armchair quarter-backing. It truly rings hollow.

[Suits]

(08-13-2017 02:10 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

Give it a break. Not a single moderate gives a shit how many people on the right tut-tut the nazis.

My chief concern is people on the right who are Nazis.

Just as I am concerned about people on the left who are communists.

My allegiance will always be to freedom of opportunity, civilized societies and to fighting against crime, those who seek to enslave others and the creators of fear.

[Disco_Volante]

Suits if you were concerned about violence you'd be posting and campaigning against Chicago, Baltimore, east st Louis, etc....yet you ignore that for simple thoughts of another group. Completely different standard.

[MMX2010]

Suits Wrote:

Seeking the best life that you can live is a perfectly reasonable and decent thing to do, provided that you don't trod on the reasonable rights of other people in the process.

There are more than one RVF threads discussing Libertarianism, but its failure to stop American Progressivism makes this thread not one of them.

[MMX2010]

(08-13-2017 02:23 AM)Disco_Volante Wrote:  

Suits if you were concerned about violence you'd be posting and campaigning against Chicago, Baltimore, east st Louis, etc....yet you ignore that for simple thoughts of another group. Completely different standard.

He's not. He's concerned about Libertarianism.

[Suits]

(08-13-2017 02:15 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

(08-13-2017 02:01 AM)Suits Wrote:  

...
You are creating a maxim that doesn't have legs to stand on.

People are perfectly entitled to make self-serving decisions.

Seeking the best life that you can live is a perfectly reasonable and decent thing to do, provided that you don't trod on the reasonable rights of other people in the process.

Thank God for the internet so you can snipe people with skin in the game from the safe space you've created in a far away land.

We get it. Nobody said you're not allowed to piss off and leave the West to its fate. But if you've cashed out then please stop armchair quarter-backing. It truly rings hollow.

On the contrary, I've taken action, which is the opposite of armchair quarter-backing.

People will go to significant lengths to convince themselves that they are an action taker. For example, the reason why many people love to own guns is because it provides the semblance of having taken action, with no real incursion of risk or tough choices.

Action hasn't been taken until that gun has been used for its intended purpose. Owning guns is like owning an airline ticket to the destination to allows talk about moving to, but never actually depart for. The best you can say is that you are prepared to take action.

I on the other hand have taken real actions with real consequences and haven't limited my activism to posting online. I've taken real solutions and I'm providing the service of describing actionable solutions (accompanied by the required actionable steps) to the members of this community.

Having "skin the game" is a self-imposed limitation that no one forced on you.

While I disagree with their ideology, I have some level of respect for torch carrying neo-Nazi marchers, because they actually have skin in the game. They've put themselves out there, and damn the consequences.

Simply existing as a member of a demographic that has been the beneficiary of better conditions in the past (that they did not personally participating in earning) and is predicted to a less beneficial position in the future does not constitute having skin in the game.

It's nothing more than being pissed that history is not going in the direction they were hoping for.

[Going strong]

(08-13-2017 12:58 AM)Suits Wrote:  



Done.

If you want to hide your identity, you should blank the seat number as well... oh, and your identity also appears (to any google admin) through your googleuser reference, in your "picture name"

... ... ...

The identity of the (evil, or say, criminally reckless at least) car driver not being released yet, makes me wonder, and hope it is a Leftist "anti-fa"...

so the Right should refrain from action until the identity of the perp is known! I think the perp wanted to punish (hit) the cars of the slow-driving Right-Wingers in front of him. MSM and local SJW police withholding his ID in order to gain a few hours to push their "evil Whites" narrative...

[Suits]

(08-13-2017 02:28 AM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

There are more than one RVF threads discussing Libertarianism, but its failure to stop American Progressivism makes this thread not one of them.

I'm not a Libertarian by a long shot.

(08-13-2017 02:23 AM)Disco_Volante Wrote:  

Suits if you were concerned about violence you'd be posting and campaigning against Chicago, Baltimore, east st Louis, etc....yet you ignore that for simple thoughts of another group. Completely different standard.

No, I'm not an advocate of "complaining." I'm an action taker.

Since I don't command the National Guard in Illinois, I'm focusing on engaging in beneficial actions that exist within the range of possibility for me.

My current activities include participating in the creating technology that allows people to create incomes in a place of their choosing so that they aren't trapped in violent cities and creating educational resources so that young people are aware of the options they have in life, can pursue the education they believe they need at a cost that isn't prohibitive or debt-creating and allows them to create business that free them from the weight of social and government institutions that dampen free speech and discourage morally inspired lifestyle decisions.

[Rush87]

(08-13-2017 01:23 AM)Frank Sicosus Wrote:  

"Hey, ok, yeah, there might be an errant Nazi here or there. And, alright, the events might be advertised with Nazi imagery theme posters. And yes there may be a chant here or there that has only ever been known to be used by Nazis.. but anyway get with the program, we don't have time for perfect messages"

Leonard sir, I only ask why this shitty (failure gauranteed) standard needs to be supported. The entire organisation and execution of this thing was done idiotically from start to finish.

If you believe the American society is collapsing then why not advocate for a fight back that has more than 0% chance of gathering support?

Here's the most simplistic way of putting it: If the right react or apologise every time a representative of an undesirable group is linked to their cause, then the left have total power over what they can censor.

Lets say a small fishing village of 50 was to protest the settlement of 25 refugees from an African region densely populated with the Boko Haram - If by chance one of those fifty, which accounts for 2% of their population was a white nationalist and started a rally, by acknowledging them, you will almost certainly lose by default.

The case of white nationalists amongst the alt right is ridiculous. Telling us to disavow them is ridiculous. It's the exact same argument as teaching us not to rape. 99% of us have never been racist. We didn't learn to 'not be racists'. We just aren't. Like every other normal human being. So when there is a small demographic of 'white nationalists' partaking in any one event it shouldn't even be worthy of comment, because once it is commented on, it becomes a focal point, and once it's a focal point, it's a weapon.

[Suits]

I'm going to bow out of the conversation at this point, but anyone who wishes to is more than welcome to PM me.

[Disco_Volante]

Really what do the left have at this point? The state has 200 trillion in unfunded liabilities. You think they can control the collapse?

As has been well documented, even east Germany had far more control over their economy yet they still collapsed. It's an illusion, mostly bullshit.

The piece of paper saying you own anything is fragile and only dependent on the culture which issues said paper. It will devolve into gangs and families. Feminism and collectivism will be crushed by superior patriarchal forces. I think deep down they know it.

[Leonard D Neubache]

Suits, if you're actively engaged in doing something practical to aid what could loosely be described at the Roosh right then I retract my accusation and apologise.

Points regarding no-enemies-to-the-right I stand by.

We can start casting stones when organise our own 1000 strong rally in defiance of serious threats of violence.

[Frank Sicosus]

(08-13-2017 02:10 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

(08-13-2017 01:38 AM)Frank Sicosus Wrote:  

...
Respectfully, you are not making much sense or addressing the point.

Why exactly does the fight back have to be "Nazi theme or bust"?

It adds nothing, it takes away virtually everything, and is not required.

Everything you desire, if it can be obtained, can be obtained without that laughable and useless garbage.

You're bordering in paid opposition with this constant insistence that we're arguing for Nazi imagery to be the mainstay of right wing rallies.

Stop muddying the waters. It got old pages ago with Zigzag's nonsense. If you're here to score cheap personal points then kindly re-evaluate your goals in life.

This is not complicated. The left trampled the right for decades because they operated on a simple guideline.

No enemies to the left.

You don't have to join the alt-right or the neo-nazis, but it's pretty simple to just ignore them and say "no enemies to the right."

Posts like yours and Suits' make it clear to the left that they can stun-lock the right wing cucks by simply trotting out a nazi every now and then. Guys like you concern yourself with gnashing your teeth, pulling your hair and flagellating your own side because "we're not like that,waaaaah!" While the left gains political grounds by any means all you do is sit there and concern yourself with purity tests and intellectually masturbating toward the goal of concocting the peak of theoretical political immaculacy, at which point you presume what? That upon reaching the height of correctness that everyone is going to get on board? That the alt-right, the alt-light and the alt-reich are all going to be BTFO? That the cuck moderates will suddenly be inspired to get off of their fat asses?

Give it a break. Not a single moderate gives a shit how many people on the right tut-tut the nazis. Boomerfags are not studiously running through news feeds thinking "that's it, I'm throwing in with the freaks on the left".

No enemies to the right. It's not hard. Don't agree with the nazis? Ignore them. The Overton window has a long way to be dragged before it goes past Roosh-V forum and beyond it to a place that we're not comfortable with, so please, stop clutching your pearls because I'm all out of smelling salts.

You've completely misunderstood my point. I do not care so much how it "looks" - I'm saying that I would never want to participate with people who are retarded enough to unironically use a Nazi Theme for posters, in actions, in chants etc. Do you want to? Would you?

This is not about political correctness, it is about what you want to stand for and who with.

Why are you insisting that this aspect must be overlooked, and pretending or accepting that it's "just the way it is"? It doesn't make sense. There are millions who agree with the basic ideas of the new right, actions and movements can be led by these great and honorable people, who are the majority.

Sure, there is no need for a panic attack or going overboard- but not wanting to get behind a faggot like Richard Spencer and his retarded Nazi play followers is hardly a "purity test", Leonard.

Edit-

Forgot to add, someone mentioned "disavow". I'm not at all talking about that. As was stated by others, there is no need "disavow" and in no way am I suggesting that or desiring that.

I'm saying that people saying (in a roundabout way) "yeah yeah, whatevs, just grab a torch don't worry about the nazi posters, we have a battle to fight" are silly. No such acceptance is required. We are not in physical war and one is not imminent, despite what people thousands of miles away see on tv in one area of one city on one evening. We are not at the point of "just accept the Nazi for the moment until after the war".

[Kona]

(08-13-2017 02:39 AM)Going strong Wrote:  

The identity of the (evil, or say, criminally reckless at least) car driver not being released yet, makes me wonder, and hope it is a Leftist "anti-fa"...

so the Right should refrain from action until the identity of the perp is known! I think the perp wanted to punish (hit) the cars of the slow-driving Right-Wingers in front of him. MSM and local SJW police withholding his ID in order to gain a few hours to push their "evil Whites" narrative...

Its been released.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/mother-charlott...d=49185691

His mom says he was going to an alt right pro trump rally.

Edit: he's about as alt right as they come:

[url=https://twitter.com/LorenzoMeow/status/896561497110978561][/url]

Aloha!