[Kendrick]

Hey guys, looking for some tweaking and input on a 10 month trip to EE/Russia. Dates will be November-August. We will Airbnb decent flats in central locations for a minimum of a month at a time. It will be me and a friend.

Background

We both spent the last two years in SF.

Me: I'm 27, 6'3" and 175 lbs lean and muscular, pale skin, brown hair, brown eyes, good looking. Most really hot girls are happy to talk to me. I'd say my game is at an intermediate level. I'm personally more interested in quality girls than quantity.

Friend: 26, 6'2" and fit, half Korean and half Chinese, good looking too. His game is at a similar level.

Neither of us speak Russian, but we plan on getting a tutor (if this is feasible) in every city we spend a month in, hopefully we'll be conversational after a few months.

The Trip

After reading many of the great threads on the travel forum and of course Roosh's articles, I'm definitely most interested in Kiev, St. Petersburg, and Moscow. A special thanks to Slubu for his detailed threads.

This is the plan so far:

Nov: Krakow
Dec: Budapest
January: Bucharest
February-August: unknown

We probably won't do more than a month or two in Moscow, even with the Ruble being cheap it still seems way more expensive than St. Petersburg or Kiev. There's other cities in EE that other members have liked in the Baltics or Balkans, but it seems to me the highest quality girls are in the Ukraine or Russia, so we're planning on spending the bulk of the last 7 months split between Moscow, Kiev, and St. Petersburg, and possibly the Baltics, unless you guys have any suggestions.

We have a good friend in Bucharest to show us around, and friends who can connect us with friends they have in Moscow, St. Petersburg, and Kiev. Would love to meet some of the other members of the forum that are currently traveling out there.

I'd be interested in hearing opinions from well traveled members on what we can expect. I don't really have any expectations, just excited to get out of SF and on an adventure.

I'll update this post as we go along, ala slubu. Thanks for stopping by guys.

[Pokerbaby]

I'd skip Krakow.

Krakow is the absolute worst city in Poland for foreigners.

I would rank Poland:

1) Mid-sized town with a lot of University students.
2) Warsaw
3) Krakow

[ZAMSKI]

I don't know why Pokerbaby is saying that. I bet with you and your mate's stats, plus the fact that school is in full swing during this time, I bet yall would absolutely kill it. Have fun mate and looking forward to the development of this thread.

[Pokerbaby]

(09-08-2016 10:57 AM)ZAMSKI Wrote:  

I don't know why Pokerbaby is saying that. I bet with you and your mate's stats, plus the fact that school is in full swing during this time, I bet yall would absolutely kill it. Have fun mate and looking forward to the development of this thread.

They wouldn't do bad. Nowhere in Central/Eastern Europe would 2 good looking, young American dudes, do "bad".

But they would do way better elsewhere. More beautiful girls with less effort. Plus Krakow is relativel expensive and I assume 2 young guys aren't exacty swimming in cash.

Oh and forget Airbnb.

http://www.oferty.net or http://www.olx.pl.

You will need to befriend a Polish speaker.

[Kendrick]

Thanks for the tips guys. We don't have a huge budget like slubu did, but we're not extremely strapped for cash either. It was my understanding that Warsaw wasn't great, and Krakow and Wroclaw were the best options in Poland. Krakow seems like a pleasant city.

I'm also hearing conflicting reports of whether Budapest is actually worth spending a month in.

We initially weren't going to do Prague, but maybe it'd be a good time of year (winter) to spend a month there.

Other than that, still really excited about Ukraine and Russia, we'd head over there earlier, but it just seems brutally cold before spring.

[kirdiesel]

Looking forward to hearing about this trip

[Slam]

Following this thread as I am anticipating something similar.

Kendrick, just wondering how are you planning to pack? You will need clothes for all the seasons (esp extra clothes for winter), yet moving around with two huge suitcases would be a big hassle.

[BishesMyron]

(09-08-2016 10:28 AM)Pokerbaby Wrote:  

I'd skip Krakow.

Krakow is the absolute worst city in Poland for foreigners.

I would rank Poland:

1) Mid-sized town with a lot of University students.
2) Warsaw
3) Krakow

While I see where you are coming from (spent a year between Warsaw and Krakow), both Warsaw and Krakow also attract the hottest and most sexually open minded women from all around Poland. They might have easier foot in the door in cities such as Lodz due to lack of competition but women might be slightly more on the conservative end.

The reason why people hate on Warsaw / Krakow in this forum is because there's no same level of exotic factor and male competition is stronger but considering stats of you OP and his buddy, they'll do fine.

[Pokerbaby]

(09-14-2016 05:37 PM)BishesMyron Wrote:  

(09-08-2016 10:28 AM)Pokerbaby Wrote:  

I'd skip Krakow.

Krakow is the absolute worst city in Poland for foreigners.

I would rank Poland:

1) Mid-sized town with a lot of University students.
2) Warsaw
3) Krakow

While I see where you are coming from (spent a year between Warsaw and Krakow), both Warsaw and Krakow also attract the hottest and most sexually open minded women from all around Poland. They might have easier foot in the door in cities such as Lodz due to lack of competition but women might be slightly more on the conservative end.

The reason why people hate on Warsaw / Krakow in this forum is because there's no same level of exotic factor and male competition is stronger but considering stats of you OP and his buddy, they'll do fine.

I am not really hating on Warsaw or Krakow. I like both cities, especially Warsaw I have defended Warsaw many times on this forum.

It's just about choices. A smaller town will give them more access to more quality women with a lot less effort. And even if this doesn't hold true, at the very least, the cost of living will be much lower.

I have to ask the question, without trying to sound like an asshole, Have you lived in Small town Poland?

Polish women aren't super sophisticated and often don't know the difference between British and American/Canadian accents. Often times I was asked where I was from, responding with a "guess", only to have them guess the UK because I spoke English. That means getting lumped in with the British stag tourists that are generally hated on.

Roosh mentions this in Bang Poland. Go with his lead.

[Kendrick]

(09-14-2016 01:58 PM)Slam Wrote:  

Following this thread as I am anticipating something similar.

Kendrick, just wondering how are you planning to pack? You will need clothes for all the seasons (esp extra clothes for winter), yet moving around with two huge suitcases would be a big hassle.

Since it will only be a train to a different city once a month (or two months), I think I'm fine with taking a large 'check in' roller type suitcase and a medium size 'carry on' backpack. I'll stuff my day pack into the larger suitcase.

I've done the whole live out of one backpack and hostel type travel for 3 months in Western Europe and 5 months in South America when I was younger and I'm totally over that type of travel.

I should be able to fit all the clothes I need and want in two big suitcases, although I'm curious as to how Slubu and Roosh travel, but I would imagine similar to how I plan to.

[WeekendCasanova]

Roosh burns all of his clothes prior to changing destinations. Hides all of the pussy juice covered evidence...or something like that.

[Kendrick]

(09-14-2016 05:37 PM)BishesMyron Wrote:  

(09-08-2016 10:28 AM)Pokerbaby Wrote:  

I'd skip Krakow.

Krakow is the absolute worst city in Poland for foreigners.

I would rank Poland:

1) Mid-sized town with a lot of University students.
2) Warsaw
3) Krakow

While I see where you are coming from (spent a year between Warsaw and Krakow), both Warsaw and Krakow also attract the hottest and most sexually open minded women from all around Poland. They might have easier foot in the door in cities such as Lodz due to lack of competition but women might be slightly more on the conservative end.

The reason why people hate on Warsaw / Krakow in this forum is because there's no same level of exotic factor and male competition is stronger but considering stats of you OP and his buddy, they'll do fine.

I think our stop in Poland will be Krakow for a month, for a few reasons.

I'm assuming November will be offseason for tourists and thus less stag parties. While women are a main consideration, I also want to experience Krakow as a city, stay in the old town, read Dostoyevsky in a gloomy cafe. The idiosyncrasies of travel are important to me.

Updated itinerary:

Nov: Krakow
Dec: Budapest
Jan: Prague (college buddy is getting married here)
Feb: Bucharest
Mar: Kiev
Apr: Kiev
May: St. Petersburg
Jun: St. Petersburg
July: Moscow

[Pokerbaby]

Krakow is a great city..just not for game. If anything else besides game is a consideration, then go for it.

[Kendrick]

Does anyone have any strong opinion between Krakow and Belgrade?

The sense I got from reading the many threads on the board is that Krakow will be easier at the expense of quality (8+ girls scarce) and that Belgrade has top tier girls that are harder with no ONS culture, with perhaps harder competition from local men (which doesn't really phase me).

Other considerations are members have described Belgrade as a more boring city one might not want to spend a whole month in, whereas Krakow is one of the nicer cities in EE.

Thoughts?

If game was the only consideration I would learn toward higher quality and harder to pull (Belgrade). Maybe I'm selling Polish girls short though.

[Innuendo]

If it's your first time in EE, go to Krakow.

[Kendrick]

(09-26-2016 04:50 PM)Innuendo Wrote:  

If it's your first time in EE, go to Krakow.

We booked our flights into Krakow Nov 1!

Here's what we have so far:

Krakow: 3 weeks
Budapest: 3 weeks
Bratislava: 1 week (visiting college buddy)
Munich: 10 days (christmas/NYE w/ friends)
Prague: 1 week (wedding)
Belgrade: 1 month
Bucharest: 1 month
Odessa: 1 week
Kiev: 2 months (March)
St. Petersburg - 2 months
Moscow- 1 month

Then back to Cali in time to make it to Burning Man

We might end up reducing time in Kiev/SPB in favor of exploring the Baltics or other cities, but given how cheap they are currently, the exceedingly high quality of women, and the fact we enjoy tier 1 cities, I think 2 months could be merited in those cities.

[Kendrick]

On another note, in what countries is it generally cheapest to buy clothes? Is it cheaper than buying in the States? I typically wear mid-end designer clothes (zara, diesel, etc).

What about electronics? I wanted to buy a canon T5 at some point, should I just buy it here before I go or might I find it cheaper in EE with favorable exchange rates?

Apologies if this has been discussed already, I didn't have much luck searching the forums.

[_Cicero]

I'll come out of retirement to comment...

As an old Russia hand by this point, let me say that I'm not big on Peter. I should add I haven't done that much gaming there, but I went out two nights, have done some day gaming, and have been there a total of 5 times. I'd take Moscow over it any day. Granted, I know Moscow well, but Moscow was love at first sight for me. I doubt Peter is that much cheaper than Moscow. If I were you, I'd add a Soviet Central Asian country to the list that ends with "stan", and drop Peter completely. You could save money after spending more time in Moscow by doing a few extra weeks in Ukraine or some time in the Baltics. I like blonde girls, so I would recommend you do the "Baltic sweep".

[DaveR]

(09-29-2016 10:25 AM)Kendrick Wrote:  

On another note, in what countries is it generally cheapest to buy clothes? Is it cheaper than buying in the States? I typically wear mid-end designer clothes (zara, diesel, etc).

What about electronics? I wanted to buy a canon T5 at some point, should I just buy it here before I go or might I find it cheaper in EE with favorable exchange rates?

Apologies if this has been discussed already, I didn't have much luck searching the forums.

Everything will be cheaper in the US.

[presidentcarter]

(09-29-2016 12:34 PM)_Cicero Wrote:  

As an old Russia hand by this point, let me say that I'm not big on Peter. I should add I haven't done that much gaming there, but I went out two nights, have done some day gaming, and have been there a total of 5 times. I'd take Moscow over it any day. time in the Baltics. I like blonde girls, so I would recommend you do the "Baltic sweep".

I have to second this. Piter is dirtier, seedier, much smaller, and has a lot more tourists.

You'll be grouped in with the sex tourists from Finland and UK.

The higher end "Santa Barbara" club I went to was full of pay4play girls and girls scamming for high-priced champagne purchases. The trashy bars at Dumskaya are...trashy.

Moscow is more isolated, in a good way. The only advantage Piter has is logistics (because it small). You can pretty much walk everywhere whereas in Moscow you'll want to hop around a bit thus you'll need to Uber or taxi.

[Pointer]

My impression of Belgrade is that the girls like to show off and dress to impress. They would rather spend a lot of money on brand name clothes instead of shopping at H&M. They're also status oriented and as a foreigner you are supposed to act a certain way. Bars and clubs are quite bad for game. It was mostly groups sitting around the tables, dancing with their friends for a short while then back to sitting down some more...The vibe was much different compared to Krakow. Didn't try day game or online game as I only spent there 3 days. I'm not sure what you consider 8+ but if you're thinking of super models in high heels don't get your hopes up unless you speak the local language.

[Kendrick]

(09-29-2016 06:30 PM)Pointer Wrote:  

My impression of Belgrade is that the girls like to show off and dress to impress. They would rather spend a lot of money on brand name clothes instead of shopping at H&M. They're also status oriented and as a foreigner you are supposed to act a certain way. Bars and clubs are quite bad for game. It was mostly groups sitting around the tables, dancing with their friends for a short while then back to sitting down some more...The vibe was much different compared to Krakow. Didn't try day game or online game as I only spent there 3 days. I'm not sure what you consider 8+ but if you're thinking of super models in high heels don't get your hopes up unless you speak the local language.

Good advice. My standards are essentially what slubu has described previously, I don't throw around an 8 or 9 rating lightly. That being said I've decent success in that range in the US. Most people comment that Belgrade has the hottest girls outside of the FSU, but more and more I'm leaning toward shortening my time in Belgrade and Bucharest in favor of heading to Russia/Ukraine in early Feb. I find Russian girls to be the most attractive and there's something about the Russian soul, literary history, cold and darkness that draws me there.

[Kendrick]

(09-29-2016 12:34 PM)_Cicero Wrote:  

I'll come out of retirement to comment...

As an old Russia hand by this point, let me say that I'm not big on Peter. I should add I haven't done that much gaming there, but I went out two nights, have done some day gaming, and have been there a total of 5 times. I'd take Moscow over it any day. Granted, I know Moscow well, but Moscow was love at first sight for me. I doubt Peter is that much cheaper than Moscow. If I were you, I'd add a Soviet Central Asian country to the list that ends with "stan", and drop Peter completely. You could save money after spending more time in Moscow by doing a few extra weeks in Ukraine or some time in the Baltics. I like blonde girls, so I would recommend you do the "Baltic sweep".

Cicero the legend! I've read your data sheets and threads, honored to have you weigh in.

Just from scouting airbnb monthly rental rates, a decent 2BR in SPB goes for $750-800 right off of Nevsky Prospect, while a 2BR in Moscow seems to be going for $1300 and that toward the 3rd Ring Rd, it's closer to $1800-2000 anywhere close to Arbat or the city center.

Maybe there are better websites or ways to rent for 1-3 months in Moscow? How important is living close to the city center? Are there neighborhoods outside the city center that are acceptable?

I completely believe you when you say Moscow is that much better, but it seems like SPB is still a great way to experience Russia for half the rent of Moscow, although maybe I should just shell out the extra $300-500 a month to live in Moscow.

The Baltics seem very cool, although people on the boards have had mixed reviews (slubu didn't like Tallin, Riga has a bad reputation), but Vilnius seems to have a good reputation. At any rate the quality seems to be top tier which is the most important.

Generally any insight on Moscow logistics, current cost of living, etc would be great.

If i didn't mention it before, I like clubbing and night game is my forte.

[Kendrick]

(09-29-2016 05:48 PM)presidentcarter Wrote:  

(09-29-2016 12:34 PM)_Cicero Wrote:  

As an old Russia hand by this point, let me say that I'm not big on Peter. I should add I haven't done that much gaming there, but I went out two nights, have done some day gaming, and have been there a total of 5 times. I'd take Moscow over it any day. time in the Baltics. I like blonde girls, so I would recommend you do the "Baltic sweep".

I have to second this. Piter is dirtier, seedier, much smaller, and has a lot more tourists.

You'll be grouped in with the sex tourists from Finland and UK.

The higher end "Santa Barbara" club I went to was full of pay4play girls and girls scamming for high-priced champagne purchases. The trashy bars at Dumskaya are...trashy.

Moscow is more isolated, in a good way. The only advantage Piter has is logistics (because it small). You can pretty much walk everywhere whereas in Moscow you'll want to hop around a bit thus you'll need to Uber or taxi.

It's unfortunate to hear the club scene is lacking in SPB, as that's my favored way to game. How much time did you spend in SPB and how long ago was that? I'm hoping there won't be as many tourists there in April/May. Aside from the club scene it seems like it has a lot of art and culture and architecture going for it.

At any rate given how cheap the ruble is now, maybe I should just try to make Moscow work for longer given what you guys have said.

How do you guys compare Kiev to Moscow or SPB? Favorably? Considerably cheaper? Is Odessa worth an extended stay in the spring time?

[Nascimento]

I like your itinerary. You're choosing to spend at least 3 weeks in most places which gives you a good amount of time to make things work in each place.

If there's a tip I can give, it's to be flexible with your dates, because you might end up liking a place a lot and wanting to stay more. Conversely, a place might not be giving you what you're looking for, and you might want to be moving on quick.