[AntiTrace]

I understand game is a skill, and like any skill there really is no end state. It's not like if you can play the 60 second waltz in thirty seconds on the piano that you have reached the end of your piano journey.

A lot new people discoverer game and first work on mass approaching with memorized routines. A mix of inner game and self development normally follows, with the awkward and calibrated mass approaches continuing. Confidence is gained, experienced is gained, and the routines are fine tuned and more calibrated. Then each attribute of a player slowly increases: fashion, confidence, fitness, social awareness, conversational skills, etc. As each attribute is slowly tweaked and increased one at a time, the overall game level is increased.

But at what point have you internalized game?

I think it comes at the point where you can consistently pull without even thinking about. You dont win every battle, game is about numbers, but the ones you win you just show up to.

I'll always consider myself a beginner, because you never be a master at everything and essentially game encompasses everything about how you live your life. But I have realized that I don't even try anymore. It just kind of happens.

That old line that most females feed to their beta orbiters: "Just be yourself". I think You have internalized game when you actually can "just be yourself" and pull consistently. No memorized routines, no need for a wing to back you, no need to pre-game and get all pumped up and "into state", etc. It's like a light switch that can turn and off as you please, except that it is always on.

[Rage_on]

It really seems to be, fortunately, like any other skill set. Things become second nature in a given situation through thoughtful repetition. Until we've experienced EVERY situation, there are going to be variables we encounter that are unfamiliar, and so those situations will prove something to us. I have yet to approach a mixed set of people (male/female) where I considered the males to be at my level or higher. I just haven't done it. I know I will, but until I can reasonably predict what that experience will be like I have no practical frame of reference. So all the "internalization" of what it may be like really just produces fear. Without some reasonable certainty, its impossible to act confidently. that's why repetition is so important in overcoming apprehension, we just get the fuck in there and do it, not fearing the outcome but learning from the experience. Of course I have a lot more experience with approaching then I do late game and shit. But I am supposing all stages of playerhood are similar and we learn through trial and error.

I know when I do approach a group like that it will be because I WANT to approach a group like that. I want to have that experience, not merely to extract a girl. Its like playing an instrument, you have to love to practice. Being lauded for a performance (like banging a sexy girl) is great, but if you didn't love the hardwork you never would have gotten there. I decide before the approach that ii am going to enjoy and learn from it, the outcome is largely beyond my control. If she insults me I am going to find amusement in it, if she wants to fuck me, likewise. Both are valuable. Sorry if I got off topic. I just felt like writing.

[OnlyMarryInTajikistan]

You have internalized game when your inner game is rock solid.

If you read a defeatist thread about "9s being unattainable", and your natural response is to laugh it off, then you have internalized game.

[General Mayhem]

Couple things:

I don't think you can internalize game until you have figured yourself out as a man. I think you have to know exactly who the fuck you are, and be self-assured beyond any doubt in order to have mastered game.

You also need to have completely internalized the fact that all women are below you, but on the same token you aren't bitter about the true nature of women. Instead, you love women for what they are.

I'll leave out my thoughts on having a passion that takes precedence over women, but know that's important.

Things like frame and body language are obviously important, but at the mastery phase you aren't going to be thinking about them.

Once you hit mastery I feel like "game" never even crosses your mind.

[heavy]

I'm not even close with women, but I know with sports, let's say basketball...

When it just flows. You don't think about it. You don't think about your footwork, or timing, or aiming the shot. There's no consciousness to it. It just flows. It's all feeling.

I'm guessing it's sorta like the Buddhist nirvana thing. There's no self-consciousness.

The reality is, though, it's situational and temporary. Even Michael Jordan...remember his shrug when he was on fire. He couldn't always light up the other team and drop 63. He wasn't always flowing. But when you're flowing, you just shrug and enjoy the moment.

[polar]

1. Unconscious incompetence
2. Conscious incompetence
3. Conscious competence
4. Unconscious competence

(5. Mastery)

[simonafc]

if you've been through a few or enough situations, you begin to unconciously act upon alot of actions.


not sure how far i am into it, but with how i am currently, i do things unconciously, i see things, and analyze it automatically
most of the time i dont even have to think about it.

I know when im jumping into sets without even thinking about it.

it just comes.

[Nascimento]

(10-01-2014 10:38 AM)polar Wrote:  

1. Unconscious incompetence
2. Conscious incompetence
3. Conscious competence
4. Unconscious competence

(5. Mastery)

This post deserves examples and further breakdown.

I believe I am at conscious competence. It took me about a year or two since conscious incompetence and I feel it's going to take even longer until I get to unconscious competence.

Before that, I was at unconscious incompetence every single day of my life.

[Atavistic]

Reading from what I’ve just read about the 5 levels of game internalization, at the rate I am going it would probably take me thousands of years to reach those levels, if not more. Progress for me is very slow even though I'm trying.

[AntiTrace]

(10-01-2014 08:09 PM)Atavistic Wrote:  

Reading from what I’ve just read about the 5 levels of game internalization, at the rate I am going it would probably take me thousands of years to reach those levels, if not more. Progress for me is very slow even though I'm trying.

no it wont.

just be saying that youve already progressed to level 2: conscious incompetence.

You know your doing something wrong.

Withina few months of practice you can get up to level 3, where you know what to do, but it takes you being focused and at the top of your game to do it.

level 4 will then take years, when you no longer have to be "in state". You just simply have it. People think your a natural and at times you dont even know what you did to attract a chick.

[Nascimento]

(10-01-2014 08:18 PM)AntiTrace Wrote:  

(10-01-2014 08:09 PM)Atavistic Wrote:  

Reading from what I’ve just read about the 5 levels of game internalization, at the rate I am going it would probably take me thousands of years to reach those levels, if not more. Progress for me is very slow even though I'm trying.

no it wont.

just be saying that youve already progressed to level 2: conscious incompetence.

You know your doing something wrong.

Withina few months of practice you can get up to level 3, where you know what to do, but it takes you being focused and at the top of your game to do it.

level 4 will then take years, when you no longer have to be "in state". You just simply have it. People think your a natural and at times you dont even know what you did to attract a chick.

To add to that, I've been at it for 2 years and I'm 21 right now. I started from nothing, if you really wanted to and looked back on my posts since I joined you'll find some of my stories about when I first started..

I feel I've had glimpses of level 4 already. There have definitely been several aha moments especially over the past few months.

[horn]

When you're inner game is a ten around a 10.

And it doesn't matter if you pick her up, or not. If she blows you off nastily, your inner game is still a 10.0 from the Russian judge.

[AntiTrace]

(10-01-2014 08:40 PM)horn Wrote:  

When you're inner game is a ten around a 10.

And it doesn't matter if you pick her up, or not. If she blows you off nastily, your inner game is still a 10.0 from the Russian judge.

truth.

I saw in big jump in my inner game and results when I truly internalized that game is about numbers. When I stopped beating myself up for getting rejected, flaked on, or having things fizzle out pre-bang.

It took a while to get that attitude. It a normal process in game. We learn game and when something doesn't work as planned, we blame it on ourselves (actually a healthy habit) and try to figure out what we did wrong. But with women you ultimately can't do that. THere are just too many unkown variables to worry about a single encounter not working out.

When I internalized that game is about numbers, it felt like a huge weight was lifted off my shoulders. I no longer had myself to blame. It made approaching so much easier. I went from sniper game to shot gun (at times grenade) game. Just approach and see what sticks.

[Rage_on]

I think going from no knowledge to the fact that it is a game to straight up accepting it and deciding to be a player is the biggest and hardest step for those who aren't naturals. After that it's honing a skill like any other. But there's something to be said about having the confidence to know you can get pussy. You may not always get it, but you have enough experience to know that when you aren't pulling you're learning and it's just as or more valuable.

[horn]

Exactly, when they flake it's their problem, not mine.

This late-20s [old for me] was blowing up my phone last nite, today, and earlier tonite. Sent sexy pics, arranged a meet, the whole 9 yards.

Then I get this aplogetic text 'Oh, my engine broke down in traffic, I'm really mad because I wanted to see you and now I'm getting towed in a bad neighborhood....'.
so, at first, I'm like okay, she came strong with what could be a totally legit excuse. My car's broken down twice in the past and that's not counting dead batteries. It happens.

But you know what happened after I replied and said no problem, some other time......ghost. I'd bet she never contacts me again. I already NEXTed her.

Frankly, younger girls are not much flakier. It's so person-dependent.

[Atavistic]

(10-01-2014 08:18 PM)AntiTrace Wrote:  

(10-01-2014 08:09 PM)Atavistic Wrote:  

Reading from what I’ve just read about the 5 levels of game internalization, at the rate I am going it would probably take me thousands of years to reach those levels, if not more. Progress for me is very slow even though I'm trying.

no it wont.

just be saying that youve already progressed to level 2: conscious incompetence.

You know your doing something wrong.

Withina few months of practice you can get up to level 3, where you know what to do, but it takes you being focused and at the top of your game to do it.

level 4 will then take years, when you no longer have to be "in state". You just simply have it. People think your a natural and at times you dont even know what you did to attract a chick.

Yeah, I agree. I was just being irrational when factoring in the time. Right now, I'm at about 5 approaches a day the last few years. I'm trying to make an effort to seduce a woman as all of my bangs have been pros and semi-pros (which I consider them pros regardless).

I will say that on the bright side, at least I'm not giving up and resorting exclusively to P4P.

Anyways, like anything in life hardwork pays off. So the levels make sense.

[polar]

(10-01-2014 06:50 PM)Nascimento Wrote:  

(10-01-2014 10:38 AM)polar Wrote:  

1. Unconscious incompetence
2. Conscious incompetence
3. Conscious competence
4. Unconscious competence

(5. Mastery)

This post deserves examples and further breakdown.

I believe I am at conscious competence. It took me about a year or two since conscious incompetence and I feel it's going to take even longer until I get to unconscious competence.

Before that, I was at unconscious incompetence every single day of my life.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_stag...competence

There are so many moving parts to game.

To paraphrase how an insightful (and unfortunately former) member of this board, xsplat, put it once, you start out in game slapping on a few souped-up parts on your Ford Taurus beater, and over time you re-engineer the entire car to optimize the whole thing for performance.

After a friend introduced me to game and the Mystery Method, it took me nearly a year before I did my first approach. When I started, I could barely ask a stranger for the time or for directions, much less a cute girl. Yet I somehow expected things to go smoothly and that I'd be collecting handfuls of phone numbers and bathroom pulls in no time.

I crashed and burned. For a long time, my ego was far bigger than my game. I took rejections personally. I'd go in my head. I'd avoid approaching But over time, I built momentum, my game improved, and I got some new girls which turned into lays, fuck buddies and LTR's. You start at the bottom of the ladder and climb as high as you have the determination for.

Anyway, I think the lines between 2 and 3 are blurry, it solely depends on what your goals are. The further out you set your goals, the longer it will take you to reach the 3rd stage. I'd place myself in bucket 2 - I can get numbers from day game consistently and can get laid via online, but conversion rates aren't as great as I'd like and while the quality is improving, it's not where it could be quite yet.

I can tell I'm on the verge of a breakthrough in mindset, internalizing that I bring more awesome to the table than the girls in my life, abundance mentality. Scoring dates consistently (albeit online) has been a big part of that - I know that even if my fuck buddies go on strike, I can get fresh tang within a couple of weeks at most.

Just keep moving forward.