[weambulance]

Some of y'all just don't get it. Our crime is existing.

There is no way to avoid their attacks. Haven't you been paying attention for the last, oh, three years? Even people who embrace SJW bullshit wholly are a single, bare misstep away from being torn apart by the shrieking mobs if they're members of a "privileged" class. We've seen it again and again.

I don't give a solitary fuck what libtards think when they see media coverage of this event. There is no possibility whatsoever that they will just wise up and join our side willingly. They are mentally ill, disassociated from reality. All this worry about "optics" is a total waste of time and mental energy.

"Don't give them ammunition" - what the fuck does that mean? Walk on eggshells? Ask permission of our enemies before we do anything?

We could do absolutely nothing and they would still demonize us by simply making shit up. [1]

You cannot reason someone out of a position xhe did not reason xhitself into. So stop trying!


1 - See: media treatment of President Trump for the last year.

[MMX2010]

Strongly disagree with the Bad Optics assessment.

Blood and soil is easily flipped by explaining what it means, and then asking whether Mexico belongs to Richard Spencer's crowd or to the people who have lived in Mexico for centuries.

The left will deem this a violent protest, while images from Berkeley and Hamburg are still in people's heads. And they'll claim the GOP should denounce the rally, which they will. And, lastly, they'll blame Trump for its existence, which echoes Hillary's "basket of deplorables" accusation.

[weambulance]

(08-12-2017 11:52 AM)zigZag Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:38 AM)weambulance Wrote:  

I'll just paraphrase what I said at least a dozen times in the God Emperor thread:

Worrying about what the enemy is going to say about what we do is absolute nonsense. There is no way we can behave short of committing mass suicide that will convince them to say nice things about us.

The twitter video in the embedded tweet that roosh posted with the drone footage is partially set to an adolf hitler speech. There is only one way to interpret that.

Fuckwit leftists lionize people like Che Guevara, and I'm supposed to clutch my pearls because some weirdos nominally on my side fetishize Nazism? Why?

[zigZag]

(08-12-2017 11:59 AM)weambulance Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:52 AM)zigZag Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:38 AM)weambulance Wrote:  

I'll just paraphrase what I said at least a dozen times in the God Emperor thread:

Worrying about what the enemy is going to say about what we do is absolute nonsense. There is no way we can behave short of committing mass suicide that will convince them to say nice things about us.

The twitter video in the embedded tweet that roosh posted with the drone footage is partially set to an adolf hitler speech. There is only one way to interpret that.

Fuckwit leftists lionize people like Che Guevara, and I'm supposed to clutch my pearls because some weirdos nominally on my side fetishize Nazism? Why?

You're judged by the company you keep.

[nomadbrah]

(08-12-2017 12:02 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:59 AM)weambulance Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:52 AM)zigZag Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:38 AM)weambulance Wrote:  

I'll just paraphrase what I said at least a dozen times in the God Emperor thread:

Worrying about what the enemy is going to say about what we do is absolute nonsense. There is no way we can behave short of committing mass suicide that will convince them to say nice things about us.

The twitter video in the embedded tweet that roosh posted with the drone footage is partially set to an adolf hitler speech. There is only one way to interpret that.

Fuckwit leftists lionize people like Che Guevara, and I'm supposed to clutch my pearls because some weirdos nominally on my side fetishize Nazism? Why?

You're judged by the company you keep.

Judged by who?

I don't give a shit about what leftists think unless they have the ability to shame or bully me out of earnings or social standing. Which they do in some cases. If you think that is exclusive for being a "nazi" then you're wrong though. Just being a vocal libertarian or anti-feminist or MRA or not on board with gay marriage and trannyism will get you labelled a nazi.

There's nothing we can do as traditional men in the public sphere and not be called nazis. Particularly if we're white.

I tell you, the right of assembly, the ability to assemble, is never something to take for granted. It is literally impossible for something like this to happen in most European countries where Antifa are allowed to use extreme violence. These meetups are extremely important for the right of even moderate conservatives to speak their mind in public and assemble in public.

I thought we were through with the cuck shit after Milo got assaulted for his tour.

[weambulance]

Yeah, because being more-or-less friendly with Nazi LARPers is really going to put a stain on my reputation. Or are you under the impression that if the SJW whackos doxxed me, they would not try to ruin my life because I didn't cross that particular line?

[MMX2010]

[url=https://twitter.com/NotPaxDickinson/status/896411768578351104][/url]

Gigantic, if true. And I trust Pax to not lie.

Biggest tweet is number three, "Police refused to arrest us. Assaulted us instead and pushed us towards ANTIFA. Wanted to create a violent situation."

[david.garrett84]

Too many folks here are getting hung up on minor points.

What percentage of the non-leftist attendees can we firmly label "Nazi" or "pro-Nazi"? 1-2%? That's all I'm suspecting from having seen the feeds.

Too many people here in this thread are accepting the faulty logic being put forward by the leftists - the iconography or views of a minority on the right can be superimposed on the vast majority.

For example, literal Nazis believe in the primacy of the nation-state. Yet this doesn't invalidate the views of any of us who see the primacy of the nation-state for different reasons.

Literal Nazis believe that men should be the primary public social actors. Yet this doesn't invalidate the views of any of us who see that men should be the primary public social actors for different reasons.

[Transsimian]

(08-12-2017 08:04 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Chelsea Manning is going to curb stomp fascists...

[url=https://twitter.com/xychelsea/status/896235475853357060][/url]

And now the number of transexuals I respect goes down to zero again.

Crazy.

[david.garrett84]

(08-12-2017 12:26 PM)Transsimian Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 08:04 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Chelsea Manning is going to curb stomp fascists...

[url=https://twitter.com/xychelsea/status/896235475853357060][/url]

And now the number of transexuals I respect goes down to zero again.

Crazy.

[MMX2010]

It's disappointing that many members who deeply know about the James Damore firing, are stating political rules-of-conduct that were only valid before James Damore got fired.

There is no more clamoring for the best optics. There is no more clamoring to talk to the media in order to get a fair dissemination of your ideas, so that informed people can decide for themselves.

Vox Day posted this article by a staunch True Conservative, Non Alt-right author.

You should read the entire thing to fully appreciate the bewilderment and exasperation in his tone.

Article Wrote:

The key difference in tactics between the alt-right and traditional right is that the alt-right doesn't place much value on playing fair, and they mock conservatives' seeming desire to lose honorably. On a recent Periscope video Vox said that his supporters in tech companies (which he claims are numerous) should "be the second or third most enthusiastic SJW in your group."

He considers SJWs to be the enemy that's beyond reason. When a commentator suggested that publically supporting SJW views might give them legitimacy, Vox said "F--- legitimacy. You are thinking like a conservative…"

It will be poisonous if the tech right feels compelled to not only hide their beliefs but also to actively pretend to believe in progressive diversity values. This pretending will embitter them, probably pushing many to the more radical alt-right.

[zigZag]

(08-12-2017 12:09 PM)nomadbrah Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 12:02 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:59 AM)weambulance Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:52 AM)zigZag Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 11:38 AM)weambulance Wrote:  

I'll just paraphrase what I said at least a dozen times in the God Emperor thread:

Worrying about what the enemy is going to say about what we do is absolute nonsense. There is no way we can behave short of committing mass suicide that will convince them to say nice things about us.

The twitter video in the embedded tweet that roosh posted with the drone footage is partially set to an adolf hitler speech. There is only one way to interpret that.

Fuckwit leftists lionize people like Che Guevara, and I'm supposed to clutch my pearls because some weirdos nominally on my side fetishize Nazism? Why?

You're judged by the company you keep.

Judged by who?

I don't give a shit about what leftists think unless they have the ability to shame or bully me out of earnings or social standing. Which they do in some cases. If you think that is exclusive for being a "nazi" then you're wrong though. Just being a vocal libertarian or anti-feminist or MRA or not on board with gay marriage and trannyism will get you labelled a nazi.

There's nothing we can do as traditional men in the public sphere and not be called nazis. Particularly if we're white.

I tell you, the right of assembly, the ability to assemble, is never something to take for granted. It is literally impossible for something like this to happen in most European countries where Antifa are allowed to use extreme violence. These meetups are extremely important for the right of even moderate conservatives to speak their mind in public and assemble in public.

I thought we were through with the cuck shit after Milo got assaulted for his tour.

You aren't trying to convince SJWs. You're trying to convince the regular people who may not be as politically savvy/involved. The people who actually got Trump elected. When they see Nazi shit they're gonna end up believing the media about your group and then you'll end up on an island surrounded by enemies and effectively neutered. That's my point.

[budoslavic]

Well, we shouldn't be surprised by this. The Right gets shut down while the Left continues to get away with whatever they are doing.

[url=https://twitter.com/FaithGoldy/status/896425784595886081][/url]

[Roosh]

Police are allowing antifa to assemble:

[url=https://twitter.com/polNewsForever/status/896426434683699202][/url]

[MMX2010]

(08-12-2017 12:40 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

You aren't trying to convince SJWs. You're trying to convince the regular people who may not be as politically savvy/involved. The people who actually got Trump elected. When they see Nazi shit they're gonna end up believing the media about your group and then you'll end up on an island surrounded by enemies and effectively neutered. That's my point.

You don't know this to be true. You just believe it's true, based on who knows what.

But the worst part is, you're echoing the same appeasement strategy that has been followed by True Conservatives for thirty years, and how many victories against Progressives do True Conservatives have?

[url=https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/896420822780444672][/url]

Some people, like AnonymousBosch, will be saddened by this Tweet. But I'll recall Vox Day's admonition that "it takes two election cycles, not one".

And I'll also challenge ZigZag and anyone else worried about "optics" to scan the behavior of our enemies in response to this Tweet. How much genuine goodwill will God-Emperor Trump receive because of this tweet? Will the Trump-Russia investigation be covered more fairly? Will the media report more accurately on God-Emperor Trump's accomplishments? Will our enemies admit that they were wrong to categorize God-Emperor Trump as a Nazi, and promise to no longer use that word, unless they're absolutely sure?

None of these things will happen, because our enemies cannot be fucking appeased by proper fucking optics.

------

Edited to add: I can predict Progressive reaction now.

Two hours before Trump denounced the violence in Charlottesville, Progressives and NeverTrump cucks were calling on Trump to denounce the rally.

Two hours after reading Trump's tweets, those same idiots will say that Trump's denouncement either "came too late" or was an insincere attempt to "pretend to not be a Nazi".

[zigZag]

(08-12-2017 12:56 PM)MMX2010 Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 12:40 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

You aren't trying to convince SJWs. You're trying to convince the regular people who may not be as politically savvy/involved. The people who actually got Trump elected. When they see Nazi shit they're gonna end up believing the media about your group and then you'll end up on an island surrounded by enemies and effectively neutered. That's my point.

You don't know this to be true. You just believe it's true, based on who knows what.

But the worst part is, you're echoing the same appeasement strategy that has been followed by True Conservatives for thirty years, and how many victories against Progressives do True Conservatives have?

[url=https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/896420822780444672][/url]

Some people, like AnonymousBosch, will be saddened by this Tweet. But I'll recall Vox Day's admonition that "it takes two election cycles, not one".

And I'll also challenge ZigZag and anyone else worried about "optics" to scan the behavior of our enemies in response to this Tweet. How much genuine goodwill will God-Emperor Trump receive because of this tweet? Will the Trump-Russia investigation be covered more fairly? Will the media report more accurately on God-Emperor Trump's accomplishments? Will our enemies admit that they were wrong to categorize God-Emperor Trump as a Nazi, and promise to no longer use that word, unless they're absolutely sure?

None of these things will happen, because our enemies cannot be fucking appeased by proper fucking optics.

You're not trying to appease your enemies. You're trying to have more people join your side. If you don't care about optics then you'll end up on an island with only enemies surrounding you. Then you have nothing.

[david.garrett84]

(08-12-2017 01:02 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

You're not trying to appease your enemies. You're trying to have more people join your side. If you don't care about optics then you'll end up on an island with only enemies surrounding you. Then you have nothing.

The three most successful conservative groundswells of the last 25 years - the Gingrich-led Congress, the Tea Party and the Trump 2016 campaign - fixated the least on "optics". Particularly the latter two. They were largely unapologetic. If they were called extremists, they just went on with things.

If you want great cases of good-optics-above-all-else, look at Senator Lindsey Graham, John McCain, and others - "conservative" sell-outs who make no difference in the long-run and only buttress the side they claim to be against.

[zigZag]

(08-12-2017 01:11 PM)david.garrett84 Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 01:02 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

You're not trying to appease your enemies. You're trying to have more people join your side. If you don't care about optics then you'll end up on an island with only enemies surrounding you. Then you have nothing.

The three most successful conservative groundswells of the last 25 years - the Gingrich-led Congress, the Tea Party and the Trump 2016 campaign - fixated the least on "optics". Particularly the latter two. They were largely unapologetic. If they were called extremists, they just went on with things.

If you want great cases of good-optics-above-all-else, look at Senator Lindsey Graham, John McCain, and others - "conservative" sell-outs who make no difference in the long-run and only buttress the side they claim to be against.

There is a huge difference between the tea party and conservative Republicans and guys marching to the beat of a guy who is openly a neo-nazi. Even trump has distanced himself from the rally already.

[Libertas]

Quote:

"Don't give them ammunition" - what the fuck does that mean? Walk on eggshells? Ask permission of our enemies before we do anything?

This is a strawman that becomes a reductio ad absurdum.

Of course you don't ask for permission, and of course nothing you do will please the Year Zero cultists, including Trump's tweet, but you don't actively use symbols and phrases that are going to harm your own side. And that's exactly what these idiots did.

Now Trump had to disavow again. Predictable. Even Fox News is calling this a "White Nationalist" rally. But unlike other rallies where it was all about making America great again and displaying the symbology of America as a great nation, you have stuff that looks exactly like Nazi or Klan imagery. That's all that was needed. Now the good point that the right got shut down while the left and Antifa thugs still got to march is going to be drowned out, all because those idiots had to carry torches instead of Gadsden flags. The narrative of this rally is going to be that and nothing else. Prior to this the left all but had a monopoly on political violence. Whatever happened there and regardless of Antifa's involvement those torches are going to obscure the narrative about this.

As a way to illustrate, there's another forum I frequent that's devoted to UFC and wrestling primarily. It's mostly comprised of a right wing commentariat that is largely pro-Trump. These aren't your basic bitch conservatives. Every last one of them is aghast at what happened down there.

Nothing was gained from this.

[RaccoonFace]

The "you shouldn't cave to the left, cowards!" crowd doesn't seem to understand that leftist aren't the only non-rightists in the world, there's also the moderates/normies.

I couldn't care less how people on our side look to leftists, all of us are evil anyway in their eyes, but I do care how moderates perceive us.

If these people were waving American flags and wearing Trump gear the general public would sympathize with them, instead they decided to carry torches like a bunch of larping idiots.

The alt right chimping out at Trump or Cernovich is just them being enraged they're not as popular as those two individuals.

Maybe there's a reason for that?

Maybe selling a border wall by saying "We need to keep the drugs out of our country" is smarter politics than "BEEP BOP WE NEED AN ETHNOSTATE NOW"?

Maybe screaming "white genocide" makes you look like a lunatic instead of a victim to normal people?

WN's have never achieved anything, and there's a reason for that. At least they get to feel pure though, that's more important than accomplishing actual real life results!

From MPC:

Quote:

How soon ye forget: Spencer, who was never pro-Trump, couldn't wait to signal against him and badmouth ARE president to the mouthbreathing idiots, largely out of jealousy that Trump has a bigger dick and f**ks 10/10 models, not weird looking rootless Russian mail order brides. Now Spencer wants you to join whatever malcontent crew is dumb enough to be scammed by him so he looks like a leader of something consequential (in reality any mediocre anti-Trump rally in January had bigger attendance than this).

"You will not replace us" is a feeble, defensive slogan that turns out to be untrue. As a matter of fact, every generation is replaced, and in Europe replacement of "whites" is at their own behest. But its main fault is that it is a negative slogan, which offers no vision other than trite, familiar #Resistance--so if the intent was to sink to the level of equally defensive, angry, and powerless antifa larpers, mission accomplished.

This spectacle is designed to benefit no one but Spencer himself--far from growing the feeble and deeply unpopular white nationalist movement, it's merely joining the various dinky WN sects behind this flamboyant gaylord. It also forces normal people to distance themselves further from him and defend Trump and his policies against glib assertions of racism, and will demoralize the weak-minded--normally the opposite effect you want from a rally.

This all comes at an inconvenient moment as well, when Google and its YouTube subsidiary have been making aggressive anti-speech moves (and engaging in illegal employment practices). Once again Spencer has successfully damaged an opportunity to go on the offensive against the left. But why go on the offensive when you can have a big gay march about a statue of an irrelevant Confederate general? (Lost in all this: the march is a bunch of unwelcome out-of-towers marching into someone else's city and protesting what they do with their monuments. You cannot shout "f**k OFF" loudly enough at this.)

If someone can explain to me how this move hurts the GOP establishment or removes Paul Ryan from office, I'm all ears. But, spoiler alert, you can't, not only because you aren't very smart. This is all culture war antics, we've seen it all before, and each time it results in no change in anything--except Spencer's assumed stature as king of the Nazi f****ts.

[david.garrett84]

(08-12-2017 01:16 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

There is a huge difference between the tea party and conservative Republicans and guys marching to the beat of a guy who is openly a neo-nazi. Even trump has distanced himself from the rally already.

A reference to Spencer, yes?

The funny thing is, Spencer's rhetoric is still less repugnant and damaging for the US than that of Shaun King, Marc Lamont Hill, Van Jones, or Al Sharpton.

I don't recall white people/white supporters of Spencer violently rioting as a consequence of views promulgated by him. But I can read about the LA riots of the early 1990s, fed by the race-baiting of guys like Sharpton, and I can definitely recall the many "Black Lives Matter" riots incited by King, Lamont Hill, Jones, and Sharpton.

Richard Spencer would not exist if we had "enjoyed" a balanced representation of ideas about privilege and fairness in Western society over the last 20 years.

I disagree with much of what Spencer says, yet his views and actions are less offensive towards minorities than the views and actions of the aforementioned African-American SJWs are to whites, especially non-privileged whites.

You're so worried about optics, but look at how easily the media will claim "KKK!", "white supremacists!", and "Nazis!":

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/...confusion/

Science equipment covered up with sheets in a lab!

[Libertas]

"You will not replace us" is indeed a pathetic slogan that makes you look weak. Why didn't that come to my attention earlier?

[zigZag]

(08-12-2017 01:27 PM)david.garrett84 Wrote:  

(08-12-2017 01:16 PM)zigZag Wrote:  

There is a huge difference between the tea party and conservative Republicans and guys marching to the beat of a guy who is openly a neo-nazi. Even trump has distanced himself from the rally already.

A reference to Spencer, yes?

The funny thing is, Spencer's rhetoric is still less repugnant and damaging for the US than that of Shaun King, Marc Lamont Hill, Van Jones, or Al Sharpton.

I don't recall white people/white supporters of Spencer violently rioting as a consequence of views promulgated by him. But I can read about the LA riots of the early 1990s, fed by the race-baiting of guys like Sharpton, and I can definitely recall the many "Black Lives Matter" riots incited by King, Lamont Hill, Jones, and Sharpton.

Richard Spencer would not exist if we had "enjoyed" a balanced representation of ideas about privilege and fairness in Western society over the last 20 years.

I disagree with much of what Spencer says, yet his views and actions are less offensive towards minorities than the views and actions of the aforementioned African-American SJWs are to whites, especially non-privileged whites.

You're so worried about optics, but look at how easily the media will claim "KKK!", "white supremacists!", and "Nazis!":

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/...confusion/

Science equipment covered up with sheets in a lab!

One of these things created a world war that killed 10s of millions of people and forever changed the world. BLM isn't good but its a far stretch to compare it to nazism.

Anyways if all you guys thinking joining Neonazis is a way to advance your cause then fair enough. Just know that for the overwhelming majority of americans of all races.. Nazism is a non starter.

[LEMONed IScream]

Car just banged into another car that subsequently went into a crowd of Antifa. HA!



Hoppe approves.

[weambulance]

Libertas, you need to let go of the notion that we'll be able to vote our way out of this.

I don't particularly care if some pussy moderates and delusional Polite Right types get the vapors because of some torches and 7 seconds of a Hitler speech 99.999% of the world would not recognize unless someone told them what it was. They'll join the sides that will have them, in the end.