[Serious Sam]

(08-21-2016 07:27 PM)Kona Wrote:  

I just went to Walmart a while ago. It doesn't matter which one.


Those are my bonus items. What you don't see is the two bags of charcoal that I also forgot to scan.

Now, my bill came out to well over $150. I got beer, Johnsonville brats, bar s (or 5) polish and smoked sausages, maybe ten packages of hotdog buns, and some other personal items.

Here is my logic (and please just support me, as I've already been told how stupid this is):

Maybe I got $25 worth of free stuff. Imdrivinga truck with a six liter v8 engine. That barely covers my gas. Now Walmart gets all kinds of tax breaks and pays the townsfolk shit, so fuck them. If I get a free delicious Boston cream pie flavored yogurt, that's thanking me for supporting them.

That is all.

Now, if any of you are in haleiwa you are welcometo come by for a bratwurst.

Aloha!

And since you don't need a receipt to return shit to Walmart, you could take all that stuff back and let them pay you. I think I just found my new career.

[JacksonRev]

(08-21-2016 07:27 PM)Kona Wrote:  

Now Walmart gets all kinds of tax breaks and pays the townsfolk shit, so fuck them.

The entire point of this thread.

[K Galt]

Quote:

It's definitely bullshit. Hawaii is situated in a shipping lane that goes to and from asia from the west coast of the U.S.

You can find U.S. import goods in countries like the Philippines for cheaper than you can find in Hawaii.

Of course the shipping cost reason doesn't make any sense. There's no fuel surcharge which justifies the markup of consumer goods in Hawaii.

It's all based on local supply and demand as the retailers see it.

They have figured out how to collude and price fix in Hawaii. There's essentially a cartel of retailers and consumer goods supermarkets there which ensure prices are artificially very high.

Their profit margins must be absurd compared with the mainland USA like 1000%+ which is probably why they are so loose with loss prevention. They have already figured out they can have 1,000+ Konas carrying stuff out the front door with five finger discount but they will still make insane amounts of money.

It's so much more than that. First off, the most expensive cost associated with shipping is human resources...aka collectively bargained, unionized labor. The Longshoreman/Stevedores have some of the highest guaranteed wages and benefits package of any union in the State.

They, in turn have the most powerful union that works hand in glove with the local Government to maintain their power. And oh yeah, if anyone dares point out the corruption and graft involved in local politicians, the political party machine, the unions and the Government departments and agencies, well, the Longshoreman can just threaten a strike. If no one unloads the ships, the store shelves go empty in a matter of days.

That is the biggest reason why "shipping costs" are so high for Hawaii.

Another reason is supply chain economics. Every shipping container that gets unloaded at Honolulu Harbor, is usually trucked to warehousing facilities (most at Campbell Industrial Park on the West side) where all the goods are stored and distributed island wide to the stores as they are needed to keep the store shelves stocked. That's all facilities, employees, trucking company fees, refrigerated/freezer storage and trucking, warehousing fees, forklift operators.... the list goes on and on.

And never forget...in every job associated with all of these phases of shipping, trucking, delivery, storage etc., also involves jobs with employees who have State of Hawaii (and now FedGov Obamacare) mandatory health coverage paid for by employers, as well as salary and benefits.

All of this results in far higher costs in delivering goods in a Just In Time inventory system our corporate market place, which translates into $8 for a gallon of milk (never mind the fact that places like wal mart first shipped in milk and sold it for half the price of locally produced dairy farm milk...and lo and behold, more than a decade later, all of the local dairys are closed, but that's just one example of an entire economy changed by Wal Mart's initial cutthroat pricing entrance into any marketplace.)

Setting up this exact same system in the Phillipines, with no unions, no Gov mandated employer provided health care, no excessive GE taxation etc., and a work force willing to work for low wages in all aspects of the supply chain is why you get the price differentials on shipped goods from the US in places like Hawaii versus places like the Phillipines.

It's the entire economic and governmental systems that are part of the "collusion" to keep prices artificially high.

TL;DR

While I share Kona's senitments towards Wal Mart -- fuck them -- rather than steal from them, I just don't shop there. Ever.

I'd rather pay higher prices for my goods than support Wal Mart.

[Adv8nturous]

Think people need to read the article.

Either Walmart is letting this happen/ encouraging it through cost cutting lax security or the article is lying.

It's not blaming Walmart for the undeclass it's blaming them for letting the police respond to / pick up the check for, their neglect.

If it was a smaller, local business just starting up and getting this reputation with local police it would have to show improvements or be closed down.

[K Galt]

Quote:

Either Walmart is letting this happen/ encouraging it through cost cutting lax security or the article is lying.

It's both.

Quote:

It's not blaming Walmart for the undeclass it's blaming them for letting the police respond to / pick up the check for, their neglect.

Wal Mart has aided and abetted the gutting of the American middle class for the past 20 years. From cut throat competition to drive out local competitors, to relying on Gov subsidies, to employer schemes such as having a large workforce of part time shift employees so that no single worker gets enough hours to qualify for FedGov mandated employer provided health care, and low enough wages that their workers qualify for EBT welfare, QUEST medical coverage, and other Government run/taxpayer funded entitlement programs.

But that's only one way they exploit the EBT corruption...

Understand that the biggest subsidies Wal Mart enjoys is the EBT loophole that allows them to get EBT reimbursements from FedGov for the sales of all the processed junk food they stock entire aisles with. Soda, chips, cookies, candy, crackers, microwave meals....all of it, eligible for EBT purchase (FedGov welfare subsidy) as long as they maintain a couple of aisles of fresh produce and dairy for sale.

This is how mega-corporations exploit their human resources and milk the tax payers to subsidize their labor force.

And this is only one small part of the demonic evil that is Wal Mart.

[Kona]

(08-22-2016 01:01 AM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:  

Quote:

To be fair Enigma, the real hero of this thread is Kona.

Stealing some charcoal and yogurt from the local Walmart, then bragging about it online, doesn't make you a hero, it makes you a low-life.

Is that why you didn't come over? You think I'm a low-life?

I still get leftovers if you change your mind.

Aloha!

[Ghost Tiger]

(08-22-2016 04:50 PM)Kona Wrote:  

(08-22-2016 01:01 AM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:  

Quote:

To be fair Enigma, the real hero of this thread is Kona.

Stealing some charcoal and yogurt from the local Walmart, then bragging about it online, doesn't make you a hero, it makes you a low-life.

Is that why you didn't come over? You think I'm a low-life?

I still get leftovers if you change your mind.

Aloha!

Oh I'm there bro! I love the smell of stolen charcoal in the morning!

Us low-lifes gotta stick together yo!

Aloha!

[booshala]

(08-22-2016 03:49 PM)K Galt Wrote:  

Quote:

It's definitely bullshit. Hawaii is situated in a shipping lane that goes to and from asia from the west coast of the U.S.

You can find U.S. import goods in countries like the Philippines for cheaper than you can find in Hawaii.

Of course the shipping cost reason doesn't make any sense. There's no fuel surcharge which justifies the markup of consumer goods in Hawaii.

It's all based on local supply and demand as the retailers see it.

They have figured out how to collude and price fix in Hawaii. There's essentially a cartel of retailers and consumer goods supermarkets there which ensure prices are artificially very high.

Their profit margins must be absurd compared with the mainland USA like 1000%+ which is probably why they are so loose with loss prevention. They have already figured out they can have 1,000+ Konas carrying stuff out the front door with five finger discount but they will still make insane amounts of money.

It's so much more than that. First off, the most expensive cost associated with shipping is human resources...aka collectively bargained, unionized labor. The Longshoreman/Stevedores have some of the highest guaranteed wages and benefits package of any union in the State.

They, in turn have the most powerful union that works hand in glove with the local Government to maintain their power. And oh yeah, if anyone dares point out the corruption and graft involved in local politicians, the political party machine, the unions and the Government departments and agencies, well, the Longshoreman can just threaten a strike. If no one unloads the ships, the store shelves go empty in a matter of days.

That is the biggest reason why "shipping costs" are so high for Hawaii.

Another reason is supply chain economics. Every shipping container that gets unloaded at Honolulu Harbor, is usually trucked to warehousing facilities (most at Campbell Industrial Park on the West side) where all the goods are stored and distributed island wide to the stores as they are needed to keep the store shelves stocked. That's all facilities, employees, trucking company fees, refrigerated/freezer storage and trucking, warehousing fees, forklift operators.... the list goes on and on.

And never forget...in every job associated with all of these phases of shipping, trucking, delivery, storage etc., also involves jobs with employees who have State of Hawaii (and now FedGov Obamacare) mandatory health coverage paid for by employers, as well as salary and benefits.

All of this results in far higher costs in delivering goods in a Just In Time inventory system our corporate market place, which translates into $8 for a gallon of milk (never mind the fact that places like wal mart first shipped in milk and sold it for half the price of locally produced dairy farm milk...and lo and behold, more than a decade later, all of the local dairys are closed, but that's just one example of an entire economy changed by Wal Mart's initial cutthroat pricing entrance into any marketplace.)

Setting up this exact same system in the Phillipines, with no unions, no Gov mandated employer provided health care, no excessive GE taxation etc., and a work force willing to work for low wages in all aspects of the supply chain is why you get the price differentials on shipped goods from the US in places like Hawaii versus places like the Phillipines.

It's the entire economic and governmental systems that are part of the "collusion" to keep prices artificially high.

TL;DR

While I share Kona's senitments towards Wal Mart -- fuck them -- rather than steal from them, I just don't shop there. Ever.

I'd rather pay higher prices for my goods than support Wal Mart.

Fantastic lay-out of relevant information, you must have a background in logistics or freight forwarding... There are so many layers to the reasons behind shit in our modern market economy. And I agree, if you hate Walmart so much, just go somewhere else.

[K Galt]

Quote:

Fantastic lay-out of relevant information, you must have a background in logistics or freight forwarding...

Thanks...lets just say I'm in my 40's, and I've lived in Hawaii for all of my life, and I've worked a large number of varying types of jobs and have seen many facets of this system in action. I also went to college and got a business degree which essentially trained me to be a cog in this system, and I worked for several years in the belly of the beast in the State of Hawaii Government and a former Hawaii Government Workers Union member.

Let's just say I have a full grasp of what is called "The Old Boys Network" in Hawaii - which is the same network you find anywhere else in America where the taxes are high, the party in power in the State and County Governments is entrenched and the unions have an iron grip on the economy...aka the Democratic Party political machine.

Any state in the US where the taxes are low and the unions don't hold much power, is where you're going to find the cheapest cost of living.

[Gimlet]

I ship to Walmart on a weekly basis, out of China and out of the US. I've been shipping to various retailers for many many years.

The reason why Walmart's prices are higher in Hawaii is because they don't have a Distribution Center in Hawaii. (Not in general merchandise which is what I know, grocery may be different.) Goods for Hawaii ship out of a CA DC, or they make domestic vendors ship direct to HI here and there. Without a DC in Hawaii, it isn't cost effective for them to ship from China direct to stores as there is no place to break down the goods an repalletize. Also, there aren't enough stores there to make it cost effective to ship an entire container from a given vendor, then set up an HI distribution center to service a handful of stores. Think about it, Walmart has approx 3500 supercenters which are serviced by a mere 42 DCs for general merchandise. HI doesn't have the qty of stores to get a DC of their own.

[K Galt]

Quote:

The reason why prices are higher in Hawaii...

You mean prices at Wal Mart in Hawaii are higher...my posts here where more about why prices on everything in Hawaii are higher, including locally produced goods and services that have almost nothing to do with shipping.

That being said, even without a Wal Mart Distribution Center of our own, by sheer volume of shipping, and cheaper production costs of goods from China and other 3rd world manufacturers in addition to all the other politically connected subsidies that Wal Mart employs, they are able to offer most of their merchandise cheaper than most other competing businesses in Hawaii.

When the first Wal Mart opened up in Mililani (a town in the center of the island of O'ahu) around 20 years ago, people from all over the island drove to shop there...some of them doing a 2-3 hour round trip just to shop there. The price differential between Wal Mart and local businesses was that dramatic. Of course, once competing businesses - local mom and pop stores and locally built franchises - all went out of business or got bought out by national corporations, such differences in prices are no longer so pronounced (aka they raised their prices once they cornered the market). Wal Mart is infamous for this.

[LINUX]

Well the article does have a point. You don't see this kind of shit happening at Costco.

[Gimlet]

(08-22-2016 06:36 PM)K Galt Wrote:  

Quote:

The reason why prices are higher in Hawaii...

You mean prices at Wal Mart in Hawaii are higher...my posts here where more about why prices on everything in Hawaii are higher, including locally produced goods and services that have almost nothing to do with shipping.

I edited to say Walmart specifically, 5 minutes before you posted, you probably hit quote then had other business to attend to while I edited. No harm, no foul.

I only know HI companies/locations I have personally shipped and can't speak to the rest of your post. I am only clarifying previous incorrect posts on this thread speculating why HI Walmarts are priced the way they are, given their closer location to China, and in comparison to the Philippines. Those were way off the mark.

[K Galt]

Got it...no harm, no foul.

Aloha!

[Delta]

I'm finding this thread extremely disturbing.

So the consensus moral code here is that stealing is okay... no, heroic... as long as you're doing it to "the corporations" and/or it's easy to avoid getting caught? That sounds like some Bernie Bro logic, and I expected better from this group.

Walmart is not wrecking society.

They attract a lot of low-brow criminals? Good, it keeps them separate from everyone else.

They cause smaller retails to go out of business? That's because people CHOOSE to buy stuff at Walmart instead. So they've enriched people's lives by providing them a place they'd prefer to shop.

They pay their employees low wages? Let me ask: Who is willing to pay those same employees a nickel more than Walmart? No one. I know this because those employees are CHOOSING to work at Walmart.

Capitalism works. It's quite apparent if you think beyond the idiotic soundbites parroted by Bernie supporters. And there is no legitimate justification for stealing from Walmart (or anyone). Just admit you want free shit instead of acting like a crusader for justice.

[Leonard D Neubache]

(08-22-2016 07:55 PM)Delta Wrote:  

I'm finding this thread extremely disturbing.

So the consensus moral code here is that stealing is okay... no, heroic... as long as you're doing it to "the corporations" and/or it's easy to avoid getting caught? That sounds like some Bernie Bro logic, and I expected better from this group.

...

Capitalism works. It's quite apparent if you think beyond the idiotic soundbites parroted by Bernie supporters. And there is no legitimate justification for stealing from Walmart (or anyone). Just admit you want free shit instead of acting like a crusader for justice.

Word to the wise. Never use terms like "I expected better" unless you're talking to your child. Regardless of whether you're morally correct, it's a cuckism.

Secondly, you can't legitimately espouse the values of capitalism because you've never lived under it. There are millions of pages of workplace laws largely brought into force by corporations and unions, and the idea that any nation on earth is operating in a free market is absurd.

Then again, start a business, pay the same rate of tax that Walmart does and then see how long it takes the IRS to bend you over a barrel.

[SamuelBRoberts]

At what tax rate does it become acceptable to steal from someone?
My neighbor's got a house and gets a nice fancy mortgage deduction. I live in an apartment and pay out the ass in taxes.

Is it okay for me to jack his TV? What if I only take all the stuff from his change drawer?

[Leonard D Neubache]

Ease up, sport. I didn't say it was ok to steal. I just said that it's laughable to suggest that we're operating in a free market.

[SamuelBRoberts]

Fair enough, but I'm going to admit I'm also bewildered by the forum's inability to agree on basic shit like, "petty theft is wrong."
This isn't a massive gray area that's troubled philosophers for generations, this is the sort of stuff you pick up on the first day in pre-school.
Kona isn't starving to death. He's not going to drop dead in the street without his Boston-Creme flavored yogurt.
He just doesn't want to pay for it.

I'm not going to speculate on motives, but I'm absolutely astonished that the forum's reaction has been "Yeah, I steal stuff too!" and "Can any of us truly say that it's wrong to steal from the grocery store?"

[Leonard D Neubache]

You're going to run into a minor dilemma here.

RVF Forum is not about creating or maintaining ethical codes of societal conduct. Arguably, spending your days banging sluts rather than wifing up a virgin in your late teens and raising a respectable family is far more socially destructive than swiping the occasional tub of yoghurt.

My advice is not to get into moral crusades on an internet forum. I don't always listen to that advice myself, and when I falter I soon remember why I should have let certain issues slide in the first place.

Practice the phrase, "not my cup of tea, but whatever floats your boat..."

For all we know Kona is trolling the fuck out of us.

[SamuelBRoberts]

"Practice the phrase, "not my cup of tea, but whatever floats your boat...""

That's goofy. Would you feel the same way if I stole your shit?
If somebody swipes your wallet are you like, "Well, perhaps I'm being far more socially destructive because I banged a chick outside a bar last Friday."

[Leonard D Neubache]

Dude. Take a breath. In person I can pop someone in the nose for stealing from me. On the internet I'm limited to using caps lock and an abundance of exclamation marks. Pick your battles, because when you get into a shit slinging match it doesn't matter if you have the high ground, you're still going to end up covered in shit.

Have you got shit going on outside the forum or what? Because this is not a big thing.

[Kona]

(08-22-2016 08:43 PM)SamuelBRoberts Wrote:  

Kona isn't starving to death. He's not going to drop dead in the street without his Boston-Creme flavored yogurt.
He just doesn't want to pay for it.

If I was, would it be OK with you then?

Look, SamuelBRoberts, I wasn't trying to upset you. I apologize for that.

I just think it is hilarious that it is so easy to take things from the giant corporation Walmart. That article says Walmart spends a huge amount of money on loss prevention. You can watch all kinds of YouTube videos of Walmart security chasing down shoplifters.

They do all this loss prevention crap, then they leave a huge hole that is the self checkout.

I just think its funny. I don't think I'm robin hood. If I lead you to believe that was what I was doing, I also apologize.

I like to think I'm a funny guy, and funny stuff just makes me happy.

By the way, are you related to JJ Roberts?

Aloha!

[Cattle Rustler]

(08-22-2016 09:40 PM)Kona Wrote:  

By the way, are you related to JJ Roberts?

Shit just got real.




Also SBR, do you get upset when Walmart steals from the working/middle class? You know, when Walmart prices in food stamps and welfare into their employees final wages. Oh, and then Walmart asks the gubbmint to please let them accept EBT, then turns and markets their EBT acceptance to their employees on welfare. What a wonderful Henry Ford idea, make your workers your customers! Except Henry F at least paid their employees a decent wage.

Or when Walmart asks for tax breaks from localities in return for opening a store, robbing children of a better education because of the revenue lost to fund their school.

What about companies that Walmart asks to "one up", to lower their price or increase the quality on their items....lowering their margins?

Chill dude, we're just talking about a non-breathing pronoun that rakes in billions. No one is getting hurt and there's no reason to go on an attack on a senior member.

[Leonard D Neubache]

This is going to be a big issue in our times.

How long and hard does the corporate oligarchy have to fuck you before you decide to fuck them back, and in what form do you do it?

Personally I prefer to do my stealing directly from the government, but that's just me.