[YoungAngel1]

Ok, so I've been in a relationship for about 5 months, with a pretty cool girl. Smart, educated, with a banging body. She also treats me as well as anyone I've ever dated, constantly cooks and cleans. So, this morning, I helped her move with her lil brother and mom. The lil bro really does seem like a good guy. Very passive, soft spoken, and sensitive. He's a 25 yr old man living at home with his mom, and suffers from psychosis from Drug use. while moving, I noticed how his sister and mother treated him like a worthless POS. his sister would constantly degrade him every time he made a mistake, and his mother was just brutal towards him. This went on for the entire move. Dude pretty much had no confidence in what he was doing, I suppose because growing up, his sister and mother never gave him confidence. So, into the move I asked him, who he would vote for in the upcoming election, and you guessed it, this dude said Hillary, because he was raised by women. This is a man that has no father figure in his life whatsoever. Who knows, maybe he just got shitty genetics from nature, but nurture played a huge part in his soft demeanor. While his sister was riding him, I tried to stick up for him, but i don't think he even wanted it.

It was so brutal, that I really wanted to leave. A naturally good guy getting dominated and treated like shit by his mother/sister. I'm pretty sure his confidence is shot.

It was a realization straight in my face. Just wanted to get that off my chest...

[Remington]

If you are that concerned, take him under your wing and continue being a good guy to him. Who knows how he is treated at home if his mother and sister belittle him in front of you like that. Take him out for a drink and treat him like a human being. Don't get into the mix between him and the mother and sister, just be a friend and make him feel good about himself.


Edit: This thread made me depressed and ruined my buzz.

[OregonToSoCal]

This is probably the wrong advice to take since I'm sure the consensus of the forum is to not get involved with him, not stick up for him and enjoy banging the girl but if it were me I wouldn't be able to bite me tongue and would call her out on why she and her mom treats him like shit. Something along the lines of "why are you always busting "Timmy's" balls on everything?"

Honestly, seeing something like that would kill all interest I have in seeing this girl ever again. Probably because I can identify with being that kid. My upbringing and environment wasn't nearly that harsh but I was the quiet, sensitive kid who often times ended up being the target of teasing and bullying. Now when I see something like that it incites rage in me.

If I don't respect how a woman I'm seeing treats other people, especially her family, she has no place in my life. Instant hard next.

[PapayaTapper]

^^^^EDIT: I wrote the following before seeing OTSC's post above.


When I was in 8th grade I used to walk home with a group of buddies because it was more fun and cooler than riding the bus. Plus we'd almost always get into adventures / mischief by cutting through the apt complex, shopping center, stop at the 7/11, etc...shit 12 yo's do

My best friend at the time was a kid nicknamed Bugsy (I dont remember exactly how he got that nickname but he was pretty much our group leader and considered a badaass at school)

One day we were walking home after school and cut through the woods and along a small creek when we came across a raccoon eating something on the other bank. We were all pretty excited about it and trying not to scare it.

I dont remember exactly how it happened but I do remember how it made me feel. Bugsy picked up a rock, threw it and somehow managed to hit the racoon. Whether from pain, or fear, but probably both the damn thing sprang up let out a squeal, and ran off.

I remember getting so pissed off my vision literally went red (over the years I've learned that "seeing red" is not just an expression...it's a real thing). Long story short I screamed "you mother fucker!" at Bugsy, bum rushed him, tackled him and generally pummeled the shit out of him until a couple of the other kids pulled me off of him. He avoided me from that point forward all the way through high school

The point of this is your story OP brought up a bit of that rage in me. I can't stand to see the defenseless be it human or animal, picked on, bullied or otherwise taken advantage of. I obviously dont know anything other than what you've shared but my sense is the mom probably drove the dad away and her daughter is just mimicking her mom. Whatever... this isn't ok. The fact that it's this poor chode's own family makes it even worse.

I know you probably don't want to fuck up your relationship with your GF or meddle in other people's affairs. That's perfectly understandable.

But there's a saying that comes to mind: "Your character is the only thing you can see when your left standing in the dark" (sic). I've always thought it meant, that doing the right thing when not doing it is easier is a measure of one's character

I hope you can find a way to help that guy.

[robreke]

If she treats her brother like that, it means it's within her capability to eventually treat or attempt to treat, her own man like that, not to mention her future kids like that.

Kindness is a immutable character quality and so is meanness.

I'd think hard about a LTR with a woman like this. Has she ever exhibited anything, even fleeting, like this to you?

[kaotic]

(11-20-2015 07:07 PM)robreke Wrote:  

If she treats her brother like that, it means it's within her capability to eventually treat or attempt to treat, her own man like that, not to mention her future kids like that.

Kindness is a immutable character quality and so is meanness.

I'd think hard about a LTR with a woman like this. Has she ever exhibited anything, even fleeting, like this to you?

Bingo, what I was going for, if she's that shitty of a person to her OWN brother, whose next in the line, especially when you piss her off ?

Actions speak louder than words.

Your LTR with her sounds solid.....for now. There also other things in the picture you probably aren't seeing. Get as much info as you can on the brother (without sounding nosy).

Offer to take her bro out, get to know and see if he's worth helping out. This world has enough pummeled males and the lack of brothers in arm.

[olive]

YoungAngel1,
as per robreke kaotic, don't be surprised the day your LTR turns to maxi bitch on you for whatever reason. as you've seen it's in her after all...

Remington's advice is conditional ("IF YOU'RE SO CONCERNED then ...") but what follows is not a good idea. don't do it. tried too many times now:

you can't export democracy to lands where it can't live.
likewise, you can't export balls to bodies where it can't live. you will just waste time or worse in the process.

if you're in the mood and wish to do some good in the area of helping youngsters grow balls, offer your help to those who have shown the initial premise of overthrowing the tyranny. on that kind of body, exported balls can grow and prosper.

[YoungAngel1]

Thanks for all the comments guys

As for my, LTR, she's bout as traditional as it gets when it comes to gender roles. We've talked about it many times, she's all for me being the lead, and she taking a step back. She even packs my lunch everyday. That's why I was so shocked earlier today how she was treating her bro. I did ask her why she treated him like that tonight, and apparently it comes from hurtful things that he has sad while he was in psychosis.

Honestly, I would be shocked if she turned on me. Maybe I would've gotten beaten down 3 yrs ago, but I'm a new man after being on this forum for a year.

[RockHard]

(11-20-2015 09:25 PM)YoungAngel1 Wrote:  

I did ask her why she treated him like that tonight, and apparently it comes from hurtful things that he has sad while he was in psychosis.

Yeah, and that makes it OK for her and her mom to trash the guy? I think that says a lot about her ability to forgive people. The guy was going through a medical condition, for chrissakes. So when she's PMSing and says something snippy, that gives you the right to trash her?

Something's missing from this story though. You're saying that it's because he was raised by women, but then there's some history of drug use - she's saying that his drug use turned him mean, but maybe his drug use is because of how he was treated when he was younger, and the "hurtful" stuff he said was his inner self speaking the truth when his self-control was down. People who are in oppressive situations will bottle up their resentment as a survival skill but then it blows up at times when they're too vulnerable to maintain their self control. Could be when they're tired or drunk, seems like some kind of drug induced psychosis would do the trick.

I would be very careful. Mom & daughter sound like they could be a pair of vampires. I'd take a "strong confident" woman who's at least honest in her intentions over a sociopath pretending to be a "traditional red pill woman". If you want to get serious with her, I'd figure out this brother situation first.

[Captain Gh]

(11-20-2015 09:25 PM)YoungAngel1 Wrote:  

Thanks for all the comments guys

Honestly, I would be shocked if she turned on me. Maybe I would've gotten beaten down 3 yrs ago, but I'm a new man after being on this forum for a year.

I hope you're right on this one because it seems that you got in a LTR right after coming here, so it sounds that you never went through that frivolous time. And you sound extremely invested in this chick. Every time I hear a guy say "I would be shocked if my girl did"... then I simply hope the best for them!

A lot of veteran here can tell you that girls can turn on you just like that, so while being confident, you gotta have a low level of skepticism about her, all the while loving her. Not trying to scare you OP so keep doing what you're doing. Just be careful cause it sounds that you've idealize your relationship just a tad too much with this chick

[Dr. Howard]

(11-20-2015 07:07 PM)robreke Wrote:  

If she treats her brother like that, it means it's within her capability to eventually treat or attempt to treat, her own man like that, not to mention her future kids like that.

Kindness is a immutable character quality and so is meanness.

I'd think hard about a LTR with a woman like this. Has she ever exhibited anything, even fleeting, like this to you?

I would also begin to back away from this woman as an LTR prospect. For me, the #1 thing that I need in a wife is compassion as a trait. I don't need a woman around, or support when I am healthy, wealthy and successful. My money and energy can provide support to get shit done. I need a wife for support when i get ill or broken down, a compassionate woman will be there but a spiteful and judgemental one will just point out your faults or what you did wrong to hit the bottom and walk on you.

Manufacture a crisis that is your fault and see how this chick reacts. Pretend you've been fired (when you've really just taken vacation) and see what happens. I'm going to bank on her snubbing you vs. being compassionate.

PS, you said 'her and her mom and bro' where is her father?

[Direct or subtle]

A 25 yr old man " who would vote for ... Hillary " can't be saved, in my experience. At sixteen or eighteen, yes, but at 25 yo, good luck with mending and saving his mind, life habits, instincts, personality..

[LINUX]

Yea, DOS is right , it might be too late for him. But you should still try. People who have mental issues often make the best friends. I have very few friends who haven't been classified with some sort of disorder. I have one bipolar dude who calls me all the time and says " hey Linux , you dead yet?" And I usually reply with " which personality am I talking to today ?" We get along great and party all the time.

[Alpha_Romeo]

Maybe you cannot turn his life around, really that is up to him to decide and take action on his own. But for the love of God, could you at least talk him into voting for someone else? Anyone, really. Anyone. But. Hillary.

[WestIndianArchie]

Society sees a weak woman, and wants to protect her.
Society sees a weak man and wants to crush him.

As for what to do with your LTR who treats her own family like that, take it as a reminder that is your fate if you fail to measure up in her eyes.

Now a lot of guys want to focus on the fact that this is her own brother, but the red pill pretty much teaches us that "sentiment" "loyalty" "honor" - those are male concepts and ideas.

Women only talk about those things when they want to bind YOU to their will.

Indeed, the people who talk about it the most, are the ones who want you to do their bidding. (Managers, Owners, Investors, Politicians, Religious leaders)

The Red Pill should make you suspicious of "Values".

But when I see folks talk about Red Pill, and raising their children Red Pill, Red Pill women, Red Pill politics - it's like they want to forget that the Red Pill is about survival of the fittest, law of the jungle, each man for himself.

Cooperation only if everyone benefits, and most of the time all the participants are shaking hands with the left and a knife in the right.

That's no way to run a relationship, run a family, run a society - but that's the duality that we all deal with on a daily basis.

WIA

[eatthishomie]

(11-21-2015 11:07 AM)Direct or subtle Wrote:  

A 25 yr old man " who would vote for ... Hillary " can't be saved, in my experience. At sixteen or eighteen, yes, but at 25 yo, good luck with mending and saving his mind, life habits, instincts, personality..

I mean, I took the red pill at 32 after a lifetime of being a beta.

It is possible to change at any time.

[GlobalMan]

I think this fact:

"suffers from psychosis from Drug use"

makes it difficult to take away anything meaningful from either his own thoughts or how his family treat him. Who knows what kind of bullshit he's put the family through prior to your acquaintance.

It's very possible they treat him like a "worthless POS" because for such a long period of time he was, and they are used to having to treat him like a baby because he has constantly made bad choices and can't take care of himself, again, possibly severely affecting the family.

[YoungAngel1]

I'm happy to say that after confronting her about this dilemma I was having, she seemed to be in agreement with what I said about uplifting, and actually supporting her brother, and not putting him down, and using shaming as a technique. He actually came over on Sunday, and she was a lot more kind.

Ironically, for whatever reason, she shit tested me a couple of times this past weekend challenging my authority. I was able to maintain frame, and push back. I guess you can say, for the first time I realized that the game never actually stops. I will continue to be tested, and can never be too comfortable.

[Off The Reservation]

OP
C'mon lets hear the other red flags.

[cascadecombo]

Like with any story there has to be more that we aren't hearing, and even more that you don't know. The kid could have been completely fucked up back when he was a little younger and buried himself in that place he is now. However:

What I do hear though is you got a chick you're into and will probably have more interactions with the guy. Like some of the other dudes here have said, I too would want to be a positive influence in the guys life for as long as I'm around. Who knows how much longer you and that girl will be a thing, but if you plan on a future that guy could use a positive influence.

I've got a friend raised by a single mother, who loves the dude but the lack of a father still fucked him up a bit mentally. He can pull anything but after that he tends to fuck himself over a lot and the shit takes a toll on him. Since I moved out of the states I now get the occasion facebook/skype message from him asking for help or someone to talk to. I can't say the advice I give him is always perfect or even the best thing for him, but I think he happy to know that he's got a buddy out there who cares.

If there is anything you'd wanna do for that guy, I'd say just be his friend and show him what he could become. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. But don't forget, Monkey see monkey do.

[olive]

You can take whatever pill you want, whenever you want - nobody challenges that. In fact it's not uncommon a case to turn your life around after a failed marriage /LTR and decide 'fuq all da bitches'.

What we are saying is, it's difficult to EXTERNALLY change someone at 25. If the change is coming from within never too late.

Hence the you can't export democracy to Iraq quote earlier in thread. It just won't stick.

OP can't help (and change) that 25 year old dude unless he helps himself.

[Turnus]

I would be very wary about committing to anything serious with this chick. Look at how she treated her own brother. What happens when your 2-3 years into a relationship, the newness has worn off, and she doesn't like the way you do something around the house. She's already shown her true colors.

[TexasJock]

Just by posting your concern, your gut instinct is telling you something. I'd listen to that. Not knowing where the father is in all of this , unless he's dead, one has to wonder if he was driven off. Where this guy is at in his life right now you could be the influence he has needed.

Im sure with the knowledge of the past drug abuse and being treated in the manner he is, his self esteem is probably tanked and could very well benefit from some kind of interaction with you. It's never too late to help someone and while we can't save everyone, we can do what we can when we see someone in need.
Good luck to ya.

[duedue]

(11-20-2015 07:07 PM)robreke Wrote:  

If she treats her brother like that, it means it's within her capability to eventually treat or attempt to treat, her own man like that, not to mention her future kids like that.

Kindness is a immutable character quality and so is meanness.

I'd think hard about a LTR with a woman like this. Has she ever exhibited anything, even fleeting, like this to you?

Nope, women and people in general can get abusive and condescending if you let them. The reason she's not been abusive to the OP, yet, is that he's not let her, because he's demonstrated high value. I've had times when I was depressed and notices that people were more condescending and abusive, even cashier girls who are paid to be nice to you. (But there were other times when I was not in a good mood and so were offhand with a hired gun and then realized that she became more respectful from then on.)

This is said in different ways in manosphere. One version is that "Women don't respect a man who respects them". I bet my money if the brother becomes an asshole overnight his mother and sister would become much more respectful. Just think how many ways there are in which he can cause them trouble.

This is basically
LAW 17) "Keep others in suspended terror --- cultivate an air of unpredictability!"

P.S. Just notices WIA said it better.

[Cobra]

Firstly, good ol' "Timmy" has my vote for forum beta, but yes at the end of the day he may be a guardian angel flyingin to save the OP from a potential harmful relationship.

If I were you OP, take him under your wing and learn as much as you can about his sister and the family. This is a win win.