Big win for Putin.
Russian people firmly rejecting the Western provocateurs.
Many very bitter people in media.
Russian people firmly rejecting the Western provocateurs.
Many very bitter people in media.
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Quote:[url=https://twitter.com/KevinRothrock/status/975412693883596806]
Quote:[url=https://twitter.com/IntheNow_tweet/status/973601349387636741][/url]
Quote:[url=https://twitter.com/_VachelLindsay_/status/975527556622331905][/url]
Quote: (03-18-2018 06:40 PM)just a human Wrote:
I know that here are a lot of Putin fans.
I have a question for You -have You ever met any real criminals in Your life?
If You have so-You already know, that You can't trust a word of them.
Not only in Russia,but in whole eastern Europe are a lot of people like him- some kinda legalized criminals,ex KGB agents, they are still close to governments here a lot. Corrupted as fuck.
No- thanks. I will NEVER be their supporter.
They are playing a show in front of dumb auditory.
I know- you have problems in west ,but please- don't fall in this ex soviet trap.
Quote: (03-19-2018 05:23 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:
Quote: (03-18-2018 06:40 PM)just a human Wrote:
I know that here are a lot of Putin fans.
I have a question for You -have You ever met any real criminals in Your life?
If You have so-You already know, that You can't trust a word of them.
Not only in Russia,but in whole eastern Europe are a lot of people like him- some kinda legalized criminals,ex KGB agents, they are still close to governments here a lot. Corrupted as fuck.
No- thanks. I will NEVER be their supporter.
They are playing a show in front of dumb auditory.
I know- you have problems in west ,but please- don't fall in this ex soviet trap.
You're wasting your breath explaining what is probably not so obvious to anybody who has not actually lived through the Soviet era, who doesn't have any relatives who have managed to survive that nightmare; or, who hasn't lived in contemporary Eastern Europe as an Eastern European themselves.
The only way to accomplish anything in business or government in EE is through bribery, favors, and other corrupt means that prevent the proliferation of some semblance of honest capitalism, which if instituted would pretty quickly lift a lot of the country out of the muck and render Putin, his ilk, and their empty promises of future prosperity largely unnecessary.
As @Gopnik rightly pointed out, there's a tendency to conflate criticism against, or opposition to Putin as being categorically globalist, pro-LGBT, culturally marxist and whatever other characteristics that have nothing to do with the objective situation and which we ALL agree are undesirable.
This is lazy, un-nuanced thinking. Putin is, by all OBJECTIVE measures, a criminal of the highest (or, lowest) order. Russians are climbing over themselves to GTFO. Even the Russians who have family and genuinely love their country - because there's a lot to love about this ancient land - even they are forced to send their children to get educated in China or elsewhere because good luck accomplishing anything through honesty and diligence in a place like Russia.
Putin's public image is also a complete fabrication. Most Russians see right through the KGB veneer but to Westerners who don't have experience with this particular species of snake, his presentation can easily seduce you. He's a smart, well-spoken, but ultimately evil man.
Of course, in addition to all of the clandestine murdering and corruption, there's also the fact that the KGB operated (and operates) chiefly through overt, visible to the naked eye means ("active measures").
See: Yuri Bezmenov, former KGB defector with instructive videos on YouTube that detail exactly the kinds of people you're dealing with; people who are not at all what they seem, unless you know what they are. (In the latter case, they are exactly what they seem.)
There was no doubt that Putin would win because there was no doubt that any legitimate opposition had been sabotaged at every step.
@Rocha What is your infatuation with this thug? Can you not see the evidence before your very eyes that the people he claims to uphold are still stuck in post Soviet morass largely due to him and his cronies? If you love Russian and Russians, how can you support a dictator who has demonstrated his disdain for their well being time and again?
Quote: (03-19-2018 05:23 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:
The only way to accomplish anything in business in EE is through bribery, favors, and other corrupt means that prevent the proliferation of some semblance of honest capitalism
Quote: (03-19-2018 05:23 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:
Quote: (03-18-2018 06:40 PM)just a human Wrote:
I know that here are a lot of Putin fans.
I have a question for You -have You ever met any real criminals in Your life?
If You have so-You already know, that You can't trust a word of them.
Not only in Russia,but in whole eastern Europe are a lot of people like him- some kinda legalized criminals,ex KGB agents, they are still close to governments here a lot. Corrupted as fuck.
No- thanks. I will NEVER be their supporter.
They are playing a show in front of dumb auditory.
I know- you have problems in west ,but please- don't fall in this ex soviet trap.
You're wasting your breath explaining what is probably not so obvious to anybody who has not actually lived through the Soviet era, who doesn't have any relatives who have managed to survive that nightmare; or, who hasn't lived in contemporary Eastern Europe as an Eastern European themselves.
The only way to accomplish anything in business or government in EE is through bribery, favors, and other corrupt means that prevent the proliferation of some semblance of honest capitalism, which if instituted would pretty quickly lift a lot of the country out of the muck and render Putin, his ilk, and their empty promises of future prosperity largely unnecessary.
As @Gopnik rightly pointed out, there's a tendency to conflate criticism against, or opposition to Putin as being categorically globalist, pro-LGBT, culturally marxist and whatever other characteristics that have nothing to do with the objective situation and which we ALL agree are undesirable.
This is lazy, un-nuanced thinking. Putin is, by all OBJECTIVE measures, a criminal of the highest (or, lowest) order. Russians are climbing over themselves to GTFO. Even the Russians who have family and genuinely love their country - because there's a lot to love about this ancient land - even they are forced to send their children to get educated in China or elsewhere because good luck accomplishing anything through honesty and diligence in a place like Russia.
Putin's public image is also a complete fabrication. Most Russians see right through the KGB veneer but to Westerners who don't have experience with this particular species of snake, his presentation can easily seduce you. He's a smart, well-spoken, but ultimately evil man.
Of course, in addition to all of the clandestine murdering and corruption, there's also the fact that the KGB operated (and operates) chiefly through overt, visible to the naked eye means ("active measures").
See: Yuri Bezmenov, former KGB defector with instructive videos on YouTube that detail exactly the kinds of people you're dealing with; people who are not at all what they seem, unless you know what they are. (In the latter case, they are exactly what they seem.)
There was no doubt that Putin would win because there was no doubt that any legitimate opposition had been sabotaged at every step.
@Rocha What is your infatuation with this thug? Can you not see the evidence before your very eyes that the people he claims to uphold are still stuck in post Soviet morass largely due to him and his cronies? If you love Russian and Russians, how can you support a dictator who has demonstrated his disdain for their well being time and again?
Quote: (03-19-2018 08:36 AM)Rocha Wrote:
Its the same as turning Ukrainian tv on and listen to Poroshenko, Lyashko, Tianyhbok, Yatsenuk, Parubiy...
Quote: (03-19-2018 05:23 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:
There was no doubt that Putin would win because there was no doubt that any legitimate opposition had been sabotaged at every step.
Quote: (03-19-2018 08:49 AM)Count Pierre Wrote:
Quote: (03-19-2018 08:36 AM)Rocha Wrote:
Its the same as turning Ukrainian tv on and listen to Poroshenko, Lyashko, Tianyhbok, Yatsenuk, Parubiy...
Most ukrainians abhor Putin, and not just crooked politicians. No need to answer that it's because "they are all being brainwhashed" please (even if in some way, it's bit true).
Quote: (03-19-2018 10:09 AM)Rocha Wrote:
Ukraine is not just Kiev and Lviv.
Quote: (03-18-2018 05:53 PM)CynicalContrarian Wrote:
Quote:[url=https://twitter.com/IntheNow_tweet/status/973601349387636741][/url]
Quote: (03-18-2018 11:01 AM)Gopnik Wrote:
Quote: (03-19-2018 12:40 PM)Gopnik Wrote:
I get why Putin is popular among anti-establishment discussion groups like this one, but I don't see what's so great about having him drain the nation's wealth instead of a pro western puppet.
Quote: (03-19-2018 12:40 PM)Gopnik Wrote:That might also be the case, anyway there is no reason to support him, especially if you hold cultural values higher then economic values like most members of this forum probably do.
@Mage when I saw the video, I actually thought it could be proof that Navalny is a Kremlin puppet. Supporting something like that is political suicide in Russia. Otherwise, I have no idea why he would openly say that.
Quote: (03-19-2018 02:05 PM)Rocha Wrote:
Has Russia ever had a better leader than Putin?
Never.