[Samseau]

So according to the mainstream press, jobless rate has fallen to a new post-recession low, of 5.9%:
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/U...3-08-37-17

But then you can go the St. Louis FED's website and dig into the numbers, and what do we find?

Labor Force Participation Rate falls to 36 year lows:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-03...t-labor-fo

The vast majority of jobs added were low-income part-time jobs:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-03...nimum-wage

The vast majority of jobs created were for old people who cannot retire due to financial insecurity:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-03...t-prime-25

And to top it off, average hourly earnings fell:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-03...-july-2013

Even women have less jobs:
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/ali-meye...abor-force

Analysis:

Now, first let me preface by saying that I like linking to zerohedge because I feel they do the best job of explaining the numbers. However, this is not zerohedge "doom and gloom," you are a fool if you think this, since the charts they are pulling all come from the St. Louis FED's website which you can find here: http://www.stlouisfed.org/

Anyhow, here's the part that gets me. How is it that average Americans accept this propaganda with no outcry or reflection? It's not like the USA is the USSR which banned contrary sources of information. In America, the contrary sources of information come from the government itself, and is made freely available to the public. Yet the only sources people check are headline news. It's amazing: it's like the people willingly delude themselves. No totalitarian regime required.

My best guess is that the people who are broke and unemployed already know how much shit sucks as they live in their parents house, while those with jobs couldn't care less about anyone else and think that since they have jobs it can't be that bad for anyone else. So those with jobs never bother to look deeper into the numbers, while those without jobs don't bother to explain to anyone else since most people are brainwashed by the mainstream press or jobless people are too depressed to even try and make a case.

Regardless, watching this unfold leaves me flabbergasted. The levels of hypocrisy, indifference, and denial is out of control. It's almost like I'm trapped in a dystopian novel, where the government proudly proclaims that the jobless rate has fallen as more people than ever languish without money.

[The Beast1]

People just don't care. That's why.

If the dollar looses its reserve status there will be a hyper-inflationary event no doubt about it. I'm curious who is going to get screwed the most. Curiously, you'd think they would just screw the citizens. However, if people couldn't buy food it will be chaos and there will be lots of rioting going on. The "police" aren't going to be able to keep control outside of the major cities. This would be the start of a revolution.

Personally, I think that the Fed and policy makers will freak and instead force the TBTF banks to buy those toxic assets that the fed has been buying to soak up the liquidity. This will be the punch in the gut that will mark the end of American hegemony abroad. At this point, it will be impossible for the government to service the debt and a default will occur spiraling the whole thing even further down. This event screws the banks, federal government, and anyone who is heavily invested in the markets (eg 1%).

I wouldn't be surprised if the military leaders and defense contractors attempt a coup if the 2nd one occurs. Rome was in turmoil when the republic ended and the "empire" began. Too many interests worldwide don't want to see a world dominated by Russia and China. Most people won't revolt so long as the TV is on and there's food on the table. There may be a few "revolutionaries" around the country, but they will get squashed quickly if they can't get the support of the majority.

[TigerMandingo]

(10-03-2014 12:00 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

In America, the contrary sources of information come from the government itself, and is made freely available to the public. Yet the only sources people check are headline news. It's amazing: it's like the people willingly delude themselves. No totalitarian regime required.

Manufacturing Consent by Chomsky was the best explanation for this phenomenon.

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(10-03-2014 12:00 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

So according to the mainstream press, jobless rate has fallen to a new post-recession low, of 5.9%:
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/U...3-08-37-17
...

The vast majority of jobs created were for old people who cannot retire due to financial insecurity:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-03...t-prime-25
... Yet the only sources people check are headline news. It's amazing: it's like the people willingly delude themselves. No totalitarian regime required.

...
Regardless, watching this unfold leaves me flabbergasted. The levels of hypocrisy, indifference, and denial is out of control. It's almost like I'm trapped in a dystopian novel, where the government proudly proclaims that the jobless rate has fallen as more people than ever languish without money.

That book title tells it all really: Fifteen Steps to Corporate Feudalism: How the Rich Convinced America's Middle Class to Eliminate Themselves


In the US the people had a strong reliance on work-ethic, individual accomplishment, freedom & economic liberty. All those slogans were misused beginning in the 1970s, when the whole system was restructured. It is all forgotten that the US tax system was extremely slanted taxing the wealthy in the excess of 70%+ or that unions made the widespread prosperity from the 1950s to 70s possible.

Also long forgotten are the armed conflicts where previous generations fought veritable civil wars for decent wages as in the Battle of Blair Mountain:


That very same conflict is now described as something that a few crazy union workers started, but the truth is that after incidents as those the US president and industrialists moved to increase wages of the general population. The gains were hard-fought.

Now with the increase of technology, more debt and innovative financial products the people did not even realize as their living standard from the 70s dropped further and further.

They changed even the unemployment calculation proceedings - if they would be calculated as in the early 1980s the numbers would be looking like this:

Real unemployment is in excess of 23%. Due to social security you just don't see the starving men and women in the streets as during the last depression.

Either way - the worst is still to come. Opportunities are still there, but it will be more and more difficult. The current indebted millennials with their useless degrees have not even realized what is going on around them.

[It_is_my_time]

I don't know how much longer this economy can continue to float on this debt and how much longer they can keep interest rates down.

This are very bad economically and we have not even started to feel the true effects yet.

[birdie num num]

(10-03-2014 12:00 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

Regardless, watching this unfold leaves me flabbergasted. The levels of hypocrisy, indifference, and denial is out of control.

I feel you, man.

If I'm not mistaken, jobless numbers are measured by claims for unemployment. I'm an independent contractor and unqualified to receive unemployment, thus I don't figure in to the unemployment numbers. When the government claims a certain number, you can bet that it a few percentage points higher.

Where is Howard Beale when you need him?

[Samseau]

I'm way past the point of feeling angry about this anymore. I used to feel pissed off when I was younger, but now it's like watching lemmings walk off a cliff. How am I supposed to feel anything other than astonishment?

(10-03-2014 12:47 PM)Cunnilinguist Wrote:  

(10-03-2014 12:00 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

In America, the contrary sources of information come from the government itself, and is made freely available to the public. Yet the only sources people check are headline news. It's amazing: it's like the people willingly delude themselves. No totalitarian regime required.

Manufacturing Consent by Chomsky was the best explanation for this phenomenon.

Mind elaborating?

[Quintus Curtius]

Until people can't eat, it doesn't seem to resonate.

The rulers here have been able to buy off everyone with consumer goods, social media, amusements, and distractions. For now.

They're only going to wake up when the squeeze really hits them. And even then I'm not so sure.

I don't have much faith in the average person "seeing the light." Just look at what type of people are running for office.

[TigerMandingo]

(10-03-2014 02:32 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

Mind elaborating?

It's been awhile since I read it, but the main argument was along the lines of: Totalitarian regimes use force to control the way people think. But nowadays that's an outmoded and impractical way to control the population. So in the West, the method used is much more subtle: the media operates within a very narrow spectrum of opinion. So, for instance, when discussing the Iraq war, both sides will talk about how it was a "quagmire" and a "mistake" but you will never hear that it was an illegal invasion that violated international law. That's just an example, i don't want to enter into that debate

[Akula]

I am pretty much resigned to the effective death of the US for all intents and purposes (and by extension the death of the west barring certain regions). The cultural suicide aside, people are just too fat, dumb and happy at this point to even have a clue as to what's going on. We are lied to all day, every day by the mainstream media yet that's not even a big problem for most Americans.

It's not like it would really be all that hard for the average Joe to look up U6 unemployment on Wikipedia and figure out the situation is way worse than we're being told, or to just realize that "hey, there aren't that many jobs out there these days that are worth a sh*t" or to be shocked by faux panics like "the campus rape epidemic" but apparently everyone is too busy doing SJW stuff & getting offended 24-7, posting 'cool' selfies on Instagram, drinking Starbucks coffee and/or drafting their fantasy football teams to even care or bother learning anything meaningful.

Unfortunately, a very serious police state is well on the way to preventing any true revolution and/or movement to make things right. It's already happening more and more every day. With the overmedication of society right now + the rise of the police state we're not really all that far from Huxley's Brave New World of Soma and cloned babies I'd say. After all, women are just too damn busy these days who has time to spend 9 months pregnant not being able to drink, smoke and eat certain foods? And who will have time for 'revolution' anyway when we get half the country on the government dole and used to handouts that keep them busy doing mindless shit all day long?

[solo]

It's like this in Sweden too. Here the politicians bragged about the statistics of having created 250.000 jobs during the last 8 years. Yeah, but overall the unemployment rose during that time period. It's the net change that's relevant.

I think the reality is that unemployment rates aren't going to come down in the West. They're only going to increase. Around 10% unemployment is accepted as normal now, even as a good rate when you compare it to that of the basket case economies. What's more is the people in charge *want* a certain unemployment to keep down inflation (NAIRU). And when you listen to people like Peter Schiff it seems obvious that the dollar is going to crash sooner or later, under the burden of the debt. It's the same situation in Europe. The combined level of debt in Sweden for instance, is actually higher (490% of GDP) than it was in the US before the crisis (296% of GDP). If the US dollar and/or the European currencies tank maybe people will start to wake up but I'm not holding my breath. Most people are oblivious about what's going on.

I would sure like to know how you guys cope with the brainwashed blue pill masses. Not just on this issue, but obviously on feminism and other issues too. I've reached the point where I can't even discuss politics with most people anymore. It's simply too frustrating and energy-consuming. So instead of getting pissed off all the time, which isn't healthy if it happens too often and for no good, I've decided to try and laugh at them.

For us, I think the implications are the same as they have been for a while. Forget about having a "career" unless you have great connections or talents. Focus on blue collar type jobs and making money online. Game the system and enjoy the decline.

[Sp5]

(10-03-2014 02:32 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

I'm way past the point of feeling angry about this anymore. I used to feel pissed off when I was younger, but now it's like watching lemmings walk off a cliff. How am I supposed to feel anything other than astonishment?

(10-03-2014 12:47 PM)Cunnilinguist Wrote:  

(10-03-2014 12:00 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

In America, the contrary sources of information come from the government itself, and is made freely available to the public. Yet the only sources people check are headline news. It's amazing: it's like the people willingly delude themselves. No totalitarian regime required.

Manufacturing Consent by Chomsky was the best explanation for this phenomenon.

Mind elaborating?

The press operates as an echo chamber for government and special interest/elite opinion. The themes the government wants to propagate are dutifully copied down by reporters like stenographers and repeated without factual examination or analysis. Opposition is marginalized.

As alluded to by Cunnilinguist, the best example was the run-up to the Iraq War, when the WMD theme was endlessly repeated, the talking head retired generals and think-tank "analysts" reinforced the government message, and antibody against the war marginalized as a dirty hippie.

You haven't seen much serious reporting on the financial crisis, or the debt and its sources. Financial news is covered strictly in terms of the NASDAQ, Dow and S&P, up or down?

[Ensam]

I dunno, by my local anecdotal economic measures employment is back up:
Traffic has been a nightmare the past month or so - a year ago it was non-existent.
Today there was a line of cars trying to find a parking space at the local business lunch spot - 3 months ago the parking lot was half empty during lunch.

[Akula]

(10-03-2014 03:31 PM)solo Wrote:  

It's like this in Sweden too. Here the politicians bragged about the statistics of having created 250.000 jobs during the last 8 years. Yeah, but overall the unemployment rose during that time period. It's the net change that's relevant.

I think the reality is that unemployment rates aren't going to come down in the West. They're only going to increase. Around 10% unemployment is accepted as normal now, even as a good rate when you compare it to that of the basket case economies. What's more is the people in charge *want* a certain unemployment to keep down inflation (NAIRU). And when you listen to people like Peter Schiff it seems obvious that the dollar is going to crash sooner or later, under the burden of the debt. It's the same situation in Europe. The combined level of debt in Sweden for instance, is actually higher (490% of GDP) than it was in the US before the crisis (296% of GDP). If the US dollar and/or the European currencies tank maybe people will start to wake up but I'm not holding my breath. Most people are oblivious about what's going on.

I would sure like to know how you guys cope with the brainwashed blue pill masses. Not just on this issue, but obviously on feminism and other issues too. I've reached the point where I can't even discuss politics with most people anymore. It's simply too frustrating and energy-consuming. So instead of getting pissed off all the time, which isn't healthy if it happens too often and for no good, I've decided to try and laugh at them.

For us, I think the implications are the same as they have been for a while. Forget about having a "career" unless you have great connections or talents. Focus on blue collar type jobs and making money online. Game the system and enjoy the decline.

Funnily enough, I was just on a bus for a few hours with some older Swedish guys who were cool but seemed very blue pill and pretty beta, despite 3 of them being big dudes who liked hockey (but kinda fat and blubbery guys too).

One guy was telling me how great the economy in Sweden is, and how bad the growing 'far right' party is that's apparently anti-immigration. And at one point he said "the US economy is really doing well, isn't it?" I started off on how the numbers are massaged, how it's not really gotten much better etc. but after a couple minutes was like "eh, fuck it" and just shut up. A few years ago I might have gone into expansive detail on the issues, but now increasingly I feel like it's a waste of time. So many people, Europeans & Canadians especially IMO, just take the crappy feel-good mostly left-wing state-run media they are fed daily and take it as gospel and/or regurgitate it when 'discussing' politics. It's like they don't even have their own viewpoint or even certain digressions from what the standard state media are saying. They also are fed so much garbage about how crazy the US is that they have all these litmus test issues they often bring up to see what I think (e.g. US foreign policy, gun laws, Evangelicals, etc.) and sort of test me.

At this point I'm also just too tired of trying to explain all this red-pill sh*t to people that are starting from ground zero even in the later stages of their lives who should know better. But people aren't taught to challenge and think critically anymore...it's all about not offending and being PC for the most part and toeing the mainstream party line.

Still, those guys were nice and got along with them. They were on an 8-week holiday (!!) (courtesy of the Swedish government I presume).

[DjembaDjemba]

America seems to be following Germany's footsteps.

Long hours, high productivity, but consistently low wages. Unlike Germany the US social safety net is rickety, as its financed by only [top] 40% of the population.

Participation rate is at its lowest since 1979.
The first factor is the baby boomers that are now retiring. And the second is that too many people are unemployable with no discernible skills to get them working at livable wages, so they sit on their ass collecting the dole.

If you've got a quantifiable skill such as a blue collar trade, or discernible expertise in a white collar position the US is a good place to make money right now. In my industry companies are screaming for people.

[Samseau]

The usual cheer-leading: http://thehill.com/policy/finance/219686...-celebrate

[Tex Pro]

I am amazed how low the labor force participation rate has gotten. Any lower, and the labor force participation will be at what it was BEFORE women entered the workforce. LOL!

That said, SNAP (aka food stamps), Section 8, Medicaid, living with relatives, easy credit, etc. means that lots of people don't really need to work. The government also doesn't need tax revenue since it just borrows to make up any shortfall.

We really are living in weird times.

[rekruler]

The truth is, most people are just not very smart. These not-so-smart people aren't really capable of independent thought and by default take things they hear at face value when they even bother to listen to things at all.

Of those who are smart, only a certain fraction has the energy or "hustle" to step out and ponder the larger picture. Now we're already in hallowed territory, the fraction we're talking about is pretty small. But even among this fraction, not everybody gives a shit for the simple reason that if you're smart and aware enough to think shit like "the Fed is printing money a la Weimar Germany" chances are good you're doing well for yourself even while the rest of the country sinks. So in the end, you're left with a very small percentage of people who both understand what's going on and are personally negatively impacted by it. That's just not enough critical mass to bring about any sort of accountability to the elites who are steering the ship into the iceberg.

[RawGod]

(10-03-2014 06:24 PM)rekruler Wrote:  

The truth is, most people are just not very smart. These not-so-smart people aren't really capable of independent thought and by default take things they hear at face value when they even bother to listen to things at all.

Of those who are smart, only a certain fraction has the energy or "hustle" to step out and ponder the larger picture. Now we're already in hallowed territory, the fraction we're talking about is pretty small. But even among this fraction, not everybody gives a shit for the simple reason that if you're smart and aware enough to think shit like "the Fed is printing money a la Weimar Germany" chances are good you're doing well for yourself even while the rest of the country sinks. So in the end, you're left with a very small percentage of people who both understand what's going on and are personally negatively impacted by it. That's just not enough critical mass to bring about any sort of accountability to the elites who are steering the ship into the iceberg.

Succinctly explains a lot about the world.

[Feisbook Control]

I have to admit that I am extremely concerned about the state of the world right now. I went off reading Zerohedge about a year ago because it freaked me out too much. I've been back reading it for the past few weeks, along with some other doom and gloom websites. For a different (though somewhat overlapping) take on things, check out John Michael Greer.

Why I feel extremely concerned is the following. Firstly, as everyone has pointed out, the average person seems to be completely oblivious or in denial. The trouble is that -- to quote Keynes, I believe -- the markets can remain irrational longer than you can stay solvent. There are any number of strategies I could employ right now, if I were to believe that the collapse is literally right around the corner. However, any of them could be a mis-allocation of resources that would seriously hobble my standard of living if the collapse isn't actually right around the corner. I'll give some examples. An obvious one would be shorting the market/society or segments of it, but I could simply bleed to death that way if this whole thing manages to miraculously limp along for another 5, 10, 15 years. There are huge bubbles in real estate in both Australia and Taiwan. People have been saying they're just about to pop for years now.

Or, let's say I liquidated all of my investments and went all in on stacking precious metals. What if precious metals go sideways for five years? I saw a video on Youtube a while ago of a guy who had $300,000+ in precious metals. The video was from a few years ago when silver was about double the current price. He was banking on silver going to $100/ounce. Yet what if it doesn't? Unless that stack of silver (and some gold) is a minor part of his net worth, he's done half his net worth in the past few years! Now, of course, the market could tank, though there are certain companies that will probably always do well. So, I would incur a massive opportunity cost by not being invested in those. Or, another example would be getting myself a bit of land and getting heavily involved in permaculture. I could feed myself in the collapse, right? Again though, if the collapse doesn't come for five years, then I'd forego those investment returns, and I'd burn a whole lot of time working as a subsistence farmer, time that I could potentially spend earning money.

The other major concern I have is that I believe that anything and everything is on the table right now. There are two parts to this. The first is that even if the above (or something else) were a viable strategy, there is the legislative risk we need to consider. We could see confiscation of assets, be they bank balances, stock portfolios/retirement funds, land, precious metals or anything else. Even in the case of precious metals, whilst I think that the government would have some problems there, the issue is still that if you had a big stash of precious metals buried somewhere safe, sooner or later, people would find out that you were contravening the government restrictions. Even if they didn't try to steal from you or kidnap your spouse/kid/dog, you'd better believe they'd rat you out. A few years ago in Australia, there were severe water restrictions during a drought. Even in some cases where people were using bore water to water their gardens and had signs on their fences stating that, neighbours complained to the government that people were breaking the rules (which they weren't). The role of love for authority and jealousy from those who would not be prepared cannot be underestimated.

The second part is that I'm not even sure if there is anywhere that wouldn't be affected by this madness. Every major nation is drowning in debt right now, has terrible demographics, etc. If people think Russia or China will seamlessly replace the U.S. as world hegemon, they're not paying enough attention to the economic and social issues in those countries. Likewise, people might say they're going to run off to Chile or some such place. Firstly, if the U.S./European/Japanese/Chinese economy tanks, every economy is going to tank. Secondly, if you're an outsider, you're going to be a major target, either by the government or people around you. Even if they don't target you, they most likely won't help you. Unless you had integrated extremely well into your local community and had a very broad network of friends, you'd be really socially isolated.

Now, of course, there will also be opportunities in all of this. As Baron Rothschild is noted for saying, "buy when there's blood in the streets, even if it's your own". That's part of my strategy going forwards. I'm trying to remain optimistic, level-headed and alert, and not give in to either fear or greed. I'm trying to implement a multi-faceted strategy involving diversification across asset classes and geographic regions. I'm trying to be sensible about how I use my resources. I'm not quite where I want to be yet, and even still, I am concerned that everything is very much on the table and that governments and ordinary citizens alike could still properly fuck me.

As for what the average person thinks, I would say that I only know four people who really have an understanding of how far up shit creek the world is. I don't know anything about one guy's approach to this since I haven't known him that long. The other three seem to be way off on their solutions, I think. Here's why:

1. The first guy has land in the Philippines where he's undertaken a permaculture project. He doesn't have all of his eggs in that basket, fortunately. Regardless though, there are opportunity costs, and also he'd be a rather obvious target for both the government and locals. If I were to pick a third world nation to do that kind of thing, it wouldn't be that one.

2. A friend in Australia is a major gold bug. Recently, I asked him about his situation. It's all paper gold! He's invested in mining companies and has deposits at the Perth Mint that can supposedly be redeemed for physical gold. Jesus. As the saying goes, if you can't hold it, you don't own it. What's the point of being a gold bug and thinking that paper assets are dangerous/worthless if...you hold paper gold?!

3. A third guy owns a house and his family has some rural property. Good start. Then he goes and shoots himself in the foot by being an extremely active member in the Greens Party, which just wants to exchange one set of stupid ideas for another, which leads me to believe (after several frustrating conversations about economics and the causes of inflation) that where he is right is a case of a broken clock telling the right time twice a day. Also of note is that he rails against the fossil fuel industry for its myth of progress and its pernicious role in lobbying the government. Yet he and his friend are involved in the solar energy industry and are lobbying the government. He is also under some sort of sci-fantasy delusion that one day, the entire Australian economy is going to be powered by wind farms and solar panels. He's the worst kind of apostate: the zealous convert to a new religion.

Everyone else is in complete la-la-land, including most parts of the internet. I feel like this is one of the few places I can have an intelligent conversation on any of this, so I am very much looking forward to other people's opinions on this topic because I have absolutely no idea whether I am on the right track, or way off, just like the people I mentioned immediately above.

[Sawyer]

I've been in this collapse game almost 20 years. When I started I was convinced the shit was going to go down. Now I realize I'm tired of the collapse game, but I'm damn happy with my life. So maybe the coming collapse was just an excuse to do shit I wanted to do all along (and it probably was, subconsciously or not), but shit I love living in the woods. I understand the people, I work with my hands and I love it. But do I believe, for all I've done, that my childhood buddies running hedge funds in NYC are worse off to weather the storm? HELL NO. They and their progeny will be around long after I'm gone, their ideas and attitudes will survive long after people like me are fully enslaved or rendered otherwise inoperable.

ATTITUDES ARE LIKE COCKROACHES. THEY ARE WHAT SURVIVE.

Whatever happens you're one of two things: You're a survivor or you're dead. I live around survivors but I don't mistake myself for one of them, as prepared as I might be. I do what I love every day and that's a form of survival in itself. I've got a great woman. But I'm lunch to the natives in my community if the balloon ever goes up, and God bless them for it.

Survival isn't about assets, it's about attitude. Which makes me think the whole collapse mentality may be a huge sales gimmick. Not that I give a flying one. All I can say is if you're happy you're going to be happy no matter what hits the fan, and attitude, without question, has been and always will be the coin of the realm. Attitudes are the real gold. Everything else is bullshit.

Edit: Besides neighbors. Good neighbors are far more important than good investments or even attitudes. So if you want to invest in the future, become a valuable neighbor.

[Handsome Creepy Eel]

(10-03-2014 02:44 PM)Cunnilinguist Wrote:  

(10-03-2014 02:32 PM)Samseau Wrote:  

Mind elaborating?

It's been awhile since I read it, but the main argument was along the lines of: Totalitarian regimes use force to control the way people think. But nowadays that's an outmoded and impractical way to control the population. So in the West, the method used is much more subtle: the media operates within a very narrow spectrum of opinion. So, for instance, when discussing the Iraq war, both sides will talk about how it was a "quagmire" and a "mistake" but you will never hear that it was an illegal invasion that violated international law. That's just an example, i don't want to enter into that debate

I believe that this is correct. It is akin to the flexible exchange rate in the currency market - it looks to be floating freely, but a closer looks reveals that it is just inside fixed boundaries, with the central bank intervening whenever the rate becomes too low or too high. The recent example here was entering the EU - all media, no matter how hostile to each other usually, were adamant about how critical it is for our future and blah blah blah.

[Akula]

(10-03-2014 07:23 PM)RawGod Wrote:  

(10-03-2014 06:24 PM)rekruler Wrote:  

The truth is, most people are just not very smart. These not-so-smart people aren't really capable of independent thought and by default take things they hear at face value when they even bother to listen to things at all.

Of those who are smart, only a certain fraction has the energy or "hustle" to step out and ponder the larger picture. Now we're already in hallowed territory, the fraction we're talking about is pretty small. But even among this fraction, not everybody gives a shit for the simple reason that if you're smart and aware enough to think shit like "the Fed is printing money a la Weimar Germany" chances are good you're doing well for yourself even while the rest of the country sinks. So in the end, you're left with a very small percentage of people who both understand what's going on and are personally negatively impacted by it. That's just not enough critical mass to bring about any sort of accountability to the elites who are steering the ship into the iceberg.

Succinctly explains a lot about the world.

Yeah nice post but I'd add that you also can't necessarily blame the average guy on the street too much for just not 'getting it'.

The press are AWFUL and seemingly completely controlled by special interest groups, corporations and certain lobbies. So they are biased and do what they are told and are lead by naive idiotic idealists who are almost entirely on the left worldwide, with Murdoch's empire being a notable example on the right (but still toeing mostly blue pill ideas).

So the opposition is a controlled one whereby the average guy isn't really presented both sides of the equation. Look at the diverse issues like the Middle East, ongoing Ukrainian situation, 'global warming' and immigration and you can see how awful they are handled and explained by the mainstream media - it's all mostly one sided and generally fits their government's storyline and also what's generally good for big business, oil, the Israel lobby, CAIR, etc. (pick your powerful lobby group) depending on the country and/or situation.

(I guess the environment is the one 'cause celebre' that goes against big business but still there is a lot to gain for many politicians and businessmen in this arena.)

[Simeon_Strangelight]

(10-04-2014 01:08 AM)Feisbook Control Wrote:  

...

Everyone else is in complete la-la-land, including most parts of the internet. I feel like this is one of the few places I can have an intelligent conversation on any of this, so I am very much looking forward to other people's opinions on this topic because I have absolutely no idea whether I am on the right track, or way off, just like the people I mentioned immediately above.

Frankly - it is not even that the average Joe is not getting it. You can talk with economists who have genius-level IQs and they are regurgitating just the dogmas they have been taught. I personally have been reading The Economist since my teens for more than a decade. Did it ever mention interest-free money creation? No - and neither did the universities I studied at.

Top level economists like Milton Friedman or Meynard Keynes knew about it, but remained silent, since they did not wish to be left in obscurity. Also they associated with high-level people who were aware of this on a natural basis.

Also regarding a total-collapse-mindset: it would be simply highly illogical. The collapse is to come in steps. It may come faster than in the last 30 years, but it will be feasible. A total collapse and prepping via gold, silver, cans and guns/bullets would only lead to chaos and could frankly become dangerous even to the highest elites as well.

The take-down will come in stages with many ups and downs. Within 50 years most people in the West will be on the dole, live in tiny city appartments, have no travel opportunities and a lifestyle that is significantly lower. That is the plan - if it happens - we will see.

Planned-opolis is a real (not fake) planning scenario for our Western future - it was published by powerful green NGO.

Even in the best of the 4 introduced scenarios you have:

- calorie card (rationing food)
- no private transport affordable
- school & career allotment - all common core and UN guidelines for future
- no meat & no affordable organic high quality food
- almost everyone living in ecofashist cities
- super wealthy still can afford best food, travel and living on the countryside
- also the videos are being seen from the viewpoint of an upper middle class member - the rest of the lot will be having worse conditions

Real life options:

- getting a bit gold/silver won't hurt, but you have to realize that in any real collapse the government & military can always step in and confiscate it all (just as holding gold was made illegal in the US for some time in the past)
- getting real estate works best if you invest in big agriculture, become not only sustainable yourself producing as much food as you want for yourself - albeit not for the reason of food shortages, but more for the reason of having good quality food yourself, which will become more expensive
- apart from that I expect all real estate to be taxed more and more via property & eco-fashism taxes - the only way how it is viable is if you have a lot of it and it produces income & are able to pay off property and eco taxes
- you can always move and invest in businesses in countries like China, where more and more of the Western manufacturing capacity will be transferred. Even opening a well-led Bavarian-style beer, wurst & sauerkraut restaurant in one of the mid-level multi-million Chinese cities will be good enough for quite some time.
- stop watching those libertarian & world-collapse sheisters like Alex Jones, Peter Schiff & listening to politicians like Ron Paul. Some of them tell a lot of truth, but in the end they prevent the people from organizing and realizing that you would have to demand interest free money creation as the first step - get rid not only of private central banking, but also most usury & fractional reserve banking itself. If you don't do that, there won't be change. And there won't be any change, so don't expect any.
- best way is to spread your eggs far and wide, invest in regions where everyone is getting more wealthy or in businesses which take advantage of the deteriorating times (pawn shops, weed dealerships, weed farming etc. )
- the decline will come in waves and stages and there is plenty of time to enjoy the decline, move to an island on Thailand, open a small bar and live on 2k per month for the rest of your life (real-life example of someone I know by the way)

The only thing certain about life is that you don't leave this place alive anyway - so why worry? Plan, work & enjoy.

[ElBorrachoInfamoso]

I'm surprised more people don't know what the relevant numbers really are. Maybe it's because I'm in a bubble and speak mostly to other businessmen, but we all know the official jobs numbers are bullshit and we all know what metrics we should really look at to get an accurate picture of the macroeconomic situation.

And for all those crying about the death of the middle class. If you split the US into three income terciles say in 1970, it is true that over the last few decades the middle tercile has been shrinking. However, the lowest tercile has remained about the same size. The highest tercile has been growing. What's the takeaway? The middle income group is shrinking because many families have increased their incomes not because they became poor.