[MMM]

This thread is all I hoped it would be, and more!

[Dalaran1991]

Excellent thread.

If we are seriously considering the situation though Roosh, I don't think scaring off attackers is even an option. Somebody entering your home with a weapon and bad intents ain't gonna get scared off. Or they are in a pack.

Forget ranged weapon. Too clumsy and slow to deploy, and given the confined space if you miss the shot you are dead.

Scorpion has the best idea. A short sword and shield combo is an excellent force multiplier. If you can run to or block the doorway, your shield will easily protect you from the most harm and the attackers can't bring numbers to bear, while the stabbing sword easily pick at the enemy.

A spear is not that good for the same reason why warriors carry short sword as a back up: if they get close you are dead, and its not that effective against multiple attackers storming you.

[nomadd]

Boxing class

[Hannibal]

(03-01-2016 07:47 PM)weambulance Wrote:  

It's a trail hawk I think; I bought it at least 10 years ago. The head is probably fine, it's just wobbly on the haft (bad fit) after I beat a bunch of stuff up with it and holding the head on with a screw is chintzy to begin with.

I haven't removed the head to see if it's tapered such that I could put a proper haft on it. If it isn't, I suppose I could drill a hole through the other side of the head, wedge it onto a haft as tight as possible, and then use a solid pin to hold it all together.

The end is supposed to be tapered so the head won't fly off and the handle is oval shaped to prevent the socket (also oval shaped) from rotating when you're striking with it. The pin isn't necessary.

Tomahawks are designed that way so you can fix them with no tools in the middle of nowhere. Making a specialized handle with a wedge setup when you probably didn't have so much as a hammer was a losing proposition, but any idiot could hack a stick apart with the axe head, taper it a bit and get by.

(03-02-2016 12:41 PM)H1N1 Wrote:  

The whole 'if you don't have training then the weapon is as dangerous to you as the bad guy' shtick is a lie peddled by those who'd keep you living in fear and dependent on a non-responsive police force.

What you need is a short, effective close range weapon which only requires gross motor skills to use (bludgeoning or stabbing weapon basically) and a whole load of real bad intentions.

That tired trope always pops up. "Yeah, well the weapon is only as good as whoever is using it."

These armchair ninjas seem to think that you need 10 years of training under the wisest sensei in the land in order to figure out how to use a knife. You'd think the murder statistics in the UK would have put that to rest by now.

(03-02-2016 02:43 PM)tallglassofmilk Wrote:  

Nunchuks are surprisingly easy to learn how to use, it takes at most an afternoon.

Why would you use a specialized weapon? Use a damn baseball bat. Don't believe the hollywood hype.

It's not known exactly where nunchuks came from, but I can tell you with certainty that only the nobles practiced martial arts and the nunchuk was more fashionable than it was effective.

They, unlike bats, require training to learn how to use so you don't hit yourself in the nuts. There is also no known training system for using them.

I would put these a category below balisongs, because at least with a balisong you can stab the target after waving the weapon around and letting everyone know you have it.



You know who wins a knifefight in an elevator? It's the guy who stabs first. Not the guy who brandishes or uses the most complicated weapon.

[weambulance]

I dug out my trail hawk for a closer look.

When I removed the set screw, I pulled the head right down the haft with no problem. It didn't fall right off, but it's just a light press fit. That poor fit means the haft is a lot more likely to break from the start than a traditionally hung axe.

The head seems nice enough. I measured the socket and it tapers from about 27.5mm at the top to 25mm at the bottom. The inside of the socket is rough--it might be the paint--but there are no voids. It rings like a bell when I tap it. Too bad they drilled a hole through one of the cheeks and tapped it. I'll fill that with weld at some point I guess.

I was assuming the reason it had a set screw was because the socket wasn't tapered. Actually, it's because Cold Steel wanted to skip properly fitting the haft to cut the price down.

As to the haft itself, the grain alignment is acceptable, but not great. I like that it doesn't have some crappy varnish on it like most wood-handled tools come with. I don't like much else about it, but that's largely down to the traditional design of tomahawks. Straight grip, no palm swell, because it has to fit through the head from grip-end first... meh. The roughness/texture for gripping is okay, but it's a bit slim for my hand and I doubt it would be that easy to jerk the tomahawk back out of some enemy's body in the heat of combat. It's possible to dramatically improve the grip with some kind of wrap, I suppose.

The haft as designed is marginally easier to replace in the field than a traditional axe handle. But if I can carve a proper tomahawk handle out of a chunk of found wood, I can carve a regular axe handle too. The hardest part there is slitting the bit that goes through the eye (can't remember the proper name off the top of my head) for the wedge, but I generally carry a Sven saw with me when I'm out.

So, in conclusion I like the tomahawk head except the hole they put in it, but if I'm going to use it I'm going to hang the head on a straight axe-style handle with a light palm swell, probably like the kind of swell you'd have on a double bitted axe so I can use the hammer end too.

Edit - I just noticed the haft alone actually feels like a really nice little club.

[RonPaulStateOfMind]

If money was no object and I owned a property? In addition to having multiple weapons, I'd get:

1) Thermal Vision Goggles or Bi/Monoculars. Here is an example of it being used to see through smoke: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxB0KdARKAg

2) This is one of the sweetest sites I've found for this: http://www.smoke-screen.com/

Plus get some kind of kill switch for your electricity to keep the lights off for your advantage. Even in the worst case scenario with a group of heavily armed invaders they will have a slim chance of taking you down or beating you even if you have no gun.

[weambulance]

I'm not a nunchaku expert, but I have used them. My impression is nunchakus are more about blocking and manipulating limbs and such than swinging strikes the way they do in the movies. For one, the nunchaku isn't very heavy so while it might hurt like a bitch to get whipped with one, you're not going to break bones larger than fingers. The other problem is the swinging end tends to bounce right back off the target and it isn't easy to control. It fucking hurts to have the swinging end bounce back and nail you in the hand. They're viable weapons in skilled hands but not in the way most people think.

They're also illegal in most places I've lived.

If you have a wood stove, or a fire pit, or any other reason to keep firewood around, here's a good tool that serves as a wicked weapon in a pinch:

   

They come in different lengths, 24-30-36 inches I think, and they're about $60. Great tools for moving chunks of firewood around without killing your back bending over time and again for hours. "I just grabbed the closest thing and defended myself."

Edit - The tool above is called a hookaroon, or a pickaroon sometimes. I wouldn't bother with the wood handled varieties, the tool tips are usually too fat to work well. Logrite makes them in blue as above, and Stihl sells the same thing in orange.

[da_zeb]

(03-02-2016 12:41 PM)H1N1 Wrote:  

(03-02-2016 10:06 AM)da_zeb Wrote:  

The problem with any sort of physical weapon like a knife, axe, baseball bat, sword etc is that unless you're trained in its use, it can just as likely be turned against you.

I agree with everyone who has suggested getting a dog; however, in my opinion a large dog is overkill, as it will cost a lot more in feed, leaves bigger piles of shit and sheds more hair for little extra value since the main purpose of it is to frighten off the intruder (or at least give them pause) and to alert you so that you have time to prepare yourself to deal with the intruder, (by running away, calling law enforcement, or defending yourself). Even the friendliest dog will undergo a personality change into a vicious snarling beast if someone comes snooping around your house late at night or tries to force their way in. Unless the intruder is there specifically to injure or kill you and are well armed, they won't risk entering a home with a dog.

Pepper spray or bear spray is another good option since it doesn't require any training, and in the confined spaces of your home it will be very effective.

You can also take steps to intruder-proof your home by installing locks and deadbolts on interior doors.

The whole 'if you don't have training then the weapon is as dangerous to you as the bad guy' shtick is a lie peddled by those who'd keep you living in fear and dependent on a non-responsive police force.

What you need is a short, effective close range weapon which only requires gross motor skills to use (bludgeoning or stabbing weapon basically) and a whole load of real bad intentions.

I'm going to assume that anyone at risk of having trained killers come for them in the middle of the night is already aware of how to handle lethal scenarios, deal with trained motivated attackers and protect themselves against them.

That leaves everyone who is at risk of getting beaten up, raped or killed as part of a robbery gone wrong. This means the guys in your hallway are not there to kill you as a primary purpose, and they have not come with that outcome in mind. If you have the right attitude yourself, then you have the upper hand, because you are ready to use lethal force before they are. If you are armed, and committed to the fight, and you're not a total pussy/miserably outnumbered, then you should prevail, even against superior numbers, as confined spaces necessitate a more 1v1 style of fighting.

Ideally you'd either attack with the bad guys unawares, or draw them through a doorframe so that they have to come at you in single file. This will make a massive difference to your ability to survive the contact.

It's 3 am and you're awakened by a noise. You only went to bed at 1 am after you'd been out for a few drinks with friends. You're tired and possibly still under the influence of alcohol. You're not sure what it is you heard. It's dark. You grab your baseball bat, stumble out into the hall and the intruder, who heard you fumbling around in your bedroom shines a flashlight in your eyes blinding you. You blindly swing at him as he rushes you but the bat glances off the wall, missing his head and hitting his arm, but without sufficient force to break it. He tackles you, throwing you to the floor.

It's all very easy to play the tough guy on internet forums but in the real world you're going to be at a disadvantage because the initiative lies not with you but with the intruder. He could be bigger than you, he could be better armed. He may even have some knowledge of you and your habits.

That's why I suggested getting a dog. A dog is an intelligent alarm system. It'll ignore the tree branch brushing against the window when the wind blows. It probably won't bark at the innocent person walking down the street. It will definitely wake you though if someone tries to get in. Suddenly the initiative is no longer solely with the intruder and you have an ally who will fight to the death for you. The intruder will recognise this, and unless he's either stupid or specifically targeting you with intent to hurt you, he'll probably beat a retreat.

And pepper or bearspray is effective at a distance, will not dissipate quickly in a confined space, and doesn't take much skill or coordination.

Violence should always be the last resort for the simple reason that its unpredictable and not just in the sense that you could be hurt or killed, but that you could end up in court charged with assault or attempted murder or manslaughter. The US, with its relaxed self-defence laws is an outlier - in most countries unless it is such an open and shut case of self-defence that no conviction is possible, the injury or death of an intruder will result in charges against the homeowner. In the end you may be acquitted, but that won't get back the substantial amounts of the money and time lost to defending yourself.

[NASA Test Pilot]

Baphomet gave a solid backdrop. I would add the following. You should have some type of (offensive/defensive) plan set up for your house/apartment even with a firearm. Know what you will do in general based on a few different scenarios. Rehearse like you would rehearse something in your martial arts. Knowing how the encounter/battle might flow before you engage is a decisive advantage. Know your entry and exit points (doors, windows) as it is your home turf and use it (terrain) to your advantage. Know where the artificial barriers such as sofas, chairs, countertops, washing machines, tables, etc. are located and practice with them to maneuver and strike. The tactical advantage of knowing your terrain is for surprise and to capitalize on a movement error by your attacker since he is probably unfamiliar with the terrain. This knowledge can give you an advantage that you can translate into time that can be used to escape or for a decisive blow in order to incapacitate (mid-section or knees) or terminate (head, neck) after which you may egress.

This may sound trivial, but you need to control your adrenaline and use it in decisive moments when you have the advantage, not in panic. Learn to take even length, medium breaths in through your nose when you realize that you are in a potential confrontational /combat situation and then again before you strike. This breathing will translate into time in the course of hand to hand that you can use to your advantage.

As second choice to the greater than 300 lumen light, is to consider some type of night vision device and flipping the breakers (if you have time). Light or lack thereof will give you a decisive advantage, particularly for escape or a critical blow.

Assuming he has breached your house doors/windows and you cannot escape at first and your attacker is armed with a knife; you do not want to close the distance with him, unless you are an experienced knife fighter and even then it should be plan ´B´ as you can use the closing distance to your advantage at first. Some type of projectile weapon is best to engage at a distance like a sling shot/wrist rocket, throwing dagger(s) or even a blow gun (not as exotic as one might think). The dog serves multiple security functions such as keeping the intruder at bay, distracting the attention of the intruder so that you can move to gain a tactical advantage with the terrain in your abode (to escape, reposition or strike). If you have hard wood floors, having ball bearings or marbles (6-8) in a preplaced tubes can potentially be used to decrease the attackers maneuverability, slow him down to evade, escape or reposition yourself (but not with a dog scenario). The placement of the ball bearings/marbles can also be like a pre-positioned cache for more slingshot rounds.

You are continuously trying to convert your excess time (before hand-to-hand) to create distance in order to escape or re-position for surprise/tactical advantage in order to administer a critical blow.

For close quarters, the goal is one strike and move/egress and repeat if necessary. A hatchet is one of the most versatile for closing (throw at chest) and removing to re-engage if you need a quick second strike. The second option (an in conjunction with the hatchet) is a long knife (take the time and learn to fight with one). A solid choice is the Roman short sword as you can use it to go thrust through walls like a sword, you can remove it quicker than a sword, and a case can be made for throwing this as well.

I wholeheartedly concur with H1N1 on the Kukri; I carried one in my cockpit along with my K-bar and .45 through many trials and tribulations. I give a head nod to Going strong´s idea of the classic trench knife (I wish that it was longer and I could throw it effectively).

If you are trapped and cannot evade and some of the other items are not around and you are using non-lethal items to attempt to incapacitate, a set of Kali sticks (or police batons) are simple and effective. An everyday item would be to use a magazine and roll it up to strike. For defense, wrap a towel around your neck (into your t-shirt) and another towel wrapped around your opposing (without weapon) forearm. Another common defend/strike item is a skillet. You can use magazines with duct tape as modest body armor around the mid-section and vital organs (this takes time). If you engage a knife fighter, you should constantly try to increase the distance between you and the knife.

If someone uninvited is coming into your house with a knife (or any lethal weapon) do not count on him being scared; he might be, but to think like that will put you at a disadvantage. If you have rings of defense and he is inside one of your inner rings, I recommend a mindset of law of the jungle, not law of society.

[swoosh]

The bottem line is you want to have something effective and something that you know in your mind that if you draw it, you will be faced with the reality that you will most likey have to use it.

When I think of swords and bats and axes and all that crap, I think yes they are scary, but having to use that on another human being would be aweful and not to mention disgusting.

Think about sitting in a court of law trying to explain why you cut off an intruders arms with a katana... Good luck with that shit.

Pepper spray in a closed area had the potential to disable not only your attacker but yourself included.

A high powered stun gun might be your best option and is less than lethal. It might buy you enough time till the police arrive... Unless your attacker is on PCP.

The best defense is avoidance or an escape route.

[swoosh]

I would also like to add that everyone here has made some good points about knowing your home turf.

I have to point out though that combat is not your expertise. When the time comes and you truly identify a life threatening event, you will not be able to think, your ability to make higher decsions is greatly impaired and overcome by you're body's fight or flight response, it's natural.

So practice because muscle memory will kick in and you should be able to function at least on a basic level and carry out your rehearsed plan.

You could always move to a chiller place

[weambulance]

Someone mentioned using a powerful flashlight but I don't think a strobe feature was mentioned. Having a bright strobe pointed at your face is very disorienting. I use lights that can strobe on my AR-15s (TLR-1s), but I don't have a handheld strobing flashlight that I can recommend. The Foursevens Quark Smart QSL is probably okay. I have a Foursevens Mini I keep in my jacket and it's been very reliable.

The key point with such a light is you want to be able to turn the strobe on with one button push, and not have to cycle through different modes to get there.

I like the concept of things like bright LED distraction balls. The idea is you'd roll them down a hall or in a room to draw the invader's eye for a second or two, giving you the initiative to do something. But nothing I've seen on the market seems worth buying. The less expensive ones have poor reviews, and the good ones are crazy expensive. I'll probably try making my own someday. Just put together a simple LED circuit that will strobe, or strobe for a few seconds then stay on, etc and cast it in clear silicone rubber.

[Vos]

I haven't personally tried this, but I bring it to the table 'cause I recently heard about someone who did do this for his home:

Bit of a DIY, but the guy got a cheap wiffle ball bat and filled about 2/3 of it with Quikrete or something.

Pros: Probably will catch attacker off guard, okay range, blunt force
Cons: Won't scare off attacker, sturdiness?

This is mainly for luring your attacker into a false sense of security. Again, not sure how effective it is since I haven't personally tried it.

[Rush87]

BUT LOL… Being serious, I would probably buy a taser and some hand cuffs. I would never want to hack or shoot someone. It would probably traumatise me for life. Plus, with a taser and handcuffs, it would be very easy to articulate your story to the police/courts.

[nomadd]

Is taser legal in the USA?

[Suits]

The best solution is often the simplest.

Just invite Little Dark to move in as your flatmate.

[Moto]

I have a machete from the corner hardware store. It basically feels like a light Chinese broadsword with a short handle. I'm trained in the broadsword. However it really is a hacking weapon. It does not take the skill required of a Katana, for example, to use effectively.





I would also be fine with, or suggest an oak dowel (can be found in many hardware stores for use as mailbox posts). Make sure the grain is going the long way. In my old kung fu school we would carve these up into battle "canes" and train similarly to swords. For me a 3 ft dowel is perfect. You want a 1 inch diameter, but you can go bigger for more weight but less speed/ ease at changing direction. I'd take a "straight cane" over a baseball bat. Better for close quarters. There are many attacks aside from a home-run swing.

[Phoenix]

(03-03-2016 07:38 AM)Suits Wrote:  

The best solution is often the simplest.

Just invite Little Dark to move in as your flatmate.

No way the cops are going to accept using Little Dark is "reasonable force".

[ms224]

These guys might have some answers that you seek.

So yea, invite the girls over to show your garden.

[Dalaran1991]

(03-03-2016 07:38 AM)Suits Wrote:  

The best solution is often the simplest.

Just invite Little Dark to move in as your flatmate.

What if one day he tells you to "go home"? Where would you go then?

[El Chinito loco]

Crossbows are a horrible home defense weapon. They were originally designed for castle siege defense and to dismount horsemen which is far different. Home defense you would be fucked if you had one chance to hit someone in a narrow corridor in close quarters with a crossbow and then you had to reload.

The surveillance system is pretty good advice as a deterrant. You can have lots of fake but convincing looking cam mounts at various points too

Lightweight kevlar. I'm surprised noone recommended this yet. You hear some fucktard climbing in your window? Throw on your vest and grab your combat knife. Chances are if they don't have a firearm you'll be at an advantage in that fight.

Various fogger type chemical sprays are good. If you really think you are going to get mobbed you could also buy a few of these puppies and invest in a gas mask. If multiple shitheads mob you just pop smoke and put on your mask and then bail as they gag on fumes.

[robreke]

Samurai sword:

[Razgriz]

It would seem to be that a plain old hammer would do the trick. Small enough to easily weild and if it has the claw on the back side that's definitely going to have a bite. They are super common in the home for the "it's just what I grabbed". I don't think I know anyone who doesn't already own one of these. You can get them in all sizes and various weights and at any local hardware store.

[Running Turtles]

I agree with the suggestion to have pepper spray or CS gas and a stun gun/taser. People are suggesting plenty of cool weapons, but none of which would you be able to take with you. If you stay in apartments, having a couple of small cameras hidden around probably wouldn't hurt should you need a lawyer.

As mentioned before, most weapons mentioned are illegal in Europe and pepper sprays and extendable batons are illegal in Norway (CS Gas is legal).

[Deepdiver]

If you are in a neighborhood where their guard animals can EAT your guard animals you are in the wrong effing place!