[Feldeinsamkeit]

(02-13-2015 09:11 AM)Deluge Wrote:  

Australian dudes are trapped in a vicious cycle, we are outgoing and tall but a lot of the girls are busted and fat. So we all have to hit the gym hard to boost our standing, but that only skews everything even more and it becomes race to the bottom. Maybe in some FSU Industrial shithole the dynamics are the opposite, why take care of yourself when you can dress like a gopnik and still land cute girls?

I've had exactly the same thought with regard to British women. It's shocking to see ever more cases of tall, muscular and well-built guys with not just frumpy, but outright fat girlfriends. And, yes, it is a vicious circle, since the more guys have to compete for these broads, the less pressure there is going to be on the women to keep to even a minimum standard of physical or personal attractiveness, developing into an ever downward spiral. In the UK it suffices for a woman to be moderately overweight to be sure of a boyfriend. If she happens to be slim, the competition for them is through the roof, even for older gals.

As for that industrial shithole in far-flung FSU territory, such places exist in abundance and it is the very same dynamic as described above, the only difference being it's the guys who can sit back and let the girls do the work.

Lord, I really curse every day I'm still stuck in the UK, it's killing my soul being stuck here. But, yes, I've heard from many different sources that Aussie women are as bad as US and UK women.

[Adrenaline]

Spot on about Australia. Women have some terrible genetics and lifestyle choices see them go downhill fast. I wouldn't say a lot of the guys here have classic model good looks but the majority of the younger generation are definitely tall and jacked. I'm somewhere between 5'11-6'0 and often feel like a dwarf. Most girls don't go for "pretty boys" here anyway so being tall and jacked are probably the main weapons in being successful. I do consider myself to have "pretty boy" features and have been asked to model a couple of times, which can either work to my advantage or disadvantage depending on the type of woman. There is a market for my type of look but a lot of women straight out refuse to be with a guy who is "prettier" than her and so many end up going for the average looking cavemen types.

Just typing this makes me realise how much I hate the gender dynamics here, even though I love everything else about the country.

[Deluge]

Australian girls are better looking than British girls, no one would deny that. People are really bad when it comes to telling height, everyone thinks they're taller than they actually are and only the tall people they see stick in their minds. The average young (18-24) Aussie guy is 5'10. And I don't know where the cavemen over pretty boys thing came from, sounds like you need to hang out with higher class girls.

[Adrenaline]

(02-13-2015 11:13 PM)Deluge Wrote:  

Australian girls are better looking than British girls, no one would deny that. People are really bad when it comes to telling height, everyone thinks they're taller than they actually are and only the tall people they see stick in their minds. The average young (18-24) Aussie guy is 5'10. And I don't know where the cavemen over pretty boys thing came from, sounds like you need to hang out with higher class girls.

I measured my height so I know for a fact I'm around that mark. That's an average so for every 6'3-6'4 guy you could have a 5'6-5'7 guy and it could still bring the average to 5'10. Doesn't mean there aren't a shitload of tall men in the country.

Who are these higher class girls you speak of? The Australian culture doesn't breed such a species. The only classy girls I've met are imported from other countries (Greeks, Italians, Serbians etc). Australian girls are masculine and insecure as fuck, hence not wanting to be with someone who outshines them physically.

[MarcusAbbertini]

(02-13-2015 11:33 AM)Feldeinsamkeit Wrote:  

(02-13-2015 09:11 AM)Deluge Wrote:  

Australian dudes are trapped in a vicious cycle, we are outgoing and tall but a lot of the girls are busted and fat. So we all have to hit the gym hard to boost our standing, but that only skews everything even more and it becomes race to the bottom. Maybe in some FSU Industrial shithole the dynamics are the opposite, why take care of yourself when you can dress like a gopnik and still land cute girls?

I've had exactly the same thought with regard to British women. It's shocking to see ever more cases of tall, muscular and well-built guys with not just frumpy, but outright fat girlfriends. And, yes, it is a vicious circle, since the more guys have to compete for these broads, the less pressure there is going to be on the women to keep to even a minimum standard of physical or personal attractiveness, developing into an ever downward spiral. In the UK it suffices for a woman to be moderately overweight to be sure of a boyfriend. If she happens to be slim, the competition for them is through the roof, even for older gals.

As for that industrial shithole in far-flung FSU territory, such places exist in abundance and it is the very same dynamic as described above, the only difference being it's the guys who can sit back and let the girls do the work.

Lord, I really curse every day I'm still stuck in the UK, it's killing my soul being stuck here. But, yes, I've heard from many different sources that Aussie women are as bad as US and UK women.

I'm in currently in one of the worst cities in the UK; Coventry. You can walk around the city centre for an hour and not see any female above a 6. It is a pretty dire state of affairs but when I do see a solid 8 it makes it all the more exciting to make her part of the rotation. Guys around here have zero game and look like a bag of sh*t so just approaching is usually more than enough.

The point I'm trying to make it is it's easy to just sit here and read negative threads about the UK and justify your short comings with women on logistics. I'm not saying anyone in this thread has that problem I'm just airing out some thoughts. You can swap the UK with any major western country.

Even in the biggest dives in the UK you can still have huge success because every guy is terrible when it comes to women. You just need to stay positive and keep improving yourself. Then when you finally do go to places with a higher 'BDT' it will be that much easier.

[Deluge]

(02-14-2015 02:26 AM)Adrenaline Wrote:  

(02-13-2015 11:13 PM)Deluge Wrote:  

Australian girls are better looking than British girls, no one would deny that. People are really bad when it comes to telling height, everyone thinks they're taller than they actually are and only the tall people they see stick in their minds. The average young (18-24) Aussie guy is 5'10. And I don't know where the cavemen over pretty boys thing came from, sounds like you need to hang out with higher class girls.

I measured my height so I know for a fact I'm around that mark. That's an average so for every 6'3-6'4 guy you could have a 5'6-5'7 guy and it could still bring the average to 5'10. Doesn't mean there aren't a shitload of tall men in the country.

Who are these higher class girls you speak of? The Australian culture doesn't breed such a species. The only classy girls I've met are imported from other countries (Greeks, Italians, Serbians etc). Australian girls are masculine and insecure as fuck, hence not wanting to be with someone who outshines them physically.

You think Wog girls are classy? Jesus. Wog girls are almost as trashy as bogan girls, only difference is Wog girls are hotter. From the caveman comment and that, it sounds like you need to go for more girls from a higher socioeconomic background. The wealthier they are, the hotter and thinner the girls are and the less muscular, less tattooed and less confident the guys are. The guys are more attractive in some ways (face, height, style) but overall they're much weaker competition.

If you hang out in lower class and average venues, you've got the worst quality with the strongest competition. It's a fucking shit show. Now there are some "elite" super hard to get into venues where the girls are super hot local "models" and the guys are all tall, jacked and well-dressed, but the generally the better the girls the weaker the dudes and that's true of any good niche here. That's the secret to doing well in Australia.

[Feldeinsamkeit]

Has anybody on here experience of the Austrian dating market? Do Austrian guys often date down, like in the UK?

[JWLZG]

(02-15-2016 06:54 AM)Feldeinsamkeit Wrote:  

Has anybody on here experience of the Austrian dating market? Do Austrian guys often date down, like in the UK?

You've asked the same question in another thread and it's been answered for you likewise. You need to stop using "Anglosphere dating market" filters to cultures that are hardly comparable.

[Feldeinsamkeit]

(02-15-2016 07:36 AM)JWLZG Wrote:  

(02-15-2016 06:54 AM)Feldeinsamkeit Wrote:  

Has anybody on here experience of the Austrian dating market? Do Austrian guys often date down, like in the UK?

You've asked the same question in another thread and it's been answered for you likewise. You need to stop using "Anglosphere dating market" filters to cultures that are hardly comparable.

Actually, I've received quite contradictory accounts of how Austria compares to the UK and other Anglosphere societies, hence my renewed question here. I really need to find out how thirsty Austria guys are versus those in the UK, since I'm going out of my mind here with the UK dating market and am now seriously considering taking the plunge into Austria and need more intel on this.

[rudebwoy]

How does this relate to you?

So what if Austrian guys are thirsty, it doesn't mean the women will be receptive to you.

[Feldeinsamkeit]

(02-15-2016 01:26 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

How does this relate to you?

So what if Austrian guys are thirsty, it doesn't mean the women will be receptive to you.

If the SMP there is as bad as the UK is for men, then I'll give it a miss and maybe look to the Czech Republic instead.

[spalex]

You can definitely date up. No question about it. But you may get sick of putting in the effort.

A lot of my mates here are dating up massively. But in this case, they met their Polish bird abroad. Then they came here to get drunk, fuck party on the cheap and have a cool live abroad experience like most of us have.

But once you're here and you are looking for new girls, it can be really hit and miss. Sometime you will find some amazing looking girls who are willing to date some local spuds, but they won't speak conversational English.
Most of the time you will meet decent looking girls that speak conversational English. But most of these girls have lived abroad or they are a little more intelligent, or they are onto your shit and take a bit more gaming.
Which is why I think it is easy to get jaded in Poland. I know that I am over it after 1.5 years. Maybe I am just getting lazy. Maybe it is just the fact that I live in a small city filled with lower class people.

Either way. The opportunity is there for the taking. But it takes more effort than what most sexual refugees will have you believe.


And on Aussie girls... Is there a minus scale for the busted dudes test? They are fucking dog-shit. I went back home over xmas and new years. The getting fit culture has boomed like crazy since I was gone. It's like every second or third guy is on steroids and dressing in rags to show off his muscles. Where the girls have just decided its too hard and covered themselves in tattooes to make themselves look different (not better).
Holy fuck, I am so glad that I am not single in Sydney anymore.
Also someone mentioned Aussy guys in Thailand. Holy fuck! Imagine going there with you 3/10 girlfriend! I would rather sit at home and do nothing than put myself through that misery.

[Feldeinsamkeit]

(02-15-2016 01:58 PM)spalex Wrote:  

You can definitely date up. No question about it. But you may get sick of putting in the effort.

A lot of my mates here are dating up massively. But in this case, they met their Polish bird abroad. Then they came here to get drunk, fuck party on the cheap and have a cool live abroad experience like most of us have.

But once you're here and you are looking for new girls, it can be really hit and miss. Sometime you will find some amazing looking girls who are willing to date some local spuds, but they won't speak conversational English.
Most of the time you will meet decent looking girls that speak conversational English. But most of these girls have lived abroad or they are a little more intelligent, or they are onto your shit and take a bit more gaming.
Which is why I think it is easy to get jaded in Poland. I know that I am over it after 1.5 years. Maybe I am just getting lazy. Maybe it is just the fact that I live in a small city filled with lower class people.

Either way. The opportunity is there for the taking. But it takes more effort than what most sexual refugees will have you believe.

Haha, "sexual refugee" - in that formulation I truly recognize myself and my predicament here in the UK for the first time!

But I don't mind putting in some effort, since things for me in the UK have just become ridiculous of late. Since improving my posture and appearance, I do get eye fucked on the street fairly frequently, often by quite young women (I'm a 41-year old fart, BTW), but I find it very hard to connect with British women having previously dated mostly European and other foreign women, largely due to their vapid personalities and entitled attitudes.

You speak about Poland but I was thinking more of Czech Republic as my pussy asylum. Do you know how CR compares with Poland, as far as guys dating up or down is concerned?

[rudebwoy]

(02-15-2016 01:48 PM)Feldeinsamkeit Wrote:  

(02-15-2016 01:26 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

How does this relate to you?

So what if Austrian guys are thirsty, it doesn't mean the women will be receptive to you.

If the SMP there is as bad as the UK is for men, then I'll give it a miss and maybe look to the Czech Republic instead.

My suggestion to you is raise your value at home. Sounds cliche but be the best you can be, work on yourself first.

There is no magical place where girls will swoon over you, unless we are talking other continents like Asia or Latin America.

Czech Republic and Poland have been ravaged already, women there know their value. A few years back I dated an attractive single mom from Czech Republic, she got crazy offers from guys all over the place.

I will also say to get the best out of these places, you have to be living there or have the ability to spend a month there at a time.

[rudebwoy]

[/quote]

Do you know how CR compares with Poland, as far as guys dating up or down is concerned?
[/quote]

I think you are missing the point.

Whether the local guys date up or down, has no bearing on you.

You should be more concerned about your "foreign status" and how you will be percieved.

[Feldeinsamkeit]

(02-15-2016 02:09 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

(02-15-2016 01:48 PM)Feldeinsamkeit Wrote:  

(02-15-2016 01:26 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

How does this relate to you?

So what if Austrian guys are thirsty, it doesn't mean the women will be receptive to you.

If the SMP there is as bad as the UK is for men, then I'll give it a miss and maybe look to the Czech Republic instead.

My suggestion to you is raise your value at home. Sounds cliche but be the best you can be, work on yourself first.

There is no magical place where girls will swoon over you, unless we are talking other continents like Asia or Latin America.

Czech Republic and Poland have been ravaged already, women there know their value. A few years back I dated an attractive single mom from Czech Republic, she got crazy offers from guys all over the place.

I will also say to get the best out of these places, you have to be living there or have the ability to spend a month there at a time.

Yes, I fully agree that a man always needs to work to improve his own SMV regardless of where he is living and should never rest on his laurels, should he find himself having any, that is.

But does your point also apply to those women who haven't travelled much outside of their home country, e.g., those who haven't lived in the Anglosphere? I can imagine that a young woman living in Prague, especially if she's on a social whoring platform, will get international sausage mail on a daily basis, but what about some girl from the sticks, say in Jihlava, who only has the meatheads swigging pivo in the local tavern to choose from? Don't you think you need to differentiate between cases, here?

[rudebwoy]

^My ex lived in a small village near the german border, at the time she was on myspace. So I don't think it matters, as long as she has internet access she will get attention.

The problem with small towns is that the english proficiency will be low. So unless you plan on picking up the local language then you are no further ahead.

Places like Russia and FSU, give you more options if you are willing to learn the lingo.

[Tactician]

I love the Busted Dudes test as a quick way to gauge gender ratios.

What I want to know is how the availability of prostitution correlates to the Busted Dudes test.

In the Anglosphere, with a few exceptions, prostitution is either illegal or very expensive for the average man to have access to, and the whores are often very mediocre.

My idea is that the ease of access to P4P places a ton of pressure on women to not only be sexy, but to also be at least a bit feminine, since men have an outlet to vent their sexual frustrations and have less reason to put up with any particular woman's shit, whether that be her physical attractiveness or her personality.

For example, I was with a buddy in Thailand many years ago and a prostitute offered me sex for about $5 USD (200 baht) - the price of a cheeseburger. I turned her (her???) down, but that night definitely put things in perspective with regards to the thirst in the West and the amount of money guys will waste trying to get scraps from women many of us wouldn't even take a second glance at.

*Disclaimer: I'm not advocating P4P, I'm just saying that it's mere presence provides competition which removes the monopoly on pussy that non-prostitute women would otherwise hold. This leads to less thirst in a society since men have the hooker option in the back of their mind, which then leads to less entitled, and, consequently, better overall behavior and appearance from women.

The men don't have to use P4P. It still gets men thinking, "is she better than a hooker?"

Edit: Really good sex-bots would probably have a similar effect in reducing thirst even though I'd never use that shit.

[zuma]

(02-12-2015 07:13 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

Btw, is there a reason so many Slavic guys have those boot camp hair cuts? Do they think it's gay to grow their hair out a bit like in the west?

Having polish friends, here are the answers:

- Polish guys loose very fast their hair, therefore they prefer to be bald than to have kind of clearance in hair
- Winter/cold days are quiet long in Poland, meaning you will wear a cap 6 months per year. Some guys prefer to be bald or very short hair to avoid hair scratching or this kind of stuff
- shampoo is expensive in Poland (in comparison to other products/cost of life). Being bald save a lot of money
- Saving money on hairdresser
- Polish guys have a low sense of fashion, they don't care about it and prefer to have very short hair to avoid doing stylish things with their hair
- Hooligan stuff, but it's a minority

Anyway, from the picture the polish girl is a low 6 according to polish standard.

[rudebwoy]

(02-15-2016 03:35 PM)Tactician Wrote:  

I love the Busted Dudes test as a quick way to gauge gender ratios.

What I want to know is how the availability of prostitution correlates to the Busted Dudes test.

In the Anglosphere, with a few exceptions, prostitution is either illegal or very expensive for the average man to have access to, and the whores are often very mediocre.

My idea is that the ease of access to P4P places a ton of pressure on women to not only be sexy, but to also be at least a bit feminine, since men have an outlet to vent their sexual frustrations and have less reason to put up with any particular woman's shit, whether that be her physical attractiveness or her personality.

For example, I was with a buddy in Thailand many years ago and a prostitute offered me sex for about $5 USD (200 baht) - the price of a cheeseburger. I turned her (her???) down, but that night definitely put things in perspective with regards to the thirst in the West and the amount of money guys will waste trying to get scraps from women many of us wouldn't even take a second glance at.

*Disclaimer: I'm not advocating P4P, I'm just saying that it's mere presence provides competition which removes the monopoly on pussy that non-prostitute women would otherwise hold. This leads to less thirst in a society since men have the hooker option in the back of their mind, which then leads to less entitled, and, consequently, better overall behavior and appearance from women.

The men don't have to use P4P. It still gets men thinking, "is she better than a hooker?"

Edit: Really good sex-bots would probably have a similar effect in reducing thirst even though I'd never use that shit.

I will have to disagree with this.

There are a ton of strip clubs, massage parlors and backpage motel whores in my city. The quality in my local strip club is so poor now that I find myself looking at the bartenders and waitresses.

All these establishments cater to men with different budgets.

This has not made the women any more feminine in my city, probably made it worse.

As for the Thailand example - how much did it cost you to travel there from Canada? Not exactly a cheap trip.

A better example would be Sweden and Iceland, both of them have outlawed prostitution. I believe Iceland restricted porn as well, but yet the women are still down for ONS and having sex quickly if they like you.

[Tactician]

(02-15-2016 03:48 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

(02-15-2016 03:35 PM)Tactician Wrote:  

In the Anglosphere, with a few exceptions, prostitution is either illegal or very expensive for the average man to have access to, and the whores are often very mediocre.

I will have to disagree with this.

There are a ton of strip clubs, massage parlors and backpage motel whores in my city. The quality in my local strip club is so poor now that I find myself looking at the bartenders and waitresses.

All these establishments cater to men with different budgets.

This has not made the women any more feminine in my city, probably made it worse.

As for the Thailand example - how much did it cost you to travel there from Canada? Not exactly a cheap trip.

A better example would be Sweden and Iceland, both of them have outlawed prostitution. I believe Iceland restricted porn as well, but yet the women are still down for ONS and having sex quickly if they like you.

I'd expect prostitution to make women more feminine due to the increased competition, even with unattractive prostitutes since it's still more options for men, but your examples are putting things in perspective. I can't see how prostitution would make the situation worse though.

Anyway, I'm definitely underestimating the impact of culture since I'm writing from Canada and was thinking about prostitution in Asia/SEA when writing that post. Asia/SEA has already feminine women who would still be feminine even without prostitution just because of the culture.

[JWLZG]

(02-16-2016 03:11 AM)Tactician Wrote:  

I'd expect prostitution to make women more feminine due to the increased competition, even with unattractive prostitutes since it's still more options for men, but your examples are putting things in perspective. I can't see how prostitution would make the situation worse though.

Anyway, I'm definitely underestimating the impact of culture since I'm writing from Canada and was thinking about prostitution in Asia/SEA when writing that post. Asia/SEA has already feminine women who would still be feminine even without prostitution just because of the culture.

I disagree too about it being an "Anglosphere" phenomenon, over here, prostitution is legal, but its legislation varies by state. There's no taboo involved in being a sex worker, less so than it is to patronise one. No man in their 20s would readily admit to doing so either.

I'd go as far as to say that prostitution isn't so much an answer to the BDT as much as it is a factor towards it. Roosh wrote about it in the original article:

Roosh Wrote:

Spain and Italy. Beautiful girls, but equally handsome men. Hard to date up. Men are known for visiting whorehouses, especially in Spain, which is not a good sign.

Note that a few lines down:

Roosh Wrote:

Thailand, Philippines. Average-looking girls but nonexistent male competition. You can date up.

Prostitution is just as common in the latter than the former. They fare much better on the busted dudes test though. I wouldn't propose that it would incentivise women into being more feminine or attractive (if we're going to quantify these factors separately) insofar as the usage of prostitutes won't dent their sexual supply much.

Also there are cultural factors that determine the usage and acceptability of P4P. In SEA cultures whereby extramarital sex is frowned upon, it's legality may not necessarily have a cause and effect on the BDT as you might to think. And what about its necessity in a remote Australian mining town, where women are as much of a rarity as in a French Foreign Legion garrison, and the few non-pros working there are already being passed around like table salt?

[rudebwoy]

Tactician - I live in Canada's largest city.

[ChickenLover9T9]

I voted for the UK, although AU may take the prize because I've heard and seen so much about the market down under... however I've never been there so I cannot comment on it reliably.

I will say something that might appear strange. In the UK, some 2nd tier cities, generally nearer the south, especially south west, have some of the most beautiful girls I have ever seen. But, they tend to be on the young side. The legal age of consent here in the UK is 16, and it's often between 16-20 that girls are most attractive here. They decline very fast as they enter university, ruin their bodies with alcohol, drugs and casual sex. It's amazing what 3-4 years does. British girls aren't genetically inferior, it's just that they grow up in an environment that causes their looks and personality to degrade very quickly.

If you go to a 2nd tier city centre in the summer during the day you will see what I mean. But all older men in the UK are shamed for dating women 10-20 years younger, so if you're nearing 40 the best girls are out of your reach. So the remaining options are the older, busted women.

If you're a lad in high school who is just normal and at least somewhat cool, with no conscious "game", you can date up. But the girls you date in high school grow up to be far less attractive, and in university, the work place, cold approach, wherever you meet women, even with far better "game" than you had in high school, you just won't get the quality you used to.

As for London, it had very bad quality. I saw few if any stunners. Any really attractive women would be from EE. Roosh went there for a few days and thought the talent was poor. A few days is not enough to judge a place but I have been there a lot for extended periods in different areas, local talent is just terrible for such a big city.

In university I knew a polish girl, she was pretty, feminine and pleasant, not a stunner but fairly attractive, blonde, very skinny but with a pleasantly big rack for her frame. I was expecting her to have a top level BF given what british girls generally demanded, but her polish BF was average and mind numbingly boring. Looking back I could have had her but at the time had no clue about anything, really.

[ChickenLover9T9]

rudebwoy Wrote:

Quote:

Do you know how CR compares with Poland, as far as guys dating up or down is concerned?

I think you are missing the point.

Whether the local guys date up or down, has no bearing on you.

You should be more concerned about your "foreign status" and how you will be percieved.

The question the OP raises is legitimate.

But dating "up" or "down" is not an exact science - in most countries if you glanced at couples, the woman would be the "better looking" of the two because her attributes displayed to the opposite sex are concentrated within the domain of aesthetics indicating fitness to bear and raise children. Men do have pure genetic fitness as attributes (genetically handsome, height, muscle), but there are also many other areas where the man can make himself more sexually attractive, these things not always being obvious on first glance.

However, the post originating from Roosh known as the "busted dudes test" is a useful if incomplete metric. You can make valid conclusions from it but at the same time your own results may differ drastically for many different reasons. Even if you think you have a reliable conclusion from the BDT, rudebwoy is correct in his expression of the limitations of this crude test. But to say that it has (absolutely) "no bearing" on your results is not correct. In some places, the test can be accurate for me. In other places, it does not correlate reliably with results. For example, in the southern parts of the UK (but not London), I have seen some beautiful girls who were with desperately average boyfriends. Are they "convenience" boyfriends or are these girls really head over heels in love with them? No one knows for every couple but more of them are than aren't. Similarly I see ripped guys walking hand in hand with an average girl, or at least a girl nowhere near as pretty as the one that just walked by with her boyfriend who looked like a closet gay. I have seen hot girls hand in hand with socially castrated guys who could pass as faggots quite regularly. Is that an indicator that the dating market in the UK will be good? Obviously not, because we all know it is shit.

I saw fewer super hot girls walking with average guys in France and Germany, but got far better results there. I also got better results with hotter girls who have the better personalities.

It is not that the condition of the SMP is not extremely important, it absolutely is. It's like (IIRC) Warren Buffett said any management team of a big company can look great when the sector as a whole is doing well, but when the market conditions deteriorate, that's when the clothes come off, or something to that end...

The point being, if you're going to chase after girls, you want to get the maximum return. The question/accusation of "you can't get american/british/australian girls so you go to EE where it is easy" (or similar) has been addressed by many men who have expatriated for greener pastures (read: more favorable SMP), including Roosh himself. Yes, of course you should improve yourself, and a lot of that improvement will take place at home where you need time to prepare, but when you finally have the choice between one very bad SMP (UK, USA) and other significantly better SMPs, then while it is not a guarantee that you will succeed in whatever country/city you choose, you are stacking the deck more in your favor as opposed to scrapping for every single morsel just for survival. Take a look at what is happening to mining stocks right now: even the most stellar management will not keep these companies from either going under or losing billions and billions from their market cap. They can "improve" up to a certain maximum point, and then it is down to market factors (in this case commodity prices)... out of their control... Yes as men we must take responsibility but also not be blinded by our pride so much that we cannot admit where this or that factor is out of our control and we need to adapt accordingly.

In short, choosing the right SMP is a very important decision. Self-improvement has its limits in a very poor SMP. If there is a very, very favorable SMP (as some of us experienced in high school), super hot chicks will just naturally end up at your house, without any conscious knowledge of "game". Go out into the big wide world in 2016, the evolution of the internet, smart phones and social media obsessions, and you will find that no conscious level of game that I had in highschool gets you nothing, and even with a ton of self-improvement, I can't say I have gotten a girl hotter than I did in high school. They were prettier, more feminine both in mind and body. That is the difference.

The "busted dudes test" is just that, a quick test. It's not anywhere near a 100% foolproof way of measuring how good a certain city/country will be to you. I think, OP, you need to live in a place for a month or two, hit the pavements hard and see what you get. Out of your two choices I would not pick Austria, more expensive than CZ and I think the girls would be more feminine in CZ. However I think there are better places in EE than CZ. If you're so set on CZ though just go for it and see what happens. I was "forced" to various areas of Germany and France for work (wouldn't have gone otherwise) but I was pleasantly surprised at how much better I did with women in these western countries. Poland may have declined slightly but certain cities still might be great for us. We never know until we try.